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    Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    People who spend more than ten bucks on art confuse me.

    Zen Vulgarity on
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    PodlyPodly you unzipped me! it's all coming back! i don't like it!Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?

    Podly on
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    SarksusSarksus ATTACK AND DETHRONE GODRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    People who spend more than ten bucks on art confuse me.

    LOL IS VIDEO GAMES ART

    Sarksus on
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    CindersCinders Whose sails were black when it was windy Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    People who spend more than ten bucks on art confuse me.

    Damn E-pirates.

    Cinders on
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    HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    People who spend more than ten bucks on art confuse me.
    man a tube of oil paint costs more than 10 bucks

    Hakkekage on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Podly wrote: »
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?

    Heh, I knew this question was coming. *grabs some popcorn* let's see how this plays out.

    Inquisitor on
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    Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Whelp too bad!

    ngbbs49923a9e5fb9c.jpg

    Zen Vulgarity on
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    PodlyPodly you unzipped me! it's all coming back! i don't like it!Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    I DO COCAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAINE

    Podly on
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    CokebotleCokebotle 穴掘りの 電車内Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Podly wrote: »
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?

    Heh, I knew this question was coming. *grabs some popcorn* let's see how this plays out.

    I brought the soda! *pulls out a 2 liter of root beer*

    Cokebotle on
    工事中
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    Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Broke up with my girl last night so I went to the club (to the club) :whistle:

    Zen Vulgarity on
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    ResRes __BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Podly wrote: »
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?

    Because an art that you like and think is awesome might look stupid to me and then I might not like it.

    --

    I love how Law and Order SVU tries to be edgy all the time. CHARGE MOTHERS OF FAS BABIES AS CRIMINALS IS THAT RITE TO DO???

    Res on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    really podly?

    Variable on
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    ZimmydoomZimmydoom Accept no substitutes Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Podly wrote: »
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?

    Shut up, Podly.

    Zimmydoom on
    Better-than-birthday-sig!
    Gim wrote: »
    Zimmydoom, Zimmydoom
    Flew away in a balloon
    Had sex with polar bears
    While sitting in a reclining chair
    Now there are Zim-Bear hybrids
    Running around and clawing eyelids
    Watch out, a Zim-Bear is about to have sex with yooooooou!
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Podly wrote: »
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?

    Heh, I knew this question was coming. *grabs some popcorn* let's see how this plays out.

    Because it doesn't exist without perception, and perception varies from person to person and even within each person, probably infinitely.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    I don't think "subjective" in terms of value judgments, but to the interpretation of the artwork, which is a collection of images designed to illicit certain cognitive responses.

    Which I think is what Podly might be getting at.

    But I think he's doing it just to do it.

    CopyofPiggyattersmonocles.jpg

    Zen Vulgarity on
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    HarrierHarrier The Star Spangled Man Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Cinders wrote: »
    Harrier wrote: »
    Ahahaha, there's going to be an honest-to-God secession candidate in the Texas governor's race.

    Link please, I want to know if I need a visa if I want to see my Texas friends.
    Here's the Texas Secession Party's website.

    You know what the worst part is? I see the bullshit bondholder bailout that Tim Geithner's trying to foist on the American taxpayer, I see the way Congress is dithering... and a tiny voice in my head says, "Maybe this wouldn't be such a bad idea."

    I tell myself that Texas couldn't last on its own, especially without any major industry, but... we do generate most of our own electricity, so we'd have that advantage going for us.

    Harrier on
    I don't wanna kill anybody. I don't like bullies. I don't care where they're from.
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    PodlyPodly you unzipped me! it's all coming back! i don't like it!Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Res wrote: »
    Because an art that you like and think is awesome might look stupid to me and then I might not like it.

    So then "art" itself is not subjective, but rather the evaluation of art is -- that art is an object upon which we judge a value predicate?

    Podly on
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    JustinSane07JustinSane07 Really, stupid? Brockton__BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Whelp too bad!

    ngbbs49923a9e5fb9c.jpg

    Love that show.

    JustinSane07 on
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    Shazkar ShadowstormShazkar Shadowstorm Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    i want to go to NIN
    but i broke

    84094790.jpg

    Shazkar Shadowstorm on
    poo
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    Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Art valued over the cost of the materials put into it are not worth it to me.

    Zen Vulgarity on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    But I think he's doing it just to do it.

    I think it's important to question the assumptions of our culture from time to time.

    Inquisitor on
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    HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Podly wrote: »
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?
    its meaning changes over time and it is a conversation between its content and its form? What we consider less skillful art--take egyptian carvings, for example, which are pretty much abstractions of the human figure--were not valued by the ancient egyptians because they were well done, but because they served their purpose of glorification and recording of events

    i mean i'm taking that example from ghombrich who i read like...5 years ago, but still

    the standards by which we judge art are wholly a factor of its time. Baroque was originally a dirty word. So was impressionism. But if you hate on Caravaggio to an art history major in this day and age you is gonna get SHANKED

    hell i like mannerism better than high renaissance

    Hakkekage on
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    RichyRichy Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Is music "art"?

    What about a rap song about a girl's butt? Is that "art"?

    What if the girl in question is the Venus de Milo, and the song is sung in front of the Mona Lisa? Is it "art" then?

    Richy on
    sig.gif
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    ResRes __BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Podly wrote: »
    Res wrote: »
    Because an art that you like and think is awesome might look stupid to me and then I might not like it.

    So then "art" itself is not subjective, but rather the evaluation of art is -- that art is an object upon which we judge a value predicate?

    You can call something an art and then I might call it poop.

    Res on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    matt has a problemmatt has a problem Points to 'off' Points to 'on'Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Richy wrote: »
    Is music "art"?

    What about a rap song about a girl's butt? Is that "art"?

    What if the girl in question is the Venus de Milo, and the song is sung in front of the Mona Lisa? Is it "art" then?
    What if it's sung as if it's the Mona Lisa singing it about the Venus de Milo?

    matt has a problem on
    nibXTE7.png
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    DynagripDynagrip Break me a million hearts HoustonRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited March 2009
    Harrier wrote: »
    Cinders wrote: »
    Harrier wrote: »
    Ahahaha, there's going to be an honest-to-God secession candidate in the Texas governor's race.

    Link please, I want to know if I need a visa if I want to see my Texas friends.
    Here's the Texas Secession Party's website.

    You know what the worst part is? I see the bullshit bondholder bailout that Tim Geithner's trying to foist on the American taxpayer, I see the way Congress is dithering... and a tiny voice in my head says, "Maybe this wouldn't be such a bad idea."

    I tell myself that Texas couldn't last on its own, especially without any major industry, but... we do generate most of our own electricity, so we'd have that advantage going for us.
    oil refining is a major industry.

    Dynagrip on
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    CindersCinders Whose sails were black when it was windy Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    i want to go to NIN
    but i broke

    I want to go to the Ultra Music Festival, but I broke too.

    Cinders on
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    Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    But I think he's doing it just to do it.

    I think it's important to question the assumptions of our culture from time to time.

    Art having a subjective quality is a weird assumption to challenge.

    Although, with the fucking month I've spent on race laws, I think everyone should fuck until we're all brown.

    Zen Vulgarity on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Variable wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    that makes sense VH. I got into that without really thinking that if I cared more I'd probably react similarly.
    Well, like I said, it affects me when he's talking about stuff I don't give as much of a shit about too.

    I think I'm just more annoyed by condescension than you are.

    But man, the dude disapproves of "it makes me feel good" as a reason for liking things, and then goes down a list of the things he likes to do because they make him feel like he's superior to other people. How seriously can you really take anything such a person says?

    it's bad enough to make up reasons someone likes something, it's far worse when they actually explain themselves.

    I don't follow. Are you under the mistaken impression that I made any of that up?

    ViolentChemistry on
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    OrganichuOrganichu poops peesRegistered User, Moderator mod
    edited March 2009
    Organichu wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    So consider the following factors:

    1.) I have $6k in student loans (a federally consolidated loan for which I meet the minimum every month)
    2.) I have $5.1k owed directly to my prior university from which I received no credits, which I am seriously delinquent on but which they don't send to collections I guess because they're a university.
    3.) I'm 21 and I don't make very much money
    4.) I live in PA
    5.) We're in a recession

    Should I go to PSU? I feel like going to a larger school that allows me to take out loans for dorms (like Penn State) would be wise because a.) I'd be working towards a degree, b.) I'd have more free money to pay my active, interest-bearing debt with my old university, and c.) I'd be able to defer my federally consolidated loan while at PSU.

    Thoughts?
    Unless you plan to lie on your application, you'll have to disclose that you attended the prior university, as well as provide transcripts. The new university most likely won't admit you, knowing you owe the prior one 5 grand.

    Man, I hadn't even considered that. Shit.
    Universities tend to be very willing to work out payment plans with you. It can't hurt to at least call and see if you can set up something you can afford. At least then you'd be current, and able to apply to new schools.

    Thanks dude.

    Do you think there's any chance that the Fed would include this debt in my consolidation? It's not a loan but obviously it's a significant expense occurred in the pursuit of my education. Probably not but it'd be fanfuckingtastic if I could defer that $5.1k while I were in school, which could be done if my consolidated loan would swallow it. Or do they only deal with actual loans?

    Organichu on
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    SarksusSarksus ATTACK AND DETHRONE GODRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    I had a paragraph written about the subjectivity, or rather the objective nature, of art, but then I saw Poldy's continuation of his point and I'll just forget it. I love you, Poldy.

    Sarksus on
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    HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Art valued over the cost of the materials put into it are not worth it to me.
    yeah this would have been the prevailing attitude in like...the 1400s, when artists were just artisans

    now it is all about the intellectual artist brah

    bout 500 years too late to the party thurr

    Hakkekage on
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    Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    Art valued over the cost of the materials put into it are not worth it to me.
    yeah this would have been the prevailing attitude in like...the 1400s, when artists were just artisans

    now it is all about the intellectual artist brah

    bout 500 years too late to the party thurr

    Remind me to dig money out of artist's pockets.

    Zen Vulgarity on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Art having a subjective quality is a weird assumption to challenge.

    It's also weird to have a privileged category that is above any kind of objectivity, and once you've created this privileged category then it becomes important to figure out what does and does not fall within its domain.

    Or something, I'm just musing here.

    Inquisitor on
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    Shazkar ShadowstormShazkar Shadowstorm Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    imma punch someone soon

    Shazkar Shadowstorm on
    poo
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    JustinSane07JustinSane07 Really, stupid? Brockton__BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Batboy_Steals_MINI.jpg

    BAT BOY RIDES AGAIN!

    JustinSane07 on
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    ResRes __BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Res wrote: »
    Podly wrote: »
    Res wrote: »
    Because an art that you like and think is awesome might look stupid to me and then I might not like it.

    So then "art" itself is not subjective, but rather the evaluation of art is -- that art is an object upon which we judge a value predicate?

    You can call something an art and then I might call it poop.

    Obligatory but also I can poop and then say it's art.

    Res on
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    ViolentChemistryViolentChemistry __BANNED USERS regular
    edited March 2009
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    Podly wrote: »
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    art is completely subjective

    why?
    its meaning changes over time and it is a conversation between its content and its form? What we consider less skillful art--take egyptian carvings, for example, which are pretty much abstractions of the human figure--were not valued by the ancient egyptians because they were well done, but because they served their purpose of glorification and recording of events

    i mean i'm taking that example from ghombrich who i read like...5 years ago, but still

    the standards by which we judge art are wholly a factor of its time. Baroque was originally a dirty word. So was impressionism. But if you hate on Caravaggio to an art history major in this day and age you is gonna get SHANKED

    hell i like mannerism better than high renaissance

    Then you fall into his cop-out. Go with my answer, his cop-out doesn't work on that one.

    ViolentChemistry on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    edited March 2009
    nevermind VC, not worth it.

    Variable on
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    PodlyPodly you unzipped me! it's all coming back! i don't like it!Registered User regular
    edited March 2009
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    its meaning changes over time and it is a conversation between its content and its form? What we consider less skillful art--take egyptian carvings, for example, which are pretty much abstractions of the human figure--were not valued by the ancient egyptians because they were well done, but because they served their purpose of glorification and recording of events

    i mean i'm taking that example from ghombrich who i read like...5 years ago, but still

    the standards by which we judge art are wholly a factor of its time. Baroque was originally a dirty word. So was impressionism. But if you hate on Caravaggio to an art history major in this day and age you is gonna get SHANKED

    hell i like mannerism better than high renaissance

    There are many flaws in this argument. For starters, it assumes that something could have a private meaning. How could anything have a private meaning? If it cannot be expressed publicly, it cannot have meaning. And if it CAN be expressed publicly, there is already a principle of verification with which we are comparing our opinions.

    If it changes over time, that means that it is not subject based, but rather preserved within objective culture. This, again, shows that it is not inherently subjective.

    If it is a conversation between content and form, than it is NECESSARILY not subjective, because content is only formed within context, and context is a historically dependent entity. It exists as a part of a world with which we interact which has always - already established values. This is basic hermeneutics.

    Also, you are comparing two examples of institutional "high art." Pop is much different.

    Podly on
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