Well the list of outrageously overpowered stuff is pretty short now, it's really just like Tyranids and Mek mines. Obviously a lot of other stuff needs work or changes in one direction or anything, but those are the main ones really breaking the game right now (I'm not looking at the various bugs or mechanic problems here).
Ha, I'm with you on the Tyranids, but I would argue Eldar need some serious love before mek mines. Which I will concede could use some changes. Eldar seem to be powerful in a seasoned players hands, but they're impossible when you're new.
-Choose Farseer hero
-Make Banshees
-Get Fortune and maybe Doom
-Win game
Sounds like someones a little mad they lost. 8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)
Also if I can get all game design for a minute, this is the melee vs ranged problem:
In generic non-squad based RTS, ranged units become exponentially more powerful as the size of their forces increase, whereas melee units become increasingly worse as the scale increases and they reach the maximum number of units able to get into melee. Take the classic Zergling vs Marine example. 2 Zerglings are the same price as one Marine, and the Zerglings will completely destroy the Marine. However, in a larger engagement, say 20 Zerglings vs 10 Marines, the Marines have an advantage because they can destroy some or all of the Zerglings before they even reach melee range, and the larger the fight the more extreme this example is.
Now DoW2 has 3 critical reasons why this doesn't work here: Melee Combat, Squads and Retreat. A ranged unit in Starcraft still does full range damage even when being attacked in melee (which exceptions of units with minimum range like Siege-Mode Siege Tanks etc), so being locked into Melee Combat doesn't make a difference to its damage output. However a ranged unit in DoW2 locked into Melee Combat is forced to use its (likely vastly inferior) melee skill to fight. This is further compounded by the Squad system of DoW2. This means that one melee attacker can force an entire squad of ranged units into melee combat, and the AI's obsession with having them seek cover during gunfights means the squad is probably spread out and more easily engaged in melee.
Finally, the Retreat mechanic and the vast difference between Ranged and Melee damage to retreating units (melee does 6.5x the damage of ranged damage to a retreating unit) and that the Retreat mechanic takes out a lot of the risk of trying to get into melee range (get surprised by a suppression weapon? just retreat!). This is further compounded by the fact that the two main melee races are also horde races and can cause retreating units to get stuck in them. It basically means that Tyranids and Orks can much more easily capitalize on a retreat than Eldar or Space Marines, since the melee units Eldar/SM do have are in such small numbers they can't block the retreat path the way orks and tyranids can.
All these factors combine to give melee a pretty sizable advantage over range, especially in a 1v1 scenario. In 3v3 especially when the Ranged army has time to fortify its position, you do start to see the exponential ranged system again but not to a sufficient extent.
Hey Relic when you said that you fixed units not responding orders maybe what you should do is fix it so when you give a unit a command it fucking responds to the fucking order maybe? Maaaaaaybe?
Hey Relic when you said that you fixed units not responding orders maybe what you should do is fix it so when you give a unit a command it fucking responds to the fucking order maybe? Maaaaaaybe?
I don't get it. If they fixed it, they should respond to your orders.
Pancake on
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surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
I lost four rippers, two horms, about six or seven terms, 2 zoans, and my ravener died like 10 times. The ravener self-revived though, but the rest. I didn't bother to retreat anything but rippers.
I lost four rippers, two horms, about six or seven terms, 2 zoans, and my ravener died like 10 times. The ravener self-revived though, but the rest. I didn't bother to retreat anything but rippers.
I lost four rippers, two horms, about six or seven terms, 2 zoans, and my ravener died like 10 times. The ravener self-revived though, but the rest. I didn't bother to retreat anything but rippers.
Guess how much I lost by!
Did you even lose?
Well, almost.
We had 41 VPs left.
Goomba on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
That map taught me that heavy bolters can do almost max damage from full range with their upgrade. That' pretty cool. The Eldar's platform upgrade isn't that good but it also costs less.
[Relic]CTasker (ctasker): Question: (Lord Lokgar) says (smdhell): First off, thanks for doing this live chat. Here is my first question: As a nid player since beta, even I have to agree that spore mines are OP. Are there any plans to make them anti-building only (Their supposed intended role), and how do you plan on achieving that? Along those lines, is the bug where you can't melee spore mines fixed yet?
Answer: I wouldn't say that Spore Mines are too over powered but they are a bit of a binary unit. We are looking at changing their role but we're not entirely sure how to proceed. The ravener tunnel fix should change the current Nid mechanics a bit and we'll see where the Meta rests after that
Fuck me, they think the ravener tunnel change is a big deal?
But at least they think Mekboy mines are broken as hell, so there's that. I'm pretty glad at that.
Maybe the devs are so busy with work that they never get to play their own game and are there for only knowledgeable about whats going on through community managers who only really visit one or two forums where they are treated special...maybe?
Good theory, but the MP guys play online a LOT, in addtion to internal playtesting. And most of the Relic folk you see posting on the various places are devs.
Good theory, but the MP guys play online a LOT, in addtion to internal playtesting. And most of the Relic folk you see posting on the various places are devs.
I bet they play tyranids :winky:
randombattle on
I never asked for this!
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BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
edited May 2009
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
Bethryn on
...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
Posts
Maybe you should play to win instead of playing to whine. Heh.
And you know he's the one yelling back to his buddies, "Don't worry, you guys, I GOT THIS."
Sounds like someones a little mad they lost. 8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)8-)
Like a boss.
On the black screen
That is super awesome and extremely cool. Especially the part where he dodge rolls out of the way.
But that is way, way too goddamn long =P
It's not that long. Certainly shorter than the FC sync kill for the Bloodthirster in the first game.
Which was, incidentally, way too goddamn long =P
Also seriously Mekboy mines are incredibly overpowered unless you get units that die from slugga pistols. While retreating.
Like a boss
STAB ITS BRAINS OUT
like a boss
Any SM unit with a power sword does it, including the sergeants
I don't get it. If they fixed it, they should respond to your orders.
The fuck were you thinking Relic?
So that increases the sync to... ASM squads.
Okay.
It makes them feel like they're being fair when they spam them.
Guess how much I lost by!
Oh yeah true, that charge is pretty good.
Did you even lose?
We had 41 VPs left.
Really? I didn't think it was all that. The Trophy Rack, on the other hand...
Edit: Holy shit.
Fuck me, they think the ravener tunnel change is a big deal?
But at least they think Mekboy mines are broken as hell, so there's that. I'm pretty glad at that.
I never asked for this!
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.
I hate Rippers.