But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
It still got messed up too. If you said Revan was female in the beginning, half the time Revan was referenced, it was with male pronouns.
You can't claim that the canon Exile is female, and then complain that the game accidentally treats the canon Revan as male. Which he is.
I don't actually care if people refer to the Exile as male or Revan as female. The only reason there are canon genders and alignments is because with them inserted into an ongoing continuity that may reference those two, they needed some sort of consistency.
Pancake on
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QuirkyLittleTyrantA Mug Featuring Pichu On A CloudRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
It's unfortunate that canonical genders and alignments for the PCs had to be chosen, and it's even worse when they picked, in my opinion anyway, the least interesting gender combinations for each game. I thought by making them take place a bagillion years before the movies, they could avoid that shit.
But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
It's unfortunate that canonical genders and alignments for the PCs had to be chosen, and it's even worse when they picked, in my opinion anyway, the least interesting gender combinations for each game. I thought by making them take place a bagillion years before the movies, they could avoid that shit.
What does this even mean? You don't like the fact they only allowed the player to select between male or female?
QuirkyLittleTyrantA Mug Featuring Pichu On A CloudRegistered Userregular
edited November 2009
I meant it's sad that they had to pick canonical genders in the first place, and that a male Revan and a female Exile were pretty boring as compared to a female Revan and a male Exile (your mileage may vary).
QuirkyLittleTyrant on
PSN ID: Khrysocome
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joshgotroDeviled EggThe Land of REAL CHILIRegistered Userregular
But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
I never went back and re-rolled after playing it once. Hanharr and Disciple? Evil Wookies don't exist.
But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
I never went back and re-rolled after playing it once. Hanharr and Disciple? Evil Wookies don't exist.
That's just plain racist. I bet they all look like Chewbacca to you, right?
l337CrappyJack on
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
Well no shit it matters in the context of playing KotOR 2, since it dictates the characters you get. But I'm talking about, say, if a KotOR 3 comes around that lets you do the same thing for the Exile. Basically I'm talking fluff for story.
Henroid on
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joshgotroDeviled EggThe Land of REAL CHILIRegistered Userregular
But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
I never went back and re-rolled after playing it once. Hanharr and Disciple? Evil Wookies don't exist.
That's just plain racist. I bet they all look like Chewbacca to you, right?
But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
I never went back and re-rolled after playing it once. Hanharr and Disciple? Evil Wookies don't exist.
That's just plain racist. I bet they all look like Chewbacca to you, right?
Wrong
That's even worse. That's like Resident Evil 5 for Wookies.
As the great Wookie Civil Rights leader Malbacca King once said, "GRRRRRROOOOAAARRR".
But that wasn't especially difficult to do. You picked Revan's gender and alignment. The results didn't matter except in four places. And only one of those didn't involve any significant presentation.
Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
Well no shit it matters in the context of playing KotOR 2, since it dictates the characters you get. But I'm talking about, say, if a KotOR 3 comes around that lets you do the same thing for the Exile. Basically I'm talking fluff for story.
That's cute! You presume there might be a KOTOR3!
Anyway... I get what you're saying now. The problem with the way KOTOR2 handled things is that it likely didn't take into account the possibility of a massive delay between games. How it dealt with Revan and the potential motivations of the Exile led to an assumption that we'd follow the Exile to find Revan...
Now what? There's simply too many strange little options in The Sith Lords to simply start a new game and ask 'What was the Exile's gender?' and 'What was the Exile's alignment?' Not to mention the pigeonholing of the rest of the party and their future outcomes. Sometimes it feels like part of the reason we don't have a KOTOR3 is because Obsidian was too clever by half and wrote a story that ended in such a way that there is no satisfactory means for picking up the threads at a later date.
It would be highly likely that any solution in a potential KOTOR3 wouldn't be good enough. And now that we've moved up a generation, you can't just reuse the old art assets either... Like Shenmue 3, KOTOR3 is just a pipe dream at this point.
They have to say that. In the same way the rumoured Shenmue MMO was going to be Shenmue 3. KOTOR3 was eliminated when LA decided they would gut themselves as a cost cutting measure. It should say wonders that a company that practically divested itself of all internal development can't seem to find anybody willing to take on a highly anticipated (and likely to sell like a motherfucker in spite of any particular quality) game...
Bioware/Lucasarts have stated that SW:TOR is basically KoTR 3.
No way to know how truthful that is.
Too fucking bad, that's all you get.
Since when is Bioware in the habit of outright lying?
manwiththemachinegun on
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
edited November 2009
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
Henroid on
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
That doesn't sound like a purely marketing comment at all.
Same setting, same developers as the first one. Sounds as close to a sequel as we're going to get.
In fact the more I think of it, the question of it being the continuation of the KotR franchise isn't even a question at all. The only question is if it will do it well.
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
"Its a FPS, pretty much every level is going to have you getting the blue key for the blue door and the red key for the red door. Oh, and monster closets."
Genre's do evolve, you know. Whether TOR is the game that finally does it, who knows. But its Bioware, they are saying it will, and it is literally described as "this occurs x years after KotR I/II." I don't about anyone else, but as a guy who's played Bioware stuff since the first Baldur's Gate, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.
Raynaga on
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited November 2009
Hmm...if they add Revan armor to the MMO who want to bet that pretty much every douchebag will be wearing it(I know I will! If I played MMOs that is).
Dragkonias on
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
MMORPG's don't have to adhere to a single formula, y'know. And TOR is getting a lot of reputation for being the first plot-heavy, and well done in that regard, MMORPG. You might want to catch up.
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
MMORPG's don't have to adhere to a single formula, y'know. And TOR is getting a lot of reputation for being the first plot-heavy, and well done in that regard, MMORPG. You might want to catch up.
Meh, I don't listen to PR speak much. I'll believe it when I see it.
One of the heavily demoed levels is that of a Sith retaking a warship from the Republic. The mission unfolds in two stages, fighting your way to the bridge and then repelling the Jedi led commando team. There's a moment on the bridge where you get a lightside/darkside choice and that affects how the rest of the mission plays out. All of it is fully voice acted and the characters return (or don't) based on what you do.
When I was in third grade, I filled a whole wide ruled composition book with my own idea for a Star Wars RPG. I'd write down story elements, gameplay sections, even some rudimentary rules. At home, I'd play out my ideas with my plastic action figures. I don't think my teachers really understood what I was trying to do, but they let me turn in my updates in lieu of other writing assignments, so I was as happy, as, well, an 8 year old Star Wars fan could be.
I was much older when KOTOR came out, but I remember as soon as I created my character, I was instantly swept back into my childhood. This was the game I had envisioned years ago. I didn't have a lot of patience for games by then. I never completed any RPGs, despite buying a lot of them. Even with its length, I breezed through KOTOR, and even played through it a second time before eventually moving onto something else. Looking back, it was probably the last of my unadulterated gaming experiences, before I took on more real world responsibilities and began to feel jaded and guilty about my hobby. This is probably why I could never get into KOTOR2.
I doubt if I played the game now, I'd feel the same way, but maybe I'll pick it up on Steam once I've cleared out my backlog. I'd love to try KOTOR2 again as well.
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
MMORPG's don't have to adhere to a single formula, y'know. And TOR is getting a lot of reputation for being the first plot-heavy, and well done in that regard, MMORPG. You might want to catch up.
Meh, I don't listen to PR speak much. I'll believe it when I see it.
Then... go watch the video where they play through cinematic dialogue, Mass Effect style, as a Sith and proceed to go around defending the Imperial ship from Republic boarders?
Zetetic Elench on
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
MMORPG's don't have to adhere to a single formula, y'know. And TOR is getting a lot of reputation for being the first plot-heavy, and well done in that regard, MMORPG. You might want to catch up.
Meh, I don't listen to PR speak much. I'll believe it when I see it.
There's... there's footage and people who've played the game. And that number is going to increase when the beta starts. o_O
I will accept SW:TOR as KotOR 3 if it adds to that whole realm of plot and answers some questions. That's all that matters; I'm not necessarily concerned with the gameplay style (I actually don't like the KotOR games much for just the gameplay elements, aside from Force Powers and the whole deriving from D&D thing).
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
MMORPG's don't have to adhere to a single formula, y'know. And TOR is getting a lot of reputation for being the first plot-heavy, and well done in that regard, MMORPG. You might want to catch up.
Meh, I don't listen to PR speak much. I'll believe it when I see it.
Um, you can. There are numerous videos of in-game plots/quests/etc.
If you just want to sit in your preformed opinions rather than actually investigate what you're trying to talk about, I guess that's your choice.
Raynaga on
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited November 2009
Meh, those aren't the full game though. Pardon my pessimism, but there have been times in the past where games have gotten a lot of pre-release hype and not lived up to it. So, let me put it this way again, I will believe it when I see it.
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Keepin' the wimmenz force users down.
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Which is evidence toward why it doesn't matter what their gender or Force-ual preference are, too.
You can't claim that the canon Exile is female, and then complain that the game accidentally treats the canon Revan as male. Which he is.
I don't actually care if people refer to the Exile as male or Revan as female. The only reason there are canon genders and alignments is because with them inserted into an ongoing continuity that may reference those two, they needed some sort of consistency.
Steam: ZappRowsdower
For Revan? Not really. For the Exile? Well, it matters more. Mira is better than Hanhaar. Handmaiden is better than Disciple. At least when talking about gameplay benefits. Obsidian simply overreached and got burned for flying to close to the sun... To mix some metaphors...
What does this even mean? You don't like the fact they only allowed the player to select between male or female?
Steam: ZappRowsdower
I never went back and re-rolled after playing it once. Hanharr and Disciple? Evil Wookies don't exist.
That's just plain racist. I bet they all look like Chewbacca to you, right?
Well no shit it matters in the context of playing KotOR 2, since it dictates the characters you get. But I'm talking about, say, if a KotOR 3 comes around that lets you do the same thing for the Exile. Basically I'm talking fluff for story.
Wrong
That's even worse. That's like Resident Evil 5 for Wookies.
As the great Wookie Civil Rights leader Malbacca King once said, "GRRRRRROOOOAAARRR".
Nonsense. Republic Commando wookiees are awesome.
That's cute! You presume there might be a KOTOR3!
Anyway... I get what you're saying now. The problem with the way KOTOR2 handled things is that it likely didn't take into account the possibility of a massive delay between games. How it dealt with Revan and the potential motivations of the Exile led to an assumption that we'd follow the Exile to find Revan...
Now what? There's simply too many strange little options in The Sith Lords to simply start a new game and ask 'What was the Exile's gender?' and 'What was the Exile's alignment?' Not to mention the pigeonholing of the rest of the party and their future outcomes. Sometimes it feels like part of the reason we don't have a KOTOR3 is because Obsidian was too clever by half and wrote a story that ended in such a way that there is no satisfactory means for picking up the threads at a later date.
It would be highly likely that any solution in a potential KOTOR3 wouldn't be good enough. And now that we've moved up a generation, you can't just reuse the old art assets either... Like Shenmue 3, KOTOR3 is just a pipe dream at this point.
Translation: Bacta or bowcasters?
Edit -
FUCK YOU I CAN DREAM!
By take a hit you mean the Clone Wars cartoons started up. And there's no way to make a profitable game out of that mess.
I like it. And it seems to be going strong.
Though it loses some of its mystique since you already know how it ends.
No way to know how truthful that is.
So long as it does enough appropriate name dropping, I'll be happy.
And I'm sure we'll get some related plots too, they're not going to forget the KotOR name for a long while.
Too fucking bad, that's all you get.
Since when is Bioware in the habit of outright lying?
It's a MMORPG pretty much every plot/answer is going to boil down to a raid/fetch quest. Which...I guess happens in normal RPGs, but at least you don't have that jackass mage stealing all your sweet loots on your squad.
Same setting, same developers as the first one. Sounds as close to a sequel as we're going to get.
In fact the more I think of it, the question of it being the continuation of the KotR franchise isn't even a question at all. The only question is if it will do it well.
"Its a FPS, pretty much every level is going to have you getting the blue key for the blue door and the red key for the red door. Oh, and monster closets."
Genre's do evolve, you know. Whether TOR is the game that finally does it, who knows. But its Bioware, they are saying it will, and it is literally described as "this occurs x years after KotR I/II." I don't about anyone else, but as a guy who's played Bioware stuff since the first Baldur's Gate, I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt.
MMORPG's don't have to adhere to a single formula, y'know. And TOR is getting a lot of reputation for being the first plot-heavy, and well done in that regard, MMORPG. You might want to catch up.
Actually it looks like they've kind of short-circuited that; the Sith mooks in the cinematic trailer look like they're wearing Revan's mask.
Meh, I don't listen to PR speak much. I'll believe it when I see it.
There is no 'fetching' involved.
http://www.youtube.com/user/KotorMMO#p/u/8/Omq1ZNkDZyE
I was much older when KOTOR came out, but I remember as soon as I created my character, I was instantly swept back into my childhood. This was the game I had envisioned years ago. I didn't have a lot of patience for games by then. I never completed any RPGs, despite buying a lot of them. Even with its length, I breezed through KOTOR, and even played through it a second time before eventually moving onto something else. Looking back, it was probably the last of my unadulterated gaming experiences, before I took on more real world responsibilities and began to feel jaded and guilty about my hobby. This is probably why I could never get into KOTOR2.
I doubt if I played the game now, I'd feel the same way, but maybe I'll pick it up on Steam once I've cleared out my backlog. I'd love to try KOTOR2 again as well.
Then... go watch the video where they play through cinematic dialogue, Mass Effect style, as a Sith and proceed to go around defending the Imperial ship from Republic boarders?
There's... there's footage and people who've played the game. And that number is going to increase when the beta starts. o_O
Um, you can. There are numerous videos of in-game plots/quests/etc.
If you just want to sit in your preformed opinions rather than actually investigate what you're trying to talk about, I guess that's your choice.