So I just got this and I'm wondering what to be as my starting Race/Type. I would like to be a Formarl or Fomar... but I've been burned before when it comes to class balance in these Phantasy Star games, in PSU Forces were underwhelming to say the least.
Anyone have experience across the 3 types that can speak to any imbalances?
Forces are incredibly overpowered in this game. A force weapon's ATP is actually based off MST. So rods and wands will do start to do incredible melee damage. However you'll be made of glass so you have to watch out.
Huh, so in this game there are actual attacks associated with Force weapons? That's pretty cool. In past games you weren't able to do much with a Wand/Staff other than link a Technic to it. That's a change that I can get behind, I remember PSO v.2 had a single weapon that used TP in place of ATP and I loved it. Thanks.
You can also cast with a melee weapon, but the damage will probably be garbage. Good for characters who stick to buffs / debuffs, though.
Kupi on
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
0
IceBurnerIt's cold and there are penguins.Registered Userregular
edited November 2009
You could melee with FO weapons in all versions of PSO, and all other Phantasy Star games except PSU. They just weren't idiotically geared for doing heavy melee damage; instead they granted stat/spell bonuses or cast techniques for free.
You're probably talking about Elysion, a saber which MST instead of ATP.
Forces have been a good class in everything but PSOv2 Ultimate and PSU. Ultimate in PSOv2 was just broken period, but Episodes I & II rebalanced everything very nicely. PSU just hated Forces and fucked them over in every possible way. Their greatest asset was not dying quite as quickly to enemy techniques (which auto-aimed and would adjust slightly mid-flight to hit you, while yours could not and had fucking miserable hit detection on top). Yeah...
We've reached the 51st floor now after a small break on the 41st. I'm 69 now. The team is starting to show signs of fatigue, however a rappy encounter on floor 48 helped lift our spirits. We also encountered the Shot Mother for the first time on Floor 50. We were not amused by her circle strafing.
In unpleasant news, Ogi was suffering from what I have called "Tower Madness". He claims it was an accident, but he incapacitated Kai by shooting an explosive trap next to him. This is not the first time we have been near traps that exploded on us. I told Ogi to take a rest and we could continue without him. I switched him out and shall continue my journey shortly. I am uncertain if we can reach the top before our need to sleep catches up with us.
And I still can't kill that damn octopus in under 60 seconds. Having a hard time finding any decent guns, still using a stundeo rifle, been avoiding upgrading it in hopes I find something better.
Could always just come back in fifty levels or similar. I'm guessing the reward is trigrinders or similar...?
to Eeveelution: Can't compare it to Crystal Chronicles, but this is definitely worth the money if you like this type of game.
Yeah gives trigrinders, i was just farming him for the octobazooka in hopes it would be decent, it was not.
Also I was going to say the worst boss was;
Mother trinity, why the hell did that third bouncing thing become invulnerable after the other two were killed? Dumb.
But then I hit dark falz, sheesh, I cannot hit those bouncing orbs as a RAcast, and they keep popping up under me before I can move. And I cannot see a pattern on it.
And being low on healing items when this fight starts doesn't help. Stupid AI is redicuously bad, I do 4x their damage with one of my light attacks. I tell them to spread out and they all bunch in front of falz when he does his laser attack so they all die.
God the only thing this game is teaching me about it's heavy handed friendship and teamwork, is that teamwork is one guy doing all the damn work.
And I still can't kill that damn octopus in under 60 seconds. Having a hard time finding any decent guns, still using a stundeo rifle, been avoiding upgrading it in hopes I find something better.
Could always just come back in fifty levels or similar. I'm guessing the reward is trigrinders or similar...?
to Eeveelution: Can't compare it to Crystal Chronicles, but this is definitely worth the money if you like this type of game.
Yeah gives trigrinders, i was just farming him for the octobazooka in hopes it would be decent, it was not.
Also I was going to say the worst boss was;
Mother trinity, why the hell did that third bouncing thing become invulnerable after the other two were killed? Dumb.
But then I hit dark falz, sheesh, I cannot hit those bouncing orbs as a RAcast, and they keep popping up under me before I can move. And I cannot see a pattern on it.
And being low on healing items when this fight starts doesn't help. Stupid AI is redicuously bad, I do 4x their damage with one of my light attacks. I tell them to spread out and they all bunch in front of falz when he does his laser attack so they all die.
God the only thing this game is teaching me about it's heavy handed friendship and teamwork, is that teamwork is one guy doing all the damn work.
I'll agree that the third chess piece becoming invulnerable is dumb. If the camera were better it would be fun, but as it is you have to keep an eye on both the chess piece and Trinity, which you can't do at the same time. Trinity is way more dangerous than the last piece, so you just end up focusing on her and eating attacks from the other one constantly. Easy for resta users to heal through, God help casts.
For Falz, don't worry about shooting the orbs. They damage falz when taking out, but shooting falz directly works fine too. He has a telltale movement when he does the ground posts, watch for that. When not dodging various things, best place to stand is right beside falz, on either side of his shoulders. Orbs shouldn't hit you there, and you can hit his head for better damage. Just remember to run away when the posts come up, he does the area burst thinger, and when he shoots the dark beam.
Bah, what's the drop rate on that calamity soul, anyway? Good experience, but haven't found anything decent yet.
OK so chain combos boost photon arts, yeah? They also boost Ra techniques.
Razonde, no chain: ~150 damage on zaphobos and all his friends, sometimes twice per
Razonde, 4 chain: ~350 damage on zaphobos and all his friends, sometimes twice per
Well, I played a bit; I like the new mechanics and I hope they make it into the next game in the franchise.
I just hope that SEGA either abandons the DS altogether or adapts a new control scheme using the stylus. The controls on the DS can either facilitate a great Action RPG or the worst, it all depends on the developers' implementation. By choosing to ignore the stylus for gameplay I think Sega's done a disservice to the system. The DS just doesn't have the proper physical controls for a traditional Action RPG control scheme and I think this is glaringly obvious in PS0. Part of what made the PSO franchise great in my eyes was the ability to simply get out of the way of a bosses attack, but in this game its simply clunky.
The evasive roll is a great idea, but as presented its lacking a certain responsiveness, it's hard to explain but in any other Action RPG with this kind of move you can combine a direction input while pressing the roll or similar manuever and you'd simply move in the intended direction, in PS0 this is not the case. Also, camera is terribad.
I can't shake the feeling that they were working against the system rather than with it. And if that was the case then they should have abandoned the project.
PSO never played great and I have no idea how anyone could prefer its combat over this (or PSU especially but that's a tangent) in any capacity, except for the extra clunkiness of trying to use something that's not on your palette or trying to change equipment in a timely manner.
For Mother Trinity, it's pretty easy to get things under control in the last phase if you leave the spinny-sword one. Once all of your teammates die it will just hop after you, so you can get it into a pattern where it won't be able to hit you while you attack during the laser lock-on.
Caduceus is so awesome. Rodeo Drive is so awesome. I'm still using it on a level 50 Fonewearl and just beat hard Dark Falz to death in probably a bit less than two minutes (~25% dark boost). I just recently found another weapon that has more MST without any grinding, but it doesn't have Rodeo Drive or an element so it was a no go. The experience boost is starting to taper out compared to level requirements (around 30 a hit, now), but it's still respectable enough.
I'm finding Grants really super terrible when I can just Rodeo Drive everything into the ground. Megid is pretty spiffy, though.
I think I'm becoming increasingly annoyed by the corner cutting and general backwardness of some of the design decisions in the series, but I am still unable to avoid putting reckless amounts of time into any Phantasy Star game.
I have defeated the tower, but at what cost? I have lost my sanity in exchange for treasures. What do I have to show though? Just some weapons with bad %'s, a mistranslated Claimh Solais, and a femini soul. Was Super mode really worth it? Was it worth losing my humanity? I wonder, but more than anything one question nags at me. A question I can't escape.
So there's actually strategy to beating Mother, the spinny guys actually do different things?
I beat her and started Falz and died in like 15 seconds and I haven't gone back because holy crap, grinding. I'm only level 29, people have been saying 35? Although I finally have a Megid waiting for me once I hit 30.
I was lvl 35 as a Ranger when I beat it.
I basically went in and shot everything to hell, using my comrades as disposable meat shields.
Haven't figured out what else to do yet.
blaze_zero on
0
MaddocI'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother?Registered Userregular
edited November 2009
So, just started playing this and so far it's pretty cool.
Yay: Within the first ten minutes of playing I get a group of Rappies, and a Rappy Soul for a reward.
Boo: After making my character, I went to go read up on the classes and find that Hunewm is considered to be pretty terrible. Will I hate myself down the road if I continue leveling this character?
So there's actually strategy to beating Mother, the spinny guys actually do different things?
I beat her and started Falz and died in like 15 seconds and I haven't gone back because holy crap, grinding. I'm only level 29, people have been saying 35? Although I finally have a Megid waiting for me once I hit 30.
I was a 29 HUmar when I beat Falz. Maybe you just need to pick a class that can take a punch.
spookymuffin on
PSN: MegaSpooky // 3DS: 3797-6276-7138 Wii U NNID: MegaSpooky
So there's actually strategy to beating Mother, the spinny guys actually do different things?
I beat her and started Falz and died in like 15 seconds and I haven't gone back because holy crap, grinding. I'm only level 29, people have been saying 35? Although I finally have a Megid waiting for me once I hit 30.
I was a 29 HUmar when I beat Falz. Maybe you just need to pick a class that can take a punch.
Well it's kind of the whole point to be a Force person. I like to play them but I don't like to grind, and I'm certainly not going to grind up another 30 levels just to beat it with a different character. Really I just want to unlock hard mode so I can get started on the actual game.
Gilllllllder.
I can't believe you already beat the Eternal Tower on Super Hard.
Jeeeez.
Ack no, I meant was it really worth unlocking super hard. I finished it on hard. However by the end it started to feel like super. The enemies got noticeably stronger starting on floor 70 or so.
And I still can't kill that damn octopus in under 60 seconds. Having a hard time finding any decent guns, still using a stundeo rifle, been avoiding upgrading it in hopes I find something better.
Could always just come back in fifty levels or similar. I'm guessing the reward is trigrinders or similar...?
to Eeveelution: Can't compare it to Crystal Chronicles, but this is definitely worth the money if you like this type of game.
Yeah gives trigrinders, i was just farming him for the octobazooka in hopes it would be decent, it was not.
Also I was going to say the worst boss was;
Mother trinity, why the hell did that third bouncing thing become invulnerable after the other two were killed? Dumb.
But then I hit dark falz, sheesh, I cannot hit those bouncing orbs as a RAcast, and they keep popping up under me before I can move. And I cannot see a pattern on it.
And being low on healing items when this fight starts doesn't help. Stupid AI is redicuously bad, I do 4x their damage with one of my light attacks. I tell them to spread out and they all bunch in front of falz when he does his laser attack so they all die.
God the only thing this game is teaching me about it's heavy handed friendship and teamwork, is that teamwork is one guy doing all the damn work.
I'll agree that the third chess piece becoming invulnerable is dumb. If the camera were better it would be fun, but as it is you have to keep an eye on both the chess piece and Trinity, which you can't do at the same time. Trinity is way more dangerous than the last piece, so you just end up focusing on her and eating attacks from the other one constantly. Easy for resta users to heal through, God help casts.
For Falz, don't worry about shooting the orbs. They damage falz when taking out, but shooting falz directly works fine too. He has a telltale movement when he does the ground posts, watch for that. When not dodging various things, best place to stand is right beside falz, on either side of his shoulders. Orbs shouldn't hit you there, and you can hit his head for better damage. Just remember to run away when the posts come up, he does the area burst thinger, and when he shoots the dark beam.
Bah, what's the drop rate on that calamity soul, anyway? Good experience, but haven't found anything decent yet.
Took me like 5 runs on normal mode solo to get it. I can trade it to you if you want.
EDIT: nvm, just saw your other post. I'm still looking for a vanguard
I haven't read too much about this, mostly because I'm afraid that if I start playing it it'll take over my life like PSO did. And I've got four term papers to write.
But does this game have mags? I think they were my favourite part of PSO.
I haven't read too much about this, mostly because I'm afraid that if I start playing it it'll take over my life like PSO did. And I've got four term papers to write.
But does this game have mags? I think they were my favourite part of PSO.
So there's actually strategy to beating Mother, the spinny guys actually do different things?
I beat her and started Falz and died in like 15 seconds and I haven't gone back because holy crap, grinding. I'm only level 29, people have been saying 35? Although I finally have a Megid waiting for me once I hit 30.
You can beat Falz at 24 or earlier as a Force, but it does require a pretty thorough knowledge of his abilities from having done it before. Slicers are incredible in this fight, both for hitting Falz and his balls. Just because the president says it can't be done, doesn't mean it can't be done.
Are slicers the only weapon that uses your magic stat rather than attack? I still feel plenty strong with the Caduceus staff.
Every Force weapon uses MST for its attack stat, be they canes, rods, or slicers. This has the frustrating effect of making Newman Forces better meleers than the human ones because not only do they have a better attack stat, they also have more accuracy. I think the only place they suffer is in defenses, and let's face it, every Force is going to be squishy to functionally equal degrees.
Kupi on
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
Went the role of a FOmar. I have to say I'm enjoying playing him immensely. The first boss fight was a blast, but hard to do until I got a rank of resta. Now I can pretty much dodge and demolish nwo that I have my weapon's timing down.
MonkeyConQuesoNo more MH ClawHappy handsRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
Pfffffft. Fine, I'm buying this game on the way home from work tonight, just so I'll have something new to do while I'm visiting the wife's family in NC, and when I get frustrated at Monster Hunter.
I love playing Casts, but it sounds like FO's are the way to go. This a true statement? Is there an argument for Casts?
Pfffffft. Fine, I'm buying this game on the way home from work tonight, just so I'll have something new to do while I'm visiting the wife's family in NC, and when I get frustrated at Monster Hunter.
I love playing Casts, but it sounds like FO's are the way to go. This a true statement? Is there an argument for Casts?
Each race has the potential to get the highest stat in something (females less so, unfortunately). Hunters are basically objectively worse than Forces and Rangers are somewhere in between, so Ranger Casts should be alright, using Heal Traps and such.
speaking of slicers, those things are ridiculous. At level 6 it was doing about 75% of the damage my level 30 RAcast was doing.
It's almost better than the guns in every way, except if you throw it the wrong way you can't attack again right away.
Speaking of RA weapons, what is the point of the bazooka/rockets? I assumed they did splash damage but they don't seem too. Just a slightly higher damage non-comboable weapon?
Morkath on
0
MonkeyConQuesoNo more MH ClawHappy handsRegistered Userregular
Each race has the potential to get the highest stat in something (females less so, unfortunately). Hunters are basically objectively worse than Forces and Rangers are somewhere in between, so Ranger Casts should be alright, using Heal Traps and such.
Alright, I will stick to my loved class then, and see how I fare. PS0 get!
Are slicers the only weapon that uses your magic stat rather than attack? I still feel plenty strong with the Caduceus staff.
Every Force weapon uses MST for its attack stat, be they canes, rods, or slicers. This has the frustrating effect of making Newman Forces better meleers than the human ones because not only do they have a better attack stat, they also have more accuracy. I think the only place they suffer is in defenses, and let's face it, every Force is going to be squishy to functionally equal degrees.
They do not have better accuracy. Force accuracy in general is worse than the other classes, and the newmans have the lowest of all. I have 40 ATA, 2 Hero/Hits, and like 5 hit materials on my fonwearl, and I still miss things on hard moderately often. Super Hard will supposedly turn that often into super often.
Posts
Anyone have experience across the 3 types that can speak to any imbalances?
You're probably talking about Elysion, a saber which MST instead of ATP.
Forces have been a good class in everything but PSOv2 Ultimate and PSU. Ultimate in PSOv2 was just broken period, but Episodes I & II rebalanced everything very nicely. PSU just hated Forces and fucked them over in every possible way. Their greatest asset was not dying quite as quickly to enemy techniques (which auto-aimed and would adjust slightly mid-flight to hit you, while yours could not and had fucking miserable hit detection on top). Yeah...
PSN: theIceBurner, IceBurnerEU, IceBurner-JP | X-Link Kai: TheIceBurner
Dragon's Dogma: 192 Warrior Linty | 80 Strider Alicia | 32 Mage Terra
We've reached the 51st floor now after a small break on the 41st. I'm 69 now. The team is starting to show signs of fatigue, however a rappy encounter on floor 48 helped lift our spirits. We also encountered the Shot Mother for the first time on Floor 50. We were not amused by her circle strafing.
In unpleasant news, Ogi was suffering from what I have called "Tower Madness". He claims it was an accident, but he incapacitated Kai by shooting an explosive trap next to him. This is not the first time we have been near traps that exploded on us. I told Ogi to take a rest and we could continue without him. I switched him out and shall continue my journey shortly. I am uncertain if we can reach the top before our need to sleep catches up with us.
Yeah gives trigrinders, i was just farming him for the octobazooka in hopes it would be decent, it was not.
Also I was going to say the worst boss was;
But then I hit dark falz, sheesh, I cannot hit those bouncing orbs as a RAcast, and they keep popping up under me before I can move. And I cannot see a pattern on it.
And being low on healing items when this fight starts doesn't help. Stupid AI is redicuously bad, I do 4x their damage with one of my light attacks. I tell them to spread out and they all bunch in front of falz when he does his laser attack so they all die.
God the only thing this game is teaching me about it's heavy handed friendship and teamwork, is that teamwork is one guy doing all the damn work.
For Falz, don't worry about shooting the orbs. They damage falz when taking out, but shooting falz directly works fine too. He has a telltale movement when he does the ground posts, watch for that. When not dodging various things, best place to stand is right beside falz, on either side of his shoulders. Orbs shouldn't hit you there, and you can hit his head for better damage. Just remember to run away when the posts come up, he does the area burst thinger, and when he shoots the dark beam.
Bah, what's the drop rate on that calamity soul, anyway? Good experience, but haven't found anything decent yet.
I started using my digrinders on my stundeo rifle, but it's not helping much, even at +20
Razonde, no chain: ~150 damage on zaphobos and all his friends, sometimes twice per
Razonde, 4 chain: ~350 damage on zaphobos and all his friends, sometimes twice per
And I thought forces were too powerful before.
of course pso-world is down so I can't see how anything looks before I buy it. =/
cmon, guess
Shitty %s, element and photon art, but I got one
I just hope that SEGA either abandons the DS altogether or adapts a new control scheme using the stylus. The controls on the DS can either facilitate a great Action RPG or the worst, it all depends on the developers' implementation. By choosing to ignore the stylus for gameplay I think Sega's done a disservice to the system. The DS just doesn't have the proper physical controls for a traditional Action RPG control scheme and I think this is glaringly obvious in PS0. Part of what made the PSO franchise great in my eyes was the ability to simply get out of the way of a bosses attack, but in this game its simply clunky.
The evasive roll is a great idea, but as presented its lacking a certain responsiveness, it's hard to explain but in any other Action RPG with this kind of move you can combine a direction input while pressing the roll or similar manuever and you'd simply move in the intended direction, in PS0 this is not the case. Also, camera is terribad.
I can't shake the feeling that they were working against the system rather than with it. And if that was the case then they should have abandoned the project.
For Mother Trinity, it's pretty easy to get things under control in the last phase if you leave the spinny-sword one. Once all of your teammates die it will just hop after you, so you can get it into a pattern where it won't be able to hit you while you attack during the laser lock-on.
Caduceus is so awesome. Rodeo Drive is so awesome. I'm still using it on a level 50 Fonewearl and just beat hard Dark Falz to death in probably a bit less than two minutes (~25% dark boost). I just recently found another weapon that has more MST without any grinding, but it doesn't have Rodeo Drive or an element so it was a no go. The experience boost is starting to taper out compared to level requirements (around 30 a hit, now), but it's still respectable enough.
I'm finding Grants really super terrible when I can just Rodeo Drive everything into the ground. Megid is pretty spiffy, though.
I think I'm becoming increasingly annoyed by the corner cutting and general backwardness of some of the design decisions in the series, but I am still unable to avoid putting reckless amounts of time into any Phantasy Star game.
I have defeated the tower, but at what cost? I have lost my sanity in exchange for treasures. What do I have to show though? Just some weapons with bad %'s, a mistranslated Claimh Solais, and a femini soul. Was Super mode really worth it? Was it worth losing my humanity? I wonder, but more than anything one question nags at me. A question I can't escape.
How the hell was I able to breathe in space?
I can't believe you already beat the Eternal Tower on Super Hard.
Jeeeez.
I beat her and started Falz and died in like 15 seconds and I haven't gone back because holy crap, grinding. I'm only level 29, people have been saying 35? Although I finally have a Megid waiting for me once I hit 30.
I basically went in and shot everything to hell, using my comrades as disposable meat shields.
Haven't figured out what else to do yet.
Yay: Within the first ten minutes of playing I get a group of Rappies, and a Rappy Soul for a reward.
Boo: After making my character, I went to go read up on the classes and find that Hunewm is considered to be pretty terrible. Will I hate myself down the road if I continue leveling this character?
I was a 29 HUmar when I beat Falz. Maybe you just need to pick a class that can take a punch.
Wii U NNID: MegaSpooky
Well it's kind of the whole point to be a Force person. I like to play them but I don't like to grind, and I'm certainly not going to grind up another 30 levels just to beat it with a different character. Really I just want to unlock hard mode so I can get started on the actual game.
Ack no, I meant was it really worth unlocking super hard. I finished it on hard. However by the end it started to feel like super. The enemies got noticeably stronger starting on floor 70 or so.
That makes more sense. I thought you had super ground and we're already in Super Hard.
Took me like 5 runs on normal mode solo to get it. I can trade it to you if you want.
EDIT: nvm, just saw your other post. I'm still looking for a vanguard
Pokeymanz: 0002-2940-9674
But does this game have mags? I think they were my favourite part of PSO.
XBL |Steam | PSN | last.fm
Yes. Mags are in.
You can beat Falz at 24 or earlier as a Force, but it does require a pretty thorough knowledge of his abilities from having done it before. Slicers are incredible in this fight, both for hitting Falz and his balls. Just because the president says it can't be done, doesn't mean it can't be done.
Rods, Wands, and Slicers.
Gotta say, liking my Hunewm a lot more since I switched over to MST and Slicers.
I do a ton of damage, my techs are pretty good, and I heal for more than half my life in one shot with Resta.
My only complaint would be that I'm not extremely impressed with my Photon Art
Every Force weapon uses MST for its attack stat, be they canes, rods, or slicers. This has the frustrating effect of making Newman Forces better meleers than the human ones because not only do they have a better attack stat, they also have more accuracy. I think the only place they suffer is in defenses, and let's face it, every Force is going to be squishy to functionally equal degrees.
Hope to play online later.
I love playing Casts, but it sounds like FO's are the way to go. This a true statement? Is there an argument for Casts?
Destiny! : Warlock - Titan - Hunter
It's almost better than the guns in every way, except if you throw it the wrong way you can't attack again right away.
Speaking of RA weapons, what is the point of the bazooka/rockets? I assumed they did splash damage but they don't seem too. Just a slightly higher damage non-comboable weapon?
Alright, I will stick to my loved class then, and see how I fare. PS0 get!
Destiny! : Warlock - Titan - Hunter
They do not have better accuracy. Force accuracy in general is worse than the other classes, and the newmans have the lowest of all. I have 40 ATA, 2 Hero/Hits, and like 5 hit materials on my fonwearl, and I still miss things on hard moderately often. Super Hard will supposedly turn that often into super often.