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[First 100 Days] Voter's Remorse...

1678911

Posts

  • QuidQuid I don't... what... hnnng Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Cantido wrote: »
    Quid wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    How does this qualify as his shortcoming, if it is a shortcoming?
    When you are a leader, you take responsibility when things go well, but you also take responsibility when things fucked, whether you did anything or not.
    How the Hell is Obama responsible for the entire Republican congress being jackasses that refuse to compromise?

    Someone here said it. There are two kinds of responsible. A captain responsible for whatever happens on his ship, and then there's actually being in control of a situation.
    But the captain/ship thing isn't really apt either. A captain is in charge of a ship, responsible for the ship. Obama isn't responsible for congress. He's not in charge of them.

    Quid on
  • Professor PhobosProfessor Phobos Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Quid wrote: »
    Cantido wrote: »
    Quid wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    How does this qualify as his shortcoming, if it is a shortcoming?
    When you are a leader, you take responsibility when things go well, but you also take responsibility when things fucked, whether you did anything or not.
    How the Hell is Obama responsible for the entire Republican congress being jackasses that refuse to compromise?

    Someone here said it. There are two kinds of responsible. A captain responsible for whatever happens on his ship, and then there's actually being in control of a situation.
    But the captain/ship thing isn't really apt either. A captain is in charge of a ship, responsible for the ship. Obama isn't responsible for congress. He's not in charge of them.

    Indeed. Co-equal branches.

    Professor Phobos on
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    Plus, if half of the crew on the ship are pirates, the captain can't control how they'll act. He can try treating them like equals, but that's not gonna stop the pirates from blowing up the rum storage.. room (?), if they so choose to.

    In the end, he's still human.

    evilintent on
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  • Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    It doesn't help that the Republicans seem to just not agree to try and make his life hell.

    Zen Vulgarity on
    oVSbgTI.png For more artwork like this, check out Jakub Rozalski's imgur
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    I think we've all agreed it went like this:

    Obama offers to discuss matters of pertinence with republicans, and wants to reach a compromise that will make both sides somewhat happy. Republicans sniff his hand, growl menacingly, piss on his hand, bite it, then fart in his face.

    Not to be flippant, but that's basically what the Dems did under Bush with the GOP majority.
    Absurd. The Democrats constantly caved over the course of those six years, and the two afterwards as well.

    Also, Obs, you cannot magically make someone willing to compromise when the only thing they're willing to do is try to stab you in the back. Or the front. It is neither Obama's fault nor his responsibility that every Republican in Congress is being a whiny-ass titty baby.

    Captain Carrot on
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    It doesn't help that the Republicans seem to just not agree to try and make his life hell.

    Being dickheads for the sake of being dickheads. Now I understand playing devil's advocate, and I'm all for that. But this is really just too fucking far. Someone needs to go to a GOP assembly and pimpslap each and everyone of them back to their senses.

    evilintent on
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  • QuidQuid I don't... what... hnnng Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    Plus, if half of the crew on the ship are pirates, the captain can't control how they'll act. He can try treating them like equals, but that's not gonna stop the pirates from blowing up the rum storage.. room (?), if they so choose to.

    In the end, he's still human.
    Nah, he's still responsible for letting them on in the first place. It's his ship. He's the one that picks the people that work on it.

    Obama did not pick anyone in congress. It's more like expecting him to be responsible for his crazy next door neighbor's kid that won't be happy until they own his house.

    Quid on
  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    So, wait, I'm confused about how we're supposed to discern bipartisanship. Is it seriously about the end result vote tally and not about the process of sausage making that occurs among the legislators?

    If that is to be the case then Obama proposing H.R. 1281: 'The Puppies, American Flags, and Apple Pie are Awesome Bill' is the absolute height of bi-partisanship, no? Would such a proposal raise his estimation in your eyes even though it's little more than a stupid waste of time and rank pablum?

    Meanwhile actions such as these:
    moniker wrote: »
    January 27, 2009
    WASHINGTON — President Obama made a campaign trip of sorts on Tuesday to seek bipartisan support for his economic stimulus plan, visiting Republicans on Capitol Hill and suggesting that he was open to some limited revisions that would address their demands for more tax cuts.
    ...

    But, Republicans interviewed after the meeting said, Mr. Obama told them he would listen to proposals to expand on provisions cutting taxes for small businesses and would be open to corporate tax cuts as well if Republicans cooperated to close tax loopholes for big business.
    ...

    “This was not a drive-by P.R. stunt, and I actually thought it might be,” said Representative Zach Wamp, Republican of Tennessee. “It was a substantive, in-depth discussion with our conference, and he’s very effective.”

    “He knows that the debt and the deficit are huge long-term problems as well,” Mr. Wamp said, “and he made a compelling case. He sounded, frankly, a lot like a Republican.”
    ...

    Mr. Obama spoke to House Republicans for about 10 minutes and then took about a dozen questions for an hour, members said. He emphasized the seriousness of the economic emergency and lamented, “I would love to not have to spend this money.”

    When reminded that he was late for his Senate meeting, he joked that “my former colleagues can wait,” drawing his biggest applause from the House lawmakers.

    That should actually count against him providing a good faith effort towards bipartisanship because the minority whipped votes in order to make a monolithic fuck you? I'm rather confused.

    moniker on
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    moniker wrote: »
    So, wait, I'm confused about how we're supposed to discern bipartisanship. Is it seriously about the end result vote tally and not about the process of sausage making that occurs among the legislators?

    If that is to be the case then Obama proposing H.R. 1281: 'The Puppies, American Flags, and Apple Pie are Awesome Bill' is the absolute height of bi-partisanship, no? Would such a proposal raise his estimation in your eyes even though it's little more than a stupid waste of time and rank pablum?

    Meanwhile actions such as these:
    moniker wrote: »
    January 27, 2009
    WASHINGTON — President Obama made a campaign trip of sorts on Tuesday to seek bipartisan support for his economic stimulus plan, visiting Republicans on Capitol Hill and suggesting that he was open to some limited revisions that would address their demands for more tax cuts.
    ...

    But, Republicans interviewed after the meeting said, Mr. Obama told them he would listen to proposals to expand on provisions cutting taxes for small businesses and would be open to corporate tax cuts as well if Republicans cooperated to close tax loopholes for big business.
    ...

    “This was not a drive-by P.R. stunt, and I actually thought it might be,” said Representative Zach Wamp, Republican of Tennessee. “It was a substantive, in-depth discussion with our conference, and he’s very effective.”

    “He knows that the debt and the deficit are huge long-term problems as well,” Mr. Wamp said, “and he made a compelling case. He sounded, frankly, a lot like a Republican.”
    ...

    Mr. Obama spoke to House Republicans for about 10 minutes and then took about a dozen questions for an hour, members said. He emphasized the seriousness of the economic emergency and lamented, “I would love to not have to spend this money.”

    When reminded that he was late for his Senate meeting, he joked that “my former colleagues can wait,” drawing his biggest applause from the House lawmakers.

    That should actually count against him providing a good faith effort towards bipartisanship because the minority whipped votes in order to make a monolithic fuck you? I'm rather confused.

    We all are. We all are...

    evilintent on
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  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    They're pissed off, probably because Obama has effectively soothed them. You don't think that if the Republicans had a majority right now with a Republican President in power the Democrats would not be doing the exact same shit? They'd be doing it even worse.
    Also, can you cite the 'more bipartisanship' in George Bush's first year?

    Bush Tax cuts for example. Lots of Democrats voted in favor

    Congratulations on providing an example that blatantly contradicts the point you're trying to make.

    Lawndart on
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Not to mention, you literally cannot be more obstructionist than zero votes without like, assassinating members of the other party so their votes can't be counted. You can't provide negative votes.

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
  • ObsObs __BANNED USERS regular
    edited May 2009
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.

    Obs on
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  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.
    Because Democratic Senate leadership is the legislative equivalent of droopy dog.

    OptimusZed on
    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. Now With Ninjas!

    They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
  • Robos A Go GoRobos A Go Go Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.

    Because he can't use 9/11 to manipulate the public into seeing anyone who disagrees with him as a traitor?

    Robos A Go Go on
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.

    Because he has the common sense to not be a dick who forces his opinions on others and basically stomps his foot in the ground and proclaims 'I AM EVERYTHING'?

    evilintent on
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  • HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    I AM THE STATE

    Hakkekage on
    3DS: 2165 - 6538 - 3417
    NNID: Hakkekage
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.
    Because Democratic Senate leadership is the legislative equivalent of droopy dog.

    Hey, Joe Lieberman isn't in the Senate leadership.

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Because he's not willing to be bigger assholes than the Republican Party?

    Fencingsax on
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  • BallmanBallman Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.

    Because he can't use 9/11 to manipulate the public into seeing anyone who disagrees with him as a traitor?

    Yeah, this is the answer I agree with. I thought it was pretty much a given after 9/11 that the Bush administration got its way, or "the terrorists would win". In his defense, Bush isn't very bright, and so many people were scared shitless that their convictions otherwise might not have felt that strong in comparison.

    Ballman on
    JC of DI wrote:
    Mr. G wrote: »
    So, there's a video of Kurt Cobain in [Guitar Hero 5] out. I feel dirty watching this, he just looks wrong.

    Well Cobain's mo-cap session was completely useless, so you can't blame them.
  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Republicans don't give a fuck about the country compared to their own political interests.




    Obs wrote: »
    Exactly.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Well, it's mostly because the Republican Party is making the same fundamental mistake the Bush Democratic Party did, which is to assume that the country is fundamentally right wing. The Democrats thought by looking like Republicans on "national security" issues, they could be right wing enough to win upcoming elections by being GOP-lite. This was dumb.

    The Republicans think that they'll come back to prominence by being super right wing, so oppose everything the moderately liberal President is presenting. This is just as dumb.

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    Poor Obs.

    Well, not really.

    :D

    evilintent on
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  • Gabriel_PittGabriel_Pitt (effective against the Irish) Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.
    What the fuck is wrong with you? What is so fucked up in your head that you're apprently advocating another terrorist attack on American soil? You need serious help.

    Gabriel_Pitt on
  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    Lawndart on
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.


    Weeee!


    E: Again with the fucking TOTP.

    evilintent on
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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.


    Weeee!


    E: Again with the fucking TOTP.
    Heller makes that pretty unlikely all in all. At least that those laws would stick around after they were challenged.

    DevoutlyApathetic on
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.

    Weeee!

    E: Again with the fucking TOTP.

    Or he could just hammer through the Freedom of Choice Act, but both of these things would be retarded to actually do right now, as you don't want to piss off anti-choice Democrats like Bob Casey (D-PA) before you get health care, energy, and education done. For guns it would be Tester, Webb, and others from the border South and Mountain West.

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
  • 101101 Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.

    Really obs? really?

    Your Definition of bipartisan is making the other party cave?

    Are you Really that dumb?

    101 on
  • LawndartLawndart Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.

    Weeee!

    E: Again with the fucking TOTP.

    Or he could just hammer through the Freedom of Choice Act, but both of these things would be retarded to actually do right now, as you don't want to piss off anti-choice Democrats like Bob Casey (D-PA) before you get health care, energy, and education done. For guns it would be Tester, Webb, and others from the border South and Mountain West.

    I'd much sooner have any "Suck it, Republican Congressional minority" cards be played to get a progressive judge onto the SCOTUS and/or to get healthcare reform passed.

    Lawndart on
  • Clint EastwoodClint Eastwood My baby's in there someplace She crawled right inRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    101 wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.

    Really obs? really?

    Your Definition of bipartisan is making the other party cave?

    Are you Really that dumb?
    Yes, yes he is.

    Clint Eastwood on
    uekIEp1.png
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Except the Republican minority doesn't matter. It's the squishy Democrats that have all the power: Bayh, Nelson, etc.

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    Cloudman wrote: »
    101 wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?






    Exactly.

    Really obs? really?

    Your Definition of bipartisan is making the other party cave?

    Are you Really that dumb?
    Yes, yes he is.

    Oh, I thought he was faking it. This explains so much.

    evilintent on
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  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.
    And then a thousand cries of grief from a couple dozen more cop shootings. That's a really fucking stupid idea.

    Captain Carrot on
  • Zen VulgarityZen Vulgarity What a lovely day for tea Secret British ThreadRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Gay marriage would piss them off more than gun laws.

    Zen Vulgarity on
    oVSbgTI.png For more artwork like this, check out Jakub Rozalski's imgur
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.
    And then a thousand cries of grief from a couple dozen more cop shootings. That's a really fucking stupid idea.

    Erm. Stricter gun (control) laws.

    What?

    @ZV: True, but I was going with something that would fly more easily. Even dems are split on the gay marriage thing. Dem |= liberal as Denmark

    evilintent on
    6a00d83451c45669e2011571303907970b-.jpg
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.
    And then a thousand cries of grief from a couple dozen more cop shootings. That's a really fucking stupid idea.
    Yep. Especially given the fact that it wouldn't survive judicial review after the DC case.

    Gun control, no matter anyone's individual stance, is politically off the table for a while.

    OptimusZed on
    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. Now With Ninjas!

    They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    evilintent wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.
    And then a thousand cries of grief from a couple dozen more cop shootings. That's a really fucking stupid idea.

    Erm. Stricter gun (control) laws.

    What?
    Oh, right, I forgot, those laws would be effectively implemented immediately and make the guns in possession of people who would do this vanish. Seriously, having laws isn't the same as having them enforced.

    Captain Carrot on
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    evilintent wrote: »
    evilintent wrote: »
    Lawndart wrote: »
    Obs wrote: »
    So why can't Obama make Republicans cave the way Bush made Democrats cave?

    Because the Democratic minority in 2001 was actually committed to bipartisanship while the Republican minority in 2009 is not?

    And the awesome thing is that Obama doesn't need to make the Republicans in Congress "cave".

    You know what he could do to really add insult to injury?

    Make gun laws strict as fuck.

    *that comes on the news*

    The anguished screams of a thousand billion damned souls are heard from every GOP assembly in the country.
    And then a thousand cries of grief from a couple dozen more cop shootings. That's a really fucking stupid idea.

    Erm. Stricter gun (control) laws.

    What?
    Oh, right, I forgot, those laws would be effectively implemented immediately and make the guns in possession of people who would do this vanish. Seriously, having laws isn't the same as having them enforced.

    It's a joke. I wasn't advocating him doing that (at least not right now).

    Lighten up, just a teeny bit.

    evilintent on
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  • DarkCrawlerDarkCrawler Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Because the Republicans are fucking crazy?

    Can we still do this?

    DarkCrawler on
  • evilintentevilintent Registered User
    edited May 2009
    Because the Republicans are fucking crazy?

    Can we still do this?

    What's the connection between your last post and the last page of posts?

    evilintent on
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This discussion has been closed.