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Housemate is a deadbeat, and now is broke. [Solved]
Daedalus
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Registered User regular
Currently I live in a two-bedroom apartment with my fiancee and another girl. We'll call her Amber. My fiancee and I share one room and Amber has the other room. We split rent evenly three ways, which is more fair than it looks at first because the room that my fiancee and I share is twice the size of the room Amber has to herself. We all share food, and my fiancee and I do virtually all of the cooking because left to her own devices, Amber would live off of ramen and Wendy's. The way it's been working is that Amber pays for the gas and electric, and my fiancee and I pay for the food. This was initially done out of convenience, because the utilities were in Amber's name, and we'd save the receipts for a month and add and compare them etc. etc, but after a few months of the food total coming out to exactly the utilities total (plus or minus like ten dollars) we just stuck with the system and stopped bothering to save receipts, by mutual agreement.
My fiancee and I are stuck doing essentially all of the chores around the house because Amber never does any. If asked to, for instance, wash some dishes, she'll say "yeah, I'll do it later" or something similar and maybe she'll do half a sinkfull sometime before the end of the week. Maybe. During last summer vacation, when she was alone in the apartment for a couple months, she had completely trashed the place and then went on some week-long trip on the day she knew we were coming back, so my fiancee and I spent two full days cleaning up the garbage on the living room floor, the rotting food left out in the kitchen, the dead hamster's cage in the bathroom (!) and all sorts of other problems. We've basically put up with this because, well, we signed a lease and we're stuck with her.
We've lived like this for a bit over a year and a half. Our lease ends at the end of May, and that's when I graduate college, move to a different state, start my job, and, well, enter the real world.
Here's where shit just got bad: Amber, in addition to never doing any of her share of the damn work, always terribly mismanages her finances. She's ended up broke on rent twice before. Once, my fiancee lent her the money, she paid it back after a month or so, and everything was okay(ish). A second time, Amber's sister helped her out.
It's not as if the other two of us are loaded. Amber's running off of the same amount of student loans and financial aid as my fiancee and she's never needed me to cover her rent. Amber has a tendency to spend any spare cash she has on shit like DVD sets and expensive clothes and going out to restaurants more than someone with her cash reserves should.
Anyway, sure enough, she's flat broke and doesn't have the money to pay the rent or utility bill for April. She asked me for the money, since her sister won't bail her out anymore, and I told her that I'm not really doing that great myself right now (which is true; I've got to save up my money for the move), and that I'd talk it over with my fiancee later today, when she got done with classes. I did this because I'm a big pussy who can't stand pissing people off. My fiancee and I have already talked this possibility over when she was doing some kind of emergency yard sale last weekend and we have no intention of giving her money.
Sidenote: she asked me this today, while right behind her, in the kitchen, was a massive pile of dishes she dirtied last weekend during some kind of party while we were away. A pile of dishes that we've asked her to clean twice now.
She also told us that she was looking for a part-time job, but this is fictional: she spends 100% of her free time in her room watching Friends reruns.
Anyway, my initial gut reaction to this is to wait until she leaves, box up all her stuff, move it out to the curb, and change the locks on the doors. This is almost certainly a very bad idea, so what's the right way to handle this? I could put up with it and just pay the money (we only have two more months, and I can probably cover it), but I think I've got too much self-respect (or, perhaps, built-up anger) to do that. Besides, my fiancee would kill me; she hates Amber more than I do at this point (which is ironic, because Amber was her friend in the beginning; I didn't really know her until we all moved in).
tl;dr: hated housemate can't pay rent, utilities. advice?
My fiancee and I are stuck doing essentially all of the chores around the house because Amber never does any. If asked to, for instance, wash some dishes, she'll say "yeah, I'll do it later" or something similar and maybe she'll do half a sinkfull sometime before the end of the week. Maybe. During last summer vacation, when she was alone in the apartment for a couple months, she had completely trashed the place and then went on some week-long trip on the day she knew we were coming back, so my fiancee and I spent two full days cleaning up the garbage on the living room floor, the rotting food left out in the kitchen, the dead hamster's cage in the bathroom (!) and all sorts of other problems. We've basically put up with this because, well, we signed a lease and we're stuck with her.
We've lived like this for a bit over a year and a half. Our lease ends at the end of May, and that's when I graduate college, move to a different state, start my job, and, well, enter the real world.
Here's where shit just got bad: Amber, in addition to never doing any of her share of the damn work, always terribly mismanages her finances. She's ended up broke on rent twice before. Once, my fiancee lent her the money, she paid it back after a month or so, and everything was okay(ish). A second time, Amber's sister helped her out.
It's not as if the other two of us are loaded. Amber's running off of the same amount of student loans and financial aid as my fiancee and she's never needed me to cover her rent. Amber has a tendency to spend any spare cash she has on shit like DVD sets and expensive clothes and going out to restaurants more than someone with her cash reserves should.
Anyway, sure enough, she's flat broke and doesn't have the money to pay the rent or utility bill for April. She asked me for the money, since her sister won't bail her out anymore, and I told her that I'm not really doing that great myself right now (which is true; I've got to save up my money for the move), and that I'd talk it over with my fiancee later today, when she got done with classes. I did this because I'm a big pussy who can't stand pissing people off. My fiancee and I have already talked this possibility over when she was doing some kind of emergency yard sale last weekend and we have no intention of giving her money.
Sidenote: she asked me this today, while right behind her, in the kitchen, was a massive pile of dishes she dirtied last weekend during some kind of party while we were away. A pile of dishes that we've asked her to clean twice now.
She also told us that she was looking for a part-time job, but this is fictional: she spends 100% of her free time in her room watching Friends reruns.
Anyway, my initial gut reaction to this is to wait until she leaves, box up all her stuff, move it out to the curb, and change the locks on the doors. This is almost certainly a very bad idea, so what's the right way to handle this? I could put up with it and just pay the money (we only have two more months, and I can probably cover it), but I think I've got too much self-respect (or, perhaps, built-up anger) to do that. Besides, my fiancee would kill me; she hates Amber more than I do at this point (which is ironic, because Amber was her friend in the beginning; I didn't really know her until we all moved in).
tl;dr: hated housemate can't pay rent, utilities. advice?
Daedalus on
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And with the utilities... well, even if she doesn't pay them at all between now and the end of May, I would guess that they probably won't cut you off until then (end of May) and it's under her name so not really a problem for you.
So my advice is, don't pay any of her stuff, it shouldn't be a problem for you anyway, and Amber doesn't sound like a friendship you or your fiancee will be keeping long term anyway.
If you want advice about what to say when she asks you for money, I mean... the unique thing here is that you don't really seem to want to keep the friendship alive or anything (unlike most of these posts) so just tell her - you are saving your money for moving at the end of May and that she's spent nearly 2 years sitting around masturbating to Monica and Chandler re-runs so she can pay her own fucking bills and you don't give a damn.
Besides, he's been a really nice guy these past two years; I don't want him to get the shit end of this.
But it may be the only option.
If its legal in your area, boot her the fuck out.
Even if you don't intend keeping this girl on your Christmas card list I would still just keep things cordial and give her the practical reason for not giving her the money. Then I would talk to your landlord inform him of the situation and ask how this is going to affect your reference.
You know what you need to do, like right the fuck now?
Call your landlord.
From the landlord side of things, we're not interested in fucking over nice people. Fucking over deadbeats who don't pay rent, yes. I'd probably tell you exactly what onceling said - as long as you pay your part of the rent, we don't have a problem, and I'd still give you a positive reference. For the utilities, if they're not in your name - tough shit on her account. :P
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This is a very good idea and I'll do that as soon as I can, hopefully before Amber does.
You will most likely end up having to pay her rent, utilities are in her name so if you can manage without utilities don't pay them. You can always hold her accountable for what she owes to YOU, but YOU owe the owner the full ammount.
Talk to your landlord, if it's a private owner they may be understanding of the situation, if it's a big company you'll have a 0% chance of understanding.
Just remember for references, a late payment is a late payment. Period.
My advice would be to go directly to your landlord. Explain the situation to him, explain that you and your girlfriend are still willing and able to pay your share as stipulated, and explain that you're doing your best to be good tenants, but there's just nothing you can do about your roommate. And there really isn't. You have no legal authority over her, and from the sound of things, talking to her will accomplish nothing. Your landlord, on the other hand, does have official avenues through which he can obtain the rent. Yes, it sucks for him to have to deal with it, but that's part of being a landlord, and he should be equipped to handle it. If your lease was clear on the fact that you, your girlfriend, and your roommate are three separate entities with individual responsibilities for rent, then you have nothing to worry about. And since the utilities are all in her name, you're in the clear there, too.
Just tell your landlord about it, and do it sooner rather than later.
Aside from that, you should be confronting Amber with this stuff. She's not working, and attempting to help herself, and she's certainly not upholding her end of keeping the home clean. She doesn't deserve help from you. You don't deserve the burden she will incur on you. You can't NOT pay her portion of the bills, but you need to figure out a way to either get her to move out, or some other kind of penalty. I'm really not sure what there is to be done. The way leases work always fuck the responsible people. Every time.
Good luck with this bullshit. I hope everything works out for you.
The landlord will be key I think.
Don't help her. When she can't pay her share, tell the landlord, and he/she will kick her out.
Because this is retarded, and she is retarded for doing it, and I'm frankly amazed that you've stood for this crap for so long.
No, in almost every state and in every lease I have every seen the landlord will just make him pay the full rent when due or evict all three of them.
I have never seen a lease that was not "jointly and severely liable".
I'll call him up after class ends today and ask his advice, though. And I'll dig up my copy of the lease and see what it says exactly.
Changed that for you; but just because the landlord can does not mean he will. Especially if Daedalus has been a good tenant, always paid on time, etc. A unit providing $(Rent x 66%) is more profitable than a unit providing $0.
If your landlord is amicable to things, I would try to get something in writing from him stipulating that you will not be held legally liable for the unpaid amount of $X on the unit located at (Address here) and that he will pursue legal action for remuneration directly from Amber.
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Yeah, that won't work either; she's graduating and going to South Korea after this semester, and in all likelyhood I'll never see her or (more importantly) her money again if she doesn't pay it back by the end of the semester (which she almost certainly will not be able to).
Yes, because he needs to be dipping his toe in the "loan shark" tank right about now ... o_O And like he said, not like he'd get the money back anyways. He needs to stonewall Amber and talk to the landlord.
Also Daed, how much money are we talking about (in terms of owing the landlord, we'll leave the utility company out of it as they'll go after her directly if it comes to legalities)
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Anyway, my impression of landlords who are primarly people (and not companies) is that they consider a good tenant one who pays AND one who discusses problems with them, rather than trying to go over their heads. If you're talking with him, even if you have to work out a deal with paying the rent, he's likely to give you a good reference.
How is she moving to south korea w/ no money?
If you want to deal with her regarding dishes/cleanup and whatforth, just confront her directly. Right now the house I have, I'm the landlord for it and have two people living here. One roommate is fine, sticks to himself, doesn't make a mess or much noise and pays rent on time.
The other douche bag is pretty much the exact opposite. Never cleans, never washes dishes, never picks up after himself, never pays rent on time.
I've heard excuses around the likes of:
"Well I don't see the point in washing those dishes, I'm just going to use them later."
"I didn't give you the rent because then I'd have to go downstairs and knock on you're door."
The key to get the lazy bitch to do anything is just be upfront and direct with him. Chew them out if you want to get something done, don't walk around it trying to avoid it. Hell, me and him used to work together, and I had no problem telling him he was a lazy piece of shit (and much less nice things) in front of co-workers and senior staff members.
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Anyway, he told me to tell Amber to call him and they could work something out. I get home and tell Amber this and she tells me, "oh, I can get the rent, I just can't handle the utilities and internet bills". Then there's a big fight about her not doing chores.
I'm going to try and figure out how much she actually has, but probably some time after she's not all pissed off, so I can have an actual, y'know, conversation. Then I'll figure out what I'm paying. I don't think the utility company will disconnect in less than two months, and if I end up paying the internet bill, I swear I'll lock her out of it at the router level.
I like the way you think.
Sounds like you have this wrapped up then, its already been said it will take longer than 2 months for you to be cut off even if she doesn't pay. With that in mind if she still takes this problem to you I recommend a favourite Dr Cox quote of mine "I'm prescribing 20 cc's of it's not my problem any more!" (best said while walking away). :P
Come to think of it, does anyone know how long NYSEG takes to do a non-payment disconnect? I can't find it on their website. (I'm not worried about it affecting my credit rating; like I said, it's all in her name.)
edit: Called them up, they said 15 days after the disconnect notice. Hurm.
She should pay all of the utilities first, and pay the rest of the money left over (im assuming cost of utilities < cost of rent) to the landlord and worry about what she owes later.
This way the only person truly effected by the situation is her. And on the positive side, instead of completely screwing her credit up by being late on a number of bills she will be able to deal with someone who is actually interested in not dicking her over. She's obviously not in a good position right now, but if I were in your situation I'd rather not see her end up further under water than she needs to be.
One of my old roommates had problems paying the rent ontime some months, so we always made sure the electric/gas/cable/internet bills were paid first (so the rest of the people living there weren't disrupted). Because we, like you, had a pretty cool landlord, he was OK with four of us paying rent at the beginning of the month, and the fifth check coming a bit later.
edit: The current electric bill is due April 3rd. I may need to put some money toward that one, but I can certainly get away with her skipping the following one.
They'll hammer her with late fees.
Yeah but its usually take 4 or 5 weeks for them to send the disconnect notice possible longer. My Ex roommate ignored a bill for 3 months once. :P
Nah, I don't really see a reason to dick her like that, even if she is a terrible roommate, when it can be avoided.
Have her pay the utilities and then she can talk to the landlord about a payment schedule for the rent. He's willing to work with her, other companies don't care.
I agree with you that she needs a kick in the ass, and she isn't interested in any sort of financial advice, but why not give it one last try? Let her know what route is the best one for her to take, it's up to her if she decides to take it or not (and you're only stuck with her for another month-ish anyway).
Believe me, if the landlord is willing to work with her and she ends up fucking that up too, it will end up giving her a much bigger kick in the ass than the current situation will.
This is not exactly "good advice" material but at times in the past I haven't paid utility bills for months at a time and all they do is keep sending bills and perhaps call to talk to you about setting up payments. I'm sure this varies by company but I doubt anywhere is like "PAY NOW OR ELSE" ten days after the first bill is due. I've never even had to pay a late fee for utilities. And they will warn you of the final shut-off notice. (This almost happened with my internet bill once but I called and paid by credit card that day and there was no shut-off.)
It's still bad advice to suggest "just skip the util bills, they can't do anything for a while," not that anyone is doing that, but the point is that they are often "cool" in a way similar to your landlord -- they'll set up payments, or let you pay late, or charge you a small fee for doing so. For instance, my water bill is typically $58 per quarter, and they charge an extra $2 if it's 15 days late. Not exactly breaking the bank if I don't have the money.
Some cell phone plans can be "frozen," where it basically turns off service but keeps the contract intact so you don't have to pay for early-termination - my parents froze their account when they went to Europe, then turned it back on when they got back. Just something to keep in mind it if comes up.
This isn't heavily relevant, but those jobs are usually pretty valid. :P