Also, and somebody made this point earlier so I'm stealing the same example, I can play a million hours of tetris, but still not think it had 50 dollars worth of content. Again, I'd like to point out that I don't actually think L4D has as much or the same amount of content as Tetris or that they are worth the same amount.
Disclaimer
Because I will be strawmanned to hell and back if I don't say these unrelated details. (I will be posting this with all my "boo Valve" posts because for the love of God this thread.)
I am disappointed that they said they would support L4D1 like they did TF2, but than didn't. But I understand that they may have discovered that this new content was too much work or too much of a change. So yes things change, it may not have been misleading on purpose, but I am still disappointed.
I think L4D1 is a great game on its own, and worth 50$ to some people. I still would not have bought it though knowing what I know now (That it was only going to get minor support).
I understand that getting the Survival pack, the balance tweaks, the bug fixes, and the lighthouse map is more than most games. I also don't buy most games.
I think L4D2 has potential to be worth 50$ and not just be an expansion pack. But we'll all have to wait and see on that one and I'm currently on the fence.
I understand that there is potential for more support, but am skeptical as there are only five months and I doubt they would continue to support L4D1 much with a clearly superior L4D game available.
I know there are no guarantees that they'll be making L4D3 within a year or whatever of L4D2, and I know it's still possible that they'll support L4D2 as much as I wanted them to support L4D1! But I won't be convinced until I see it, and I will no longer take their word for it.
Yes, I know, if you don't like it don't buy it. Well, don't like my opinions don't agree with them! I believe this is a forum for discussion.
Yes, I have e-mailed Valve on these matters. I am not just ragin' on the internets.
Also, and somebody made this point earlier so I'm stealing the same example, I can play a million hours of tetris, but still not think it had 50 dollars worth of content. Again, I'd like to point out that I don't actually think L4D has as much or the same amount of content as Tetris or that they are worth the same amount.
Sorry, but if you're playing tetris for a million hours (or even just 1000), you better well consider it to be worth 50 bucks, regardless of what you actually paid for it.
Rakuen's Lifetime L4D gameplay stats. Which started collecting about a month before the Survival patch. Let's see, 297 games, 69,693 infected killed. 1,382 pounces, 1,602 survivors hit with vomit. This is significantly more than I've played, and I've played a heck of a lot of L4D.
You play the hell out of L4D then turn around and whine that the game wasn't worth $45, and that you deserve everything they're doing now for free. If that's not an entitlement complex, I don't know what is.
I didn't whine ever that the game wasn't worth $45. I gladly paid that when the game was released, I was ecstatic. What I did complain about, is having people tell me to stop feeling "entitled" when I never felt so.
But I was also expecting content like TF2 and even more so because they said so.
When the CEO of a company sends a direct message to the community, stating that we will receive ANYTHING from them along the lines, I take that into account. Especially if you've had nothing but positive experiences with said company. That's what a normal person would expect. Not entitlement, expectation.
Don't bark down my throat and single me out just cause I enjoy killing undead mans, if this was any company people would feel duped and floored.
And even if I said I feel entitled, which i most certainly didn't, isn't this just a perfect example at my entitlement? I simply just want new content, like they said they would.
I like L4D. I didn't feel the original content alone was worth $45-$50. I would've waited for a sale had I known there would be no "major" additions to the game. But I guess holding Valve to their word is entitlement.
Yea this puts it perfectly. Fuck yall who say "entitlement" in this thread.
Rakuen's Lifetime L4D gameplay stats. Which started collecting about a month before the Survival patch. Let's see, 297 games, 69,693 infected killed. 1,382 pounces, 1,602 survivors hit with vomit. This is significantly more than I've played, and I've played a heck of a lot of L4D.
You play the hell out of L4D then turn around and whine that the game wasn't worth $45, and that you deserve everything they're doing now for free. If that's not an entitlement complex, I don't know what is.
I hadn't looked at my own stats in a while, but checked them out to compare to rak. Mostly, they don't make any goddamn sense. For example, I have 65% accuracy with the minigun, but have zero kills and apparently have only fired 127 bullets from it total. I also have a pretty hard time believing that my average boomer lifespan is actually more than a minute, and that I managed to do nearly 20000 damage in a single life as smoker.
I hadn't looked at my own stats in a while, but checked them out to compare to rak. Mostly, they don't make any goddamn sense. For example, I have 65% accuracy with the minigun, but have zero kills and apparently have only fired 127 bullets from it total. I also have a pretty hard time believing that my average boomer lifespan is actually more than a minute, and that I managed to do nearly 20000 damage in a single life as smoker.
hrm yea the 20k damage is a little iffy, that might just be from you killing 2+ survivors while they were boomed.
You get a shitload of points if you have someone smokered while they are boomed.
Also, and somebody made this point earlier so I'm stealing the same example, I can play a million hours of tetris, but still not think it had 50 dollars worth of content. Again, I'd like to point out that I don't actually think L4D has as much or the same amount of content as Tetris or that they are worth the same amount.
Sorry, but if you're playing tetris for a million hours (or even just 1000), you better well consider it to be worth 50 bucks, regardless of what you actually paid for it.
This is an excellent point. But goddamn would I feel gypped considering how simple the game looks. Hell, I could program it myself. I am just pointing out that I don't consider the, "You played this for 300 hours and you still think you should be getting more for your buck?" argument doesn't really dissolve the feelings that they didn't get everything they paid for, especially when they were promised more.
Disclaimer
Because I will be strawmanned to hell and back if I don't say these unrelated details. (I will be posting this with all my "boo Valve" posts because for the love of God this thread.)
I am disappointed that they said they would support L4D1 like they did TF2, but than didn't. But I understand that they may have discovered that this new content was too much work or too much of a change. So yes things change, it may not have been misleading on purpose, but I am still disappointed.
I think L4D1 is a great game on its own, and worth 50$ to some people. I still would not have bought it though knowing what I know now (That it was only going to get minor support).
I understand that getting the Survival pack, the balance tweaks, the bug fixes, and the lighthouse map is more than most games. I also don't buy most games.
I think L4D2 has potential to be worth 50$ and not just be an expansion pack. But we'll all have to wait and see on that one and I'm currently on the fence.
I understand that there is potential for more support, but am skeptical as there are only five months and I doubt they would continue to support L4D1 much with a clearly superior L4D game available.
I know there are no guarantees that they'll be making L4D3 within a year or whatever of L4D2, and I know it's still possible that they'll support L4D2 as much as I wanted them to support L4D1! But I won't be convinced until I see it, and I will no longer take their word for it.
Yes, I know, if you don't like it don't buy it. Well, don't like my opinions don't agree with them! I believe this is a forum for discussion.
Yes, I have e-mailed Valve on these matters. I am not just ragin' on the internets.
Man I don't care how much they say that they're increasing storytelling and making their characters more round, it doesnt do shit when I don't like them at all.
I mean when I first saw the final build of the L4D cast I really liked them even though the most characterization they got were some one-liners, but these four i'm not feeling the same about.
They better make these four fucking brilliant shakespeare characters if they don't want me to go to town on my teammates with an axe
Man I don't care how much they say that they're increasing storytelling and making their characters more round, it doesnt do shit when I don't like them at all.
I mean when I first saw the final build of the L4D cast I really liked them even though the most characterization they got were some one-liners, but these four i'm not feeling the same about.
They better make these four fucking brilliant shakespeare characters if they don't want me to go to town on my teammates with an axe
That would be hilarious if the ragequitting in L4D1 turned into team killing in L4D2.
Then we would race4dead from our teammates, in the sunlight, getting chased with axes and then ragequitting once I get farted on by the new infected.
I don't understand why people don't like the new characters. But I haven't watched much of the gameplay videos. Do we already know they aren't as appealing as our original four? I mean, one of them made a GOB reference for crying out loud. I don't doubt that they'll deliver on the likable characters.
Quaz and Wally on
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Dac VinS-s-screw you! I only listen to DOUBLE MUSIC!Registered Userregular
edited June 2009
Drifting away from the drama, I got a new mic so I can play l4d like it was meant to! id is http://steamcommunity.com/id/dacvin/ if you want to add me.
Also a small question about the mic: there's a 1-sec lag when I talk. Is it possible to at least reduce it someway?
Drifting away from the drama, I got a new mic so I can play l4d like it was meant to! id is http://steamcommunity.com/id/dacvin/ if you want to add me.
Also a small question about the mic: there's a 1-sec lag when I talk. Is it possible to at least reduce it someway?
use vent
(nope, sorry)
- wait-- you're talking about the in-game lag, right? because everyone gets that, your team doesn't hear you until about a second after you say something.
Heh, pretending time played has anything to do with content.
Cool counter intuitive argument bro.
You seem to be arguing that content = quantity of "stuff" in a game, as in number of weapons, levels, skins, etc.
I would argue that the amount of enjoyable playtime a game provides is the true measure of content. For example, a relatively "simple" game like chess (six pieces with different moves, a relatively small board, a static starting position) actually has far more content than a more "complicated" game like, say, Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Battle 22, that has twenty-seven playable characters with many moves for each. Yet Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Battle 22 suffers from a major problem: it is eminently awful and therefore worthless. Chess, on the other hand, is a true gaming classic and is played by millions worldwide.
I would say that L4D contained a huge amount of content for Rak and continues to do so. In fact, there might be more content for him to unlock.
For example: can he consistently pull off bunny hop pounces to create new spots for 25 pointers? If not, then there is additional content for him to master.
I understand feeling a bit disappointed that Valve hasn't released more content (hell, I feel a little disappointed as well; one new map would be awesome!). But measuring content as the amount of "stuff" seems inferior to defining it as the enduring quality and quantity of play experience.
I don't understand why people don't like the new characters. But I haven't watched much of the gameplay videos. Do we already know they aren't as appealing as our original four? I mean, one of them made a GOB reference for crying out loud. I don't doubt that they'll deliver on the likable characters.
I don't know, I just liked the original four because they I thought they created likeable characters especially with Bill and Louis and had them be believeable survivors. People you could see actually being competent enough to get through this shit and always get shafted waiting for an escape vehicle
now we got "mama told me to pray harder", a redneck-ish guy, and some conman who's fighting through New Orleans who's first idea is how to count cards in zombie blackjack
And those guys are the ones getting fucking airstrikes from the military for assistance.
Also, and somebody made this point earlier so I'm stealing the same example, I can play a million hours of tetris, but still not think it had 50 dollars worth of content. Again, I'd like to point out that I don't actually think L4D has as much or the same amount of content as Tetris or that they are worth the same amount.
Sorry, but if you're playing tetris for a million hours (or even just 1000), you better well consider it to be worth 50 bucks, regardless of what you actually paid for it.
This is an excellent point. But goddamn would I feel gypped considering how simple the game looks. Hell, I could program it myself. I am just pointing out that I don't consider the, "You played this for 300 hours and you still think you should be getting more for your buck?" argument doesn't really dissolve the feelings that they didn't get everything they paid for, especially when they were promised more.
But I don’t see how you can be so dismissive of playtime. Ask yourself, really, how many games have you ever played for more than 100 hours that you personally wouldn’t consider worth 50 dollars. I find it hard to believe someone would invest so much time into something that they considered to be less than complete.
And that’s really what bugs me the most about this. Getting upset because Valve isn’t treating this game as kindly as they treated TF2 is one thing. I can kind of see that argument. But it IS entitlement. I’m sorry, but it is. Just realize that you felt entitled to certain things when this game was released, and that’s what you’re upset about. It doesn’t negate the validity of your complaint (though it may mitigate the sympathy you get for it).
But please, for the love of God, if you’ve sunken more than 100 hours of game time into L4D, you have absolutely no business calling this game incomplete, or referring to it as the beta test. It just makes you look silly.
Incidentally, I’m really replying to the gaming community as a whole, not necessarily the person I’ve quoted above. I’m not aware if he’s ever referred to this game as a beta test.
Heh, pretending time played has anything to do with content.
Cool counter intuitive argument bro.
You seem to be arguing that content = quantity of "stuff" in a game, as in number of weapons, levels, skins, etc.
I would argue that the amount of enjoyable playtime a game provides is the true measure of content. For example, a relatively "simple" game like chess (six pieces with different moves, a relatively small board, a static starting position) actually has far more content than a more "complicated" game like, say, Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Battle 22, that has twenty-seven playable characters with many moves for each. Yet Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Battle 22 suffers from a major problem: it is eminently awful and therefore worthless. Chess, on the other hand, is a true gaming classic and is played by millions worldwide.
I would say that L4D contained a huge amount of content for Rak and continues to do so. In fact, there might be more content for him to unlock.
For example: can he consistently pull off bunny hop pounces to create new spots for 25 pointers? If not, then there is additional content for him to master.
I understand feeling a bit disappointed that Valve hasn't released more content (hell, I feel a little disappointed as well; one new map would be awesome!). But measuring content as the amount of "stuff" seems inferior to defining it as the enduring quality and quantity of play experience.
Yes, I can.
Seeing through walls helps.
And no, if the new content is a half ass map with an even lamer mode that no one plays, then yes. That is plenty of content.
Except that they missed out on the other 80% they said would be providing..
But I don’t see how you can be so dismissive of playtime. Ask yourself, really, how many games have you ever played for more than 100 hours that you personally wouldn’t consider worth 50 dollars. I find it hard to believe someone would invest so much time into something that they considered to be less than complete.
And that’s really what bugs me the most about this. Getting upset because Valve isn’t treating this game as kindly as they treated TF2 is one thing. I can kind of see that argument. But it IS entitlement. I’m sorry, but it is. Just realize that you felt entitled to certain things when this game was released, and that’s what you’re upset about. It doesn’t negate the validity of your complaint (though it may mitigate the sympathy you get for it).
But please, for the love of God, if you’ve sunken more than 100 hours of game time into L4D, you have absolutely no business calling this game incomplete, or referring to it as the beta test. It just makes you look silly.
Incidentally, I’m really replying to the gaming community as a whole, not necessarily the person I’ve quoted above. I’m not aware if he’s ever referred to this game as a beta test.
Just cause I play it a shitload, doesn't mean it's perfect or complete. Take my drumset for example, it's a piece of fucking shit and sounds god awful, but I play it everyday because I enjoy playing drums.
I play this game because I enjoy killing undead mans. That doesn't mean content isn't missing or that the game needs to be tweaked.
Also, you shouldn't rage unintall, you should play with me, take the medkit and then incap yourself immediately afterwards. Thats always a great time
That was awesome.
The full anecdote:
We're on Dead Air, in the part with the van. As we're heading in behind the van, tank music plays. We somehow manage to kill the tank while dealing with the crescendo.
I remarked on how awesome that was: "That's true skill right there." As I am saying that, I am failing to jump to a nearby platform, proceeding to fall to my own incapacitation moments after finding a spare medkit healing me back up to green. "Speaking of true skill..."
It was hilarious. I should have done it on purpose.
I... I don't remember that level being a platformer. Where did this happen?
You know behind the baggage check with all the conveyor belts? On the upper platform, I saw some pipes and said "You know, I've never jumped to these pipes before." Well it turns out that you can't.
EDIT: Uh, Rak? No Great Name? We get it. You can stop now. We get it.
You know behind the baggage check with all the conveyor belts? On the upper platform, I saw some pipes and said "You know, I've never jumped to these pipes before." Well it turns out that you can't.
EDIT: Uh, Rak? No Great Name? We get it. You can stop now. We get it.
I had stopped but then random quoted something from like 2 days ago and I had to reply. Sorry no more trolling from me.
Also, and somebody made this point earlier so I'm stealing the same example, I can play a million hours of tetris, but still not think it had 50 dollars worth of content. Again, I'd like to point out that I don't actually think L4D has as much or the same amount of content as Tetris or that they are worth the same amount.
Sorry, but if you're playing tetris for a million hours (or even just 1000), you better well consider it to be worth 50 bucks, regardless of what you actually paid for it.
This is an excellent point. But goddamn would I feel gypped considering how simple the game looks. Hell, I could program it myself. I am just pointing out that I don't consider the, "You played this for 300 hours and you still think you should be getting more for your buck?" argument doesn't really dissolve the feelings that they didn't get everything they paid for, especially when they were promised more.
But I don’t see how you can be so dismissive of playtime. Ask yourself, really, how many games have you ever played for more than 100 hours that you personally wouldn’t consider worth 50 dollars. I find it hard to believe someone would invest so much time into something that they considered to be less than complete.
And that’s really what bugs me the most about this. Getting upset because Valve isn’t treating this game as kindly as they treated TF2 is one thing. I can kind of see that argument. But it IS entitlement. I’m sorry, but it is. Just realize that you felt entitled to certain things when this game was released, and that’s what you’re upset about. It doesn’t negate the validity of your complaint (though it may mitigate the sympathy you get for it).
But please, for the love of God, if you’ve sunken more than 100 hours of game time into L4D, you have absolutely no business calling this game incomplete, or referring to it as the beta test. It just makes you look silly.
Incidentally, I’m really replying to the gaming community as a whole, not necessarily the person I’ve quoted above. I’m not aware if he’s ever referred to this game as a beta test.
Yeah, I can see how people feel that way. I'm not sure how much time I've sunken into L4D, and it was probably enough to warrant 45$ by average game time standards. And I have admitted that I hold games to a much higher standard now because of TF2, higher than most people, so I don't say that L4D is a bullshit game not worth 50 dollars, because I know it is worth 50$ by most standards. It wasn't worth it to me, but I'm on a much tighter budget now and I get so much out of TF2 now. It's basically all I played until L4D, but then that only lasted a few weeks and I went back to TF2. I was hoping for more support to draw me back into it, but didn't see it.
I admit and have admitted that I do feel entitled to more content, but that's because they promised it to me. Maybe that's an entitlement complex, and I can accept that, but I don't find anything particularly wrong with expecting a good company like Valve to follow through on a promise like more weapons and movies.
And again, I have to agree, L4D is a fine game and is far from incomplete. People often feel like I'm saying that it is when I say I expected more content and am disappointed I didn't get it. I would basically have not complained at all if they had never ever said that they were going to support this game and include more content and even specifically said more weapons, movies, unlocks, etc... I might have been like, "shucks, oh well." But because of that promise I feel a bit miffed.
Disclaimer
Because I will be strawmanned to hell and back if I don't say these unrelated details. (I will be posting this with all my "boo Valve" posts because for the love of God this thread.)
I am disappointed that they said they would support L4D1 like they did TF2, but than didn't. But I understand that they may have discovered that this new content was too much work or too much of a change. So yes things change, it may not have been misleading on purpose, but I am still disappointed.
I think L4D1 is a great game on its own, and worth 50$ to some people. I still would not have bought it though knowing what I know now (That it was only going to get minor support).
I understand that getting the Survival pack, the balance tweaks, the bug fixes, and the lighthouse map is more than most games. I also don't buy most games.
I think L4D2 has potential to be worth 50$ and not just be an expansion pack. But we'll all have to wait and see on that one and I'm currently on the fence.
I understand that there is potential for more support, but am skeptical as there are only five months and I doubt they would continue to support L4D1 much with a clearly superior L4D game available.
I know there are no guarantees that they'll be making L4D3 within a year or whatever of L4D2, and I know it's still possible that they'll support L4D2 as much as I wanted them to support L4D1! But I won't be convinced until I see it, and I will no longer take their word for it.
Yes, I know, if you don't like it don't buy it. Well, don't like my opinions don't agree with them! I believe this is a forum for discussion.
Yes, I have e-mailed Valve on these matters. I am not just ragin' on the internets.
But I don’t see how you can be so dismissive of playtime. Ask yourself, really, how many games have you ever played for more than 100 hours that you personally wouldn’t consider worth 50 dollars. I find it hard to believe someone would invest so much time into something that they considered to be less than complete.
And that’s really what bugs me the most about this. Getting upset because Valve isn’t treating this game as kindly as they treated TF2 is one thing. I can kind of see that argument. But it IS entitlement. I’m sorry, but it is. Just realize that you felt entitled to certain things when this game was released, and that’s what you’re upset about. It doesn’t negate the validity of your complaint (though it may mitigate the sympathy you get for it).
But please, for the love of God, if you’ve sunken more than 100 hours of game time into L4D, you have absolutely no business calling this game incomplete, or referring to it as the beta test. It just makes you look silly.
Incidentally, I’m really replying to the gaming community as a whole, not necessarily the person I’ve quoted above. I’m not aware if he’s ever referred to this game as a beta test.
Just cause I play it a shitload, doesn't mean it's perfect or complete. Take my drumset for example, it's a piece of fucking shit and sounds god awful, but I play it everyday because I enjoy playing drums.
I play this game because I enjoy killing undead mans. That doesn't mean content isn't missing or that the game needs to be tweaked.
Your drum analogy isn’t really representative. Sounds to me like your drum isn’t broken or incomplete at all. Maybe it’s old and worn down. Maybe there’s a few annoying issues that it has. But it’s certainly still playable, isn’t it? Now what if I was to punch a big hole right in the center of the snare drum. Think you’d still play it? I doubt it.
Does L4D have its issues? Sure. They still haven’t patched away the power shot on the 360, and that really annoys me. But is the game broken or incomplete? No. Not at all. If it was, then you wouldn’t be playing it.
Maybe our standards of what qualifies as incomplete are different, but I still find it difficult to accept that, with so many other gaming choices available to us, anyone would spend 100+ hours banging away on a broken drum set.
You know behind the baggage check with all the conveyor belts? On the upper platform, I saw some pipes and said "You know, I've never jumped to these pipes before." Well it turns out that you can't.
EDIT: Uh, Rak? No Great Name? We get it. You can stop now. We get it.
I had stopped but then random quoted something from like 2 days ago and I had to reply. Sorry no more trolling from me.
I don't think you're trolling at all. I think you have a perfectly reasonable complaint, I just think you guys are getting a little strident about it.
In any event, back to L4D discussion: Does anyone know if knocking a survivor down something while pounced does additional damage? Like down a ladder?
I might get it if it's like 10 dollars or something.
Don't think I forgot my disclaimer
Because I will be strawmanned to hell and back if I don't say these unrelated details. (I will be posting this with all my "boo Valve" posts because for the love of God this thread.)
I am disappointed that they said they would support L4D1 like they did TF2, but than didn't. But I understand that they may have discovered that this new content was too much work or too much of a change. So yes things change, it may not have been misleading on purpose, but I am still disappointed.
I think L4D1 is a great game on its own, and worth 50$ to some people. I still would not have bought it though knowing what I know now (That it was only going to get minor support).
I understand that getting the Survival pack, the balance tweaks, the bug fixes, and the lighthouse map is more than most games. I also don't buy most games.
I think L4D2 has potential to be worth 50$ and not just be an expansion pack. But we'll all have to wait and see on that one and I'm currently on the fence.
I understand that there is potential for more support, but am skeptical as there are only five months and I doubt they would continue to support L4D1 much with a clearly superior L4D game available.
I know there are no guarantees that they'll be making L4D3 within a year or whatever of L4D2, and I know it's still possible that they'll support L4D2 as much as I wanted them to support L4D1! But I won't be convinced until I see it, and I will no longer take their word for it.
Yes, I know, if you don't like it don't buy it. Well, don't like my opinions don't agree with them! I believe this is a forum for discussion.
Yes, I have e-mailed Valve on these matters. I am not just ragin' on the internets.
Eh, to be honest I enjoyed L4D plenty, but I'm sceptical I'm going to buy this, or at least not straight away.
Unless the community shifts wholsale onto L4D2 I'm not sure I see the point, because all the video footage has just looked like L4D with a New Orleans skin as far as I've been able to see.
I was really expecting them to take their time and make a real evolution of the game. Which it could still be, but if it's not, then I don't see much point in bothering.
Unless the community shifts wholsale onto L4D2 I'm not sure I see the point, because all the video footage has just looked like L4D with a New Orleans skin as far as I've been able to see.
Is it bad that that's the biggest reason I want it?
Eh, to be honest I enjoyed L4D plenty, but I'm sceptical I'm going to buy this, or at least not straight away.
Unless the community shifts wholsale onto L4D2 I'm not sure I see the point, because all the video footage has just looked like L4D with a New Orleans skin as far as I've been able to see.
I was really expecting them to take their time and make a real evolution of the game. Which it could still be, but if it's not, then I don't see much point in bothering.
All the video footage from the day of announcement 5 months from release are always highly indicative of the final product's quality and variety
I won't be buying L4D2 until maybe when it's $20. Still probably not, however. I'll still be playing L4D1, and I'm sure there will be enough others remaining to keep a decent community going.
Unrelated note: Accidentally holding down Shift while typing out the game's initials makes L$D, lololool moneygrab
Serious post: Do people absolutely lose their cognitive ability when it comes to video game speculation
Because if you honestly think that the current l4d2 videos are anywhere near what the final thing is going to be like, you should probably stop posting
Go look at some of the early l4d videos months from release and see how much changed
You know behind the baggage check with all the conveyor belts? On the upper platform, I saw some pipes and said "You know, I've never jumped to these pipes before." Well it turns out that you can't.
EDIT: Uh, Rak? No Great Name? We get it. You can stop now. We get it.
I had stopped but then random quoted something from like 2 days ago and I had to reply. Sorry no more trolling from me.
I don't think you're trolling at all. I think you have a perfectly reasonable complaint, I just think you guys are getting a little strident about it.
In any event, back to L4D discussion: Does anyone know if knocking a survivor down something while pounced does additional damage? Like down a ladder?
Yes, they take falling damage if they exceed the threshold.
I won't be buying L4D2 until maybe when it's $20. Still probably not, however. I'll still be playing L4D1, and I'm sure there will be enough others remaining to keep a decent community going.
Unrelated note: Accidentally holding down Shift while typing out the game's initials makes L$D, lololool moneygrab
Eh, to be honest I enjoyed L4D plenty, but I'm sceptical I'm going to buy this, or at least not straight away.
Unless the community shifts wholsale onto L4D2 I'm not sure I see the point, because all the video footage has just looked like L4D with a New Orleans skin as far as I've been able to see.
I was really expecting them to take their time and make a real evolution of the game. Which it could still be, but if it's not, then I don't see much point in bothering.
All the video footage from the day of announcement 5 months from release are always highly indicative of the final product's quality and variety
It's what they chose to show, and it's what I'm seeing. Sorry if I'm actually supposed to ramp up my enthusiasm for future, better footage that I haven't seen yet, I'll do that right away.
Serious post: Do people absolutely lose their cognitive ability when it comes to video game speculation
Because if you honestly think that the current l4d2 videos are anywhere near what the final thing is going to be like, you should probably stop posting
Go look at some of the early l4d videos months from release and see how much changed
The reason I plan on holding out is not because I don't think L4D2 will be worth it, but because from that last interview it sounded like they already wanted to do more sequels. Like, the motivation was already there. I just want to wait to see if a better version comes around than spend more money on older L4D versions.
Disclaimer
Because I will be strawmanned to hell and back if I don't say these unrelated details. (I will be posting this with all my "boo Valve" posts because for the love of God this thread.)
I am disappointed that they said they would support L4D1 like they did TF2, but than didn't. But I understand that they may have discovered that this new content was too much work or too much of a change. So yes things change, it may not have been misleading on purpose, but I am still disappointed.
I think L4D1 is a great game on its own, and worth 50$ to some people. I still would not have bought it though knowing what I know now (That it was only going to get minor support).
I understand that getting the Survival pack, the balance tweaks, the bug fixes, and the lighthouse map is more than most games. I also don't buy most games.
I think L4D2 has potential to be worth 50$ and not just be an expansion pack. But we'll all have to wait and see on that one and I'm currently on the fence.
I understand that there is potential for more support, but am skeptical as there are only five months and I doubt they would continue to support L4D1 much with a clearly superior L4D game available.
I know there are no guarantees that they'll be making L4D3 within a year or whatever of L4D2, and I know it's still possible that they'll support L4D2 as much as I wanted them to support L4D1! But I won't be convinced until I see it, and I will no longer take their word for it.
Yes, I know, if you don't like it don't buy it. Well, don't like my opinions don't agree with them! I believe this is a forum for discussion.
Yes, I have e-mailed Valve on these matters. I am not just ragin' on the internets.
Unless the community shifts wholsale onto L4D2 I'm not sure I see the point, because all the video footage has just looked like L4D with a New Orleans skin as far as I've been able to see.
Is it bad that that's the biggest reason I want it?
Whatever works for you. I don't particularly mind the new setting but it's not exactly a huge "MUST HAVE" for me either.
Eh, to be honest I enjoyed L4D plenty, but I'm sceptical I'm going to buy this, or at least not straight away.
Unless the community shifts wholsale onto L4D2 I'm not sure I see the point, because all the video footage has just looked like L4D with a New Orleans skin as far as I've been able to see.
I was really expecting them to take their time and make a real evolution of the game. Which it could still be, but if it's not, then I don't see much point in bothering.
All the video footage from the day of announcement 5 months from release are always highly indicative of the final product's quality and variety
It's what they chose to show, and it's what I'm seeing. Sorry if I'm actually supposed to ramp up my enthusiasm for future, better footage that I haven't seen yet, I'll do that right away.
It's what they have done the most, and what they're forced to show at a Microsoft Conference
Posts
hrmm...
of course by tf2, i mean l4d
lolol acronyms
Disclaimer
Cool counter intuitive argument bro.
Sorry, but if you're playing tetris for a million hours (or even just 1000), you better well consider it to be worth 50 bucks, regardless of what you actually paid for it.
But I was also expecting content like TF2 and even more so because they said so.
When the CEO of a company sends a direct message to the community, stating that we will receive ANYTHING from them along the lines, I take that into account. Especially if you've had nothing but positive experiences with said company. That's what a normal person would expect. Not entitlement, expectation.
Don't bark down my throat and single me out just cause I enjoy killing undead mans, if this was any company people would feel duped and floored.
And even if I said I feel entitled, which i most certainly didn't, isn't this just a perfect example at my entitlement? I simply just want new content, like they said they would.
I hadn't looked at my own stats in a while, but checked them out to compare to rak. Mostly, they don't make any goddamn sense. For example, I have 65% accuracy with the minigun, but have zero kills and apparently have only fired 127 bullets from it total. I also have a pretty hard time believing that my average boomer lifespan is actually more than a minute, and that I managed to do nearly 20000 damage in a single life as smoker.
You get a shitload of points if you have someone smokered while they are boomed.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
This is an excellent point. But goddamn would I feel gypped considering how simple the game looks. Hell, I could program it myself. I am just pointing out that I don't consider the, "You played this for 300 hours and you still think you should be getting more for your buck?" argument doesn't really dissolve the feelings that they didn't get everything they paid for, especially when they were promised more.
Disclaimer
I mean when I first saw the final build of the L4D cast I really liked them even though the most characterization they got were some one-liners, but these four i'm not feeling the same about.
They better make these four fucking brilliant shakespeare characters if they don't want me to go to town on my teammates with an axe
Then we would race4dead from our teammates, in the sunlight, getting chased with axes and then ragequitting once I get farted on by the new infected.
Both would combine into magical powers.
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
Also a small question about the mic: there's a 1-sec lag when I talk. Is it possible to at least reduce it someway?
use vent
(nope, sorry)
- wait-- you're talking about the in-game lag, right? because everyone gets that, your team doesn't hear you until about a second after you say something.
You seem to be arguing that content = quantity of "stuff" in a game, as in number of weapons, levels, skins, etc.
I would argue that the amount of enjoyable playtime a game provides is the true measure of content. For example, a relatively "simple" game like chess (six pieces with different moves, a relatively small board, a static starting position) actually has far more content than a more "complicated" game like, say, Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Battle 22, that has twenty-seven playable characters with many moves for each. Yet Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Battle 22 suffers from a major problem: it is eminently awful and therefore worthless. Chess, on the other hand, is a true gaming classic and is played by millions worldwide.
I would say that L4D contained a huge amount of content for Rak and continues to do so. In fact, there might be more content for him to unlock.
For example: can he consistently pull off bunny hop pounces to create new spots for 25 pointers? If not, then there is additional content for him to master.
I understand feeling a bit disappointed that Valve hasn't released more content (hell, I feel a little disappointed as well; one new map would be awesome!). But measuring content as the amount of "stuff" seems inferior to defining it as the enduring quality and quantity of play experience.
I don't know, I just liked the original four because they I thought they created likeable characters especially with Bill and Louis and had them be believeable survivors. People you could see actually being competent enough to get through this shit and always get shafted waiting for an escape vehicle
now we got "mama told me to pray harder", a redneck-ish guy, and some conman who's fighting through New Orleans who's first idea is how to count cards in zombie blackjack
And those guys are the ones getting fucking airstrikes from the military for assistance.
But I don’t see how you can be so dismissive of playtime. Ask yourself, really, how many games have you ever played for more than 100 hours that you personally wouldn’t consider worth 50 dollars. I find it hard to believe someone would invest so much time into something that they considered to be less than complete.
And that’s really what bugs me the most about this. Getting upset because Valve isn’t treating this game as kindly as they treated TF2 is one thing. I can kind of see that argument. But it IS entitlement. I’m sorry, but it is. Just realize that you felt entitled to certain things when this game was released, and that’s what you’re upset about. It doesn’t negate the validity of your complaint (though it may mitigate the sympathy you get for it).
But please, for the love of God, if you’ve sunken more than 100 hours of game time into L4D, you have absolutely no business calling this game incomplete, or referring to it as the beta test. It just makes you look silly.
Incidentally, I’m really replying to the gaming community as a whole, not necessarily the person I’ve quoted above. I’m not aware if he’s ever referred to this game as a beta test.
Seeing through walls helps.
And no, if the new content is a half ass map with an even lamer mode that no one plays, then yes. That is plenty of content.
Except that they missed out on the other 80% they said would be providing..
..Oh no, wait they did, it's called L4D2
I play this game because I enjoy killing undead mans. That doesn't mean content isn't missing or that the game needs to be tweaked.
You know behind the baggage check with all the conveyor belts? On the upper platform, I saw some pipes and said "You know, I've never jumped to these pipes before." Well it turns out that you can't.
EDIT: Uh, Rak? No Great Name? We get it. You can stop now. We get it.
Yeah, I can see how people feel that way. I'm not sure how much time I've sunken into L4D, and it was probably enough to warrant 45$ by average game time standards. And I have admitted that I hold games to a much higher standard now because of TF2, higher than most people, so I don't say that L4D is a bullshit game not worth 50 dollars, because I know it is worth 50$ by most standards. It wasn't worth it to me, but I'm on a much tighter budget now and I get so much out of TF2 now. It's basically all I played until L4D, but then that only lasted a few weeks and I went back to TF2. I was hoping for more support to draw me back into it, but didn't see it.
I admit and have admitted that I do feel entitled to more content, but that's because they promised it to me. Maybe that's an entitlement complex, and I can accept that, but I don't find anything particularly wrong with expecting a good company like Valve to follow through on a promise like more weapons and movies.
And again, I have to agree, L4D is a fine game and is far from incomplete. People often feel like I'm saying that it is when I say I expected more content and am disappointed I didn't get it. I would basically have not complained at all if they had never ever said that they were going to support this game and include more content and even specifically said more weapons, movies, unlocks, etc... I might have been like, "shucks, oh well." But because of that promise I feel a bit miffed.
Disclaimer
Your drum analogy isn’t really representative. Sounds to me like your drum isn’t broken or incomplete at all. Maybe it’s old and worn down. Maybe there’s a few annoying issues that it has. But it’s certainly still playable, isn’t it? Now what if I was to punch a big hole right in the center of the snare drum. Think you’d still play it? I doubt it.
Does L4D have its issues? Sure. They still haven’t patched away the power shot on the 360, and that really annoys me. But is the game broken or incomplete? No. Not at all. If it was, then you wouldn’t be playing it.
Maybe our standards of what qualifies as incomplete are different, but I still find it difficult to accept that, with so many other gaming choices available to us, anyone would spend 100+ hours banging away on a broken drum set.
I don't think you're trolling at all. I think you have a perfectly reasonable complaint, I just think you guys are getting a little strident about it.
In any event, back to L4D discussion: Does anyone know if knocking a survivor down something while pounced does additional damage? Like down a ladder?
I'm going to hold out for L4D4.
Eh, to be honest I enjoyed L4D plenty, but I'm sceptical I'm going to buy this, or at least not straight away.
Unless the community shifts wholsale onto L4D2 I'm not sure I see the point, because all the video footage has just looked like L4D with a New Orleans skin as far as I've been able to see.
I was really expecting them to take their time and make a real evolution of the game. Which it could still be, but if it's not, then I don't see much point in bothering.
Is it bad that that's the biggest reason I want it?
Switch: 6200-8149-0919 / Wii U: maximumzero / 3DS: 0860-3352-3335 / eBay Shop
All the video footage from the day of announcement 5 months from release are always highly indicative of the final product's quality and variety
Unrelated note: Accidentally holding down Shift while typing out the game's initials makes L$D, lololool moneygrab
Because if you honestly think that the current l4d2 videos are anywhere near what the final thing is going to be like, you should probably stop posting
Go look at some of the early l4d videos months from release and see how much changed
Yes, they take falling damage if they exceed the threshold.
It's what they chose to show, and it's what I'm seeing. Sorry if I'm actually supposed to ramp up my enthusiasm for future, better footage that I haven't seen yet, I'll do that right away.
The reason I plan on holding out is not because I don't think L4D2 will be worth it, but because from that last interview it sounded like they already wanted to do more sequels. Like, the motivation was already there. I just want to wait to see if a better version comes around than spend more money on older L4D versions.
Disclaimer
Whatever works for you. I don't particularly mind the new setting but it's not exactly a huge "MUST HAVE" for me either.
It's what they have done the most, and what they're forced to show at a Microsoft Conference