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Graphic novel recommendations?

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    BriareosBriareos Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Briareos wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Servo wrote:

    that's really not how colorists work generally

    i don't understand why or how you can think that, and i realize that you can't explain it. i assume it's some kind of chemical imbalance

    I was exagerating to point out how bad it looks. But, to try to explain this hellboy wallpaper is colored in the style that the comic I saw in the store was. I could take the inked, black and white image to looking just like in photoshop in like 10 minutes, using layers, gradients, and maybe the burn and dodge tool. And my photoshop knowledge is basic at best. The colors just feel very flat to me. It would look better using black and white that using flat colors, to my eye. Obviously, other people have other opinions. But I was just trying to explain where I am coming from.

    Don't waste your time taking to this Inquisitor guy. This is the guy that two pages ago basically said that all art in modern comics sucks, starting with trashing Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen. He's either trolling or has absolutely no understanding of comic book art.

    *shrugs* I guess I lack understanding, because I'm definately not trolling. I really enjoyed reading Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen. They were a great read. But, I found the art in both of them to be very poor. Maybe it's just not for me. Excuse me for trying to find comic books that prehaps would have a story and art that interest me at the same time. Stop being so sensitive and maybe try to understand that while some people might not have the same taste in art in you, they still want to enjoy comic books, and still can enjoy some of the excellent writing contained within some comic books despite having to trudge through the art. Or, is it just easier to call me a troll then deal with the concept that someone might not enjoy the art of your favorite comics?

    DKR and Watchmen are not "my favorite comics." However, you can't simply wholesale trash the art in those two books, or any modern comic, without understanding the artistic roots of comics going back to the Golden Age and before. There are reasons why comic books look like they do, why certain artistic conventions are followed in the medium, and what it means (groundbreaking or not) when those conventions are defied. To say, "The art sucks," doesn't display your artistic preferences, but your lack of knowledge about the medium.

    In other words, arguing with you about why Miller's art in DKR is groundbreaking or why the art in Watchmen is significant would be a waste of time, because it seems that your criteria for good art is "Do I like it."

    Briareos on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Servo wrote:

    that's really not how colorists work generally

    i don't understand why or how you can think that, and i realize that you can't explain it. i assume it's some kind of chemical imbalance

    I was exagerating to point out how bad it looks. But, to try to explain this hellboy wallpaper is colored in the style that the comic I saw in the store was. I could take the inked, black and white image to looking just like in photoshop in like 10 minutes, using layers, gradients, and maybe the burn and dodge tool. And my photoshop knowledge is basic at best. The colors just feel very flat to me. It would look better using black and white that using flat colors, to my eye. Obviously, other people have other opinions. But I was just trying to explain where I am coming from.

    It looks flat because of all the black. Most of that picture is black and almost all of the black is connected. If the shadows were a lighter color instead of black, it'd look more...robust.

    But it's also intended to look flat because that's the style and it is a fantastic style.

    Garlic Bread on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Briareos wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Briareos wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Servo wrote:

    that's really not how colorists work generally

    i don't understand why or how you can think that, and i realize that you can't explain it. i assume it's some kind of chemical imbalance

    I was exagerating to point out how bad it looks. But, to try to explain this hellboy wallpaper is colored in the style that the comic I saw in the store was. I could take the inked, black and white image to looking just like in photoshop in like 10 minutes, using layers, gradients, and maybe the burn and dodge tool. And my photoshop knowledge is basic at best. The colors just feel very flat to me. It would look better using black and white that using flat colors, to my eye. Obviously, other people have other opinions. But I was just trying to explain where I am coming from.

    Don't waste your time taking to this Inquisitor guy. This is the guy that two pages ago basically said that all art in modern comics sucks, starting with trashing Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen. He's either trolling or has absolutely no understanding of comic book art.

    *shrugs* I guess I lack understanding, because I'm definately not trolling. I really enjoyed reading Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen. They were a great read. But, I found the art in both of them to be very poor. Maybe it's just not for me. Excuse me for trying to find comic books that prehaps would have a story and art that interest me at the same time. Stop being so sensitive and maybe try to understand that while some people might not have the same taste in art in you, they still want to enjoy comic books, and still can enjoy some of the excellent writing contained within some comic books despite having to trudge through the art. Or, is it just easier to call me a troll then deal with the concept that someone might not enjoy the art of your favorite comics?

    DKR and Watchmen are not "my favorite comics." However, you can't simply wholesale trash the art in those two books, or any modern comic, without understanding the artistic roots of comics going back to the Golden Age and before. There are reasons why comic books look like they do, why certain artistic conventions are followed in the medium, and what it means (groundbreaking or not) when those conventions are defied. To say, "The art sucks," doesn't display your artistic preferences, but your lack of knowledge about the medium.

    In other words, arguing with you about why Miller's art in DKR is groundbreaking or why the art in Watchmen is significant would be a waste of time, because it seems that your criteria for good art is "Do I like it."

    Ah. I see. You are that type of person. You remind me of my brother alot. Except you are to comics as he is to music. He will often introduce me to a new band, talking about how they were the first electronic band ever or something to that extent, or how they pioneered this technique or that movement. I really don't care. Does it sound nice? Do I enjoy listening to it? that is all that counts to me in music. I don't really care out it fits into the continium of music. I just listen to it and decide if I like it.

    I guess that goes for me and comic books as well. I don't care really if the art was groundbreaking for its time, or what it did to conventions. I think it's stupid that there is even a standard when it comes to comic art. But there definately is one, the majority of comic books that I've seen atleast are drawn in a similar style. Of course, there are exceptions to this. Prehaps I am just a simple man, but when I look at art all I really care about is "Does this apeal to my eye?" and that's all.

    And yes. I fully admit a lack of knowledge of the medium. To this date I've read Watchmen, The Dark Knight Returns and own Ultimate Iron Man, and all the Ultimates trades currently out. Which I bought all at once about a month ago on a whim, to try to get into comic books.

    As to Keith. I dig the fact that the art in Hellboy is flat. I love all the black, I love how it's all connected. I love that the black is a dark, rich black. If you took all the color out of the picture. I'd probably love it to death. The drawing and the inking is a fantastic style, I will agree.

    However. When I said it looked flat I was specifically talking about the colors. Not anything else. The colors are for the most part, solid, flat colors, with little shading. I guess I am just very picky when it comes to colors. I just don't dig it.

    Inquisitor on
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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    it can't have shading because all of the shadows are pure black

    shadows aren't black

    Garlic Bread on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Keith wrote:
    it can't have shading because all of the shadows are pure black

    shadows aren't black

    That's why it shouldn't be colored at all

    I can use italics too.

    Inquisitor on
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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    you don't make any sense

    you said it's the coloring that is flat

    but it is

    in fact

    the inking

    Garlic Bread on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Keith wrote:
    you don't make any sense

    you said it's the coloring that is flat

    but it is

    in fact

    the inking

    And I am saying the inking looks good flat. But adding coloring on top of that, looks bad.

    Inquisitor on
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    BriareosBriareos Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Briareos wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Briareos wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Servo wrote:

    that's really not how colorists work generally

    i don't understand why or how you can think that, and i realize that you can't explain it. i assume it's some kind of chemical imbalance

    I was exagerating to point out how bad it looks. But, to try to explain this hellboy wallpaper is colored in the style that the comic I saw in the store was. I could take the inked, black and white image to looking just like in photoshop in like 10 minutes, using layers, gradients, and maybe the burn and dodge tool. And my photoshop knowledge is basic at best. The colors just feel very flat to me. It would look better using black and white that using flat colors, to my eye. Obviously, other people have other opinions. But I was just trying to explain where I am coming from.

    Don't waste your time taking to this Inquisitor guy. This is the guy that two pages ago basically said that all art in modern comics sucks, starting with trashing Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen. He's either trolling or has absolutely no understanding of comic book art.

    *shrugs* I guess I lack understanding, because I'm definately not trolling. I really enjoyed reading Dark Knight Returns and Watchmen. They were a great read. But, I found the art in both of them to be very poor. Maybe it's just not for me. Excuse me for trying to find comic books that prehaps would have a story and art that interest me at the same time. Stop being so sensitive and maybe try to understand that while some people might not have the same taste in art in you, they still want to enjoy comic books, and still can enjoy some of the excellent writing contained within some comic books despite having to trudge through the art. Or, is it just easier to call me a troll then deal with the concept that someone might not enjoy the art of your favorite comics?

    DKR and Watchmen are not "my favorite comics." However, you can't simply wholesale trash the art in those two books, or any modern comic, without understanding the artistic roots of comics going back to the Golden Age and before. There are reasons why comic books look like they do, why certain artistic conventions are followed in the medium, and what it means (groundbreaking or not) when those conventions are defied. To say, "The art sucks," doesn't display your artistic preferences, but your lack of knowledge about the medium.

    In other words, arguing with you about why Miller's art in DKR is groundbreaking or why the art in Watchmen is significant would be a waste of time, because it seems that your criteria for good art is "Do I like it."

    Ah. I see. You are that type of person. You remind me of my brother alot. Except you are to comics as he is to music. He will often introduce me to a new band, talking about how they were the first electronic band ever or something to that extent, or how they pioneered this technique or that movement. I really don't care. Does it sound nice? Do I enjoy listening to it? that is all that counts to me in music. I don't really care out it fits into the continium of music. I just listen to it and decide if I like it.

    I guess that goes for me and comic books as well. I don't care really if the art was groundbreaking for its time, or what it did to conventions. I think it's stupid that there is even a standard when it comes to comic art. But there definately is one, the majority of comic books that I've seen atleast are drawn in a similar style. Of course, there are exceptions to this. Prehaps I am just a simple man, but when I look at art all I really care about is "Does this apeal to my eye?" and that's all.

    And yes. I fully admit a lack of knowledge of the medium. To this date I've read Watchmen, The Dark Knight Returns and own Ultimate Iron Man, and all the Ultimates trades currently out. Which I bought all at once about a month ago on a whim, to try to get into comic books.

    As to Keith. I dig the fact that the art in Hellboy is flat. I love all the black, I love how it's all connected. I love that the black is a dark, rich black. If you took all the color out of the picture. I'd probably love it to death. The drawing and the inking is a fantastic style, I will agree.

    However. When I said it looked flat I was specifically talking about the colors. Not anything else. The colors are for the most part, solid, flat colors, with little shading. I guess I am just very picky when it comes to colors. I just don't dig it.

    How nice. I've been pigeon-holed as "that type of person," which apparently means my contributions can be discounted automatically. And a good day to you, too.

    Briareos on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    you don't make any sense

    you said it's the coloring that is flat

    but it is

    in fact

    the inking

    And I am saying the inking looks good flat. But adding coloring on top of that, looks bad.

    but it doesn't look bad

    in fact, it looks quite good

    Garlic Bread on
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    hughtronhughtron __BANNED USERS regular
    edited January 2007
    I would say that Dave Stewart is one of, if not the most talented and most famous colorist in all of comics.

    Mike Mignola is SuperFantastic, and one of my favorite artists.

    The two of them spend a lot of time deciding on the colors for every issue of Hellboy that they do, especially the recent ones. Even though it's simple, everything means something. Go pick up the latest Hellboy trade, 'Strange Places', and check out the art. Every color means something to the story, represents something.

    I realize that art is subjective, but not in the case of Mike Mignola. He's the best. Give him another look. There are a lot of crap artists out there right now, and some awful colorists, who toss every light bloom filter in Photoshop onto a comic page.

    Mignola and Stewart aren't them.

    hughtron on
    minisy3.gif
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    robosagogorobosagogo Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    What do you think of these, Inquis?

    scan0031_181205_0083.jpg

    blz46.jpg

    Solo0131.jpg

    robosagogo on
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    MunchMunch Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor, do these guys do anything for you?

    Sean "cheeks" Galloway

    Skottie Young

    Karl Kerschl

    I tried to get some guys who have sort of an anime/manga kineticism to their work, while still retaining their own western-influenced style.

    Munch on
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    JCMJCM Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Look no further than the creator of the character of the above sig if you want good art.


    Invincible´s Ryan Oattley´s the man.

    JCM on
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    DayspringDayspring the Phoenician Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    I haven't been through the whole thread but has anyone read The Surrogates?
    It's a pretty cool cyberpunk/sci-fi cop story, where basically everyone sits at home plugged into robot surrogates so they don't have to go out into the big bad world themselves.

    Dayspring on
    My Warhammer stuff online: Youtube Twitter Insta
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Sorry that this post has been a long time coming. I was at Disneyland the whole of yesterday.

    Briar. Sorry if you felt wrote off or something. But, you have to admit, when I'm the type of person that only looks at art as "Do I like it?" and you look at it for it's artistic merits for the time and what it did to comic books etc. Our opinions aren't exactly going to mesh up, unless one of use changes what we are looking for when we recomend stuff to eachother.

    Robosagogo. Thanks for posting those man. The top one has some pretty nice color, the art style feels a little...retro for me prechance? Because I have no real comic book history or heritage to speak of, the art is probably trying to recreate a sense of nostalgia in me that it simply can't. The first one isn't bad by any stretch of the imagination, it's just not really blowing me away. Now, the second one. *whistles* Very nice. Very strong style coming through. Reminds me of the hell boy art style a little, but, more fluid and colorful. The fact that it has batman only makes me like it more. The third one, the inking and stuff is simply good. But the coloring, wow. The sky in particular. Very nice. Also the walls of the house are very nice. While I'm not a particularly big superman fan, I cant deny the coloring at all. What's the name of the batman one though? In particular that one has really piqued my interest.

    Munch, thanks a bunch for posting those aswell. It's very nice to see you guys trying to help out my inexperience and apparently quite picky comic book tastes. Cheeks art seems quite interesting. It definately catches the eye. Something about it doesn't quite sit right with me. But I have a feeling that it is an artstyle that would grow on me with time. What comics has he drawn? For Skottie Young, the coloring seems really top notch. But, the art itself just doesn't apeal to me. Karl Kerschl seems pretty good. Not fantastic, but very solid.

    I have to admit guys though. As I kept flipping back to that hellboy image while keith and I were yelling at eachother about it...it slowly grew on me more and more. I might have to check out some Hellboy.

    Thanks for all the help you guys.

    Inquisitor on
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    robosagogorobosagogo Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    The Batman one is from Solo #5 and is drawn and scripted by Darwyn Cooke. If you live near a comic book shop with a copy of Absolute New Frontier, ask to get a look at it as its all high-quality Darwyn Cooke images.

    robosagogo on
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    BriareosBriareos Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    That third one is Tim Sale on the drawing. I don't know if he inked and colored it, too. Glad to see that you at least like Sale, because he is my number one favorite comics artist.

    One thing I like to see in my comic book art is medium to highly stylized characters. Tim Sale's work in Batman: The Long Halloween and Batman: Dark Victory sometimes shows physically impossible characters, but it exploits the medium as if saying, "Yeah, I know people can't look like that, but this is a comic, and because of that I can draw a really cool, outrageous picture for you to admire."

    For example:

    4p8and9.jpg

    I love the Joker's mouth in that spread. It's ridiculous and impossible, but that's what makes it great.

    Briareos on
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
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    robosagogorobosagogo Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Yeah, if the only thing you didn't like about it was Superman, then it's worth noting that Sale has done a lot of Batman.

    robosagogo on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Briareos. We are in complete agreement. Exagerated/impossible characters in comic books are simply great. I think if all you go for is ultra-realism you aren't really taking full advantage of all the medium has to offer. I have film and photographs to offer me ultra-realism. By pushing the the limity of what looks real, I think a comic artist can go past simply trying to mimic real life and really create something iconic.

    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    Well, I've jotted down some artist names and some comics that I particuarly liked. The other day my friend stumbled upon a comic store close to where I live that he said is actually very nice. And I have all day off today. So I think you gents can put together what I am going to do today.

    Inquisitor on
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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Garlic Bread on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Superman has too many powers so I find him boring. It's not a personality thing. So much as a, "Oh look..super man can take a bullet to the eyeball and be okay".

    I mean, cyclops (who I don't reall like) only has laser eyes. Thats it. Super man has that, ice breath, x-ray vision, super speed, strength, durability, flight etc.

    Inquisitor on
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    MarathonMarathon Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    :|

    I hope you smacked him in the back of the head or something.

    Marathon on
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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Superman has too many powers so I find him boring. It's not a personality thing. So much as a, "Oh look..super man can take a bullet to the eyeball and be okay".

    Superman has too many powers

    but

    you like

    Iron Man

    Garlic Bread on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Superman has too many powers so I find him boring. It's not a personality thing. So much as a, "Oh look..super man can take a bullet to the eyeball and be okay".

    Superman has too many powers

    but

    you like

    Iron Man

    It is ultimate Iron Man in my avatar. And so far all he has is some pew pew and some thought scramblers. I've never read a single comic other then the ultimate ones with Iron Man in it, other then skimming my friends civil war.

    Inquisitor on
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    Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Superman has too many powers so I find him boring. It's not a personality thing. So much as a, "Oh look..super man can take a bullet to the eyeball and be okay".

    Superman has too many powers

    but

    you like

    Iron Man

    It is ultimate Iron Man in my avatar. And so far all he has is some pew pew and some thought scramblers. I've never read a single comic other then the ultimate ones with Iron Man in it, other then skimming my friends civil war.

    Ultimate Iron Man is actually Bean.

    And Cyclops doesn't have laser eyes. Those are concussion beams.

    Bloods End on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Bloods End wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Superman has too many powers so I find him boring. It's not a personality thing. So much as a, "Oh look..super man can take a bullet to the eyeball and be okay".

    Superman has too many powers

    but

    you like

    Iron Man

    It is ultimate Iron Man in my avatar. And so far all he has is some pew pew and some thought scramblers. I've never read a single comic other then the ultimate ones with Iron Man in it, other then skimming my friends civil war.

    Ultimate Iron Man is actually Bean.

    And Cyclops doesn't have laser eyes. Those are concussion beams.

    Yes yes. His eyes are dimensional portals to a realm of pure kinetic energy etc. etc.

    Who the hell is Bean?

    Inquisitor on
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    Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Bloods End wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Superman has too many powers so I find him boring. It's not a personality thing. So much as a, "Oh look..super man can take a bullet to the eyeball and be okay".

    Superman has too many powers

    but

    you like

    Iron Man

    It is ultimate Iron Man in my avatar. And so far all he has is some pew pew and some thought scramblers. I've never read a single comic other then the ultimate ones with Iron Man in it, other then skimming my friends civil war.

    Ultimate Iron Man is actually Bean.

    And Cyclops doesn't have laser eyes. Those are concussion beams.

    Yes yes. His eyes are dimensional portals to a realm of pure kinetic energy etc. etc.

    Who the hell is Bean?

    enders-game.jpg

    Bloods End on
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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    BE why do you like dumb space ship stuff

    Garlic Bread on
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    InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Bloods End wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Bloods End wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    Inquisitor wrote:
    Yeah, superman is just a character I have never been able to connect with. He's just too...super. Batman on the otherhand? Total. Badass. Gotta love him.

    When people say this, I get the feeling that they actually no nothing about Superman or Batman.

    Like a guy I worked with hated Superman and loved Batman because Superman doesn't kill people.

    Superman has too many powers so I find him boring. It's not a personality thing. So much as a, "Oh look..super man can take a bullet to the eyeball and be okay".

    Superman has too many powers

    but

    you like

    Iron Man

    It is ultimate Iron Man in my avatar. And so far all he has is some pew pew and some thought scramblers. I've never read a single comic other then the ultimate ones with Iron Man in it, other then skimming my friends civil war.

    Ultimate Iron Man is actually Bean.

    And Cyclops doesn't have laser eyes. Those are concussion beams.

    Yes yes. His eyes are dimensional portals to a realm of pure kinetic energy etc. etc.

    Who the hell is Bean?

    enders-game.jpg

    *slaps forehead* Ugh. I thought you were talking about a comic character. I read that book. In fact, the reason why I picked up Ultimate Iron man in the first place is because orson scott card did the writing, and I loved Ender's Game. And yes, I agree. The similarities between Ultimate Iron man's origin and Bean/Ender are very strong.

    Inquisitor on
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    robosagogorobosagogo Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    I can understand the negative attitude towards Superman. I can't remember ever feeling compelled to read the Superman ongoings, and the Batman stories I like probably outnumber the Superman stories I like 5 to 1.

    Kingdom Come and anything animated or done with Tim Sale are good, though. Mostly anything that focuses on Superman's personality and humanity as much as his power set.

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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    I think the reason people don't "like" Superman is because Silver Age Superman was basically a god and then CoIE happens and it's cool that they made him more "human" but then the 90s happened and that didn't help anything

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    robosagogorobosagogo Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Keith wrote:
    I think the reason people don't "like" Superman is because Silver Age Superman was basically a god and then CoIE happens and it's cool that they made him more "human" but then the 90s happened and that didn't help anything
    The average person doesn't know anything the Silver Age and the Crisis, though, and isn't it mostly people who know nothing about Superman who say they don't like him?

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    DJ EebsDJ Eebs Moderator, Administrator admin
    edited January 2007
    I think he's more of an icon than a character to most people.

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    The Lovely BastardThe Lovely Bastard Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Personally, I loved when Super Man had Super-Weaving more.

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    Bloods EndBloods End Blade of Tyshalle Punch dimensionRegistered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Kieth why do you like dumb dinosaur stuff and Patrick Warburton penis?

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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    Bloods End wrote:
    Kieth why do you like dumb dinosaur stuff and Patrick Warburton penis?

    Both of those are fantastic

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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    robosagogo wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    I think the reason people don't "like" Superman is because Silver Age Superman was basically a god and then CoIE happens and it's cool that they made him more "human" but then the 90s happened and that didn't help anything
    The average person doesn't know anything the Silver Age and the Crisis, though, and isn't it mostly people who know nothing about Superman who say they don't like him?

    That's exactly it. They don't know that there's a "Silver Age" and a "Modern Age". They just know the mainstream stuff (that's pretty much always wrong). They think Superman can fly so fast he can turn back time and shit like that.

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    robosagogorobosagogo Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Keith wrote:
    robosagogo wrote:
    Keith wrote:
    I think the reason people don't "like" Superman is because Silver Age Superman was basically a god and then CoIE happens and it's cool that they made him more "human" but then the 90s happened and that didn't help anything
    The average person doesn't know anything the Silver Age and the Crisis, though, and isn't it mostly people who know nothing about Superman who say they don't like him?

    That's exactly it. They don't know that there's a "Silver Age" and a "Modern Age". They just know the mainstream stuff (that's pretty much always wrong). They think Superman can fly so fast he can turn back time and shit like that.
    You're probably right.
    Smallville boosted to a season-high 2.3 rating/6 share in 18- to 49-year-olds, with 5.2 million viewers. The episode featured fellow DC Comics heroes Aquaman, Green Arrow, and Cyborg.

    At this point, people are probably exponentially more familiar with Smallville's Clark than they are with Superman the comic character.

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    BriareosBriareos Registered User regular
    edited January 2007
    Superman is definitely more of an icon to me than a character. I'm only just starting to get to know him as a character through that Superman For All Seasons book and now in Superman: Confidential. In everything else I've read, he's been pretty one-dimensional (including Batman/Superman: Supergirl, Kingdom Come, and New Frontier).

    I liked Bill's analysis of Superman in Kill Bill, Vol. 2, although I can imagine it rubbed Superman fans the wrong way.

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    Garlic BreadGarlic Bread i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a Registered User, Disagreeable regular
    edited January 2007
    Briareos wrote:
    I liked Bill's analysis of Superman in Kill Bill, Vol. 2, although I can imagine it rubbed Superman fans the wrong way.

    That "Clark Kent is the disguise" speech?

    Yeah, it rubbed me the wrong way because it's fucking wrong. Superman is two people. He's Kal-El and Clark Kent. He's said it times before that he couldn't and wouldn't give up being either of them.

    Why else would he be Clark Kent?

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