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EGM says 60 hours of gameplay? EVEN IF IT IS 20 HOURS, I AM SOLD!
My investment in a gamecube will finally pay off. RE4 was a great experience, but I'm ready for Zelda.
I hope my circuit city has it in.
It really depends on how many side quests you do, and how familiar you are with Zelda-style puzzles. I did about 3/4 of the sidequests I came across during normal play, and finished in about 40 hours.
Still, that is a amazing. I'm so used to games being 7 hours long at most. Maybe I just play too many first person shooters.
My wife picked up the GC version today, along with the hard cover collector's guide. Damn her eyes though, she's making me wait until Christmas before I can play it.
My wife picked up the GC version today, along with the hard cover collector's guide. Damn her eyes though, she's making me wait until Christmas before I can play it.
You must really love her, man. Either that or you really screwed up.
Thanks to everyone for all the positive comments about play length; I have a habit of not finishing games because of work/family/other people, but I have never left a Zelda game unfinished. It's just not possible and I won't entertain such thoughts. I'll be picking mine up as soon as my holiday vacation starts.
I have the Wii version, yet I just bought the GC version.
I am such a Zelda whore...is it wrong that the mirrored Hyrule bothered me all the way through on the Wii? Lake Hylia should be on the left, damnit!
I have been thinking about doing that. Good idea, bad idea?
Depends on how much the idea of playing in 'mirror mode' appeals to you. Personally I'm quite enjoying the mindfuck that it brings, along with the geeky satisfaction of seeing all the areas match up with the OoT world map.
My wife picked up the GC version today, along with the hard cover collector's guide. Damn her eyes though, she's making me wait until Christmas before I can play it.
You must really love her, man. Either that or you really screwed up.
She'd be dead already if I hadn't played the Wii version a few weeks ago.
I have the Wii version, yet I just bought the GC version.
I am such a Zelda whore...is it wrong that the mirrored Hyrule bothered me all the way through on the Wii? Lake Hylia should be on the left, damnit!
I have been thinking about doing that. Good idea, bad idea?
Depends on how much the idea of playing in 'mirror mode' appeals to you. Personally I'm quite enjoying the mindfuck that it brings, along with the geeky satisfaction of seeing all the areas match up with the OoT world map.
This man speaks the truth. I'm also finding it hilarious to turn the wrong way on instinct.
Depends on how much the idea of playing in 'mirror mode' appeals to you. Personally I'm quite enjoying the mindfuck that it brings, along with the geeky satisfaction of seeing all the areas match up with the OoT world map.
So which one is the mirrored version? In the mirror version is Link right-handed instead of left-handed?
The Wii version is the mirrored one. The Gamecube is the original, left-handed Link version.
Hm. Any idea why the two versions are mirrors of one another?
Because most people use their right hand to swing the sword in the Wii version, and they thought it would be weird if Link held his sword in his left hand.
So which one is the mirrored version? In the mirror version is Link right-handed instead of left-handed?
The Wii version is the mirrored one. The Gamecube is the original, left-handed Link version.
Hm. Any idea why the two versions are mirrors of one another?
They figured that on the wii most people would play right-handed, so they mirrored the entire game so that link would better replicate your sword slashes on screen.
Captain Subtext on
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JebralThe guy nobody pays attention toDown South in the land of free thinkingRegistered Userregular
edited December 2006
So to make Link right-handed..... They turn the whole world backwards?
So to make Link right-handed..... They turn the whole world backwards?
What the hell?
Yup, His handedness apparently has quite an impact on gameplay.... I can see why this is a problem in combat; don't know about the puzzles though.
I guess for combat alone they could have just flipped the enemy character models....
It's not accurate to OoT's Geography anyways. In OoT Death Mountain and Zora's domain where right next to eachother. They couldn't be much father apart now.
I really hope they get over that shit for the next game. I don't care if I swing the remote right-handed. Link is meant to be left-handed.
Yes, I'm one of those freaks that cares about this.
You know, I never noticed Links handedness until this entire mirror-thing came up. It does make him stand out a bit,once you're aware of it. Wasn't Link made a lefty because miyamoto is left-handed himself? Funny thing that the wiimote is probably one of the most left-handed-friendly controllers on the market.....
So how do TP's graphics stack up against the mighty Wind Waker and it's cel-shaded beauty?
I have to admit, as an initial WW skeptic, I've really come to appreciate the timeless quality that cel-shading can give a game title. Going back to play OoT was pretty painful last year, but man I could play WW 15 years from now and it'd still be pleasing to the eye.
The "mirror the whole world" thing was a quality control issue. They decided that, for the Wii, it's better if Link matches the handedness of the person playing, and most people are right handed, so he needed to be right-handed. However, since several years of work had been done on the game using the left-handed model and no one had even considered designing it around a right-handed model they simply didn't know what kind of glitches and bugs would unexpectedly pop up if they flipped the player model. The bug testing would have taken months and months.
From the standpoint of models interracting together properly it's much safer to just mirror the whole world. Any bugs that develop from that will be big and obvious and easy to find and fix, rather than the miriad of possible little collision problems from flipping just the player model. Since they were running short on time that's what they did.
In the future I expect Wii games to be designed from the ground up with the option to choose the handedness of your character. The next Wii Zelda will probably let you choose whether Link is right or left handed and leave the gameworld alone.
So how do TP's graphics stack up against the mighty Wind Waker and it's cel-shaded beauty?
I have to admit, as an initial WW skeptic, I've really come to appreciate the timeless quality that cel-shading can give a game title. Going back to play OoT was pretty painful last year, but man I could play WW 15 years from now and it'd still be pleasing to the eye.
So how do TP's graphics stack up against the mighty Wind Waker and it's cel-shaded beauty?
I have to admit, as an initial WW skeptic, I've really come to appreciate the timeless quality that cel-shading can give a game title. Going back to play OoT was pretty painful last year, but man I could play WW 15 years from now and it'd still be pleasing to the eye.
TP is gorgeous.
It really is. I don't remember who said it (maybe some reviewer), but whoever said it's the video game form of Monet was spot on.
The mirroring decision was just asinine. The sword doesn't even have 1:1 controls, and still people felt it was intuitive, what hand a third person character uses seems even more irrelevant.
"So how do TP's graphics stack up against the mighty Wind Waker and it's cel-shaded beauty?"
I think TP's a're worse, hands-down.
TP has amazing lighting, animations and art design. I definitely like TP's art design more than WW's (with the exception of WW's awesome Ganon design). However, WW's cel-shading did a much better job translating that art design to the game. WW didn't look like you were playing a polygonal video game, it felt like you were playing an illustration or a cartoon.
TP looks like a videogame. Unlike WW, you can clearly see the polygons and the low-res textures. The animations don't flow as smoothly either.
Which is a shame, because it seems like it could have easily been cel-shaded in the style of its illustrations, which would have been amazing. I think a lot of people mistake "polygons" for "realism" and don't realize that the art style of Ocarina of Time and Twilight princess is much more storybook/anime than photorealistic.
Cool to see some fans of the cel-shading. I'm curious if they'll keep that style exclusively for Wind Waker spinoffs like Phantom Hourglass, or if they'll carry it over into a brand new Zelda game.
With the Wii's increased hardware they could up the draw distance and stuff, while refining the overall technique. I think it'd be awesome.
Twilight Princess: Gorgeous character models, muddy environments
Wind Waker: Gorgeous environments, goofy character models
I was never at all a fan of Wind Waker's chibi "watermelon heads and stubby legs" thing. The cel-shading itself is gorgeous, though.
But I think I would most like a standard-polygon Zelda game that minimized 2D pixel detailing (there's tons of it in TP) in favor of solid colors that relied on good lighting to provide most of the detail instead. Sort of like Super Mario Galaxy, but with more realistic character proportions.
Cool to see some fans of the cel-shading. I'm curious if they'll keep that style exclusively for Wind Waker spinoffs like Phantom Hourglass, or if they'll carry it over into a brand new Zelda game.
With the Wii's increased hardware they could up the draw distance and stuff, while refining the overall technique. I think it'd be awesome.
They used the enemy "poof" in 4SA, and I liked it. I hope it keeps popping up. Also, we need a 4SA for Wii that can be played with either the DS or the GBA.
That way my wife and I can play together (as we only have 1 of each).
"But I think I would most like a standard-polygon Zelda game that minimized 2D pixel detailing (there's tons of it in TP) in favor of solid colors that relied on good lighting to provide most of the detail instead. Sort of like Super Mario Galaxy, but with more realistic character proportions."
I don't see why Mario isn't cel-shaded either, though.
The way I see it: graphics are technology that translates conceptual art design to the videogame experience itself. Therefore, the best graphics would be those that best translate the art design.
If you think about it, traditional polygon models do a shitty job of translating character art. In 10 or even 5years we are all going to look back on this generation of videogames and say "wow, look at all those polygons, that sure looks artificial."
The artwork in Zelda (and Mario, and actually, for most games) is hand-drawn cartoon artwork. Twilight Princess has more realistic proportions than Wind Waker, but the artwork is still cartoon, and very similar to what you'd see in a Disney movie. Instead of trying to shoehorn this style into 3-D with polygon models, Nintendo should have used cel-shading!
The problem is that the gaming population has this weird miconception that cel-shading = teh kiddie (look at Okami, or Suda51's games for why this is wrong.) I feel very strongly that cel-shading should be used way more extensively than it is now. I really think that in 5 years people are going to look at traditional polygonal graphics as completely limiting.
ALL THAT SAID: even though I don't think TP looks as good as WW, the world you explore in TP is much, much more detailed, amazing and creative than the world in Wind Waker, which I found pretty mundane for a Zelda game.
Cool to see some fans of the cel-shading. I'm curious if they'll keep that style exclusively for Wind Waker spinoffs like Phantom Hourglass, or if they'll carry it over into a brand new Zelda game.
With the Wii's increased hardware they could up the draw distance and stuff, while refining the overall technique. I think it'd be awesome.
I'm hoping they utilize that style whenever Link is a child for the story.
Cool to see some fans of the cel-shading. I'm curious if they'll keep that style exclusively for Wind Waker spinoffs like Phantom Hourglass, or if they'll carry it over into a brand new Zelda game.
With the Wii's increased hardware they could up the draw distance and stuff, while refining the overall technique. I think it'd be awesome.
I'm hoping they utilize that style whenever Link is a child for the story.
I'd be interested in seeing an older Link in that style. The animated look is pure sex, esp. with the watercolor look they used for the Minnish Cap art.
Posts
Still, that is a amazing. I'm so used to games being 7 hours long at most. Maybe I just play too many first person shooters.
You must really love her, man. Either that or you really screwed up.
Thanks to everyone for all the positive comments about play length; I have a habit of not finishing games because of work/family/other people, but I have never left a Zelda game unfinished. It's just not possible and I won't entertain such thoughts. I'll be picking mine up as soon as my holiday vacation starts.
I am such a Zelda whore...is it wrong that the mirrored Hyrule bothered me all the way through on the Wii? Lake Hylia should be on the left, damnit!
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Depends on how much the idea of playing in 'mirror mode' appeals to you. Personally I'm quite enjoying the mindfuck that it brings, along with the geeky satisfaction of seeing all the areas match up with the OoT world map.
Anyways, Hyrule's geography makes a lot more sense in relation to Ocarina of Time to me now that I remember it's mirrored.
This man speaks the truth. I'm also finding it hilarious to turn the wrong way on instinct.
EDIT:
Holy crap, even in my lesser 21" sdtv the gamecube component cables made HUGE difference. The games looks 1000x better.
Zoras Domain is in the wrong place. Boo. :?
The Wii version is the mirrored one. The Gamecube is the original, left-handed Link version.
edit - beat'd
Hm. Any idea why the two versions are mirrors of one another?
edit...seems I got beat, I knew this would happen on this question
I could've sworn he was traditionally left-handed.
Oh well. I'm sure the Wii version will still be fun even if stuff is backwards of OoT geography.
He is traditionally left-handed. So if I wasn't clear.
They figured that on the wii most people would play right-handed, so they mirrored the entire game so that link would better replicate your sword slashes on screen.
What the hell?
Yup, His handedness apparently has quite an impact on gameplay.... I can see why this is a problem in combat; don't know about the puzzles though.
I guess for combat alone they could have just flipped the enemy character models....
Also there are a ton of other differances.
Yes, I'm one of those freaks that cares about this.
You know, I never noticed Links handedness until this entire mirror-thing came up. It does make him stand out a bit,once you're aware of it. Wasn't Link made a lefty because miyamoto is left-handed himself? Funny thing that the wiimote is probably one of the most left-handed-friendly controllers on the market.....
I have to admit, as an initial WW skeptic, I've really come to appreciate the timeless quality that cel-shading can give a game title. Going back to play OoT was pretty painful last year, but man I could play WW 15 years from now and it'd still be pleasing to the eye.
From the standpoint of models interracting together properly it's much safer to just mirror the whole world. Any bugs that develop from that will be big and obvious and easy to find and fix, rather than the miriad of possible little collision problems from flipping just the player model. Since they were running short on time that's what they did.
In the future I expect Wii games to be designed from the ground up with the option to choose the handedness of your character. The next Wii Zelda will probably let you choose whether Link is right or left handed and leave the gameworld alone.
I think TP's a're worse, hands-down.
TP has amazing lighting, animations and art design. I definitely like TP's art design more than WW's (with the exception of WW's awesome Ganon design). However, WW's cel-shading did a much better job translating that art design to the game. WW didn't look like you were playing a polygonal video game, it felt like you were playing an illustration or a cartoon.
TP looks like a videogame. Unlike WW, you can clearly see the polygons and the low-res textures. The animations don't flow as smoothly either.
Which is a shame, because it seems like it could have easily been cel-shaded in the style of its illustrations, which would have been amazing. I think a lot of people mistake "polygons" for "realism" and don't realize that the art style of Ocarina of Time and Twilight princess is much more storybook/anime than photorealistic.
With the Wii's increased hardware they could up the draw distance and stuff, while refining the overall technique. I think it'd be awesome.
Twilight Princess: Gorgeous character models, muddy environments
Wind Waker: Gorgeous environments, goofy character models
I was never at all a fan of Wind Waker's chibi "watermelon heads and stubby legs" thing. The cel-shading itself is gorgeous, though.
But I think I would most like a standard-polygon Zelda game that minimized 2D pixel detailing (there's tons of it in TP) in favor of solid colors that relied on good lighting to provide most of the detail instead. Sort of like Super Mario Galaxy, but with more realistic character proportions.
They used the enemy "poof" in 4SA, and I liked it. I hope it keeps popping up. Also, we need a 4SA for Wii that can be played with either the DS or the GBA.
That way my wife and I can play together (as we only have 1 of each).
I don't see why Mario isn't cel-shaded either, though.
The way I see it: graphics are technology that translates conceptual art design to the videogame experience itself. Therefore, the best graphics would be those that best translate the art design.
If you think about it, traditional polygon models do a shitty job of translating character art. In 10 or even 5years we are all going to look back on this generation of videogames and say "wow, look at all those polygons, that sure looks artificial."
The artwork in Zelda (and Mario, and actually, for most games) is hand-drawn cartoon artwork. Twilight Princess has more realistic proportions than Wind Waker, but the artwork is still cartoon, and very similar to what you'd see in a Disney movie. Instead of trying to shoehorn this style into 3-D with polygon models, Nintendo should have used cel-shading!
The problem is that the gaming population has this weird miconception that cel-shading = teh kiddie (look at Okami, or Suda51's games for why this is wrong.) I feel very strongly that cel-shading should be used way more extensively than it is now. I really think that in 5 years people are going to look at traditional polygonal graphics as completely limiting.
ALL THAT SAID: even though I don't think TP looks as good as WW, the world you explore in TP is much, much more detailed, amazing and creative than the world in Wind Waker, which I found pretty mundane for a Zelda game.
I'd be interested in seeing an older Link in that style. The animated look is pure sex, esp. with the watercolor look they used for the Minnish Cap art.
All but one. He's ambidextrous in Zelda II, and being superstitious, always keeps his shield facing Death Mountain.