One of the grandchildren prayed to remove the division and hostility between people including "gay and straight" in the portion of the Mass where the assemblage asks "Lord Hear Our Prayer" (The Prayers of the Faitful)
Hell, within the health care debate, that's easily proven wrong. And will be again in a second.
Support for "Obama's health care" bill is 37%, in the same poll, after given a paragraph description of the health care bill the Democrats are pushing (I think the Senate HELP version), support is 53%.
I'll bet anything that within a week a majority of Americans will believe Kennedy hated this bill, even though his staff damn near wrote it.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
And how smart is it to call americans stupid yet expect them to support your ideas and vote the way you want them to vote? It's that sort of arrogant, condescending, smug crap that pisses them off.
Yeah, insulting people is a *great* way to get them to come around to your point of view.
People like Obama and Kennedy succeeded because they didn't spit in the faces of their fellow countrymen.
It's that sort of arrogant, condescending, smug crap that pisses them off.
And willfully ignorant, lazy, and hateful crap pisses me off.
I don't "spit in the faces" of my fellow countrymen. I do, however, base my assessment of political maneuvers in reality.
I asserted that americans arn't stupid.
You laughed.
That's a pretty strong indication that you believe this not to be true.
Are some americans dumb? Yeah, but the country as a whole is way too successful overall to be comprised of morons.
You don't have to be a moron in order to be stupid when it comes to politics, policy, or the arcane workings of Congress. So I'm really not seeing your point.
Americans may not be "stupid," but we've pretty clearly proven over the years that most of us are complete suckers. Suckers with no real conception of what's actually going on around them.
I think that in a huge democracy, sooner or later the ratio of government power/"average capacity of citizen to grasp the situation and manage society" just becomes critical. Kennedy certainly did his best to ameliorate the negative effects that come with the shifts of said ratio.
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
override367 on
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KalTorakOne way or another, they all end up inthe Undercity.Registered Userregular
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
See; your arrogance.
gigEsmalls on
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HachfaceNot the Minister Farrakhan you're thinking ofDammit, Shepard!Registered Userregular
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
See; your arrogance.
So what you're trying to say is that a lot of people have developed a trust in OptimusZed's arrogance?
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
See; your arrogance.
Do you really want to jump to the defense of Fox News?
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
See; your arrogance.
So what you're trying to say is that a lot of people have developed a trust in OptimusZed's arrogance?
I think lots of American ignorance comes from the lack of information in most resources. A lot of us here dig through newsgroups, multiple online news sites, newspapers(I read my local one, has a great sports section if anything), and watch multiple news shows or channels. Most people don't do that and trust that the one show they watch or listen to that day will give them the news in an unbiased way. Sadly biased reporting makes more money because it is more sensational than the truth so that is what Americans get. They get 30 second clips for topics that should take 20 minutes at minimum because if we can fit 10 headlines in the time we can do three real stories, the 10 headlines will hold more viewers and make more money. The more time people spend learning about the world the less you hear ignorance that many mark as an American trait, but for that to happen most people must put a lot of time and effort and go outside the easily attainable news.
Though I think if we are going to discuss this, we should probably move to a different topic than this one on the death of Ted Kennedy. I must admit Obama's eulogy was very well done and moving. Just reading it made me tear up a little.
I think lots of American ignorance comes from the lack of information in most resources. A lot of us here dig through newsgroups, multiple online news sites, newspapers(I read my local one, has a great sports section if anything), and watch multiple news shows or channels. Most people don't do that and trust that the one show they watch or listen to that day will give them the news in an unbiased way. Sadly biased reporting makes more money because it is more sensational than the truth so that is what Americans get. They get 30 second clips for topics that should take 20 minutes at minimum because if we can fit 10 headlines in the time we can do three real stories, the 10 headlines will hold more viewers and make more money. The more time people spend learning about the world the less you hear ignorance that many mark as an American trait, but for that to happen most people must put a lot of time and effort and go outside the easily attainable news.
Though I think if we are going to discuss this, we should probably move to a different topic than this one on the death of Ted Kennedy. I must admit Obama's eulogy was very well done and moving. Just reading it made me tear up a little.
There's nothing wrong with biased reporting provided you're upfront about it and actually doing good reporting. Biased shitty reporting is bad, but by the same token unbiased shitty reporting is also bad.
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
See; your arrogance.
Do you really want to jump to the defense of Fox News?
You should defend your sense of superiority over those who have a different opinion.
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
See; your arrogance.
Do you really want to jump to the defense of Fox News?
You should defend your sense of superiority over those who have a different opinion.
We can when that opinion is about established facts, such as the existence of death panels.
I think ignorant, and too lazy and stubborn to fix that ignorance, would be a good way to describe us.
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
People also develop a trust for specific people or sources that makes them extra super gullible to anything those sources might spew out. See; Fair and Balanced.
See; your arrogance.
Do you really want to jump to the defense of Fox News?
You should defend your sense of superiority over those who have a different opinion.
This has nothing to do with their opinions. It's purely about the legitimacy of single-source news.
The 2008 Republican presidential candidate suggested during his radio show, "The Huckabee Report," on Thursday that, under President Obama's health care plan, Kennedy would have been told to "go home to take pain pills and die" during his last year of life.
...
As it happens, Huckabee made his remarks shortly after he derided Democrats for using Kennedy's death to make the pitch that "Congress must hurry and pass the health care reform bill and do it in his memory,"
The 2008 Republican presidential candidate suggested during his radio show, "The Huckabee Report," on Thursday that, under President Obama's health care plan, Kennedy would have been told to "go home to take pain pills and die" during his last year of life.
...
As it happens, Huckabee made his remarks shortly after he derided Democrats for using Kennedy's death to make the pitch that "Congress must hurry and pass the health care reform bill and do it in his memory,"
My favorite part of this is of course that if Kennedy weren't you know, a Senator or someone similarly powerful (like a Kennedy), that would have been his treatment under the current system.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
0
DHSChase lizards.....bark at donkeys..Registered Userregular
The 2008 Republican presidential candidate suggested during his radio show, "The Huckabee Report," on Thursday that, under President Obama's health care plan, Kennedy would have been told to "go home to take pain pills and die" during his last year of life.
...
As it happens, Huckabee made his remarks shortly after he derided Democrats for using Kennedy's death to make the pitch that "Congress must hurry and pass the health care reform bill and do it in his memory,"
My favorite part of this is of course that if Kennedy weren't you know, a Senator or someone similarly powerful (like a Kennedy), that would have been his treatment under the current system.
Actually, from what I've read that basically was his treatment. He had a glioblastoma, which has a median life expectancy prognosis of about 15 months. Sure, he had the best care available, but this is a kind of particularly nasty cancer that has so far not had much success as far as treatment goes.
There really isn't much else that can be done other than managing the pain and symptoms, from what I've read.
DHS on
"Grip 'em up, grip 'em, grip 'em good, said the Gryphon... to the pig."
The 2008 Republican presidential candidate suggested during his radio show, "The Huckabee Report," on Thursday that, under President Obama's health care plan, Kennedy would have been told to "go home to take pain pills and die" during his last year of life.
...
As it happens, Huckabee made his remarks shortly after he derided Democrats for using Kennedy's death to make the pitch that "Congress must hurry and pass the health care reform bill and do it in his memory,"
My favorite part of this is of course that if Kennedy weren't you know, a Senator or someone similarly powerful (like a Kennedy), that would have been his treatment under the current system.
Actually, from what I've read that basically was his treatment. He had a glioblastoma, which has a median life expectancy prognosis of about 15 months. Sure, he had the best care available, but this is a kind of particularly nasty cancer that has so far not had much success as far as treatment goes.
There really isn't much else that can be done other than managing the pain and symptoms, from what I've read.
Not to mention the fact that his health insurance is public already.
Posts
One of the grandchildren prayed to remove the division and hostility between people including "gay and straight" in the portion of the Mass where the assemblage asks "Lord Hear Our Prayer" (The Prayers of the Faitful)
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
:?
Margaret Thatcher
I agree, but that doesn't say good things about him at all.
Margaret Thatcher
If through his death we got healthcare for the masses, then I think it says GREAT things about the man.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
The irony is that those sort of tactics will turn a lot of people off because it looks "crass" and "exploitive." Americans arn't stupid.
Margaret Thatcher
They hate us for our freedom, WMDs, Axis of Evil, Greet us as liberators....the list goes on.
Support for "Obama's health care" bill is 37%, in the same poll, after given a paragraph description of the health care bill the Democrats are pushing (I think the Senate HELP version), support is 53%.
I'll bet anything that within a week a majority of Americans will believe Kennedy hated this bill, even though his staff damn near wrote it.
And how smart is it to call americans stupid yet expect them to support your ideas and vote the way you want them to vote? It's that sort of arrogant, condescending, smug crap that pisses them off.
Yeah, insulting people is a *great* way to get them to come around to your point of view.
People like Obama and Kennedy succeeded because they didn't spit in the faces of their fellow countrymen.
Margaret Thatcher
I don't "spit in the faces" of my fellow countrymen. I do, however, base my assessment of political maneuvers in reality.
I asserted that americans arn't stupid.
You laughed.
That's a pretty strong indication that you believe this not to be true.
Are some americans dumb? Yeah, but the country as a whole is way too successful overall to be comprised of morons.
Margaret Thatcher
You don't have to be a moron in order to be stupid when it comes to politics, policy, or the arcane workings of Congress. So I'm really not seeing your point.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Currently painting: Slowly [flickr]
Lazy really is the wrong terms, Americans tend to work pretty hard. I'm not sure what the right term is, but alot of the righties are locked in little cognitive feedback loops that refuse to accept reality.
I'd love for some psychologist to analyze the right as a whole, I mean it's groupthink 101, but there's more to it than that.
Intellectually apathetic, maybe? People get to a point where they have a little bit of information about something and they figure that's all they need. They aren't interested in informing themselves any further.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
See; your arrogance.
So what you're trying to say is that a lot of people have developed a trust in OptimusZed's arrogance?
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Very compelling argument there.
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
Especially given polls where only a third of respondents can correctly identify the public option out of three possible answers and republican talking points are based on the claim that the public option isn't an option.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Though I think if we are going to discuss this, we should probably move to a different topic than this one on the death of Ted Kennedy. I must admit Obama's eulogy was very well done and moving. Just reading it made me tear up a little.
There's nothing wrong with biased reporting provided you're upfront about it and actually doing good reporting. Biased shitty reporting is bad, but by the same token unbiased shitty reporting is also bad.
You should defend your sense of superiority over those who have a different opinion.
We're talking about a company that argued(successfully, I might add) that the media can lie legally.
I think the sense of superiority is completely warranted.
problem is most of what pundits say aren't opinions they're mudslingng as much stupid against the wall hoping one percent of it sticks.
I think there's nothing wrong with cutting people out of the discourse when they are not participating in good faith.
We can when that opinion is about established facts, such as the existence of death panels.
People are entitled to their own opinions, they are not entitled to their own facts.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
My favorite part of this is of course that if Kennedy weren't you know, a Senator or someone similarly powerful (like a Kennedy), that would have been his treatment under the current system.
Actually, from what I've read that basically was his treatment. He had a glioblastoma, which has a median life expectancy prognosis of about 15 months. Sure, he had the best care available, but this is a kind of particularly nasty cancer that has so far not had much success as far as treatment goes.
There really isn't much else that can be done other than managing the pain and symptoms, from what I've read.
Not to mention the fact that his health insurance is public already.