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The Space Sims Megathread (NSF56k/Aliens/Enemy Convoys)

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    LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    I am interested in X3 also, but money is a bit tight right now. As you guys continue to learn it, I'm interested to hear more reactions and opinions.

    Lucascraft on
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    GalagaGalaxianGalagaGalaxian Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    A kill mission with a K and escorts right at the start? Were they your target or did you just have the terrible luck to start a mission just as a random Xenon raid launched?

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    SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    A kill mission with a K and escorts right at the start? Were they your target or did you just have the terrible luck to start a mission just as a random Xenon raid launched?

    The worst kind of luck. Job was to kill some piddly little M5 but he was near the gate when the Xenon jumped in. And just to rub some salt in the wound, the Xenon killed my target first so I got a lovely little message just before I died telling me I wasn't getting paid for letting someone else do the work.

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    GalagaGalaxianGalagaGalaxian Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Hah. Gotta love a hostile capital coming out of a gate right on top of you.

    Lost my recent "Dead-is-Dead" Pirate playthrough that way. Transiting through Nap.'s Memorial, 2k from the gate when a Argon M1 carrier pops through the gate and starts disgorging fighters and firing flak at me. I had just enough time to say "Well shit." before my Chimera M3+ exploded from a direct flak hit.

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    Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    I installed Shatterstar: The Subtitle I Can't Remember before I left for work this morning. The idea sounds kick ass, so hopefully the final product delivers. I just hope the bugs aren't as bad as they sound.

    Sir Carcass on
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    MegaMekMegaMek Girls like girls. Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    So, Starshatter isn't on STEAM and X3 is. I'm thinking of picking up X3, since it looks super cool and I'm really bored.

    A couple things: Is there a PA thread for X3, or maybe a website where I can read up on how to play this seemingly-complicated game? And also, is the expansion worth paying $55 (for both games) instead of only $20 (for only the original)?

    EDIT: Or wait, are Reunion and Terran Conflict totally separate games? Which one should I get?

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    GalagaGalaxianGalagaGalaxian Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Yeah, we've got an X3 thread. I'll go dig it up and bump it.

    And I would suggest X3:TC. Its newer and has a better interface. I have both, but only because due to a mistake(?) Steam was offering X3:R+X3:TC for the same price as just X3:TC (I'm not sure if this was a mistake, it feels like it but it lasted for a few months...).

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    RoyceSraphimRoyceSraphim Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXnPG19npW8

    I want this so fucking badly to be a mod!

    I don't care how many must be sacrificed, I need it!

    Okay, we kidnap volition and team Ace Combat and give them a big sound library and give them water then food when they give us concept art, then alphas and when a beta comes out, we let them see their families.


    edit:Unimportant rant on what I want from the next great space sim game.
    Oh, and fps ship to ship battles, I think everyone wants to be on board a breaching party from HW2 or be on the crew that captures a frigate in HW1, in fact, give the frigate an opportunity to escape if they loose.

    No, I ask to much...and yet I must.

    I want the depth of and storytelling and voice actor quality Freespace with sliding Newton physics and the ability to traverse from atmosphere and space and a fps component to capital ships allowing me to repair, man stations, repel borders, and sling bricks if I have to.

    Speaking of slinging bricks, I want an economy to dick around in as well.

    RoyceSraphim on
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    OlivawOlivaw good name, isn't it? the foot of mt fujiRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    In my most beautiful dreams, I imagine the Ace Combat Team announcing a new game called SpAce Combat, which is basically Ace Combat in space, plus awesome cinematic stuff like launching from your carrier into orbit and then plummeting downward through the atmosphere and a hail of laser flak to bomb some big future cities or something, or fighting between two gigantic capital ships while dudes are exploding and radio chatter is going totally crazy

    It's so glorious

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    MegaMekMegaMek Girls like girls. Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    I'd like a new Ace Combat game where they have someone else write the goddamn story. Jesus Christ...

    I mean anyone else. It would be better.

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    Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    MegaMek wrote: »
    I'd like a new Ace Combat game where they have someone else write the goddamn story. Jesus Christ...

    I mean anyone else. It would be better.

    But how else will we get our anime cliches in our flight games?

    I don't get why people are so up on Newtonian physics. I guess they're more realistic or whatever, but for me, it's definitely a case of fun before realism. I just don't find it very fun and much prefer the Freespace/Wing Commander method.

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    MarikirMarikir Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Olivaw wrote: »
    In my most beautiful dreams, I imagine the Ace Combat Team announcing a new game called SpAce Combat, which is basically Ace Combat in space, plus awesome cinematic stuff like launching from your carrier into orbit and then plummeting downward through the atmosphere and a hail of laser flak to bomb some big future cities or something, or fighting between two gigantic capital ships while dudes are exploding and radio chatter is going totally crazy

    It's so glorious

    Well, I'm sure you're aware of it already, but Project Sylpheed is pretty similar to what you've described. I don't own many 360 games, but that's one of them (along with AC6). Launching from a carrier, going toe-to-toe vs fighters, destroyers, carriers, and dreadnoughts.

    It kinda goes slightly off the rails as the plot ramps up (the final mission was...odd) but I found it to be very fun. And like the AC series, full of anime cliches.

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    StormwatcherStormwatcher Blegh BlughRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Dudes, a new Wing Commander would be the best.

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    WildSpoonWildSpoon Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    I am interested in X3 also, but money is a bit tight right now. As you guys continue to learn it, I'm interested to hear more reactions and opinions.

    Well, spent the first chunk of time with it last night and i gotta say its waaaaaaaaaaaaay more approachable than their previous games. I tried both joystick and kb/mouse combat and both worked equally well. mouse handles like freelancer for those that weren't sure. I'm doing the storyline stuff right now just as an excuse to learn the game, but I'm not sure ill stick with it long term, may just fire up a custom one. Still lots I haven't figured out yet obviously but I'm finding it way easier to learn how to do things, im already decent in dogfights and what not.

    Anyways, for what its worth its the most approachable "X" game yet but still probably not as "flashy" as the wing commanders and freespace games. I will be playing this one for quite some time.

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    GalagaGalaxianGalagaGalaxian Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Don't do "custom" start in X3:TC, it completely disables all plotlines. If you don't want to do them, don't do them. Its kinda like GTA in that sense, you can juts piss off and ignore the plot, but it'll always be there to do if you suddenly feel like it.

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    SammyFSammyF Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    The space sim I keep wishing for is a multiplayer game where you can all crew a single capitol ship together. Like a Star Trek game where every player can crew a bridge station, or a BSG game where some players are huddling together in the CIC while other players are on the flight deck keeping the fighters running. Basically I'm looking for Space Station 13 with 90% less farce.

    SammyF on
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    MechMantisMechMantis Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    SammyF wrote: »
    The space sim I keep wishing for is a multiplayer game where you can all crew a single capitol ship together. Like a Star Trek game where every player can crew a bridge station, or a BSG game where some players are huddling together in the CIC while other players are on the flight deck keeping the fighters running. Basically I'm looking for Space Station 13 with 90% less farce.

    That would also be a game with 90% less fun, as most of the fun in SS13 is dealing with that 90% farce.

    Unless there are two of these ships going against each other. Then it turns into pure gold.

    MechMantis on
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    SammyFSammyF Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Eh, your premise smacks of "people don't enjoy non-farsical story-based action/rpg/sim coops," which I basically have to reject out of hand.

    SammyF on
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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    MechMantis wrote: »
    SammyF wrote: »
    The space sim I keep wishing for is a multiplayer game where you can all crew a single capitol ship together. Like a Star Trek game where every player can crew a bridge station, or a BSG game where some players are huddling together in the CIC while other players are on the flight deck keeping the fighters running. Basically I'm looking for Space Station 13 with 90% less farce.

    That would also be a game with 90% less fun, as most of the fun in SS13 is dealing with that 90% farce.

    Unless there are two of these ships going against each other. Then it turns into pure gold.


    No it would be awesome. And of course two ships would be going against each other, were you just imagining a bunch of people staring at stat screens while they meander through space?


    Cause that reminds me of this.

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    OrogogusOrogogus San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    What would all these stations do? You can man guns in Allegiance and one guy gets to fly the ship, and other than that unless the goal is Puzzle Pirates with spaceships I don't know that you would need players to be engineers, flight deck guys, radar operators, medics, etc.

    Orogogus on
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    MarikirMarikir Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Orogogus wrote: »
    What would all these stations do? You can man guns in Allegiance and one guy gets to fly the ship, and other than that unless the goal is Puzzle Pirates with spaceships I don't know that you would need players to be engineers, flight deck guys, radar operators, medics, etc.

    Hmmm...just thinking outloud...

    Shield operators, marines, fighter pilots, bomber pilots, boarding troops, a metric f-ton of gunners (which you mentioned, yes), repair technicians.

    And I'm sure you can do radar operators as well. Have the main ships CnC have a powerful radar that the smaller ships don't have. They can set waypoints for the fighters, stuff like that.

    Plus, why limit it to one ship? Multiple ships on each side...


    And don't forget the escape pods.

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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Orogogus wrote: »
    What would all these stations do? You can man guns in Allegiance and one guy gets to fly the ship, and other than that unless the goal is Puzzle Pirates with spaceships I don't know that you would need players to be engineers, flight deck guys, radar operators, medics, etc.

    Well lets see you would have a guy who handles radar and tag's threat levels. You would have your pilot of course. Gunner. I don't know why people think that if something is a mini-game it has to be reduced to some kind of pipe-dreams esque puzzle game. You could have real time damage where the engineer would have to run around to the damaged areas of the ship and then have to assess what materials you need to fix it. Each wound to the ship is different depending on the circumstances surrounding the damage and require different parts and methods to properly fix. There is just no end to the depth you could add to this role.

    Then you could have the flight bay engineers who's goal is to repair fighters/maintain the launch bay. You could add search and rescue duties to their job to make it more interesting.

    The commander and XO who can plot courses/strategies/other special abilities. Also they probably would also double as comm officers.

    Then you have the individual fighter pilots. To throw in a little extra you could have the ship constantly vulnerable to boardings so you have to deal with repelling invasions at the same time your doing this.



    Marine classes where you just hop on transports and board other peoples ships/defend your own.




    I mean.. the possibilities here are endless.

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    OrogogusOrogogus San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Well, I'm going off of SammyF's description. Having marines, fighter/bomber pilots and gunners sounds like the Star Wars Battlefront games (except that you couldn't actually fly the capital ships anywhere).

    What would a player do as a non-shooty crewmember, like shield operator or repair technician? Those sound like the jobs that could be handled by the guy steering the ship, as does the setting of waypoints.
    Well lets see you would have a guy who handles radar and tag's threat levels. You would have your pilot of course. Gunner. I don't know why people think that if something is a mini-game it has to be reduced to some kind of pipe-dreams esque puzzle game. You could have real time damage to the ship where the engineer would have to run around to the damaged of the ship and then have to assess what materials you need to fix it. Each wound to the ship is different depending on the circumstances surrounding the damage and require different parts and methods to properly fix. There is just no end to the depth you could add to this role.

    That sounds like an endless fetch quest, and less fun than Pipe Dream or Bejeweled.

    The problem I have with marine roles is that it would be a pretty boring job if there was no boarding going on, and a capital ship game where everyone's getting boarded all the time seems unfocused.
    Then you could have the flight bay engineers who's goal is to repair fighters/maintain the launch bay. You could add search and rescue duties to their job to make it more interesting.

    Again, what would be the game mechanic behind repairing fighters and maintenance? Battlefront and Allegiance both put every player behind a gun. I'm not sure that doing otherwise presents fun gameplay opportunities for people who don't have that option.

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    GalagaGalaxianGalagaGalaxian Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    The only way I would ever play as a shield operator is if the shields worked like the manually controlled pinpoint barriers in SDF Macross.

    Trackball, go!

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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Orogogus wrote: »
    Well, I'm going off of SammyF's description. Having marines, fighter/bomber pilots and gunners sounds like the Star Wars Battlefront games (except that you couldn't actually fly the capital ships anywhere).

    What would a player do as a non-shooty crewmember, like shield operator or repair technician? Those sound like the jobs that could be handled by the guy steering the ship, as does the setting of waypoints.
    Well lets see you would have a guy who handles radar and tag's threat levels. You would have your pilot of course. Gunner. I don't know why people think that if something is a mini-game it has to be reduced to some kind of pipe-dreams esque puzzle game. You could have real time damage to the ship where the engineer would have to run around to the damaged of the ship and then have to assess what materials you need to fix it. Each wound to the ship is different depending on the circumstances surrounding the damage and require different parts and methods to properly fix. There is just no end to the depth you could add to this role.

    That sounds like an endless fetch quest, and less fun than Pipe Dream or Bejeweled.

    The problem I have with marine roles is that it would be a pretty boring job if there was no boarding going on, and a capital ship game where everyone's getting boarded all the time seems unfocused.
    Then you could have the flight bay engineers who's goal is to repair fighters/maintain the launch bay. You could add search and rescue duties to their job to make it more interesting.

    Again, what would be the game mechanic behind repairing fighters and maintenance? Battlefront and Allegiance both put every player behind a gun. I'm not sure that doing otherwise presents fun gameplay opportunities for people who don't have that option.

    Um.. walking up to it with a wrench like every other battlefield game.


    You're right. No game is fun unless its just people shooting guns. There is no way that this could possibly be fun.



    edit: be all.. OHH SHIT THEY JUST SHOT THE FUCKING OXYGEN SUPPLY GO PATCH IT OR WE DIE IN 5 MINUTES.

    Real time damage repair is not a fetch quest. And I guarantee people would want to be the guy who goes and saves everyones asses.


    Then you could have comical shit like the gravity control systems getting knocked out... etc. etc.


    There are plenty of ways to make it interesting.


    double edit: Spy engineers who purposely sabotage systems. I mean cmon.... cmon

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    MarikirMarikir Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    The only way I would ever play as a shield operator is if the shields worked like the manually controlled pinpoint barriers in SDF Macross.

    Trackball, go!


    I like this. I was thinking of something like this as well. Maybe something like Missile Command also, with the person in control of missile flak and/or point defense.

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    OrogogusOrogogus San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    You're right. No game is fun unless its just people shooting guns. There is no way that this could possibly be fun.

    I don't know, I'm just saying how it strikes me. Giving people guns gives them something useful to do when nothing's damaged, you don't need a radar operator right then, no one's in range for any boarding actions, etc.

    If your job is flight crew operator and you have to fix ships that are on the flight deck, then I think there's a gameplay problem. I've never played Battlefield, but I assume that your medics go with you out where the fighting is. If instead you have a triage area at the rear and have to do all your medicking back there, then I have a hard time believing that anyone would play medic.
    Real time damage repair is not a fetch quest. And I guarantee people would want to be the guy who goes and saves everyones asses.

    Well, what is it, then? What's the gameplay vision? You go down to the damaged oxygen supply, see what materials are needed, go get them and then wrench it back to full health? That's fine if anyone can jump into any role, but then it sounds like SW: Battlefront or Tribes in space, where the capital ship is more of a background piece than anything else.

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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Orogogus wrote: »
    You're right. No game is fun unless its just people shooting guns. There is no way that this could possibly be fun.

    I don't know, I'm just saying how it strikes me. Giving people guns gives them something useful to do when nothing's damaged, you don't need a radar operator right then, no one's in range for any boarding actions, etc.

    If your job is flight crew operator and you have to fix ships that are on the flight deck, then I think there's a gameplay problem. I've never played Battlefield, but I assume that your medics go with you out where the fighting is. If instead you have a triage area at the rear and have to do all your medicking back there, then I have a hard time believing that anyone would play medic.
    Real time damage repair is not a fetch quest. And I guarantee people would want to be the guy who goes and saves everyones asses.

    Well, what is it, then? What's the gameplay vision? You go down to the damaged oxygen supply, see what materials are needed, go get them and then wrench it back to full health? That's fine if anyone can jump into any role, but then it sounds like SW: Battlefront or Tribes in space, where the capital ship is more of a background piece than anything else.


    These are obviously rough ideas so I'll just put it this way. The possibilities for these ideas are awesome. There is not a 100% chance that it will be bad. I think what your saying is there is no way this idea could be good. And that's just not true. I think the problem is I'm thinking of a simulation type game and your thinking of star wars battlefront.


    I don't want to play star wars battlefront anymore.

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    OrogogusOrogogus San DiegoRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    My opinion is that simulation type games are difficult to make into crew-based multiplayer games, because a lot of jobs that make for good atmosphere don't necessarily provide a lot of fun on their own. I don't think that Battlefront/Tribes or Puzzle Pirates are what were in mind, but I think they're almost-inevitable endpoints given the nature of the potential roles in a spaceship setting. It seems like it would be much, much easier to make a fleet-based game and have everyone control their own capital ship with subsystems, fighter complements, etc. Is that what EVE is? But maybe the Star Trek MMORPG is the crew-based thing; I haven't followed that at all.

    ===

    In other news, the Tomorrow War is available for purchase on Gamersgate now:

    http://www.gamersgate.com/?page=product&what=view&sku=DD-TTW

    Initial word is that it's kind of buggy and the translation job is weak, but the gameplay and story are pretty good.

    EDIT:
    The 27th Century. There is peace on Earth. Mankind has discovered ways to travel outside of the solar system and planets thousands of light-years away have been colonized. The United Earth Empire is at a cross-roads as an old enemy decides the galaxy has room for only one Empire. 300 years ago one of the human colonies turned to Zoroastrianism, an ancient human religion. They formed a new nation called Konkordia and then increased the population through cloning their people. Konkordia has already conquered more than 30 planets and has become a powerful star nation. While The United Earth Empire has signed peace with Konkordia there was always tension in the relations between the two states. The Tomorrow War is a space sim based on the trilogy of novels written by a famous Russian author, Alexander Zorich. These books are dedicated to the intergalactic war of two mighty empires. Along with the graduates of the military-space academy players will witness different stages of the conflict between United Earth Empire and Konkordia. Gamers will participate in local operations and in huge space battles, meet alien races and fight against unofficial military organizations and of course take part in the final battle.

    * Powerful game engine capable of modeling whole planetary systems. The engine allows continuous flights from space into the atmosphere of a planet and landing on any part of the planet
    * Adjustable settings - from a hardcore space sim to a near arcade game
    * Dozens of NPCs and locations
    * Different types of spacecrafts - from fighters to ferry ships

    I was going to link some additional images but apparently the developer and publisher both think it's the worst thing in the world if people waste their bandwidth to show their game, and I don't have Noscript installed at the moment, so to hell with it.

    Orogogus on
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    temperature!temperature! Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    I think the multiplayer capitol ship sim sounds awesome. As for some jobs not being fun, sometimes people don't play games for the instant mindless fun. I remember a post Tycho made on the front page a while ago, how he's in a flight sim community as a flight controller. Some people might enjoy doing seemingly meaningless tasks just to keep the ship running, and obviously the jobs would rotate. I do admit that some jobs would end up being boring, and others would be awesome (gunner, pilots) but it would make for some fun.

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    SilpheedSilpheed Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Orogogus wrote: »
    ===

    In other news, the Tomorrow War is available for purchase on Gamersgate now:

    http://www.gamersgate.com/?page=product&what=view&sku=DD-TTW

    Initial word is that it's kind of buggy and the translation job is weak, but the gameplay and story are pretty good.

    EDIT:
    The 27th Century. There is peace on Earth. Mankind has discovered ways to travel outside of the solar system and planets thousands of light-years away have been colonized. The United Earth Empire is at a cross-roads as an old enemy decides the galaxy has room for only one Empire. 300 years ago one of the human colonies turned to Zoroastrianism, an ancient human religion. They formed a new nation called Konkordia and then increased the population through cloning their people. Konkordia has already conquered more than 30 planets and has become a powerful star nation. While The United Earth Empire has signed peace with Konkordia there was always tension in the relations between the two states. The Tomorrow War is a space sim based on the trilogy of novels written by a famous Russian author, Alexander Zorich. These books are dedicated to the intergalactic war of two mighty empires. Along with the graduates of the military-space academy players will witness different stages of the conflict between United Earth Empire and Konkordia. Gamers will participate in local operations and in huge space battles, meet alien races and fight against unofficial military organizations and of course take part in the final battle.

    * Powerful game engine capable of modeling whole planetary systems. The engine allows continuous flights from space into the atmosphere of a planet and landing on any part of the planet
    * Adjustable settings - from a hardcore space sim to a near arcade game
    * Dozens of NPCs and locations
    * Different types of spacecrafts - from fighters to ferry ships

    I was going to link some additional images but apparently the developer and publisher both think it's the worst thing in the world if people waste their bandwidth to show their game, and I don't have Noscript installed at the moment, so to hell with it.
    I have to say that it looks pretty interesting but I'll wait until I've seen some user reviews.

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    SammyFSammyF Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Orogogus wrote: »
    My opinion is that simulation type games are difficult to make into crew-based multiplayer games, because a lot of jobs that make for good atmosphere don't necessarily provide a lot of fun on their own.

    Out of curiousity -- have you tried Dangerous Waters? It's a multi-station sim for a few submarines and frigate (Oliver Hazard Perry class as I recall). You can play it single player, and frequently people do, but when the tempo increases there's plenty there to keep a few people busy and engaged in the game, between tracking and analyzing data received from the ship's sensors to form some sort of coherent idea of what's going on that you can't see with your eyes, plotting weapon tracks, manuevering in an environment that rapidly fills with torpedos when things go to shit, and coordinating with any other platforms in your force (like player-controllable helicopters based off the flightdeck of the FFG).

    From a flight-sim standpoint, I'd reference Fleet Defender, an F-14D simulator for the PC a couple generations back. Most people assume after watching Top Gun that the Radar Intercept Officer's primary duty is making clever quips and wouldn't be good gameplay, but the backseater's controls were as thoroughly fleshed out as the pilot's, and a good bit of the heavy lifting was actually done in the back seat pointing the AN-APG71 and selecting the settings best suited to what you needed the radar to do at the time. The game predated the days where almost everyone had a high speed connection to the Internet, but had it been developed half a decade later you could have had a very compelling multiplayer title where four players (two pilots and two RIOs) controlled an F-14 two-ship on a CAP over a CVBG.

    I'm not talking about making sims where you hit something with a wrench ten times to fix it or a game where you play tetris to put out a fire. I'm suggesting that where a lot of stuff is abstracted and simplified for easy consumption in a single-player title, there's actually plenty of sim-able content that you could give a player direct control over through a user interface to create compelling, meaningful gameplay.

    From a non-sim specific standpoint, I'd further point out that it's not actually the case the successful games must be up-tempo constantly in engaging the player. There's a ridiculous amount of down-time in WoW, and yet people keep logging in. Are the players who joined your game to be fighter pilots waiting around for the next battle to start? Give them an in-game training sim to play as a mini-game where they can compete against one another. No enemy ships to board yet? Give the Marines a deck of cards and let them play poker until you need them.

    SammyF on
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    Handsome CostanzaHandsome Costanza Ask me about 8bitdo RIP Iwata-sanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    SammyF wrote: »
    Orogogus wrote: »
    My opinion is that simulation type games are difficult to make into crew-based multiplayer games, because a lot of jobs that make for good atmosphere don't necessarily provide a lot of fun on their own.

    Out of curiousity -- have you tried Dangerous Waters? It's a multi-station sim for a few submarines and frigate (Oliver Hazard Perry class as I recall). You can play it single player, and frequently people do, but when the tempo increases there's plenty there to keep a few people busy and engaged in the game, between tracking and analyzing data received from the ship's sensors to form some sort of coherent idea of what's going on that you can't see with your eyes, plotting weapon tracks, manuevering in an environment that rapidly fills with torpedos when things go to shit, and coordinating with any other platforms in your force (like player-controllable helicopters based off the flightdeck of the FFG).

    From a flight-sim standpoint, I'd reference Fleet Defender, an F-14D simulator for the PC a couple generations back. Most people assume after watching Top Gun that the Radar Intercept Officer's primary duty is making clever quips and wouldn't be good gameplay, but the backseater's controls were as thoroughly fleshed out as the pilot's, and a good bit of the heavy lifting was actually done in the back seat pointing the AN-APG71 and selecting the settings best suited to what you needed the radar to do at the time. The game predated the days where almost everyone had a high speed connection to the Internet, but had it been developed half a decade later you could have had a very compelling multiplayer title where four players (two pilots and two RIOs) controlled an F-14 two-ship on a CAP over a CVBG.

    I'm not talking about making sims where you hit something with a wrench ten times to fix it or a game where you play tetris to put out a fire. I'm suggesting that where a lot of stuff is abstracted and simplified for easy consumption in a single-player title, there's actually plenty of sim-able content that you could give a player direct control over through a user interface to create compelling, meaningful gameplay.

    From a non-sim specific standpoint, I'd further point out that it's not actually the case the successful games must be up-tempo constantly in engaging the player. There's a ridiculous amount of down-time in WoW, and yet people keep logging in. Are the players who joined your game to be fighter pilots waiting around for the next battle to start? Give them an in-game training sim to play as a mini-game where they can compete against one another. No enemy ships to board yet? Give the Marines a deck of cards and let them play poker until you need them.


    Exactly. Everything you just said. Now in space.


    Also, I don't know about you, but I now have a huge hardon about infiltrating an enemy battlestar and sabotaging key subsystems.

    Handsome Costanza on
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    ArasenArasen Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Few things:
    1) FOR THE LOVE OF GOD LUCASARTS RELEASE A COMPILATION OF THE X-WING/TIE FIGHTER GAMES ALREADY!
    2) Freespace is indeed awesome, but screw that stealth mission in the original. Never was able to beat that.

    I would think a game playing a crewmember onboard a massive ship might be interesting if done right. That and the description of Starshatter sounds pretty cool too.

    Arasen on
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    elliotw2elliotw2 Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    elliotw2 on
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    ArasenArasen Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Yeah but I was hoping for a current release instead of selling a kidney to afford it.

    Arasen on
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    DashuiDashui Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Arasen wrote: »
    Yeah but I was hoping for a current release instead of selling a kidney to afford it.

    Dayum, I didn't know people were selling it for that price. I could sell my copies and get some good cash. :D

    Edit: Cancel that. They're only about 20 or 30 bucks on the Marketplace, but for some reason the featured seller is selling them for 60-80.

    Dashui on
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    SammyFSammyF Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    I'm marginally surprised they don't try publishing some of the XWing/Tie Fighter titles through online direct vendors like Fileplanet or Steam. It's not like if you wouldn't find a market if you kept the core gameplay but updated the graphics engine to take advantage of DX9 and DX10 cards.

    SammyF on
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    ArasenArasen Registered User regular
    edited May 2009
    20-30 bucks... sold!

    Arasen on
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    Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    edited May 2009
    Man, Starshatter is tough. Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't seem to have any shields and decoys seem nigh useless.

    Sir Carcass on
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