CCTV cameras, real or fake will not prevent home break in. They are not a deterrent for home break in. Video systems are not intended to be a deterrent to break ins. That goes against their basic design principles which is to record events. Fake cameras do not have a magical aura that changes this.
I'm sorry, but what you state above simply isn't true. Are you actively working in the security industry or is this something you are simply speculating about? I implement and manage security measures at nuclear facilities, just so you know where I'm coming from. Cameras, real or fake, are incredibly effective as deterrents for criminal activity. You seem to be confused about what is a preventative measure and what is a deterrent. A camera is not a preventative measure; it is not going to prevent a break-in from happening. It is, however, an exceedingly effective deterrent by making those looking to commit criminal activity feel as if they are being watched (whether they actually are or not). Much like a six foot high fence isn't a preventative measure, it's a deterrent; it's not going to prevent someone from crossing a certain point, but it's going to slow their progress or be a hindrance. An eight foot high fence with razor wire top and bottom is a preventative measure. It is going to prevent someone from crossing a certain point. Do you see the difference?
I would imagine massive doses of radiation and 3-Mile-Island level meltdowns are also effective deterrents. How much are those?
Sentry on
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
wrote:
When I was a little kid, I always pretended I was the hero,' Skip said.
'Fuck yeah, me too. What little kid ever pretended to be part of the lynch-mob?'
I'm sorry, but what you state above simply isn't true. Are you actively working in the security industry or is this something you are simply speculating about?
I work for an NVR and access control manufacturer, my job is to consult with customers about their system designs. This includes site walk throughs and camera placement. I design CCTV systems for a living.
I implement and manage security measures at nuclear facilities, just so you know where I'm coming from. Cameras, real or fake, are incredibly effective as deterrents for criminal activity. You seem to be confused about what is a preventative measure and what is a deterrent. A camera is not a preventative measure; it is not going to prevent a break-in from happening. It is, however, an exceedingly effective deterrent by making those looking to commit criminal activity feel as if they are being watched (whether they actually are or not).
No, it's not. People, including criminals simply don't notice them. Short of mounting them with the big Extreme flood IRs, people tend to simply ignore security cameras. They simply become a bit of background noise. And even when there are placed to be exceedingly obvious, they don't stop people from committing crimes. There isn't a deterrence value for CCTV in most situations. Even the favorable studies on the subject only show a 1% reduction in crime from use of CCTV. And the vast majority of them show that they are neutral towards crime. The British Home Office has done a number of studies and the vast majority showed that there wasn't a deterrence value. People still commit crime in front of the cameras at the same rate as they did before the cameras were in place.
The whole deterrence arugement for CCTV depends on the idea that criminals act in a rational manner. That they act in their own best intrests, thinking in the long term. They don't. We're talking about a class of people who will walk up to the camera and attempt to rip it out of the wall while looking straight at it, yet leave the VCR/DVR/NVR completely alone. And when you look at the percentage of home break-ins that are commited drug addicts, the idea that a burglar is going to be rational is laughable.
No, it's not. People, including criminals simply don't notice them. Short of mounting them with the big Extreme flood IRs, people tend to simply ignore security cameras. They simply become a bit of background noise. And even when there are placed to be exceedingly obvious, they don't stop people from committing crimes./QUOTE]
At a gas station or office building, the cameras gas background noise. A camera above the front door of your house with a big red blinking light (whether real or not), is not background noise. It makes people feel uncomfortable, which is the point. Granted, someone with nothing to lose, as you note below, isn't going to be effected much by this, but it depends on the types of threats you are attempting to protect against.
The whole deterrence arugement for CCTV depends on the idea that criminals act in a rational manner. That they act in their own best intrests, thinking in the long term. They don't. We're talking about a class of people who will walk up to the camera and attempt to rip it out of the wall while looking straight at it, yet leave the VCR/DVR/NVR completely alone. And when you look at the percentage of home break-ins that are commited drug addicts, the idea that a burglar is going to be rational is laughable.
I think we might be having this disagreement due to the fact that the threats we both see on a regular basis are, most likely, quite different. I primarily see two types of (generalized) threats: internal and external with advanced capabilities (don't have a lot of smash-and-grabs at nuclear facilities). Criminal actions by an internal source are often performed in a calculated and intelligent manner. They generally are performed with at least some knowledge of internal policy and procedures and are being performed by someone who does not want to get caught or be identified during the commission of a crime (they have something to lose - job, freedom, family, etc). For this type of activity, cameras are an effective deterrent. Those working within a facility know they are being watched (and recorded for potential future legal action if necessary), and thus, act accordingly. Depending on the goal of an external source, in the type of environment I work in, they can also be an effective deterrent. Someone attempting not to be identified in the commission of a crime is going to be deterred by the presence of cameras. Granted, someone looking to run a gate in a truck and detonate a bomb to kill people isn't going to be deterred by security cameras, but that's not what they're there for. There are a number of other methods used to prevent that type of activity.
At any rate, this is getting way off the topic of the OP. Hit me up via PM if you want to talk about this further.
underdonk on
Back in the day, bucko, we just had an A and a B button... and we liked it.
you could just put a sign that says smile you are being recorded
right inbetween your swine flu quarantine sign and your false security system sticker
Framed nicely between your NRA membership placard and the 'Beware of Dog' signage.
Ah hell. Pick one of the annoying neighbors, and stake his head on a pole on your front lawn. Very effective, and you won't clutter up your windows. It worked for Vlad the Impaler. Of course, he had to replenish regularly to keep things minty fresh, but you could probably shellac and clearcoat for improved longevity.
I kid, of course.
Zacharde on
"For future reference, I was sort of hoping for a suggestion that didn't sound like it came from that Bolshevik Muppet with all the dynamite."
Thank god I read through this thread a few days ago.
Someone broke the lock on my security door two days ago. I didn't think anything of it until this morning when my doorbell rang. I got up, opened the wooden door and didn't see anyone. I figured it was UPS so I pushed open the security door and looked out. Hiding just to the right of the door so I couldn't see him was this short sketchy fellow. We had a brief exchange in which he claimed he was looking for his buddy "Mike" but his demeanor was not at all like someone who had a wrong address. He was clearly angry I was there (My roommates and I usually are not home during the day but my job ended once school let out). He was giving me the stink eye and was sizing me up. I live with two girls and I'm rarely home so I bet he wasn't expecting a big guy to open the door.
When I told him there was no "Mike" here, he still just stood there sizing me up then said "Yeah" and went right to his truck. No looking around for the correct house or anything, just a beeline for the door of his truck. Unfortunately I'm pretty blind and didn't have my contacts in so I couldn't get his plate without sticking my face in his bumper but he has a pretty distinctive truck (red with a white camper). I gave a description to the police. My landlord, the father of one of my roommates, is replacing the security door lock as we speak. It makes sense because we live in a low income neighborhood but all have nice cars. I honestly probably wouldn't have thought twice about the whole thing if I hadn't read through this thread.
Posts
I would imagine massive doses of radiation and 3-Mile-Island level meltdowns are also effective deterrents. How much are those?
Lots. Plus they have a tendency to piss off the neighbors.
I was wondering why my buddy's facebook status was "totally sitting on all this enriched u-238 dogg"
I work for an NVR and access control manufacturer, my job is to consult with customers about their system designs. This includes site walk throughs and camera placement. I design CCTV systems for a living.
No, it's not. People, including criminals simply don't notice them. Short of mounting them with the big Extreme flood IRs, people tend to simply ignore security cameras. They simply become a bit of background noise. And even when there are placed to be exceedingly obvious, they don't stop people from committing crimes. There isn't a deterrence value for CCTV in most situations. Even the favorable studies on the subject only show a 1% reduction in crime from use of CCTV. And the vast majority of them show that they are neutral towards crime. The British Home Office has done a number of studies and the vast majority showed that there wasn't a deterrence value. People still commit crime in front of the cameras at the same rate as they did before the cameras were in place.
The whole deterrence arugement for CCTV depends on the idea that criminals act in a rational manner. That they act in their own best intrests, thinking in the long term. They don't. We're talking about a class of people who will walk up to the camera and attempt to rip it out of the wall while looking straight at it, yet leave the VCR/DVR/NVR completely alone. And when you look at the percentage of home break-ins that are commited drug addicts, the idea that a burglar is going to be rational is laughable.
Not sure. Go run along a monitored perimeter fence at a facility and see if guys with guns show up.
right inbetween your swine flu quarantine sign and your false security system sticker
Framed nicely between your NRA membership placard and the 'Beware of Dog' signage.
Ah hell. Pick one of the annoying neighbors, and stake his head on a pole on your front lawn. Very effective, and you won't clutter up your windows. It worked for Vlad the Impaler. Of course, he had to replenish regularly to keep things minty fresh, but you could probably shellac and clearcoat for improved longevity.
I kid, of course.
Behind the "Danger - Mines!" sign in your yard.
Someone broke the lock on my security door two days ago. I didn't think anything of it until this morning when my doorbell rang. I got up, opened the wooden door and didn't see anyone. I figured it was UPS so I pushed open the security door and looked out. Hiding just to the right of the door so I couldn't see him was this short sketchy fellow. We had a brief exchange in which he claimed he was looking for his buddy "Mike" but his demeanor was not at all like someone who had a wrong address. He was clearly angry I was there (My roommates and I usually are not home during the day but my job ended once school let out). He was giving me the stink eye and was sizing me up. I live with two girls and I'm rarely home so I bet he wasn't expecting a big guy to open the door.
When I told him there was no "Mike" here, he still just stood there sizing me up then said "Yeah" and went right to his truck. No looking around for the correct house or anything, just a beeline for the door of his truck. Unfortunately I'm pretty blind and didn't have my contacts in so I couldn't get his plate without sticking my face in his bumper but he has a pretty distinctive truck (red with a white camper). I gave a description to the police. My landlord, the father of one of my roommates, is replacing the security door lock as we speak. It makes sense because we live in a low income neighborhood but all have nice cars. I honestly probably wouldn't have thought twice about the whole thing if I hadn't read through this thread.
In between the "Tress passers will be shot" and "Survivors will be shot again" signs...
Movie Collection
Foody Things
Holy shit! Sony's new techno toy!
Wii Friend code: 1445 3205 3057 5295
3DS FC: 4699-5714-8940 Playing Pokemon, add me! Ho, SATAN!
All next to the, "Come on in, the door is unlocked" sign.
Hell, just print out the thread and staple it next to your door.
I did exactly that, and I now feel completely safe.