Well, right, of course. I'm assuming everyone does that. I don't use tranquility in conjunction with it until toward the end of the fight though, usually.
My alt Paladin got a Last Laugh last night. Woo! It looks sick with an Accuracy enchant. Is it just me, or is the T7.5 pally tanking stuff hard to use? I keep losing uncrittable. I have a shield right now I can't use because if I do I lose my uncrittable. Bah!
For the light/dark bombs- would it make sense for the ranged people (healers/hunters/casters) to line up or group up so that we don't run past anyone when we get bombed? Like...if people can react fast enough I feel that would be a better idea? What does everyone here do?
Here's how our group is arranged for XT.
..x..
..O..
yyyy
..z..
..z..
..z..
..z..
With y being the melee, x being the tank, O being the boss, and z being the ranged. Z extends as far down as it needs to without moving out of range of XT. For gravity bombs, people will run to their right, and for light bombs, people will run to their left. For hard mode the strategy's almost the same. On 10man people with light bomb run up to beside the boss but out of range of hitting melee with the damage. When the light spark spawns either the tank or a plate DPS (during tantrum) taunts it and the melee probably take it down with incidental damage. On 25man people just run straight out left and a spark tank picks them up and tanks them out there while ranged bursts them down.
I needed anime to post. on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited July 2009
You're much better off clumping the ranged into groups than a line for XT hardmode.
Light Bomb just does not tick that hard, and if someone can't get out within 1-2 ticks, they suck and need to be kicked from the guild/raid.
The amount of extra damage you take from everyone getting hit by a couple light bomb ticks is insignificant next to the huge amount easier that healing the raid is when clumped.
We tank XT against the left wall, mid way between the robot claw thing on the ground and the north junk pile. Tank has his back to the wall, melee behind the boss, casters stacked a bit behind them. When we were learning the fight we dropped soul wells between ranged and melee so everybody could get at least two for the fight.
The claw is where you run light sparks, void zones go to the right. Main tank taunts the spark when it spawns and then ignores it, we have 4-6 ranged assigned to kill them. They can easily kill one by the time taunt wears off and it heads towards the raid. Sometimes if a healer or warlock drops the spark, fel armor/healing agro will maket he spark melee them as it spawns. Having a holy pally turn on Righteous Fury seemed to stop that for the most part.
Hevach on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited July 2009
generally we prefer to tank him in the middle. when we tanked him to the side for hardmode, the scrapbots took too long to get to him, and we had to waste time killing them, instead of just letting him effectively get rid of them while we dealt with pummelers.
Dhalphir on
0
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited July 2009
Tanking XT in the middle is actually a huge mistake, it's best to tank him in between two of the junk piles. The adds won't spawn from junk piles if he's too close to them, so what you end up with is all of the adds spawning in the back two piles and having to travel a huge distance to reach the boss. This also herds the voids zones to appear often on the other side of the map where you have no members near.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
Tanking XT in the middle is actually a huge mistake, it's best to tank him in between two of the junk piles. The adds won't spawn from junk piles if he's too close to them, so what you end up with is all of the adds spawning in the back two piles and having to travel a huge distance to reach the boss. This also herds the voids zones to appear often on the other side of the map where you have no members near.
You are talking about hardmode right?
I don't get your last comment about void zones. Void zones will spawn wherever you drop them...
For normal mode, I agree tank him in between the two piles, it makes it much easier. But on hardmode, it generally only takes us about 15-20 seconds to kill the two Pummelers that spawn. If he hasn't absorbed all the scrapbots by then, we just wait for him to kill them all, then start DPS. Tanking him in the middle, the majority of the scrapbots are generally absorbed by him already once the Pummelers die. When he's between the piles, they are usually right about where the raid is, which means you either wait 20-30 seconds more to start DPS, or waste time killing them.
For Hardmode we tank him in between the two piles on the left side. I have my back against the wall, the melee are behind him, and the ranged and healers are about 10 yards or so behind the melee. Void zones are dropped over by the scrap pile right next to the entrance door, light bombs are dropped right next to me and i taunt them then our hunter burns them down. Our first time we barely beat the enrage, this week though we had 2-3 minutes left on enrage.
What I believe happens is Blizzard's code for Shadow Crash is just shoddy. Melee can be targetted with Shadow Crash, but it will just not cast it then as long as there are people at range. So if the boss tries casting it on melee X times in a row -- suddenly you get those 30 stacks with no Shadow Crash issue.
Nah, it's just seems to one of those cooldown abilities that the boss doesn't necessarily use on the cooldown. Flash Freeze can do the same thing - the cooldown comes up just before the first frozen blows, but about a third of the time he doesn't use it until after the frozen blows. Once we had him wait long enough that we only got two flash freezes, which basically trivializes hard mode right there.
Even in easy mode on 10's the first week or so, with one tank and everybody else at ranged we've had him go as much as 30 seconds without casting it.
Finally got some good work into firefighter (10) last night. And oh my god, we were so close on a couple of occasions (2% on all three parts in last phase before the timer ran out). Things seem fine up to last phase, we enter it with about 4 min to spare. What's killing us is usually there is about 3 dead people in that final phase. What they die to? I honestly don't know... though for head phase, i recommened to the RL about having our prot warrior tank the head while the DK is on bombs since sometimes either our hunter or lock tank die (not often but i think healing is spread out too much that phase resulting in deaths).
But so far, we haven't tried it with the prot warrior. I suppose tonight we will see. Phase 1 and 2 go without issues (hero/blood blown in p2), p3 is a hit or miss but p4 is just a mess after that....
Could you afford to hold BL until P4? P2 isn't terribly awful for our group with 2 healers so we usually just wait until P4 (of course, lag has prevented us from getting there for 2 nights now but hopefully we'll fix that Friday)
We are going to blow through bosses tonight and work more on firefighter tonight. I will suggest that, now that we had alot of time p2 is now a breeze and we know what to expect. Plus we run it with 3 heals.
well the head is currently being tanked by our hunter, assault bots by the prot warrior and bomb bots by our dk. I think it is abit spread out but that is so far what getting us to p4. mind you each transition into the final phase we tend to lose one person... then another couple little further into p4 thus -just- being shy of killing him.
Neyla on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited July 2009
once you're at that point the fight is pretty much done, at that point you're just waiting for an attempt where everyone keeps their shit together for all four phases and doesn't lose focus.
Quick question about Hodir. I'm looking at our logs from last week, and wondering what kind of damage gets done to people stuck in a Flash Freeze. Do they just take the biting cold damage from not being able to move? I'm just seeing Ice Shards (icicles), Freeze (the frost nova thing), Frozen Blows, and Biting Cold.
martini on
I raised the wall. And I will be the one to knock it down.
I could be wrong but I don't think Flash Freeze does damage. Someone who gets frozen will take damage from all those things you mentioned if they occur and will have the dot stacking because they can't move.
Regardless, people shouldn't be getting frozen anyway, so it's irrelevant.
I'm trying to use the logs to find out who is getting frozen so I can make sure their graphics settings are right (projected textures), and so I can talk to them. So no, it's not irrelevant. What does that comment even mean in the scope of looking in the log for damage types? Thanks for confirming what I thought though.
martini on
I raised the wall. And I will be the one to knock it down.
If they died from being frozen their death will come from frozen blows or biting cold or icicles... it'll be hard to distinguish their deaths from non-frozen peoples' in logs. DBM or BigWigs will show who gets frozen during a flash freeze, I'd suggest using one of those.
Failbot is also fantastic for seeing who gets caught in Deep Freeze during the attempts, but projected textures doesn't really help prevent it unless you are talking about not getting knocked back by the giant snow piles.
If you want to know who doesn't have projected textures on, check the logs for who's consistantly getting hit by icicles.
I suspect if you get flash frozen while already flash frozen it will instakill you, since that's the mechanism used against npcs. However, as above, biting cold, icicles, etc will all kill you long before there's another flash freeze.
End on
I wish that someway, somehow, that I could save every one of us
Failbot is also fantastic for seeing who gets caught in Deep Freeze during the attempts, but projected textures doesn't really help prevent it unless you are talking about not getting knocked back by the giant snow piles.
If you want to know who doesn't have projected textures on, check the logs for who's consistantly getting hit by icicles.
Ensidiafails is a GREAT addon to show who gets hit with what and it will post it to the raid. You can grab it at curse.
My guild is having a hard time with Yogg phase 2.
Do the people in the brain room always get spit out and a specific spot? Is there an easy way not to look at the skulls. Are the lunatic skulls always at the same place? Our group lacks melee dps so they put my (hunter) in there and I seem to have an issue with staying at range and shooting the tenacles in the brain room.
I'm not really looking for something like failbot that types it out in raid chat, I don't think that would be appreciated by my group. What I want is to be able to approach people afterwards and coach them. It looks like estimating based on peoples' average Biting Cold ticks might be the best shot. I have DBM and use it during the raid, but I can't remember the info from 4 days ago.
martini on
I raised the wall. And I will be the one to knock it down.
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited July 2009
Basically, if someone has more than three stacks of Biting Cold, ever, one of three things is the reason.
1) They are getting Flash Frozen. If so, they suck.
2) They suck at moving. Help them to learn how to DPS on the move better.
3) They got hit by the Frost Nova, and your dispellers are being slow.
RE: Yogg p2 for 1up:
Yes, people always get spat out at the front of Yogg (door being the front)
There isn't really an easy way not to look at the skulls. You can try to turn around as much as possible, practise doing it, but as long as your Sanity is kept high outside, you should always have enough Sanity to survive the brain room as long as you take ages.
I'm not sure about your last question regarding staying at range as a hunter, but I know we send hunters down there. I imagine they shoot the tentacles towards the brain room while the melee DPS start at the other end and work their way down.
I'm not really looking for something like failbot that types it out in raid chat, I don't think that would be appreciated by my group. What I want is to be able to approach people afterwards and coach them. It looks like estimating based on peoples' average Biting Cold ticks might be the best shot. I have DBM and use it during the raid, but I can't remember the info from 4 days ago.
When I used to raid we would upload raids to http://wowwebstats.com you can just do /combatlog to start recording the raid and then submit the file from your wow folder.
You don't even have to let people know you are doing it but you can use a lot of different search criteria to trawl through logs and see what is happening in your own time instead of trying to do it mid-raid.
We used to have them posted up for general discussion so that we could analyse post-raid and offer discussion points but YMMV.
I'm looking through the logs I posted to get this info, yeah.
Dhalpir, good point on the Frost Nova. I also wonder if we might be a bit too spread out, but I would think we would still be in range of the dispellers.
martini on
I raised the wall. And I will be the one to knock it down.
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited July 2009
Your WWS should be able to show how many times each person got hit by Frost Nova, if I recall correctly, so if they kept getting 5-6 stacks of Biting Cold despite only being hit twice by Frost Nova, you know that they are doin something else wrong.
I'm not really looking for something like failbot that types it out in raid chat, I don't think that would be appreciated by my group. What I want is to be able to approach people afterwards and coach them. It looks like estimating based on peoples' average Biting Cold ticks might be the best shot. I have DBM and use it during the raid, but I can't remember the info from 4 days ago.
You can have Ensidiafails post to officer chat (I post my fails there) or a seperate channel you create. It really is a great tool to coach people on and you can have it so it doesnt send a bit of information to the raid.
Also, thanks Dhalphir!
Where Yogg spits us out is a GREAT help. I got brain linked with my healer and he was on the opposite side once and it killed us. Also, one time as I was jumping out of the brain room I got constricted right in Yogg and no one could target my tenacle to dps it down.
1up on
0
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited July 2009
hand of protection on the player will kill the Constrictor instantly.
Ensidiafails can also be set up just to report to you in your chat window. No one else will see it. I find as a RL it helps without being a dick to people. Accidents happen but if it's the same guy over and over again it atleast lets you know why they died so you can talk to them.
For Yogg's brain room strafing is very helpful. Since you don't get hit unless you are facing them. If you still have Freya you can ignore the skulls and just DPS through. By the time you get low on sanity all the tenacles will be dead. Then just recharge your sanity before the next portal. But I don't recommend this if your planning on doing less than 4 lights.
Some rooms are easier than others. The skulls will randomly be placed in the room at certain spots. For example lets say there are 20 spots a skull can be at but only 10 skulls are there every brain phase. Sometimes the skulls will be fucked and no matter which way you are facing you will still be getting hit. For times like this just hit the tenacle as hard as you can and quickly move to the next. Other times you can go down there without losing any sanity.
The melee should all leave at about the same time 7-5 seconds left on the cast and stay roughly together up top so if one gets constricted you have people around to kill it.
We send hunters down and have them attack the back groups, I think they range the skulls but I'm not sure.
A couple friends and I are going to try and 5 man normal Flame Leviathan tonight for shits and giggles.
2 demos and a siege.
Anyone have any suggestions?
Will we need to launch people? Does anything think it'll be possible?
Posts
edit: I apparently can't read and didn't realize they weren't talking about the tank.
My alt Paladin got a Last Laugh last night. Woo! It looks sick with an Accuracy enchant. Is it just me, or is the T7.5 pally tanking stuff hard to use? I keep losing uncrittable. I have a shield right now I can't use because if I do I lose my uncrittable. Bah!
SniperGuyGaming on PSN / SniperGuy710 on Xbone Live
Here's how our group is arranged for XT.
..x..
..O..
yyyy
..z..
..z..
..z..
..z..
With y being the melee, x being the tank, O being the boss, and z being the ranged. Z extends as far down as it needs to without moving out of range of XT. For gravity bombs, people will run to their right, and for light bombs, people will run to their left. For hard mode the strategy's almost the same. On 10man people with light bomb run up to beside the boss but out of range of hitting melee with the damage. When the light spark spawns either the tank or a plate DPS (during tantrum) taunts it and the melee probably take it down with incidental damage. On 25man people just run straight out left and a spark tank picks them up and tanks them out there while ranged bursts them down.
Light Bomb just does not tick that hard, and if someone can't get out within 1-2 ticks, they suck and need to be kicked from the guild/raid.
The amount of extra damage you take from everyone getting hit by a couple light bomb ticks is insignificant next to the huge amount easier that healing the raid is when clumped.
The claw is where you run light sparks, void zones go to the right. Main tank taunts the spark when it spawns and then ignores it, we have 4-6 ranged assigned to kill them. They can easily kill one by the time taunt wears off and it heads towards the raid. Sometimes if a healer or warlock drops the spark, fel armor/healing agro will maket he spark melee them as it spawns. Having a holy pally turn on Righteous Fury seemed to stop that for the most part.
You are talking about hardmode right?
I don't get your last comment about void zones. Void zones will spawn wherever you drop them...
For normal mode, I agree tank him in between the two piles, it makes it much easier. But on hardmode, it generally only takes us about 15-20 seconds to kill the two Pummelers that spawn. If he hasn't absorbed all the scrapbots by then, we just wait for him to kill them all, then start DPS. Tanking him in the middle, the majority of the scrapbots are generally absorbed by him already once the Pummelers die. When he's between the piles, they are usually right about where the raid is, which means you either wait 20-30 seconds more to start DPS, or waste time killing them.
Even in easy mode on 10's the first week or so, with one tank and everybody else at ranged we've had him go as much as 30 seconds without casting it.
But so far, we haven't tried it with the prot warrior. I suppose tonight we will see. Phase 1 and 2 go without issues (hero/blood blown in p2), p3 is a hit or miss but p4 is just a mess after that....
is 4 min though the guideline when entering p4?
the prot warrior can tank assault bots.
tanking the head involves hitting spell reflect every 10 seconds and nothing more.
Regardless, people shouldn't be getting frozen anyway, so it's irrelevant.
If you want to know who doesn't have projected textures on, check the logs for who's consistantly getting hit by icicles.
Congrats!
Ensidiafails is a GREAT addon to show who gets hit with what and it will post it to the raid. You can grab it at curse.
My guild is having a hard time with Yogg phase 2.
Do the people in the brain room always get spit out and a specific spot? Is there an easy way not to look at the skulls. Are the lunatic skulls always at the same place? Our group lacks melee dps so they put my (hunter) in there and I seem to have an issue with staying at range and shooting the tenacles in the brain room.
1) They are getting Flash Frozen. If so, they suck.
2) They suck at moving. Help them to learn how to DPS on the move better.
3) They got hit by the Frost Nova, and your dispellers are being slow.
RE: Yogg p2 for 1up:
Yes, people always get spat out at the front of Yogg (door being the front)
There isn't really an easy way not to look at the skulls. You can try to turn around as much as possible, practise doing it, but as long as your Sanity is kept high outside, you should always have enough Sanity to survive the brain room as long as you take ages.
I'm not sure about your last question regarding staying at range as a hunter, but I know we send hunters down there. I imagine they shoot the tentacles towards the brain room while the melee DPS start at the other end and work their way down.
When I used to raid we would upload raids to http://wowwebstats.com you can just do /combatlog to start recording the raid and then submit the file from your wow folder.
You don't even have to let people know you are doing it but you can use a lot of different search criteria to trawl through logs and see what is happening in your own time instead of trying to do it mid-raid.
We used to have them posted up for general discussion so that we could analyse post-raid and offer discussion points but YMMV.
I want to know more PA people on Twitter.
Dhalpir, good point on the Frost Nova. I also wonder if we might be a bit too spread out, but I would think we would still be in range of the dispellers.
You can have Ensidiafails post to officer chat (I post my fails there) or a seperate channel you create. It really is a great tool to coach people on and you can have it so it doesnt send a bit of information to the raid.
Also, thanks Dhalphir!
Where Yogg spits us out is a GREAT help. I got brain linked with my healer and he was on the opposite side once and it killed us. Also, one time as I was jumping out of the brain room I got constricted right in Yogg and no one could target my tenacle to dps it down.
For Yogg's brain room strafing is very helpful. Since you don't get hit unless you are facing them. If you still have Freya you can ignore the skulls and just DPS through. By the time you get low on sanity all the tenacles will be dead. Then just recharge your sanity before the next portal. But I don't recommend this if your planning on doing less than 4 lights.
Some rooms are easier than others. The skulls will randomly be placed in the room at certain spots. For example lets say there are 20 spots a skull can be at but only 10 skulls are there every brain phase. Sometimes the skulls will be fucked and no matter which way you are facing you will still be getting hit. For times like this just hit the tenacle as hard as you can and quickly move to the next. Other times you can go down there without losing any sanity.
The melee should all leave at about the same time 7-5 seconds left on the cast and stay roughly together up top so if one gets constricted you have people around to kill it.
We send hunters down and have them attack the back groups, I think they range the skulls but I'm not sure.
2 demos and a siege.
Anyone have any suggestions?
Will we need to launch people? Does anything think it'll be possible?