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Somthing my sister told me about Harry Potter theme
Nakatomi2010
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So, my sister, who has a degree in music and has played in an orchestra, has told me that the Harry Potter theme is in fact the Star Wars theme played to a different tune, I wanna say like B flat or something like that... Was just wondering if that was documented anywhere... When you listen to it you can definately hear the similarities, I was just curious as to whether or not it's documented online or just an observation on her part...
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Not true but not necessarily wrong either. They are fairly similar because the original score of it was created by John Williams. They have used a couple of composers for later movies but the theme is still John Williams theme. Outside Jurassic Park and Jaws there are telltale signs without knowing that its a John Williams creation, that he made it.
If your sister was claiming the chord progression is the same, then she may or may not have been right.
Saying it's "the same theme played to a different tune" is like saying it's the same song, but with a different beat. That makes it a different dong.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vj7xGUJHtQ
I mean, Star wars goes: Dum dum dum da dum dum dum da da (shut up!)
Harry Potter goes: De, de de, da de, de, etc, etc....
Tune is the wrong word, I'm not a musical person...
chord progression sounds better... She told me this when the first Harry Potter came out, so I realy don't remember the proper words, I was just wondering if it was documented anywhere... i know it's cause John williams did the two, just curious as to whether it was something official or just a bite my thumb at you type thing...
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That is the John Williams signature. I really don't think you will find a popular John Williams theme outside the Jurassic Park and Jaws that doesn't include it. Even then at least one track per soundtrack will include it.
"tune" or key - no...if this was the case, it would be the exact same song, just higher or lower. B flat would be the "key" the song is played in. You could play it in D sharp or C or F sharp or whathaveyou, and it would be essentially the same exact song.
I haven't actually listened to them for this but there are two reasons why your sister is being dumb
First of all, Williams' music is governed by its melodies over its chord progression. Williams' strength is his melodic thematic writing, and that's really what the main focus of his cinematic scores are. Listening for progressions is missing the point. In fact, the way it often works with cinematic scoring on such a prolific level as Williams, he's got a bunch of ghosts and orchestrators, so while he comes up with the themes and direction, there are other people who handle what essentially boils down to the busywork of cinematic composition. Danny Elfman is a huge show of this... he doesn't read music, he has no musical training, but he's got great ghosts, he can pound out a theme that doesn't make people want to claw their eyes out and he's got a good team of ghosts to do the rest for him. The ghosts know Williams style and can copy the feel pretty well. Part of this means that if, say, his themes tend to have a progression from I to IV at the beginning, and the melody hints at that, they'll do that.
Secondly, when you try to make comparisons where part of your argument is "if you ignore x, y, and z", you're really not making that great of a statement. Are "Let it be" and "Basket case" the same song because they're both played by rock bands and they have the same progression? Tonal theory in regards to progressions is ruled by Paradigms, which are amazingly common. Microsoft Songsmith uses them... so if you start on one Paradigm and switch to something else, it may not be able to keep up. Simple progressions you'll see are things like I IV V I, or I ii I6 IV V I, or I vi IV V I, etc. etc. etc. These are used in so many freaking songs you wouldn't even believe it. But we don't say "Those songs are all the same". The orchestrations are amazingly different considering most likely the same orchestrators, between Star Wars and Harry Potter, so I doubt she's taking them into consideration, or at least actually looking at them.
In short, saying "They're the same minus the tune" is about as reductionist as you can get, and simplifying the whole thing to the point where it's worthless to say it anyways. You could make similar claims about maybe a bajillion different pieces spanning centuries, with some qualifiers. But it's pointless and dumb. Like did your sister somehow manage to get a music degree without ever being exposed to classical or baroque era music? If you're looking for music built on the same simple building blocks but with only a few slight differences that's the shit to look up. For that matter, why did she go after Star Wars and Harry Potter? Look at Hook and Harry Potter if you're trying to make the "IT'S ALL THE SAME" argument.
Also Bb isn't a tune
That being said, the main theme from Spider-man (the first one) DEFINITELY has a bit from the Batman theme in it (both written by Danny Elfman).
Also, I find one of the themes from Pirates of the Caribbean suspiciously similar to one in Gladiator.
I do not appreciate you calling my sister dumb. Proper responses include "Here are two reasons she is wrong" or "Here are two reasons she's came to that conclusion" but I do take offense to you calling her dumb.
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By the way, I'm not calling her dumb, I'm calling her position dumb. But I guess reading is overrated, right?
Also I took the time to explain why which I didn't have to so maybe you should be less picky over a minute detail that you obviously didn't put any thought into understanding.
So no, I wouldn't be shocked if it had similarities.
Using the term dumb in relation to one's sibling, who's gone to school on the subject of music and earned a degree in music, in addition to have served in not only her school's orchestra, but also getting first chair French horn for a different Ottawa Orchestra, I purely thought I'd ask "Hey, does anyone else know if there's anything said on this?". I do not understand why you'd jump in and just insult someone like that.
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Hmmm. I am confused.... Are you suggesting that John Williams stole the work from Star Wars? Because I am pretty sure that is not stealing. To suggest that the whole theme of Harry Potter is entirely his Star Wars theme replayed with slight changes is absurd. The idea that their are similarities in certain spots specially knowing the John Williams trademark portions is another thing altogether.
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Sorry I am not going to call her dumb... And maybe its just you poor ability to remember how she explained it to you. But if that is how she defined it with her pedigree she might want to go back to school. You are basically taking one of the greatest classical music minds of this generation and compared him to Nickelback. Obviously some people are going to take offense of that. Maybe you should ask her what she really meant instead of getting pissy about people rightfully getting upset at this notion.