Aren't sentries always around corners? I'm pretty sure every single engineer ever to come along has tried to do this. It's just about the only configuration in which they're successful at getting kills.
dedicating a guy to sapping entrances doesn't seem more ridiculous than dedicating a guy to moving the team up faster while also defending a single tunnel.
Sapping entrances is one of the few ways you can flush a bad engy out of his nest.
Aren't sentries always around corners? I'm pretty sure every single engineer ever to come along has tried to do this. It's just about the only configuration in which they're successful at getting kills.
Corners are bad for solid sentries as pyros can take them out. But they're good for surprise sentries.
Quaz and Wally on
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darunia106J-bob in gamesDeath MountainRegistered Userregular
Aren't sentries always around corners? I'm pretty sure every single engineer ever to come along has tried to do this. It's just about the only configuration in which they're successful at getting kills.
Corners are bad for solid sentries as pyros can take them out. But they're good for surprise sentries.
I guess it depends on the definition of "corner".
Every single one of the common sentry nests are tucked away to try and keep long range classes from firing on the sentry, without the sentry being able to fire back. Ie, around "corners".
I really don't see what a flame breathing sentry that was built closer to corners would be able to accomplish that the current sentry can't.
Aren't sentries always around corners? I'm pretty sure every single engineer ever to come along has tried to do this. It's just about the only configuration in which they're successful at getting kills.
Corners are bad for solid sentries as pyros can take them out. But they're good for surprise sentries.
I guess it depends on the definition of "corner".
Every single one of the common sentry nests are tucked away to try and keep long range classes from firing on the sentry, without the sentry being able to fire back. Ie, around "corners".
I really don't see what a flame breathing sentry that was built closer to corners would be able to accomplish that the current sentry can't.
Light fucka's on fire for your buddy the Axtinguisher Pyro.
On the topic of engineer unlocks: I say we need one that lets you create a force-field type barrier, like in Tribes. It's large enough to fully block most hallways, doors, and tunnels. You run up, drop it to block a pathway, and then leave. You can only have one at a time, it can be destroyed but not repaired or upgraded, and have a delay in place for dropping a new one after your current one is destroyed.
flippy suggested a bubble sheild or something like that to protect your sentry that dissapears after a time and this time is decreased by the number of objects inside it- i like the idea. it is impervious to bullets and projectiles, and stickies already inside the sheild are unable to trigger until the sheild is gone. sappers inside the sheild still disable the gun and cannot be knocked off, but do no damage until the sheild is down. the sheild also renders anyone inside it to melee weapons only, for SHOWDOWN BATTLES
useful for oh shit! my sentry! moments, as flippy suggested, at the cost of having a shotgun, so you have to back up to your pistol, and any buildings inside the sheild revert back to level one immediately. using the sheild absorbs all the metal you are currently holding.
that sounds extremely useless
Getting an instant level 1 sentry in exchange for your presumed dead lvl 3 is alright, but at the cost of all your metal and the shotgun? Besides, that lvl 1 is dropping as soon as the bubble expires, either through the stickies that are still inside of it or the surge of people that you blew the bubble up for in the first place.
The only time I guess it would be alright if it is one person that is taking out your sentry and they only have enough ammo to kill it once. And then you can repair through that anyways unless it is a demoman but hey the shield keeps the stickies inside it so you can trade a dead level 3 for a dead level 1 and no metal.
I HATE YOUR IDEAS AND MOST OF YOUR IMMEDIATE FAMILY
yeah it sounded a little underpowered when i was writing it, so maybe you can scale it back a little bit
the issue with defensive sentries is people want to leave them alone for five minutes but they can't (and really, a sentry that can take care of itself for five minutes whilst still instakilling anyone in range is stupid)
so you need a defense idea, like a sheild, that doesn't ruin ubercharges completely, or just render them extremely tough but rubbish, so you have to plink away at it for half an hour
but also one that's basically a "build-and-forget" sentry, one that you just let go and work on whatever else you want to do
dedicating a guy to sapping entrances doesn't seem more ridiculous than dedicating a guy to moving the team up faster while also defending a single tunnel.
Sapping entrances is one of the few ways you can flush a bad engy out of his nest.
Maybe it is a bad idea. Again, I'm not saying its ridiculous to dedicate a guy to sapping entrances on certain maps. Infact, its a no brainer because of two things, its effective and its easy. I don't think anyone argues the first point. The second is what is irks me. There is nothing (at least that I know of) that an engy can really do to counter a spy sapping his entrance short of hanging around a spawn protecting it, which strikes me as extremely boring and unfun. Its also not like a spy can't also sap the exit, it just takes some more skill/planning/coordination with teammates/whatever.
Anyways, apparently my argument is weak and unconvincing, so I'll drop it.
chrono_traveller on
The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. ~ Terry Pratchett
dedicating a guy to sapping entrances doesn't seem more ridiculous than dedicating a guy to moving the team up faster while also defending a single tunnel.
Sapping entrances is one of the few ways you can flush a bad engy out of his nest.
Maybe it is a bad idea. Again, I'm not saying its ridiculous to dedicate a guy to sapping entrances on certain maps. Infact, its a no brainer because of two things, its effective and its easy. I don't think anyone argues the first point. The second is what is irks me. There is nothing (at least that I know of) that an engy can really do to counter a spy sapping his entrance short of hanging around a spawn protecting it, which strikes me as extremely boring and unfun. Its also not like a spy can't also sap the exit, it just takes some more skill/planning/coordination with teammates/whatever.
Anyways, apparently my argument is weak and unconvincing, so I'll drop it.
it could be a shield that doesnt let anyone near it for 20 seconds, but weapons can get through. atleast that way you can leave for a small bit and not have to worry about it getting sapped immeadiately
dedicating a guy to sapping entrances doesn't seem more ridiculous than dedicating a guy to moving the team up faster while also defending a single tunnel.
Sapping entrances is one of the few ways you can flush a bad engy out of his nest.
Maybe it is a bad idea. Again, I'm not saying its ridiculous to dedicate a guy to sapping entrances on certain maps. Infact, its a no brainer because of two things, its effective and its easy. I don't think anyone argues the first point. The second is what is irks me. There is nothing (at least that I know of) that an engy can really do to counter a spy sapping his entrance short of hanging around a spawn protecting it, which strikes me as extremely boring and unfun. Its also not like a spy can't also sap the exit, it just takes some more skill/planning/coordination with teammates/whatever.
Anyways, apparently my argument is weak and unconvincing, so I'll drop it.
You have a point. It's just that there are so many nest placements that a spy can't really do anything against even if he's the cleverest fucker. See: Dustbowl 2-2 gated tunnel. Really only one entrance, a long corridor guarded by a sentry and high traffic. The only way we ever really see it cleared out is with an uber, and if there's an uber then there's not much need for a spy to run in there and sap it anyway.
I wouldn't like if an uber was the only way to undermine an engineer.
when i say nobody can get through that includes teammates and yourself as well as enemies. it would have to be pretty quick so jackoffs didnt just block all exits to places.
maybe an emp field might be better. something where weapons dont work around it for a short period of time. you can shoot into it, but sappers and stickies wont fire while its up.
This was a discussion from a few page ago, but something you should get points for is stunning people with the Sandman. I know you get assist points for it for people who die while they're stunned, but you don't get points for stunning ubers or stunning people who take 75% of the damage that kills them in that stun or so on.
Any given stun should be like 1/3rd of a point, a stun where someone dies within 3 seconds of it ending should count as an assist, and a stun on someone with an uber up should be a full point.
It's a large block. Of metal. About the size of a player.
It replaces the Dispenser.
For 100 metal, you can "upgrade" it to be two adjacent (or vertically stacked) Big Hunks o' Metal. You can repeat this as many times as you like, forming a Big Wall o' Metal.
Each Big Hunk o' Metal in a big Wall o' Metal has its own, individual health (about as much as a dispenser), and cannot be repaired. However, if a piece is destroyed, then you can whack any surviving segment four times to create a new Big Hunk o' Metal which will replace it (though if there's space elsewhere it may go there instead).
It's a large block. Of metal. About the size of a player.
It replaces the Dispenser.
For 100 metal, you can "upgrade" it to be two adjacent (or vertically stacked) Big Hunks o' Metal. You can repeat this as many times as you like, forming a Big Wall o' Metal.
Each Big Hunk o' Metal in a big Wall o' Metal has its own, individual health (about as much as a dispenser), and cannot be repaired. However, if a piece is destroyed, then you can whack any surviving segment four times to create a new Big Hunk o' Metal which will replace it (though if there's space elsewhere it may go there instead).
when i say nobody can get through that includes teammates and yourself as well as enemies. it would have to be pretty quick so jackoffs didnt just block all exits to places.
maybe an emp field might be better. something where weapons dont work around it for a short period of time. you can shoot into it, but sappers and stickies wont fire while its up.
Yes, and it should be called a Griefing Generator, and be deployed like so...
XXXXXXXXX
X..............X
X...Your....|O<
Grief Generator goes here
X..Spawn.|
X..............X..+<
L3 Dispenser here so you can keep rebuilding your grief generator
XXXXXXXXX
Would greatly increase the survival times of your entire team as they are confined to quarters near the health/ammo closet for maximum safety. At least until you lose.
Darkchampion3d on
Our country is now taking so steady a course as to show by what road it will pass to destruction, to wit: by consolidation of power first, and then corruption, its necessary consequence --Thomas Jefferson
Oh I know, a sentry that instead of killing people just force them to stand still for 3 seconds, they can still shoot, just not move! Lets keep this up!
Engy unlock should be a barbecue/jukebox, it don't supply ammo to your teammates but L3 healing is FAST.
L1:Radio+Toaster oven, plays tinny jazz.
L2:Side speakers pop out, sound improves, more instruments are added.
Propane tank comes up, oven turns into burner/tray with reflective panels for even cooking.
L3:The greatest thing ever built by the hands of man.
Cloaked spies occaisionally hum along with it, entranced by it's beauty(L3), normal spies still gain cloak throughout the entire process, though standing on it harms you.
G4: With the Spy update, we have heard complaints that with that update, it kind of broke the system because of the way random drops happen. Say for example you had been working toward a certain drop initially and then now you might get duplicate drops. How do you guys respond to the complaints of hardcore Team Fortress players are having, because it’s a pretty major change that you guys made?
Newell: Right, and we’re in the middle of a fairly major set of changes. So, I think it’ll make more sense to people once they can start trading items, and the things that they’re accumulating then have value. They’re not duplicates, they’re stuff that you can trade with someone else for stuff that you don’t have, so we’re in the process of iterating towards a more robust economy in the Team Fortress 2 universe.
I thought that we had been fairly clear that that’s where we’re going and that people should hang on to that stuff; it’s going to be worth more over time. So one thing is that we pay incredibly close attention to it and hopefully as we get further down this road, people will go “Ooohh, okay, I get it now, That makes a lot more sense.” But we want to get the stuff out there so that we can start associating unique items with an individual customer. That’s a pretty big piece of infrastructure to add. So, once we have that ability, then we can start giving you the ability to trade those items and then maybe craft those items or whatever and take it in that direction. We’re very much at the beginning of deploying these pieces. The nice thing is that clearly people are super excited about what’s happening and the fact that 18 months out, the number of people playing have doubled the all-time high is an indication of how much people value that sort of on-going investment and commitment to those products. The same thing can happen with Left 4 Dead and Left 4 Dead 2 and our other products. It’s a much better way to grow and continue to develop an audience. And there’d also be drama along the way as things go in and people go, “Dragons?! What?!” or whatever and then I think over time, as these pieces get flushed out they go, “Okay, that makes a lot more sense” or “That’s incredibly stupid and now I really am going to use a lot of four-letter words in my next email to Gabe.” (laughs) So, we pay attention, but we also hope people have enough confidence and have been with us long enough to know that we’re usually going in a place that they’re going to be pretty happy with over time.
I guess I shouldn't have been chucking out all those axtinguishers
Axetinguishers will still be worthless, because everyone has one. You only need ONE.
Now if I got an axetinguisher with +1 to speed or something that no one else had, then yes, it would have value. But as it stands it is 100% useless for trading.
Ah yeah I misread it, I thought it be something you'd redeem to put towards other stuff. So trading is still pointless because nothing has value..
G4: Do you think we’ll find out new details about Episode 3 by the end of the year?
Newell: Just so you know, the thing to me, that feels right, is the rhythm that Robin and his team are operating with. It’s like watching the reaction of that community, watching their ability to respond, looking at the quality of the work they’re getting with the length of those development cycles. They’re having a great time. And I think it shows on the other side, right? I mean, they were just giggling so hard when they were changing the buttons in the movies to say “leak video.” Do you remember the big screen with all the buttons? And they were like we have to put “leaks video” into that thing before we release it. They were just like cackling away. What should have been like, pretty demoralizing and stressful was for them, “Oh, this is no big deal.” So, yeah, people get the idea.
Did you guys miss where it says unique items to each player? I'll bet they'll have stats on them. I'm going to stock up on a lot of the items I play with, so I can get something good when it get's implemented.
I think the backpack should have had unlimited slots if they wanted us to keep stuff. I deleted most of the duplicates of old items but I was keeping duplicates of the new ones so I could give them out if some people still didnt have them when trading came online. though that was before the milestone patch. and before valve stole most of my 17 hats.
Engy needs more nonstatic items. Right now sentries either mean putting them in crazy places that will likely not work, but will be awesome if they do, or putting them in the typical known turtle spots, and them being invincible until a lucky/good spy, or an uber, or a smart demoman come along.
I lost all of them that i got in the 'glitch' i guess. A couple of weeks ago i got 14 hats in the span of like 15 minutes on jobs. They took those back. Still have an engy, sniper, pyro. got a fedora today.
For the Spy update, it would have preferred to see a knife upgrade instead of two invisibility watch upgrades. I think the Dead Ringer is spot on for the theme of the game, but the Cloak and Dagger seems to turn Spy from being a fairly high paced job to being one of waiting. Instead of the Cloak and Dagger, they should have added the Garrotte. It replaces the standard knife and when you use it, it doesn't drop your disguise. However, it takes a couple seconds to go off; the target is immobilised, but has time to shout for help or something. It can also only be used from behind.
For the Spy update, it would have preferred to see a knife upgrade instead of two invisibility watch upgrades. I think the Dead Ringer is spot on for the theme of the game, but the Cloak and Dagger seems to turn Spy from being a fairly high paced job to being one of waiting. Instead of the Cloak and Dagger, they should have added the Garrotte. It replaces the standard knife and when you use it, it doesn't drop your disguise. However, it takes a couple seconds to go off; the target is immobilised, but has time to shout for help or something. It can also only be used from behind.
For the Spy update, it would have preferred to see a knife upgrade instead of two invisibility watch upgrades. I think the Dead Ringer is spot on for the theme of the game, but the Cloak and Dagger seems to turn Spy from being a fairly high paced job to being one of waiting. Instead of the Cloak and Dagger, they should have added the Garrotte. It replaces the standard knife and when you use it, it doesn't drop your disguise. However, it takes a couple seconds to go off; the target is immobilised, but has time to shout for help or something. It can also only be used from behind.
the C&D is great
if you use it like a regular cloak, but you can wait around during those oh shit they know im here lemme wait in a spot they wont check prolly
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haha, that was great.
If blue team hadn't been complete cowards and charged the middle everything woulda gone well.
Instead they ran round and flanked us.
Sapping entrances is one of the few ways you can flush a bad engy out of his nest.
Corners are bad for solid sentries as pyros can take them out. But they're good for surprise sentries.
KNIFEWREEEENCH!
That's not what I wanted at all!
I guess it depends on the definition of "corner".
Every single one of the common sentry nests are tucked away to try and keep long range classes from firing on the sentry, without the sentry being able to fire back. Ie, around "corners".
I really don't see what a flame breathing sentry that was built closer to corners would be able to accomplish that the current sentry can't.
Light fucka's on fire for your buddy the Axtinguisher Pyro.
yeah it sounded a little underpowered when i was writing it, so maybe you can scale it back a little bit
the issue with defensive sentries is people want to leave them alone for five minutes but they can't (and really, a sentry that can take care of itself for five minutes whilst still instakilling anyone in range is stupid)
so you need a defense idea, like a sheild, that doesn't ruin ubercharges completely, or just render them extremely tough but rubbish, so you have to plink away at it for half an hour
but also one that's basically a "build-and-forget" sentry, one that you just let go and work on whatever else you want to do
Maybe it is a bad idea. Again, I'm not saying its ridiculous to dedicate a guy to sapping entrances on certain maps. Infact, its a no brainer because of two things, its effective and its easy. I don't think anyone argues the first point. The second is what is irks me. There is nothing (at least that I know of) that an engy can really do to counter a spy sapping his entrance short of hanging around a spawn protecting it, which strikes me as extremely boring and unfun. Its also not like a spy can't also sap the exit, it just takes some more skill/planning/coordination with teammates/whatever.
Anyways, apparently my argument is weak and unconvincing, so I'll drop it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiHuPjOkiVc
it could be a shield that doesnt let anyone near it for 20 seconds, but weapons can get through. atleast that way you can leave for a small bit and not have to worry about it getting sapped immeadiately
You have a point. It's just that there are so many nest placements that a spy can't really do anything against even if he's the cleverest fucker. See: Dustbowl 2-2 gated tunnel. Really only one entrance, a long corridor guarded by a sentry and high traffic. The only way we ever really see it cleared out is with an uber, and if there's an uber then there's not much need for a spy to run in there and sap it anyway.
I wouldn't like if an uber was the only way to undermine an engineer.
when i say nobody can get through that includes teammates and yourself as well as enemies. it would have to be pretty quick so jackoffs didnt just block all exits to places.
maybe an emp field might be better. something where weapons dont work around it for a short period of time. you can shoot into it, but sappers and stickies wont fire while its up.
Any given stun should be like 1/3rd of a point, a stun where someone dies within 3 seconds of it ending should count as an assist, and a stun on someone with an uber up should be a full point.
It's a large block. Of metal. About the size of a player.
It replaces the Dispenser.
For 100 metal, you can "upgrade" it to be two adjacent (or vertically stacked) Big Hunks o' Metal. You can repeat this as many times as you like, forming a Big Wall o' Metal.
Each Big Hunk o' Metal in a big Wall o' Metal has its own, individual health (about as much as a dispenser), and cannot be repaired. However, if a piece is destroyed, then you can whack any surviving segment four times to create a new Big Hunk o' Metal which will replace it (though if there's space elsewhere it may go there instead).
Then, you wall your teammates into the spawn.
We're still doing terrible ideas, right?
lets make it orky!!!
waagghhhhh
Yes, and it should be called a Griefing Generator, and be deployed like so...
XXXXXXXXX
X..............X
X...Your....|O<
Grief Generator goes here
X..Spawn.|
X..............X..+<
L3 Dispenser here so you can keep rebuilding your grief generator
XXXXXXXXX
Would greatly increase the survival times of your entire team as they are confined to quarters near the health/ammo closet for maximum safety. At least until you lose.
L1:Radio+Toaster oven, plays tinny jazz.
L2:Side speakers pop out, sound improves, more instruments are added.
Propane tank comes up, oven turns into burner/tray with reflective panels for even cooking.
L3:The greatest thing ever built by the hands of man.
Cloaked spies occaisionally hum along with it, entranced by it's beauty(L3), normal spies still gain cloak throughout the entire process, though standing on it harms you.
I guess I shouldn't have been chucking out all those axtinguishers
Now if I got an axetinguisher with +1 to speed or something that no one else had, then yes, it would have value. But as it stands it is 100% useless for trading.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNBIdVR95V0
This is also awesome
BRILLIANT! I want one.
EDIT: I'll throw the two screens I took up later, DOTA time is now.
dey tak hat3?
I lost all of them that i got in the 'glitch' i guess. A couple of weeks ago i got 14 hats in the span of like 15 minutes on jobs. They took those back. Still have an engy, sniper, pyro. got a fedora today.
No one would use this
the C&D is great
if you use it like a regular cloak, but you can wait around during those oh shit they know im here lemme wait in a spot they wont check prolly