Epidemic is iffy as a required, but it gives you considerably slack in your rotations. Especially if you have Pestilence.
IIT also depends on how tight your raid tuning is, if you have frost dps, odds are its not needed.
Even when you have a Frost DPS, I think it's good for a tank to have ITT. There are a lot of multi-mob boss encounters these days where the Frost DPS may be off beating on something else, leaving you the only one capable of laying ITT. Given the survivability issues DK's have post-3.2, even that 6% melee de-haste helps.
Every raid is going to be different though, you're right.
Epidemic is iffy as a required, but it gives you considerably slack in your rotations. Especially if you have Pestilence.
IIT also depends on how tight your raid tuning is, if you have frost dps, odds are its not needed.
Even when you have a Frost DPS, I think it's good for a tank to have ITT. There are a lot of multi-mob boss encounters these days where the Frost DPS may be off beating on something else, leaving you the only one capable of laying ITT. Given the survivability issues DK's have post-3.2, even that 6% melee de-haste helps.
Every raid is going to be different though, you're right.
In This Thread
forty on
Officially the unluckiest CCG player ever.
0
GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited September 2009
I fail, I am not sure what "In This Thread" is supposed to mean I guess it means it's already been talked about, but in an 80 page thread, some topics are going to end up being discussed twice.
Epidemic is iffy as a required, but it gives you considerably slack in your rotations. Especially if you have Pestilence.
IIT also depends on how tight your raid tuning is, if you have frost dps, odds are its not needed.
Even when you have a Frost DPS, I think it's good for a tank to have ITT. There are a lot of multi-mob boss encounters these days where the Frost DPS may be off beating on something else, leaving you the only one capable of laying ITT. Given the survivability issues DK's have post-3.2, even that 6% melee de-haste helps.
Every raid is going to be different though, you're right.
Epidemic is iffy as a required, but it gives you considerably slack in your rotations. Especially if you have Pestilence.
IIT also depends on how tight your raid tuning is, if you have frost dps, odds are its not needed.
Even when you have a Frost DPS, I think it's good for a tank to have ITT. There are a lot of multi-mob boss encounters these days where the Frost DPS may be off beating on something else, leaving you the only one capable of laying ITT. Given the survivability issues DK's have post-3.2, even that 6% melee de-haste helps.
Every raid is going to be different though, you're right.
In This Thread
You know when I saw that ITT thing while reading the post I figure IIT was what they meant to type and finished moving through the thread.
Epidemic is iffy as a required, but it gives you considerably slack in your rotations. Especially if you have Pestilence.
IIT also depends on how tight your raid tuning is, if you have frost dps, odds are its not needed.
Even when you have a Frost DPS, I think it's good for a tank to have ITT. There are a lot of multi-mob boss encounters these days where the Frost DPS may be off beating on something else, leaving you the only one capable of laying ITT. Given the survivability issues DK's have post-3.2, even that 6% melee de-haste helps.
Every raid is going to be different though, you're right.
In This Thread
You know when I saw that ITT thing while reading the post I figure IIT was what they meant to type and finished moving through the thread.
Epidemic is iffy as a required, but it gives you considerably slack in your rotations. Especially if you have Pestilence.
IIT also depends on how tight your raid tuning is, if you have frost dps, odds are its not needed.
Even when you have a Frost DPS, I think it's good for a tank to have ITT. There are a lot of multi-mob boss encounters these days where the Frost DPS may be off beating on something else, leaving you the only one capable of laying ITT. Given the survivability issues DK's have post-3.2, even that 6% melee de-haste helps.
Every raid is going to be different though, you're right.
In This Thread
You were worried that your post pointing out a typo/simple mistake might make you look like an asshole if you made it a double post?
Then you posted it twice more because it was very important that he understand that he used 2 "T"s instead of 2 "I"s?
Then you were patronizing when someone pointed out what a trivial and easily understood error it was that you were so diligently calling attention to?
Yeah, it's a good thing you didn't doublepost there. Totally would have been an asshole move.
UnbrokenEva on
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UnbrokenEvaHIGH ON THE WIREBUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered Userregular
I know im looking at around 8% hit rating to cap yellow attacks (5% with 3 points in Virulence, which I have).
Virulence gives spell hit, not melee hit.
What? I never said anything, anywhere, about Virulence, or DW. We were talking about tanking and Improved Icy Touch. Did you mis-quote?
Then im thinking of the wrong talent, its the one that provides 3% hit with 3 points into it...
No, you were thinking of the right talent but remembering it wrong. Virulence gives 3% spell hit, and we have no talents that improve melee hit - we still need 8%. Virulence just helps us not need to go over that to make sure our spell attacks don't miss too often.
Epidemic is iffy as a required, but it gives you considerably slack in your rotations. Especially if you have Pestilence.
IIT also depends on how tight your raid tuning is, if you have frost dps, odds are its not needed.
Even when you have a Frost DPS, I think it's good for a tank to have ITT. There are a lot of multi-mob boss encounters these days where the Frost DPS may be off beating on something else, leaving you the only one capable of laying ITT. Given the survivability issues DK's have post-3.2, even that 6% melee de-haste helps.
Every raid is going to be different though, you're right.
In This Thread
You were worried that your post pointing out a typo/simple mistake might make you look like an asshole if you made it a double post?
Then you posted it twice more because it was very important that he understand that he used 2 "T"s instead of 2 "I"s?
Then you were patronizing when someone pointed out what a trivial and easily understood error it was that you were so diligently calling attention to?
Welcome to the forums. Sometimes we poke fun at mistakes here.
Yeah, it's a good thing you didn't doublepost there. Totally would have been an asshole move.
At the time I wasn't expecting it to take such effort to get the point across.
forty on
Officially the unluckiest CCG player ever.
0
GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited September 2009
That's probably because it was such an easy to correct mistake in your own head while you're reading it, I didn't even see the point. Because, ya know, it was one of those mistakes that no one points out, because it's not worth it...except you did, three times, because you thought it was worth it. Good for you.
I know im looking at around 8% hit rating to cap yellow attacks (5% with 3 points in Virulence, which I have).
Virulence gives spell hit, not melee hit.
What? I never said anything, anywhere, about Virulence, or DW. We were talking about tanking and Improved Icy Touch. Did you mis-quote?
Then im thinking of the wrong talent, its the one that provides 3% hit with 3 points into it...
No, you were thinking of the right talent but remembering it wrong. Virulence gives 3% spell hit, and we have no talents that improve melee hit - we still need 8%. Virulence just helps us not need to go over that to make sure our spell attacks don't miss too often.
Nerves of Cold Steel is the talent I was actually talking about. It increases your hit chance by 3% making special cap 5%.
When you say wasted GCDs, what are you doing with them? I found blood presence was tight enough that it was hard to find room for more than 1 Rime proc per rotation, not to mention blowing extra RP from AMS soaking. Other "extra" GCDs are used to HoW for extra RP, or blowing cooldowns (ghoul, blood tap/UA). I have a bit of downtime in the first rotation, but once I get going UP wastes very little. I'm hit capped anyways and about 1% short of dodge capped, so that isn't entirely due to losing GCDs to misses/dodges, but UP definately helps keep the rotation together when I do get dodged. Also, Razorice stacks faster with the increased attack speed, and the 15% run speed boost is handy on many (most) fights in Uld/ToC.
No doubt that Unholy Presence can speed up Razorice a bit, but it's not like you'll reap the benefits of a full stack on anything other than a boss anyway, so a few seconds of 1%-3% less damage until you reach the 10th stack won't exactly make that big of a difference. The increased movement speed and more lenient recovery from a Dodged attack are great though.
I don't use Horn of Winter unless it's the beginning of a fight or if it's about to fall off, because quite frankly, I'm usually swimming in Runic Power due to prioritizing Obliterate over Frost Strike.
All I can say is, I tested both Presences quite a bit, and at least for me, the best I could get with Unholy Presence was to match what I could output in Blood Presence. Usually it was 200-300 DPS lower.
I suppose I could test them out a bit more, as I gave up on Unholy Presence after a couple of days trying to make it work for me.
I wish unholy presence could work for blood because I like movement speed buffs, but not at the cost of damage.
forty on
Officially the unluckiest CCG player ever.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
Unholy presence would give you way, way too much free time in blood.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Right, which is why I don't use it. But moving at 100% speed makes me feel like a cripple when my other main moves at 130% speed in DPS spec.
forty on
Officially the unluckiest CCG player ever.
0
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
130% speed? What class has that movement as standard?
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
So I guess with a new DK character if you want to have professions you gotta suck it up and spend time farming shit from the low level zones to get up to speed?
Elessar Elfstone on
Tobias: Or it could be your colon. I'd want to get in there and find some answers.
So I guess with a new DK character if you want to have professions you gotta suck it up and spend time farming shit from the low level zones to get up to speed?
Yup. No other way around it. But you do get free First Aid skill! Which is kinda ironic... seeing as your dead and all. Well, I should say, Undead.
So I guess with a new DK character if you want to have professions you gotta suck it up and spend time farming shit from the low level zones to get up to speed?
Yup. No other way around it. But you do get free First Aid skill! Which is kinda ironic... seeing as your dead and all. Well, I should say, Undead.
Shitty beans. I noticed the FA too, and figured "oh cool most of the professions must be like that"
Elessar Elfstone on
Tobias: Or it could be your colon. I'd want to get in there and find some answers.
So I guess with a new DK character if you want to have professions you gotta suck it up and spend time farming shit from the low level zones to get up to speed?
Yup. No other way around it. But you do get free First Aid skill! Which is kinda ironic... seeing as your dead and all. Well, I should say, Undead.
Shitty beans. I noticed the FA too, and figured "oh cool most of the professions must be like that"
I do low level quests while I am leveling gathering skills. At least that way my reputation isn't complete crap when buying and repairing at city faction vendors. (Also reduces the cost of any vanity pets or mounts you want to buy from old world factions.)
I level those professions before going to Outland so that I don't get annoyed at skipping all the potential skill ups and materials.
So, Mining / Blacksmith a good combo for a Death Knight? I would assume so.
Yeah can't go wrong with that combo. Sucks trawling the lowbie zones to level them at first but it's worth getting caught up before you start levelling.
Will it be as useful, though? Obliterate and SS are both used heavily in Frost and Unholy but DS is only used a couple times a rotation. Or is it one of those glyphs that there's a high chance for it to proc but it has a long internal cooldown?
Will it be as useful, though? Obliterate and SS are both used heavily in Frost and Unholy but DS is only used a couple times a rotation. Or is it one of those glyphs that there's a high chance for it to proc but it has a long internal cooldown?
Yeah I'm guessing the relic is on a 45s internal cd
Will it be as useful, though? Obliterate and SS are both used heavily in Frost and Unholy but DS is only used a couple times a rotation. Or is it one of those glyphs that there's a high chance for it to proc but it has a long internal cooldown?
Yeah I'm guessing the relic is on a 45s internal cd
I would have guessed this, but, for example, the feral druid idol that has a very similar effect (200 agility) doesn't seem to have an ICD, or if it does, it's only a few seconds.
I looked at wowhead last night, and it claims the effect has an 80% proc rate, so even with Blizzard finally remembering they created the blood tree, assuming there's no ICD like with the feral idol, it looks like yet another case where Blizzard forgets how the spec actually works.
Wow, blizzard doesn't know how to itemize relics properly? This is breaking fucking news!
Unless of course you've been paying attention to the game since, well, relics were in the game. I'm looking at you every relic for Prot Paladins for all of TBC except the one from Mother Shahraz. Or how about the increased consecrate spellpower one they thought Prot Paladins would use out of 25 man Naxx. Or the fact that the best in slot Ret one up until 3.2 could only be attained by hardcore arena play. I'm sure all relic classes deal with this, Paladin was just my main up until recently.
Forty just wants to be a snarky little bastard in every one of these WoW threads.
Wow, blizzard doesn't know how to itemize relics properly? This is breaking fucking news!
Unless of course you've been paying attention to the game since, well, relics were in the game. I'm looking at you every relic for Prot Paladins for all of TBC except the one from Mother Shahraz. Or how about the increased consecrate spellpower one they thought Prot Paladins would use out of 25 man Naxx. Or the fact that the best in slot Ret one up until 3.2 could only be attained by hardcore arena play. I'm sure all relic classes deal with this, Paladin was just my main up until recently.
There's a difference between not itemizing well and completely forgetting that a spec exists. Regardless of whether or not each relic is that good for its role, there has been a relic available to every tree of every relic class at each tier in WotLK, until Blizzard completely forgot about blood with the 245 level sigils.
Posts
What? I never said anything, anywhere, about Virulence, or DW. We were talking about tanking and Improved Icy Touch. Did you mis-quote?
In This Thread
In This Thread
You know when I saw that ITT thing while reading the post I figure IIT was what they meant to type and finished moving through the thread.
Then im thinking of the wrong talent, its the one that provides 3% hit with 3 points into it...
You were worried that your post pointing out a typo/simple mistake might make you look like an asshole if you made it a double post?
Then you posted it twice more because it was very important that he understand that he used 2 "T"s instead of 2 "I"s?
Then you were patronizing when someone pointed out what a trivial and easily understood error it was that you were so diligently calling attention to?
Yeah, it's a good thing you didn't doublepost there. Totally would have been an asshole move.
No, you were thinking of the right talent but remembering it wrong. Virulence gives 3% spell hit, and we have no talents that improve melee hit - we still need 8%. Virulence just helps us not need to go over that to make sure our spell attacks don't miss too often.
At the time I wasn't expecting it to take such effort to get the point across.
Full circle!
Blood normally has issues with AOE tanking. So I talented (in unholy) + glyphed D&D.
My AOE tanking style as blood is D&D, IT, PS, Pest, rune tap, blood boil. They stick to me like glue.
I like DRW as it gives me a bit of burst for "burn the boss"
Nerves of Cold Steel is the talent I was actually talking about. It increases your hit chance by 3% making special cap 5%.
No doubt that Unholy Presence can speed up Razorice a bit, but it's not like you'll reap the benefits of a full stack on anything other than a boss anyway, so a few seconds of 1%-3% less damage until you reach the 10th stack won't exactly make that big of a difference. The increased movement speed and more lenient recovery from a Dodged attack are great though.
I don't use Horn of Winter unless it's the beginning of a fight or if it's about to fall off, because quite frankly, I'm usually swimming in Runic Power due to prioritizing Obliterate over Frost Strike.
All I can say is, I tested both Presences quite a bit, and at least for me, the best I could get with Unholy Presence was to match what I could output in Blood Presence. Usually it was 200-300 DPS lower.
I suppose I could test them out a bit more, as I gave up on Unholy Presence after a couple of days trying to make it work for me.
Cats
Forsake, Warlock of Stonemaul
Yup. No other way around it. But you do get free First Aid skill! Which is kinda ironic... seeing as your dead and all. Well, I should say, Undead.
Shitty beans. I noticed the FA too, and figured "oh cool most of the professions must be like that"
Forsake, Warlock of Stonemaul
I do low level quests while I am leveling gathering skills. At least that way my reputation isn't complete crap when buying and repairing at city faction vendors. (Also reduces the cost of any vanity pets or mounts you want to buy from old world factions.)
I level those professions before going to Outland so that I don't get annoyed at skipping all the potential skill ups and materials.
Ahh, there we go.
Who cares?
I want to know more PA people on Twitter.
Forsake, Warlock of Stonemaul
Yeah can't go wrong with that combo. Sucks trawling the lowbie zones to level them at first but it's worth getting caught up before you start levelling.
I want to know more PA people on Twitter.
You sure showed them!
Yeah I'm guessing the relic is on a 45s internal cd
I want to know more PA people on Twitter.
I looked at wowhead last night, and it claims the effect has an 80% proc rate, so even with Blizzard finally remembering they created the blood tree, assuming there's no ICD like with the feral idol, it looks like yet another case where Blizzard forgets how the spec actually works.
I want to know more PA people on Twitter.
I am amazed at how hard you seem to work at pointing out other people's mistakes, and how much satisfaction you apparently get out of it.
Unless of course you've been paying attention to the game since, well, relics were in the game. I'm looking at you every relic for Prot Paladins for all of TBC except the one from Mother Shahraz. Or how about the increased consecrate spellpower one they thought Prot Paladins would use out of 25 man Naxx. Or the fact that the best in slot Ret one up until 3.2 could only be attained by hardcore arena play. I'm sure all relic classes deal with this, Paladin was just my main up until recently.
Forty just wants to be a snarky little bastard in every one of these WoW threads.
It's not hard work at all.