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Lookouts Guest Artists

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    ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Sentry wrote: »
    Sentry wrote: »
    Quid wrote: »
    Gabe & Tycho's art is clearly on the way out. It's primitive composition and color selection is trumped by superior artists, such as our guest artists here. If Gabe and Tycho know what are good for them, they'll retire and let the guest artists take over the comic.
    What makes you feel their composition is primitive?

    I was just kidding. I think it's ridiculous that a guest artist - one that may not be suited for a comic, but a damn good artist - is not only being so heavily criticized, but outright insulted in some cases.

    have you never been to the Art forum here? There is absolutely nothing wrong with criticizing art, be it a painting or a film or whatever.

    Besides, we've mostly moved on to criticizing the writer.

    There isn't anything wrong with criticizing the artist, but he (she?) is a good artist, and I'm seeing people call him/her an outright hack, and someone who should give up being an artist forever for creating something so awful.

    This isn't hyperbole at all.

    Hmm... I've seen scatterings of that, but not enough that you can characterize this whole thread of being that way. If anything, the consensus seems to be that the artist is clearly good, just not in this format.

    You obviously haven't been in the SE++ comic threads, because so much bile was being spit out in there that you couldn't even click on it without feeling intense hatred.

    Zombiemambo on
    JKKaAGp.png
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    This isn't the SE comic thread.

    Quid on
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    tetsujintetsujin Registered User new member
    edited July 2009
    Preacher wrote: »
    Sentry wrote: »
    SQUIRREL! wrote: »
    Also, if there are so many basilisks, as implied by the very last panel of the whole strip, how is just one little blonde kid enough to satisfy them?

    That's why it should have been the fat kid.

    Well clearly by all the stone statues they don't eat them, they just use them for lawn decoration.

    Of course! It all makes sense now. Their plan is to gradually fill the forest with stone statues: over a period of many years the land has been worn away by erosion, so the Lookouts use natural processes (human metabolism, followed by basilisk-induced petrification) to replenish the mineral content of the soil that's being gradually washed away. Probably the erosion was caused by all the human commerce crossing through the forest, and so the Lookouts have taken on the burden of helping the forest to recover. That's what the old man meant when he said "we are servants of the forest". The comic perfectly supports (i.e. fails to blatantly contradict) this theory, so it must be true!

    tetsujin on
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    emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    tetsujin wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Sentry wrote: »
    SQUIRREL! wrote: »
    Also, if there are so many basilisks, as implied by the very last panel of the whole strip, how is just one little blonde kid enough to satisfy them?

    That's why it should have been the fat kid.

    Well clearly by all the stone statues they don't eat them, they just use them for lawn decoration.

    Of course! It all makes sense now. Their plan is to gradually fill the forest with stone statues: over a period of many years the land has been worn away by erosion, so the Lookouts use natural processes (human metabolism, followed by basilisk-induced petrification) to replenish the mineral content of the soil that's being gradually washed away. Probably the erosion was caused by all the human commerce crossing through the forest, and so the Lookouts have taken on the burden of helping the forest to recover. That's what the old man meant when he said "we are servants of the forest". The comic perfectly supports (i.e. fails to blatantly contradict) this theory, so it must be true!

    ........
    ........

    Booo!
    *throws rotten fruit at tetsujin*

    emnmnme on
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    ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Quid wrote: »
    This isn't the SE comic thread.

    I wasn't trying to accuse it of being the SE comic thread.

    Zombiemambo on
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    You made a post in this thread apparently on the basis of the SE thread.

    Did you have a point?

    Quid on
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    ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Quid wrote: »
    You made a post in this thread apparently on the basis of the SE thread.

    Did you have a point?

    That I think outright insulting the guest artists is not only ridiculous, but fundamentally wrong?

    Zombiemambo on
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    And? There's not really anyone here doing that.

    Quid on
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    ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    I'm sorry, is there some kind of absolute limit to the amount of things we can say about the subject?

    Zombiemambo on
    JKKaAGp.png
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    There's not much point in stating the obvious is all.

    Quid on
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    ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Then there must not be much point in stating the obvious about the obvious.

    Zombiemambo on
    JKKaAGp.png
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    I apologize for trying to figure out why you would do that or talking to you. Feel free to continue, perhaps you can list the colors in the panels or something. Good evening.

    Quid on
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    King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    kedinik wrote: »
    Maybe next time everyone will know to vote for the idea that's actually interesting, and we won't have a close call that results in someone else making an even shittier version of a lame idea.

    Can't wait for Automata, and I kinda wish G&T had just gone with the way the votes were and throw The Lookouts away entirely.

    Tycho implied the farming out of Automata to guests, as well.

    Somehow I doubt that's what will happen after the reaction Lookouts got.

    This isn't the Tonight show. While G&T are on vacation I'm not going to read the webcomic version of Joan Rivers. That's not why I come on the site
    Gabe is totally Johnny

    King Riptor on
    I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
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    Vincent GraysonVincent Grayson Frederick, MDRegistered User regular
    edited July 2009
    kedinik wrote: »
    Maybe next time everyone will know to vote for the idea that's actually interesting, and we won't have a close call that results in someone else making an even shittier version of a lame idea.

    Can't wait for Automata, and I kinda wish G&T had just gone with the way the votes were and throw The Lookouts away entirely.

    Tycho implied the farming out of Automata to guests, as well.

    Somehow I doubt that's what will happen after the reaction Lookouts got.

    This isn't the Tonight show. While G&T are on vacation I'm not going to read the webcomic version of Joan Rivers. That's not why I come on the site
    Gabe is totally Johnny

    Also, he didn't imply that at all. IIRC, he explicitly stated they'd be doing Automata.

    Vincent Grayson on
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    OldSlackerOldSlacker Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    I also got the impression that most of the bashing was directed at the writer, not the artist of this comic.

    My take:
    In order to evade mutual destruction, the village and a pack of basilisks are in an agreement that every year one child dies from the basilisk and the other children kill that basilisk.
    The elders at the end didn't say that the leader brought doom upon them by killing the basilisk - they were explicitly angry that one of their own didn't die.

    OldSlacker on
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    SQUIRREL!SQUIRREL! __BANNED USERS regular
    edited July 2009
    I don't really think I like anything that implies that basilisks are intelligent creatures.

    SQUIRREL! on
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    OldSlackerOldSlacker Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    Making any kind of deal with them would imply they are to some degree intelligent.

    Or were the sacrifices made in order to appease "the wood spirits".

    OldSlacker on
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    I also got the impression that most of the bashing was directed at the writer, not the artist of this comic.

    It's pretty evenly split actually.

    It's just the huge problems with the writing weren't evident till the last panel, whereas the problems with the art were noticeable right from the start and have already been discussed ad nauseum.

    shryke on
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited July 2009
    shryke wrote: »
    I also got the impression that most of the bashing was directed at the writer, not the artist of this comic.

    It's pretty evenly split actually.
    Most of the stuff I've seen against the artist is less about her technical skill, and more about how her style didn't fit at all with the idea or style of an action-oriented comic.

    Fencingsax on
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    AdrienAdrien Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    kedinik wrote: »
    Maybe next time everyone will know to vote for the idea that's actually interesting, and we won't have a close call that results in someone else making an even shittier version of a lame idea.

    Can't wait for Automata, and I kinda wish G&T had just gone with the way the votes were and throw The Lookouts away entirely.

    Tycho implied the farming out of Automata to guests, as well.

    Somehow I doubt that's what will happen after the reaction Lookouts got.

    This isn't the Tonight show. While G&T are on vacation I'm not going to read the webcomic version of Joan Rivers. That's not why I come on the site
    Gabe is totally Johnny

    Also, he didn't imply that at all. IIRC, he explicitly stated they'd be doing Automata.

    Yeah. Some people thought since he said it would be running during SDCC that meant they wouldn't be making it, but they missed the first announcement:
    Gabriel and I will create and run Automata, which will be "broadcast" during the San Diego Comic Con.

    Adrien on
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    tetsujintetsujin Registered User new member
    edited July 2009
    emnmnme wrote: »
    tetsujin wrote: »
    Of course! It all makes sense now. Their plan is to gradually fill the forest with stone statues: over a period of many years the land has been worn away by erosion, so the Lookouts use natural processes (human metabolism, followed by basilisk-induced petrification) to replenish the mineral content of the soil that's being gradually washed away.

    ........
    ........

    Booo!
    *throws rotten fruit at tetsujin*

    Missiion accomplished! XD

    Though if you think about it, if people are willing to sacrifice their human population, instigating basilisk-induced petrification could be a great way for a society that's short on mineral resources to secure a local supply of raw stone material. It's like a free alchemic trans-substantiation service - it even bypasses conservation laws, as the petrified child will be heavier than the non-petrified child... So rather than sending laborers to the mountain to dig mines and haul back small chunks through treacherous routes at tremendous cost to build that stone wall or temple, just send out children to the forest periodically, arrange for the weaker (and fatter, preferably) ones to get petrified, and then - boom - local, cheap source of raw stone material. The main problem then is that the stone figure, when cut up, forms relatively small pieces... No doubt this approach to raw materials procurement results in some unique architecural decisions as a result.

    tetsujin on
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    DuffelDuffel jacobkosh Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    I just hope if there really is new Lookouts material that comes out that it's Gabe and Tycho that does it.

    I didn't think what we got was bad like a lot of people did, but I think it would have been ten times better if G&T did it like they did entry #1.

    Duffel on
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    UnoUno Registered User new member
    edited July 2009
    Hey there! Long time reader, first time poster. In fact, I registered when I found out this topic existed. I just wanted to say, really nice job on the Lookouts guest strips. I was wondering what the Penny Arcade team is going to do next! Can we expect to see Tycho writing the first chapter for a novel in an immersive, brilliant, unique setting and then having a random fanfiction writer finish off the other twenty-nine chapters?

    Maybe Gabe can do the lineart for a masterpiece and then have some random deviantart member fill it in with crayons?

    Commissioning Tim Buckley to finish off Jim Darkmagic would be an equally good idea and continue the trend of the treatment that Lookouts was given. :^:
    If the PA team are going back and completely redoing this story arc in the original intended vision eventually, I apologize in advance.

    Uno on
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    FiggyFiggy Fighter of the night man Champion of the sunRegistered User regular
    edited July 2009
    After this series was completed, I checked the "new comic thread" in SE++ to see if my disappoint was shared by anyone else. Most of the people there were ejaculating all over their keyboards over it, so I figured I was just being a picky douche.

    Then, I find this thread. I'm glad I'm not just a picky douche.

    You shouldn't have to re-read cells several times to keep up with what is happening, simply because the art style does not effectively carry the plot forward. Looking at the artists' own site, I can see why. Their own comics aren't particularly story-driven, and they're very much "artsy" folk, which is fine. I just don't think their style lends itself well to the Lookouts.

    Cardboard Tube? Maybe! Looksouts? Not so much.

    Figgy on
    XBL : Figment3 · SteamID : Figment
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    PelPel Registered User regular
    edited July 2009
    slacktron wrote: »
    Denada wrote: »
    Are you aware of an interpretation that isn't logically flawed? If you are, why are you trying to hide it from someone who genuinely wants to hear it?

    I'm game.
    But note that just because something is logical, doesn't mean that you have to like it. Plenty of utterly crap movies have logical explanations.

    Here's one possibility:

    1. The elders sacrifice some acceptable (to them) percentage of children in order to keep the northern passage Basilisk-free. We'll call this "the pact".
    2. These children must be a more acceptable loss than the travelers that were being killed before the elders made "the pact."
    3. The pact is secret, so there must some significant percentage of the population that would oppose the paying the price if it were brought to light.
    4. Thus, the scoutmaster instructs the children as well as he can -- but lies to them about "showing them how to set (Basilisks) right" when, indeed, his motivation is to take a dive when the monster shows up. The basilisk will then take one of the boys as payment and leave the rest. One kid dies, the rest grow up with their merit badges.
    5. The surviving boys are expected to report that the Basilisk was simply too much for them, and that it is a shame one of their number died, but the Northern passage is clear as long as you avoid the section with all the statues around it.
    6. But the scoutmaster has seen enough of this vile compromise and this particular troop is spirited enough to turn him against the elders. So he does, indeed, keep his word and show the boys how to kill a basilisk.
    7. Elders are pissed. Now old men like them are going to get attacked when trying to visit their Northern brothers.
    8. Scoutmaster says suck it up, you cowardly old bastards. This new generation isn't going to play that game.

    That seems like a good enough high concept, but I dislike the execution for every single reason that Kupi's article so eloquently pointed out.

    Regarding #1: Yes, but the elders call it "the creed" and speak of being "servants of the forest". This begs more questions and makes no sense in the context of just about anything.

    If 4 kids and a scoutmaster can go from being surprised by the beast - intending to sacrifice a member to the beast - killing the beast with no casualties, what's the point of the pact again?

    How can it be insured that only one will die, and the beast will not, since they seem to be quite mortal? Obviously there have been quite a few repetitions of this drama, and none have ended this way in the past. As said, the kids would probably occasionally get lucky and kill the beast on their own. What is the benefit to the basilisk community of taking sacrifices from an armed group with a fair bit of personal danger? Evidently it is implied that the basilisks have a large advantage over humans; this is belied by the depicted battle, but even if true, it seems the basilisks could negotiate a better and safer sacrifice arrangement, or just take whatever food or sacrifice they wanted without repercussion, as is often the case with this sort of overdone plot line. Why have a basilisk merit badge if the basilisk isn't supposed to die? If the arrangement is secret, doesn't anyone ever notice that none of these apparently frequent hunts has ever resulted in a dead basilisk?

    Pel on
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