I'd imagine even if he is viewed as being "part of the family", being in there with him for any length of time must still be stressful.
I assume you're talking about the gorilla knowing his own strength with regards to the dude, but with their relationship and how trusting and mutual it seems, and my suspicion that the dude knows well enough how to communicate with the apes that any "ouch" from the dude would be enough for the ape to pull it back.
I assume you're talking about the gorilla knowing his own strength with regards to the dude, but with their relationship and how trusting and mutual it seems, and my suspicion that the dude knows well enough how to communicate with the apes that any "ouch" from the dude would be enough for the ape to pull it back.
It's still a gorilla. The guy looks relaxed and he probably is pretty relaxed - animals can usually tell if you're faking, and that makes them nervous - but I'm sure he never forgets how powerful that thing really is.
There's also the fact that, apparently, the gorilla considers himself dominant in the social structure to the human, and I'm sure the dude knows how a subordinate gorilla is supposed to act and what not to do to challenge that opinion. Also, if the gorilla is in a shitty mood I'd say he doesn't go in there.
The specialized phenotypes found within ant species and other eusocial animals are amazing. It's actually a very small percentage that exhibit the di or polymorphism that creates literal castes (soldier, worker, etc.) but when it exists it's amazing. You have honeypot ants where some individuals will develop large bladder-like sacks throughout their abdomen that allow them to store food in order to act as living larders.
This functionality, while beneficial, will literally cage them within chambered segments of their nests, causing their existence to become solely dependent upon their brethren, even being consumed in times of desperation instead of regurgitation. I just think it's amazing when the phenotypic traits of a segment of a population have reached an evolutionary point where it is actually debilitating, requiring mutualism, it's a lot like specialized groups within human society (so early farmers supporting an artisan class by moving beyond survival farming). There are even some examples where the heads of soldiers have swollen to such a degree that they must be fed by their worker sisters.
I think it sometimes makes more sense to think of the ant nest as being the living organism, rather than the ants. In the same way that you think of me as being an organism, rather than my individual cells.
It's also interesting how basically every phylum and major order of animals always has some creatures that have evolved back into "worm form." (Current exceptions among vertebrates are birds and mammals, though those mole-rats are coming pretty close.)
Eel (eels are teleost fish, evolved from normal-shaped bony fish):
Caecilian (this is an amphibian)
Worm lizard (this is a reptile)
Compare to naked mole-rats:
(I just found a website claiming that the mammal lineage actually descended from worm-lizards, which is interesting.)
I assume you're talking about the gorilla knowing his own strength with regards to the dude, but with their relationship and how trusting and mutual it seems, and my suspicion that the dude knows well enough how to communicate with the apes that any "ouch" from the dude would be enough for the ape to pull it back.
It's still a gorilla. The guy looks relaxed and he probably is pretty relaxed - animals can usually tell if you're faking, and that makes them nervous - but I'm sure he never forgets how powerful that thing really is.
There's also the fact that, apparently, the gorilla considers himself dominant in the social structure to the human, and I'm sure the dude knows how a subordinate gorilla is supposed to act and what not to do to challenge that opinion. Also, if the gorilla is in a shitty mood I'd say he doesn't go in there.
I don't see how this is fundamentally any different than my favorite primates. My girlfriend could kick my ass.
I assume you're talking about the gorilla knowing his own strength with regards to the dude, but with their relationship and how trusting and mutual it seems, and my suspicion that the dude knows well enough how to communicate with the apes that any "ouch" from the dude would be enough for the ape to pull it back.
It's still a gorilla. The guy looks relaxed and he probably is pretty relaxed - animals can usually tell if you're faking, and that makes them nervous - but I'm sure he never forgets how powerful that thing really is.
There's also the fact that, apparently, the gorilla considers himself dominant in the social structure to the human, and I'm sure the dude knows how a subordinate gorilla is supposed to act and what not to do to challenge that opinion. Also, if the gorilla is in a shitty mood I'd say he doesn't go in there.
frankly the gorilla fucking is dominant when you're in the cage with him
you do what he says, because if you don't, well. it's a gorilla.
I think it sometimes makes more sense to think of the ant nest as being the living organism, rather than the ants. In the same way that you think of me as being an organism, rather than my individual cells.
The boundaries between "organism" and "group of organism" are basically lines in the sand. See the siphonophores on the first page. What the fuck are they?
See also slime-molds and sponges. (Neither of which are "really" animals, or even metazoans, but they're at the boundary):
Slime molds consist of separate, individual amoeba-like organisms. But they can cluster together to form what look and act like unified bodies, even differentiating into distinct "organs" to faciliate reproduction.
Sponges are immobile groups of cells that collectively whip their little flagellates to move water through the sponge's structure, grabbing tiny bits of food as the water passes. You can pass a sponge through a wire mesh, and it will come back together.
It's also interesting how basically every phylum and major order of animals always has some creatures that have evolved back into "worm form." (Current exceptions among vertebrates are birds and mammals, though those mole-rats are coming pretty close.)
*worms*
(I just found a website claiming that the mammal lineage actually descended from worm-lizards, which is interesting.)
There's also a worm-like snake which lives underground off of tiny insects and dirt particles; I got to play with one on a dig once. Their eyes, jaws, etc. are all vestigial.
However, I'm pretty sure that mammals evolved from mammal-like reptiles known as therapsids.
It's also interesting how basically every phylum and major order of animals always has some creatures that have evolved back into "worm form." (Current exceptions among vertebrates are birds and mammals, though those mole-rats are coming pretty close.)
*worms*
(I just found a website claiming that the mammal lineage actually descended from worm-lizards, which is interesting.)
There's also a worm-like snake which lives underground off of tiny insects and dirt particles; I got to play with one on a dig once. Their eyes, jaws, etc. are all vestigial.
However, I'm pretty sure that mammals evolved from mammal-like reptiles known as therapsids.
Bolded for truth, its still an issue of contention though, I actually did a paper tracing the evolution of vibrissae within felidae to therapsids. With the worm-like commonality throughout differing phylums, besides being a catch-all efficient form, you'll also find it as an example of neoteny within any organisms with motile larvae (if applicable).
Beren39 on
Go, Go, EXCALIBUR! - Trent Varsity Swim Team 2009, better watch out for me Phelps!
One of my father's favorite ways of killing ants, especially fire ants, was removing a chunk of one ant colony with a shovel, carrying it across the yard, and dump it on the other colony. After the dust settles the next day, he then would do it all in reverse and call it the Tet Offensive.
He'd also pause over the ant beds with the lawn mower to suck all the air out and then douse the remaining husk with gasoline and set it on fire. Or he'd throw ammonia and bleach on them in succession, thereby gassing them.
We thought the whole process was funny when we were kids, but now we realize that my father was fucking nuts.
I assume you're talking about the gorilla knowing his own strength with regards to the dude, but with their relationship and how trusting and mutual it seems, and my suspicion that the dude knows well enough how to communicate with the apes that any "ouch" from the dude would be enough for the ape to pull it back.
Never trust apes/monkeys too much. There's a reason someone coined the phrase "he's going apeshit". They may do cute human things and they may learn how to mimic cute human things, but they aren't people with lots of hair. They will fuck you up as bad as a tiger can about as quickly as that tiger can, and will give you just as much warning before they do it.
Never trust apes/monkeys too much. There's a reason someone coined the phrase "he's going apeshit". They may do cute human things and they may learn how to mimic cute human things, but they aren't people with lots of hair. They will fuck you up as bad as a tiger can about as quickly as that tiger can, and will give you just as much warning before they do it.
There was that recent NYT article about people with primate pets. I think every single one of them recalled a situation where their ape was about to tear their face off or accidentally ripped off one of their testicles or something.
On the topic of giant insects: someone suggested that oxygen rich atmospheres produce larger insects and similar creatures, and that is indeed the case. I'm not sure if it's because of evolution to fit the environment (including atmosphere) or simply that individual insects will continue to grow until they cannot properly make use of oxygen at any larger size; I would guess the former.
I'm sure as shit glad we don't have gigantism going on at near the same scale today as we did back in the geologic past, though, especially if humans weren't bigger to compensate. We've still got some megafauna in Africa, and of course in the ocean we've got the whales and the giant squid, but thank God that's the most of it.
6-foot-dragonflies, 8-foot-millipedes, spiders the size of bobcats, scorpions the size of alligators...
One of my father's favorite ways of killing ants, especially fire ants, was removing a chunk of one ant colony with a shovel, carrying it across the yard, and dump it on the other colony. After the dust settles the next day, he then would do it all in reverse and call it the Tet Offensive.
He'd also pause over the ant beds with the lawn mower to suck all the air out and then douse the remaining husk with gasoline and set it on fire. Or he'd throw ammonia and bleach on them in succession, thereby gassing them.
We thought the whole process was funny when we were kids, but now we realize that my father was fucking awesome.
Fixed that for you.
I wish I had thought of the two colonies warring thing when I was a kid.
Never trust apes/monkeys too much. There's a reason someone coined the phrase "he's going apeshit". They may do cute human things and they may learn how to mimic cute human things, but they aren't people with lots of hair. They will fuck you up as bad as a tiger can about as quickly as that tiger can, and will give you just as much warning before they do it.
There was that recent NYT article about people with primate pets. I think every single one of them recalled a situation where their ape was about to tear their face off or accidentally ripped off one of their testicles or something.
Frankly, I'd rather deal with a tiger.
i don't like the idea of primate "pets"
also i'm pretty sure a large male gorilla is easily capable of moving weight that is measured in tons
That's the problem with insects, dude. Kill one? Hell, kill a thousand? Motherfucker laid eggs a few weeks ago which are about to hatch. About five million of em.
And they do this about once a month. Humans wouldn't have a chance.
EDIT: EM - primate pets are presumably small monkeys, tarsiers, and stuff like that, which can and do make good (if undpredictable) pets. They're probably not talking about true apes, which have all kinds of laws surrounding who is allowed to have one and who isn't. Anybody with an ape as a 'pet' is probably a primatologist with a couple of decades of experience.
That's the problem with insects, dude. Kill one? Hell, kill a thousand? Motherfucker laid eggs a few weeks ago which are about to hatch. About five million of em.
And they do this about once a month. Humans wouldn't have a chance.
To be fair, I don't think insects of that mass would be capable of the r-selection reproduction method that is so typical of modern insects.
Beren39 on
Go, Go, EXCALIBUR! - Trent Varsity Swim Team 2009, better watch out for me Phelps!
On the topic of giant insects: someone suggested that oxygen rich atmospheres produce larger insects and similar creatures, and that is indeed the case. I'm not sure if it's because of evolution to fit the environment (including atmosphere) or simply that individual insects will continue to grow until they cannot properly make use of oxygen at any larger size; I would guess the former.
There are studies underway to determine whether or not there's a geometric relationship between the size of an insect and its tracheal system.... basically, is there a point beyond which the trachea takes up too much space in the body of an insect for it to continue to grow, or does the entire insect scale with the tracheal systems? If the relationship fully scales, then there is no limit to how large an insect can grow.
Personally, I wonder if there's a practical limit to how heavy the carapace can be before the insect is overwhelmed by the size of it, but that may not be a big an issue with insect as it would be with vertibrates.
That's the problem with insects, dude. Kill one? Hell, kill a thousand? Motherfucker laid eggs a few weeks ago which are about to hatch. About five million of em.
And they do this about once a month. Humans wouldn't have a chance.
EDIT: EM - primate pets are presumably small monkeys, tarsiers, and stuff like that, which can and do make good (if undpredictable) pets. They're probably not talking about true apes, which have all kinds of laws surrounding who is allowed to have one and who isn't. Anybody with an ape as a 'pet' is probably a primatologist with a couple of decades of experience.
there was a woman who "owned" a chimp, and the chimp was medicated incorrectly and tore off someone's face
it was a recent news article
i am sure she was a primatologist or something, but even so, in her home?
To be fair, I don't think insects of that mass would be capable of the r-selection reproduction method that is so typical of modern insects.
Yeah, I was mostly just being hyperbolic. It does pose some interesting questions about how such "insects" (which I know a millipede isn't really an insect, but arthropods) would have interacted and raised young. Did these monstrous creatures lay a small clutch of eggs and let them hatch, with a little army of ten-inch millipedes riding on Mammapede's back like scorpions are known to do? Did eurypterids have a social structure?
I don't know. And, as interested as I am in paleontology, when I imagine even a small clutch of Arthropleura hatching out at the same time, clawing out of porous eggshells or cocoons or whatever the fuck they did, rearing up to the sky and screeching with horrible vitality...
EDIT: EM - primate pets are presumably small monkeys, tarsiers, and stuff like that, which can and do make good (if undpredictable) pets. They're probably not talking about true apes, which have all kinds of laws surrounding who is allowed to have one and who isn't. Anybody with an ape as a 'pet' is probably a primatologist with a couple of decades of experience.
That's the problem with insects, dude. Kill one? Hell, kill a thousand? Motherfucker laid eggs a few weeks ago which are about to hatch. About five million of em.
And they do this about once a month. Humans wouldn't have a chance.
EDIT: EM - primate pets are presumably small monkeys, tarsiers, and stuff like that, which can and do make good (if undpredictable) pets. They're probably not talking about true apes, which have all kinds of laws surrounding who is allowed to have one and who isn't. Anybody with an ape as a 'pet' is probably a primatologist with a couple of decades of experience.
there was a woman who "owned" a chimp, and the chimp was medicated incorrectly and tore off someone's face
it was a recent news article
i am sure she was a primatologist or something, but even so, in her home?
When adult chimps become enraged around humans it tends to end in someone getting either (or all) their testicles torn off, nose bit off, hand almost severed, or skull bit through. They are amazing creatures and our closest genetic ancestors but they are decidedly scary. I would be nervous having to work around even a 'tame' one.
Beren39 on
Go, Go, EXCALIBUR! - Trent Varsity Swim Team 2009, better watch out for me Phelps!
When adult chimps become enraged around humans it tends to end in someone getting either (or all) their testicles torn off, nose bit off, hand almost severed, or skull bit through. They are amazing creatures and our closest genetic ancestors but they are decidedly scary. I would be nervous having to work around even a 'tame' one.
I wonder what early humans—the ones that didn't "grow up" around chimps—thought of these creatures upon first encounter. They look like hairy little midgets but are 7 times as strong as adult males.
That's the problem with insects, dude. Kill one? Hell, kill a thousand? Motherfucker laid eggs a few weeks ago which are about to hatch. About five million of em.
And they do this about once a month. Humans wouldn't have a chance.
EDIT: EM - primate pets are presumably small monkeys, tarsiers, and stuff like that, which can and do make good (if undpredictable) pets. They're probably not talking about true apes, which have all kinds of laws surrounding who is allowed to have one and who isn't. Anybody with an ape as a 'pet' is probably a primatologist with a couple of decades of experience.
there was a woman who "owned" a chimp, and the chimp was medicated incorrectly and tore off someone's face
it was a recent news article
i am sure she was a primatologist or something, but even so, in her home?
In his defense, though, he had just seen Mission Impossible.
That's the problem with insects, dude. Kill one? Hell, kill a thousand? Motherfucker laid eggs a few weeks ago which are about to hatch. About five million of em.
And they do this about once a month. Humans wouldn't have a chance.
You're right.
Against 8 foot long millipedes, orbital nukes are the only solution. But wait. What if they survived? Okay, at that point we would have to figure out a way to drive the planet into the sun.
I wonder what early humans—the ones that didn't "grow up" around chimps—thought of these creatures upon first encounter. They look like hairy little midgets but are 7 times as strong as adult males.
They probably creeped people the fuck out.
Chimps tend to avoid people whenever possible, for obvious reasons, and they're very good at doing so - despite our opposable thumbs, humans just aren't so big on the whole brachiation thing.
While there's no way to know what early Homo sapiens thought about chimps - or neanderthals, for that matter - I heard somewhere that human groups in the region historically considered chimps/gorillas different tribes of people and generally didn't go into the places where apes lived.
Interestingly, many Native American groups in the Northeast (I think the Iroquois) considered beavers as a separate nation/tribe, because they built permanent structures and because of their social organization.
Interestingly, many Native American groups in the Northeast (I think the Iroquois) considered beavers as a separate nation/tribe, because they built permanent structures and because of their social organization.
How great would it be if you were the guy assigned to be the diplomat to the beaver tribe?
Interestingly, many Native American groups in the Northeast (I think the Iroquois) considered beavers as a separate nation/tribe, because they built permanent structures and because of their social organization.
How great would it be if you were the guy assigned to be the diplomat to the beaver tribe?
You'd definitely get a lot of--
You know what, no, I'm not going to take such an easy one.
Interestingly, many Native American groups in the Northeast (I think the Iroquois) considered beavers as a separate nation/tribe, because they built permanent structures and because of their social organization.
How great would it be if you were the guy assigned to be the diplomat to the beaver tribe?
It wood be hard to get their opineons.
Beren39 on
Go, Go, EXCALIBUR! - Trent Varsity Swim Team 2009, better watch out for me Phelps!
Posts
I assume you're talking about the gorilla knowing his own strength with regards to the dude, but with their relationship and how trusting and mutual it seems, and my suspicion that the dude knows well enough how to communicate with the apes that any "ouch" from the dude would be enough for the ape to pull it back.
There's also the fact that, apparently, the gorilla considers himself dominant in the social structure to the human, and I'm sure the dude knows how a subordinate gorilla is supposed to act and what not to do to challenge that opinion. Also, if the gorilla is in a shitty mood I'd say he doesn't go in there.
This functionality, while beneficial, will literally cage them within chambered segments of their nests, causing their existence to become solely dependent upon their brethren, even being consumed in times of desperation instead of regurgitation. I just think it's amazing when the phenotypic traits of a segment of a population have reached an evolutionary point where it is actually debilitating, requiring mutualism, it's a lot like specialized groups within human society (so early farmers supporting an artisan class by moving beyond survival farming). There are even some examples where the heads of soldiers have swollen to such a degree that they must be fed by their worker sisters.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/ukwildlife/1469191681/in/pool-_n_w_outdoors
Eel (eels are teleost fish, evolved from normal-shaped bony fish):
Caecilian (this is an amphibian)
Worm lizard (this is a reptile)
Compare to naked mole-rats:
(I just found a website claiming that the mammal lineage actually descended from worm-lizards, which is interesting.)
I don't see how this is fundamentally any different than my favorite primates. My girlfriend could kick my ass.
frankly the gorilla fucking is dominant when you're in the cage with him
you do what he says, because if you don't, well. it's a gorilla.
See also slime-molds and sponges. (Neither of which are "really" animals, or even metazoans, but they're at the boundary):
Slime molds consist of separate, individual amoeba-like organisms. But they can cluster together to form what look and act like unified bodies, even differentiating into distinct "organs" to faciliate reproduction.
Sponges are immobile groups of cells that collectively whip their little flagellates to move water through the sponge's structure, grabbing tiny bits of food as the water passes. You can pass a sponge through a wire mesh, and it will come back together.
There's also a worm-like snake which lives underground off of tiny insects and dirt particles; I got to play with one on a dig once. Their eyes, jaws, etc. are all vestigial.
However, I'm pretty sure that mammals evolved from mammal-like reptiles known as therapsids.
Bolded for truth, its still an issue of contention though, I actually did a paper tracing the evolution of vibrissae within felidae to therapsids. With the worm-like commonality throughout differing phylums, besides being a catch-all efficient form, you'll also find it as an example of neoteny within any organisms with motile larvae (if applicable).
He'd also pause over the ant beds with the lawn mower to suck all the air out and then douse the remaining husk with gasoline and set it on fire. Or he'd throw ammonia and bleach on them in succession, thereby gassing them.
We thought the whole process was funny when we were kids, but now we realize that my father was fucking nuts.
Never trust apes/monkeys too much. There's a reason someone coined the phrase "he's going apeshit". They may do cute human things and they may learn how to mimic cute human things, but they aren't people with lots of hair. They will fuck you up as bad as a tiger can about as quickly as that tiger can, and will give you just as much warning before they do it.
Frankly, I'd rather deal with a tiger.
No matter how much you love your Fleshlight, it is not an animal.
6-foot-dragonflies, 8-foot-millipedes, spiders the size of bobcats, scorpions the size of alligators...
Fixed that for you.
I wish I had thought of the two colonies warring thing when I was a kid.
i don't like the idea of primate "pets"
also i'm pretty sure a large male gorilla is easily capable of moving weight that is measured in tons
And they do this about once a month. Humans wouldn't have a chance.
EDIT: EM - primate pets are presumably small monkeys, tarsiers, and stuff like that, which can and do make good (if undpredictable) pets. They're probably not talking about true apes, which have all kinds of laws surrounding who is allowed to have one and who isn't. Anybody with an ape as a 'pet' is probably a primatologist with a couple of decades of experience.
To be fair, I don't think insects of that mass would be capable of the r-selection reproduction method that is so typical of modern insects.
The 2 bulbs on the top are the eyes, it's head is partially transparent.
Personally, I wonder if there's a practical limit to how heavy the carapace can be before the insect is overwhelmed by the size of it, but that may not be a big an issue with insect as it would be with vertibrates.
there was a woman who "owned" a chimp, and the chimp was medicated incorrectly and tore off someone's face
it was a recent news article
i am sure she was a primatologist or something, but even so, in her home?
Is that the barreleye? It was discovered a few weeks back that it can rotate its eyes anywhere within the transparent section. Article here
I don't know. And, as interested as I am in paleontology, when I imagine even a small clutch of Arthropleura hatching out at the same time, clawing out of porous eggshells or cocoons or whatever the fuck they did, rearing up to the sky and screeching with horrible vitality...
I'm pretty damn sure I don't want to know.
When adult chimps become enraged around humans it tends to end in someone getting either (or all) their testicles torn off, nose bit off, hand almost severed, or skull bit through. They are amazing creatures and our closest genetic ancestors but they are decidedly scary. I would be nervous having to work around even a 'tame' one.
Notice the '', I'm talking about handled ones that they use in research, movies, etc.
They probably creeped people the fuck out.
In his defense, though, he had just seen Mission Impossible.
You're right.
Against 8 foot long millipedes, orbital nukes are the only solution. But wait. What if they survived? Okay, at that point we would have to figure out a way to drive the planet into the sun.
While there's no way to know what early Homo sapiens thought about chimps - or neanderthals, for that matter - I heard somewhere that human groups in the region historically considered chimps/gorillas different tribes of people and generally didn't go into the places where apes lived.
Interestingly, many Native American groups in the Northeast (I think the Iroquois) considered beavers as a separate nation/tribe, because they built permanent structures and because of their social organization.
Wild horses can certainly be tamed, but I agree that some animals can't really be tamed.
http://animals.nationalgeographic.com/staticfiles/NGS/Shared/StaticFiles/animals/images/primary/horse.jpg
How great would it be if you were the guy assigned to be the diplomat to the beaver tribe?
You'd definitely get a lot of--
You know what, no, I'm not going to take such an easy one.
It wood be hard to get their opineons.