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Is Post Secondary Really Worth It?

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Posts

  • Torso BoyTorso Boy Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    A hilarious state of affairs is occuring over here. My brother did a 4 year degree in Civics, and at his 5 year high school reunion, he caught up with a bunch of people that got appreteships/jobs straight out of school.

    Now, my Brother has been out of work for 6 months. When he was working it was as a busboy. For 30k a year.

    Every single one of the 'dropouts' he talked to was emloyed. Every single one was raking in more than my brother could hope to in the next 5 years, even if he landed an awsome job (at least that's his reckoning, I can't know how accurate it is)

    A couple of them now owned their own business. 2 of them owned blummin nice BMWs (Sparky and Plumber). Steve reckons that 50 percent of the guys who went on to do degrees either have shitboxes for cars or no cars at all.

    We seriously have a massive skills shortage in Australia. Not trying to say that getting a degree is ever a waste of time, it's just that where I live not going to Uni carries a sort of stigma, a hilariously ironic one for all the stuck up basterds that studied IT at Uni (ahurhrurhuhr).
    Canada's pretty similar. I'm leaning towards media/writing as a career- with university being a high likelihood, and I know my friend who's an apprentice electrician will be making more than me for a very long time. And I'm the one who passed all my courses in high school.

    Here we're rushing kids into university for stuff like CS or web design, which are fast becoming so insanely competitive that most people doing it just won't be able to succeed. Meanwhile brick layers and tool & die guys are making a killing because there's only like eight of them.

    Torso Boy on
  • MandooMandoo Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    This tends to be the general flux of things- more and more kids are going to Uni right after high school leaving less tradespeople with higher salaries and more IT & Psyc people with junk jobs. Eventually something will break and it'll flow back the other way.

    Hell, i'm in pre-med and it's starting to happen to my field as well. Pharmacists in Alberta are soon going to be able to despense some medicine without a prescription from a doctor at all. There is talk for clinical psychologists to even be able to start prescribing some antidepressants also. Both of these require less time in school then an MD (although some not by much) and will be making more money sooner then the average General Practitioner.

    Mandoo on
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  • ShurakaiShurakai Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    I could easily work for two years here in Alberta and have enough money for all the education I could ever want.

    Oil is big business.

    Why don't I do it then?

    By all rights I should, but I feel that I would be letting myself down somehow. Pursuing money instead of my dreams is not comprehensible at this point.

    In five years, when I am living on the poverty line and barely scraping by? Then, perhaps. I have to see first for myself whether or not the world is as cruel a place as it is made out to be.

    Point is, here at least you don't need a degree to make a good living. Anyone with half a brain can work some grunt job for a good chunk of change.

    Shurakai on
  • The CatThe Cat Registered User, ClubPA regular
    edited December 2006
    We seriously have a massive skills shortage in Australia. Not trying to say that getting a degree is ever a waste of time, it's just that where I live not going to Uni carries a sort of stigma, a hilariously ironic one for all the stuck up basterds that studied IT at Uni (ahurhrurhuhr).

    Yeah, my little bro's a draftie, and if he didn't spend all his money on fun stuff he'd probably have a house paying itself off via rent by now. He wangled a 10K raise just by threatening to leave his cadetship job and work for someone else, and he hasn't even finished TAFE yet!

    Thing is, some uni fields are still really well-paid, it just depends what you do. In science, geology and chemistry are where the cash is right now, and I'm talking $50K starting wages minimum for geol. Demand for accountants and other financial guys is massive too - my flatmate was thinking of becoming an actuary, and those guys earn like you wouldn't believe (they figure out the odds of events happening for insurance companies, and that helps them set premiums). Basically, you want to plan carefully where you go and if, rather than just atomatically doing uni because you got good grades in HS. Either you're chasing the cash, or doing something you love, which brings me to my last point:

    why sneer at people who aren't earning big bucks? If they're doing something they really love and are getting by okay and are happy, there shouldn't be a problem. A lot of us nerdy types are in it because we love the work, or feel that what we're doing is really important and hell, someone's gotta sort X problem out. May as well be us. There's more to life than shiny toys :?

    edit: and hey, IT guys aren't snobs. Don't be a dick.


    To the OP, my experience: Year 1: Easy/fun. Year 2/3: bludge, hard, crud. final year: difficult, but really awesome all the same. You've finally got enough background to go out and Do Things, and you actually feel like you're really learning.

    The Cat on
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  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    If you are currently in post secondary enrollment, which in Minnesota is 2 years of free college, then fuck yes it is worth it.

    Without a college degree, don't expect to make much more than 13 dollars an hour, or 24 grand a year. It is only going to get worse for non-college grads from here on out, as demand for physical labor is going down, and demand for "knowledge labor" is going up.

    100 level classes are brain-dead easy because they figure you A) don't know dick (hence all of them being "intro to" courses) and B) came from a US high school (in which case you are lucky if you know east from your asshole).

    I am currently a senior in college, and I guarantee you, the classes get fucking hard. 400 level courses, they don't fuck around.

    AbsoluteZero on
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  • blizzard224blizzard224 Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    The Cat wrote:

    edit: and hey, IT guys aren't snobs. Don't be a dick.

    Oh, no, these guys were.

    Like, total assholes. :P

    blizzard224 on
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  • musanmanmusanman Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    ElJeffe wrote:
    mcdermott wrote:
    Or were you talking about teaching at the university level?

    I was talking about highschool and below. I know several people with degrees in assorted things who're going back to get teaching credentials, which requires another 1-2 years.

    Honestly it depends on what you're teaching. If you have a field where there is no demand, a school system can make it work. There are all kinds of stupid things NCLB has implemented that allow "professionals" teach without certain credentials.

    Which irritates me because it implies that I'm not a "professional" for going through the education department and learning about how to properly educate the children.

    musanman on
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  • Atma WeaponAtma Weapon Registered User new member
    edited December 2006
    Two things came to my mind upon considering the title question.

    1. One thing I tell myself about my own degrees is that they are an accomplishment that no one can ever take away from me.

    2. If you have any love for ideas at all, then you will one day miss having the leisure to study.

    I earnestly believe that in engaging great ideas that we too can become great. College, and disciplined self-education for that matter, should be an opportunity for really considering what it means to be human. And no, I am not encouraging some monkish detachment, just a thoughtful approach to life in its beauty and hardship.

    Atma Weapon on
  • Ant000Ant000 Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    I'm only in my first year and I've learned a decent amount so far, despite the fact that every single course so far has been dry as hell. I haven't found a subject I really feel that I can sink my teeth into yet, but I've got a half-dozen new courses coming up soon that could potentially spur my interest. I figure its worth sampling everything feasible so I can really know if there's something out there that I could really devote myself to. If I don't find anything, at least I'll know that I tried, and will have a pretty good base of knowledge to go forth from and take into anything else I do, socially, economically, whatever.

    There's a lot of pressure where I live to get into like, a tech institute or an apprenticeship and get into a trade, just because of the boatloads of money available. I figure though, if I graduate with a BA in 3 years, I'll be like 22 and still pretty darn young, so I could feasibly start in a trade if I can't find a relevant job in my chosen field (albeit slightly behind my peers) and I'll have a bunch of education to boot! I would hate to skip out of college, and then have the construction/labour sector cool off or get extremely crowded (2 year wait to get into BCIT!).

    But the depth and breadth of knowledge, the critical thinking skills, the paper writing, debate and discourse, all the stuff a good post-secondary education should provide a person, is definitely a big thing to pass up for a relatively small chunk of time in your life.

    Ant000 on
  • kingmetalkingmetal Registered User regular
    edited December 2006
    the job market is beginning to change, as the world 'flattens out' and competition becomes much more fierce. contrary to what some people have been saying on this thread: a degree does not secure you a job and you're crazy to think that. I have several friends who are just now getting into the job market after college (all very bright) and most of them are struggling to make ends meet. the job market is tough to break into with just a single degree, now companies are beginning to look at two or more degrees and work experience (which you probably weren't getting while you were in school).

    granted, I don't know what field you're in. I'm majoring Electronic Communications (Audio Production) and Industrial Design (Product/Electronics) and in my fields internships and your portfolio are basically what get you in the door.

    kingmetal on
  • TubeTube Registered User admin
    edited December 2006
    I have to say, after doing a degree I completely lost faith in degrees as a measure of anything. So much bullshit happens on those courses that whether someone has a 1st or a 2:1 or whatever is now effectively meaningless.

    Tube on
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