Nice spoilers douchebags. The issue isn't even out yet.
Fencingsax: Because Dick's dumb enough not to look out for Joker?
You really sound like you're actually envious of Dick being Batman, which is bizarre to say the least.
Don't be fucking stupid. I just don't like Dick being Batman. Not the least of the problems is that it's tacitly acknowledged he's 'Batman until Batman gets back'. Fuck it if I'm interested in Interim Batman. I didn't give a shit about Jean-Paul either, no matter how grimdark they made him. Also, Joker's good enough to hit Batman, he's definitely good enough to hit Nightwing.
Also, these are fictional characters, what the fuck are you on?
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
Nice spoilers douchebags. The issue isn't even out yet.
Fencingsax: Because Dick's dumb enough not to look out for Joker?
You really sound like you're actually envious of Dick being Batman, which is bizarre to say the least.
Don't be fucking stupid. I just don't like Dick being Batman. Not the least of the problems is that it's tacitly acknowledged he's 'Batman until Batman gets back'. Fuck it if I'm interested in Interim Batman. I didn't give a shit about Jean-Paul either, no matter how grimdark they made him. Also, Joker's good enough to hit Batman, he's definitely good enough to hit Nightwing.
Also, these are fictional characters, what the fuck are you on?
I'm being fucking stupid? You're the one that seems to think that a fictional character is just not good enough to be Batman, aren't you?
My opinion on the matter is that maybe you just shouldn't read the Batman books until Bruce gets back, if Dick wearing the cowl gets your panties in a twist. God forbid that after 70 years of Bruce Wayne wearing it, his first apprentice gets to fill in for him for a while. I've loved Batman and Robin and Streets of Gotham, which just couldn't of happened with Bruce wearing the cowl.
Just_Bri_Thanks: As opposed to the old Batwoman? :P I think Detective Comics has been amazing so far but am hoping Rucka keeps the character outside the Crime Bible stuff for a while now.
I'm having a hard time seeing what's inherently bad about a story featuring Dick as an interim Batman who brings his own unique qualities to the role. Whether or not he's good enough to replace Bruce is sort of immaterial to the quality of the story, after all.
Also, personal attacks are going to get us in trouble with the mods, so let's save them the trouble of a harsh scolding and cut it out without having to be asked.
However, Detective comics is absolutely beautiful.
The artist does good work, but that is actually another beef I have with Batwoman. To put it delicately... there is absolutely no way that costume is in the furthest stretch of the imagination bullet resistant. And when she pulled out a can of aerosol spray armor I just wanted to throw up my hands.
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Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
However, Detective comics is absolutely beautiful.
The artist does good work, but that is actually another beef I have with Batwoman. To put it delicately... there is absolutely no way that costume is in the furthest stretch of the imagination bullet resistant. And when she pulled out a can of aerosol spray armor I just wanted to throw up my hands.
You know that the military has been working on/testing spray-on armor for years now, right?
It's not that much of a stretch to assume that a billionaire with military connections in a universe that has Superman would have access to such technology.
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited October 2009
She doesn't get her equipment from Batman. She may get the super top secret stuff from the US Army, but she is still spray-painting latex. And the way she is drawn can't get me to suspend disbelief enough to think she has any kind of armored inserts in there at all, which is still phrasing mildly what I really think about the art.
It's pretty, yes. But it isn't the bat style.
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...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I'm having a hard time seeing what's inherently bad about a story featuring Dick as an interim Batman who brings his own unique qualities to the role. Whether or not he's good enough to replace Bruce is sort of immaterial to the quality of the story, after all.
Also, personal attacks are going to get us in trouble with the mods, so let's save them the trouble of a harsh scolding and cut it out without having to be asked.
This exactly.
Also, does nobody appreciate the fact that having a new status quo is pretty much the whole point? I have a petty firm familiarity with the franchise (wow alliteration) , but was entirely out of the loop leading up to Morrison's run on the book.
She doesn't get her equipment from Batman. She may get the super top secret stuff from the US Army, but she is still spray-painting latex. And the way she is drawn can't get me to suspend disbelief enough to think she has any kind of armored inserts in there at all, which is still phrasing mildly what I really think about the art.
It's pretty, yes. But it isn't the bat style.
What's Batman got to do with it? 52 established the Kane family as the Wayne's equivalents (specifically that the Wayne's own half of Gotham, the Kane's own the other half). She has a lot of money.
Also, what's the Bat style? Cause Nightwing had a pretty similar skin-tight uniform, as did Batgirl.
Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited October 2009
Yes, but it has been demonstrated that Cassandra actually wears something underneath it. >_>
Edit: I also feel compelled to say here that (the former) Batgirl most likely feels that she can forgo all absolutely non-essential armor because as long as she can see you holding the gun she can dodge bullets.
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...and when you are done with that; take a folding
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Yes, but it has been demonstrated that Cassandra actually wears something underneath it. >_>
Eh, talking about whether or not a character wears something under the costume is pretty pointless, since it all depends on what the plot calls for. In the scene in the newest Batgirl series that called for her to strip off her costume, she was obviously going to be wearing something under it. The scene at the end of her series that called for her costume to get ripped in very convenient places, she wasn't.
But given how much she gets shot up in her series, I don't think her costume is very heavily armored. I think at some point Robin mentions it being the standard superhero "skintight kevlar weave", but who really cares? It'd probably be drawn as skintight even if it was supposed to be inch-thick plate mail.
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited October 2009
Damnit, Cass needs to go help Tim Drake.
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...and when you are done with that; take a folding
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Turns out Red Hood is Jason Todd after all. But his goal is to basically put Batman "out of business" as a franchise. Also Morrison retconned it so his is naturally red, like pre-crisis.
He and Scarlet have an interesting dynamic, kinda like Batman and Robin. Jason tries to be a serious badass, but he is just an acne-ridden punk who talks in slogans and reads about how to market himself better. Scarlet is the more level headed one.
Also, THE FLAMINGO IS IN GOTHAM. And he eats faces.
Its hard to say an artist is bad without being hypocritical, because my art is atrocious, but I really don't care for Philip Tan. He just doesn't produce the awesome panels that other people do. Just imagine how cool that last page of the Flamingo would have been if it were drawn by Quitely or Reis or Mankhe.
The most upsetting thing about this is that Seaguy Eternal will slowly sail further and further into the future while Morrison and Stewart are so busy.
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TexiKenDammit!That fish really got me!Registered Userregular
edited October 2009
If Stewart already has #7 done (and probably #8 by now), Seaguy should be fine.
If Stewart already has #7 done (and probably #8 by now), Seaguy should be fine.
It's kind of a secondary nudge on top of the fact that Grant Morrison will probably be the busiest man in comics by next spring if all the rumors are true and all of his announced projects stay on track.
If Stewart already has #7 done (and probably #8 by now), Seaguy should be fine.
It's kind of a secondary nudge on top of the fact that Grant Morrison will probably be the busiest man in comics by next spring if all the rumors are true and all of his announced projects stay on track.
What all does he have coming up, according to the rumors?
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TexiKenDammit!That fish really got me!Registered Userregular
edited October 2009
He's rumored to do a Batman, Superman, and WW book, and he has three different creator owned works in the pipeline for next year as well. All this on top of doing some stuff for Hollywood.
Was it me or did it seem like Tan was struggling with having to draw an intentionally unattractive female face in Scarlet? For how disfigured Quietly made her look (and even how Tan drew her last issue, from what I remember), she was drawn fairly decent-lookin' in this issue. Perhaps most comics artists are incapable of drawing unattractive women without making them excessively fat or old.
Was it me or did it seem like Tan was struggling with having to draw an intentionally unattractive female face in Scarlet? For how disfigured Quietly made her look (and even how Tan drew her last issue, from what I remember), she was drawn fairly decent-lookin' in this issue. Perhaps most comics artists are incapable of drawing unattractive women without making them excessively fat or old.
It's easier for Quitely, though, because everybody he draws is unattractive.
i actually thought philip tan's artwork was just fine. it wasn't spectacular, but i had no objections at all.
though yeah, i'm a little unclear exactly how old scarlet is meant to be. i remember thinking in the first issues she seemed pretty young, maybe a little older than damien. in this one particularly though she seems several years older.
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited October 2009
If you look back some issues it shows her without the 'face' before she was messed up.
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...and when you are done with that; take a folding
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i actually thought philip tan's artwork was just fine. it wasn't spectacular, but i had no objections at all.
though yeah, i'm a little unclear exactly how old scarlet is meant to be. i remember thinking in the first issues she seemed pretty young, maybe a little older than damien. in this one particularly though she seems several years older.
I thought she was meant to be lkate teens to early twenties.
Was it me or did it seem like Tan was struggling with having to draw an intentionally unattractive female face in Scarlet? For how disfigured Quietly made her look (and even how Tan drew her last issue, from what I remember), she was drawn fairly decent-lookin' in this issue. Perhaps most comics artists are incapable of drawing unattractive women without making them excessively fat or old.
To be fair, Quietly tends to make all his characters look a little disfigured.
Seriously though, comic books are like TV. The normal people are hot as hell and the ugly people are just kinda plain.
It just makes me sorta wonder if mainstream comics can abide an unattractive female character for long, and if convention will turn Scarlet into just another teen-model type over time. All it takes is for Tony Daniel or whoever to miss a memo and draw Scarlet like Squire with a scar, and bam, that's her default appearance. It reminds me of how Wonder Girl went from a gangly brunette stick to generic blonde superhotness, or how Baroness in the comics started out as a frumpy librarian in a sweater before getting a whole lotta plastic surgery and pulling on a leather suit.
I thought the same thing. Quitely gave her a very rounded, bloated head that looked like some kind of horrifying form of leprosy. Tan kind of flattened her nose out and added some lines to her face.
Really, I wish DC would have found someone with a more interesting style to do Tan's section. I mean, you've got Quitely, who has a very Moebius/Jean Giraud-influenced style, Frazier Irving, who does that smooth, painted thing so well, and Cameron Stewart, with his very clean, slightly retro style. Then you've got Tan, who's like a lot of the other guys at DC, and seems to be heavily influenced by the original Image creators.
I think Tan's good at what he does, but his stuff just doesn't possess the same visual punch as the other artists Morrison's working with.
TexiKenDammit!That fish really got me!Registered Userregular
edited October 2009
Tan's only good face he drew was Damien's, which always has that smug smirk on his face. That works.
But he draws Dick with hedgehog hair, and his Penguin is pretty incomprehensible (actually all the scenes with Penguin were hard to follow in the last B&R issue). Tan still hasn't gotten a hang of panel layout and having characters flow on the page.
Actually I haven't minded Tan as much as I thought I would, but man, he really blew that last page. Instead of being menacing and foreboding the Flamingo just kinda looks like something I'd come up with in Scribblenauts.
Though frankly, I think this issue had problems beyond Tan. I love the concept behind this version of the Red Hood, but the way he talks just doesn't sound like Jason. Granted, Jason was in serious need of a character overhaul so I'll withhold judgment, but the way he talks, the newly red hair, and the elongated face Tan gave him made me confused over whether this was really Jason after all.
It just makes me sorta wonder if mainstream comics can abide an unattractive female character for long, and if convention will turn Scarlet into just another teen-model type over time. All it takes is for Tony Daniel or whoever to miss a memo and draw Scarlet like Squire with a scar, and bam, that's her default appearance. It reminds me of how Wonder Girl went from a gangly brunette stick to generic blonde superhotness, or how Baroness in the comics started out as a frumpy librarian in a sweater before getting a whole lotta plastic surgery and pulling on a leather suit.
Hasn't Jessica Jones always been drawn as kinda homely looking?
It just makes me sorta wonder if mainstream comics can abide an unattractive female character for long, and if convention will turn Scarlet into just another teen-model type over time. All it takes is for Tony Daniel or whoever to miss a memo and draw Scarlet like Squire with a scar, and bam, that's her default appearance. It reminds me of how Wonder Girl went from a gangly brunette stick to generic blonde superhotness, or how Baroness in the comics started out as a frumpy librarian in a sweater before getting a whole lotta plastic surgery and pulling on a leather suit.
Hasn't Jessica Jones always been drawn as kinda homely looking?
Though frankly, I think this issue had problems beyond Tan. I love the concept behind this version of the Red Hood, but the way he talks just doesn't sound like Jason.
I felt the same way.
I think it was Jason commenting on his acne that threw the character off for me. And just why would the Red Hood mask give him acne? There seems to be a fair amount of airflow in there, unless he's breathing kitchen grease or something. You'd think Batman's tight fitting cowl or Robin's Peel-On Peel-Off mask would cause worse dermal embarrassments than wearing a red capsule on your noggin.
And can Scarlett remove that mask, or is she still too afraid to try?
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Unrelated Edit: The previous Batgirl had great characterization, and I would like to see more of that.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Don't be fucking stupid. I just don't like Dick being Batman. Not the least of the problems is that it's tacitly acknowledged he's 'Batman until Batman gets back'. Fuck it if I'm interested in Interim Batman. I didn't give a shit about Jean-Paul either, no matter how grimdark they made him. Also, Joker's good enough to hit Batman, he's definitely good enough to hit Nightwing.
Also, these are fictional characters, what the fuck are you on?
However, Detective comics is absolutely beautiful.
Also, they kind of absolutely killed any decent characterization of Batgirl through a multitude of books, so they aren't using her at all right now.
I'm being fucking stupid? You're the one that seems to think that a fictional character is just not good enough to be Batman, aren't you?
My opinion on the matter is that maybe you just shouldn't read the Batman books until Bruce gets back, if Dick wearing the cowl gets your panties in a twist. God forbid that after 70 years of Bruce Wayne wearing it, his first apprentice gets to fill in for him for a while. I've loved Batman and Robin and Streets of Gotham, which just couldn't of happened with Bruce wearing the cowl.
Just_Bri_Thanks: As opposed to the old Batwoman? :P I think Detective Comics has been amazing so far but am hoping Rucka keeps the character outside the Crime Bible stuff for a while now.
Also, personal attacks are going to get us in trouble with the mods, so let's save them the trouble of a harsh scolding and cut it out without having to be asked.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
The artist does good work, but that is actually another beef I have with Batwoman. To put it delicately... there is absolutely no way that costume is in the furthest stretch of the imagination bullet resistant. And when she pulled out a can of aerosol spray armor I just wanted to throw up my hands.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
You know that the military has been working on/testing spray-on armor for years now, right?
It's not that much of a stretch to assume that a billionaire with military connections in a universe that has Superman would have access to such technology.
It's pretty, yes. But it isn't the bat style.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
This exactly.
Also, does nobody appreciate the fact that having a new status quo is pretty much the whole point? I have a petty firm familiarity with the franchise (wow alliteration) , but was entirely out of the loop leading up to Morrison's run on the book.
What's Batman got to do with it? 52 established the Kane family as the Wayne's equivalents (specifically that the Wayne's own half of Gotham, the Kane's own the other half). She has a lot of money.
Also, what's the Bat style? Cause Nightwing had a pretty similar skin-tight uniform, as did Batgirl.
Edit: I also feel compelled to say here that (the former) Batgirl most likely feels that she can forgo all absolutely non-essential armor because as long as she can see you holding the gun she can dodge bullets.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Eh, talking about whether or not a character wears something under the costume is pretty pointless, since it all depends on what the plot calls for. In the scene in the newest Batgirl series that called for her to strip off her costume, she was obviously going to be wearing something under it. The scene at the end of her series that called for her costume to get ripped in very convenient places, she wasn't.
But given how much she gets shot up in her series, I don't think her costume is very heavily armored. I think at some point Robin mentions it being the standard superhero "skintight kevlar weave", but who really cares? It'd probably be drawn as skintight even if it was supposed to be inch-thick plate mail.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
He and Scarlet have an interesting dynamic, kinda like Batman and Robin. Jason tries to be a serious badass, but he is just an acne-ridden punk who talks in slogans and reads about how to market himself better. Scarlet is the more level headed one.
Also, THE FLAMINGO IS IN GOTHAM. And he eats faces.
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
Yeah, my bad.
They wouldn't bring back Bruce so soon...............right?
It's kind of a secondary nudge on top of the fact that Grant Morrison will probably be the busiest man in comics by next spring if all the rumors are true and all of his announced projects stay on track.
What all does he have coming up, according to the rumors?
I mean, something's gotta give
It's easier for Quitely, though, because everybody he draws is unattractive.
though yeah, i'm a little unclear exactly how old scarlet is meant to be. i remember thinking in the first issues she seemed pretty young, maybe a little older than damien. in this one particularly though she seems several years older.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I thought she was meant to be lkate teens to early twenties.
To be fair, Quietly tends to make all his characters look a little disfigured.
Seriously though, comic books are like TV. The normal people are hot as hell and the ugly people are just kinda plain.
My Let's Play Channel: https://youtube.com/channel/UC2go70QLfwGq-hW4nvUqmog
Really, I wish DC would have found someone with a more interesting style to do Tan's section. I mean, you've got Quitely, who has a very Moebius/Jean Giraud-influenced style, Frazier Irving, who does that smooth, painted thing so well, and Cameron Stewart, with his very clean, slightly retro style. Then you've got Tan, who's like a lot of the other guys at DC, and seems to be heavily influenced by the original Image creators.
I think Tan's good at what he does, but his stuff just doesn't possess the same visual punch as the other artists Morrison's working with.
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But he draws Dick with hedgehog hair, and his Penguin is pretty incomprehensible (actually all the scenes with Penguin were hard to follow in the last B&R issue). Tan still hasn't gotten a hang of panel layout and having characters flow on the page.
Though frankly, I think this issue had problems beyond Tan. I love the concept behind this version of the Red Hood, but the way he talks just doesn't sound like Jason. Granted, Jason was in serious need of a character overhaul so I'll withhold judgment, but the way he talks, the newly red hair, and the elongated face Tan gave him made me confused over whether this was really Jason after all.
Hasn't Jessica Jones always been drawn as kinda homely looking?
It's from a What If? story, but still:
I felt the same way.
I think it was Jason commenting on his acne that threw the character off for me. And just why would the Red Hood mask give him acne? There seems to be a fair amount of airflow in there, unless he's breathing kitchen grease or something. You'd think Batman's tight fitting cowl or Robin's Peel-On Peel-Off mask would cause worse dermal embarrassments than wearing a red capsule on your noggin.
And can Scarlett remove that mask, or is she still too afraid to try?