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Canadian Politics: Proroguery Electric Boogaloo (with epic Harper evil picture in OP)

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Posts

  • CorporateGoonCorporateGoon Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    hawkbox wrote: »
    Imperfect wrote: »
    Narian wrote: »
    Imperfect wrote: »
    IMHO, he's far from finished. In fact, he's pretty close to solidifying his power and making some sweeping changes across Canada.

    Most depressing post of 2010.

    I'm so sorry.


    You should be. I want to cry now. And I am Albertan and live in oil country! I'm 720% more redneck than Decius and this still makes me nauseated.

    I wouldn't worry about it. In all likelihood, Harper will be gone before he can do much of anything. The Conservatives desperately want a majority, and Harper has never been in a position to get one. If he fails a third time, then a few months later he'll retire to "spend more time with his family". The smart money seems to be on a spring election, so I'm guessing we'll have a new PM in the late fall. He may seem invincible, but the Tories have been sharpening their knives since the 2008 election.

    CorporateGoon on
  • AzioAzio Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Are the libs ready to elect Justin Trudeau as party leader yet? It's the only way they will be getting more votes next election.

    who the fuck is justin trudeau and what qualifies him to lead a party

    Azio on
  • DeciusDecius Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Decius on
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  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Azio wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Are the libs ready to elect Justin Trudeau as party leader yet? It's the only way they will be getting more votes next election.

    who the fuck is justin trudeau and what qualifies him to lead a party

    The Saviour of the Liberal Party, the Lord reincarnate, come down from on High to restore Heaven upon earth (and Marshall Law upon Quebec). Surely you have heard of him.

    Aegis on
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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Well, he is the son of Go... I mean, Trudeau.

    shryke on
  • MeissnerdMeissnerd Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    He's no Obama.

    Meissnerd on
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  • RobmanRobman Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Meissnerd wrote: »
    He's no Obama.

    Yes he might be an actual leader of substance *rim shot*

    Robman on
  • Torso BoyTorso Boy Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Harper is doing okay in terms of popularity, but his chances of re-election are slim. Regardless of actual responsibility, any PM who presides over a recession loses the subsequent election (although this doesn't rule out later re-election- see King 1930, Trudeau 1979...but Harper is not that popular). That said, electoral politics in Canada has changed so much since Trudeau, and especially since 1993, that I wouldn't be shocked to see old trends totally disappear.

    Torso Boy on
    Rent wrote: »
    So that's what having no idea what you are talking about looks like
  • RobmanRobman Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Torso Boy wrote: »
    Harper is doing okay in terms of popularity, but his chances of re-election are slim. Regardless of actual responsibility, any PM who presides over a recession loses the subsequent election (although this doesn't rule out later re-election- see King 1930, Trudeau 1979...but Harper is not that popular). That said, electoral politics in Canada has changed so much since Trudeau, and especially since 1993, that I wouldn't be shocked to see old trends totally disappear.

    Harper is in a unique situation in Canadian history though, he's technically liable under war crimes, he's flaunting several international treaties right now, but he has no effective opposition and the Canadian populace are far more interested in the weather, their families, and how they're going to manage debt and work.

    Robman on
  • psyck0psyck0 Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    He's still ahead in the polls. The recession was not very bad (my general view is "what recession") and apathy seems to be at an all-time high. The opposition isn't even baying for blood because they are too busy being incompetent (well the NDP hasn't been incompetent in my eyes, but no one seems to think that they're an option).

    psyck0 on
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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Robman wrote: »
    Torso Boy wrote: »
    Harper is doing okay in terms of popularity, but his chances of re-election are slim. Regardless of actual responsibility, any PM who presides over a recession loses the subsequent election (although this doesn't rule out later re-election- see King 1930, Trudeau 1979...but Harper is not that popular). That said, electoral politics in Canada has changed so much since Trudeau, and especially since 1993, that I wouldn't be shocked to see old trends totally disappear.

    Harper is in a unique situation in Canadian history though, he's technically liable under war crimes, he's flaunting several international treaties right now, but he has no effective opposition and the Canadian populace are far more interested in the weather, their families, and how they're going to manage debt and work.

    Essentially, the voting public is apathetic and there's no popular alternative. Hence the continued election of minority governments.

    shryke on
  • psyck0psyck0 Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I think what the liberals need to do is get off their asses and start attacking like mad. Take a month, think of the topic, and just go to town on the conservatives for a single topic. They need to stop changing their target, though, because the public is just getting confused and thinking "wait, now this new thing? If the last one was so bad, why did they drop it? There's so many things they can't possibly all be true, I bet they're lying".

    Also, more coalition. And more Rae. I thought it was a coin-toss between Rae and Iggy for effective leadership but Iggy has proved generally incompetent. Rae has looked really good.

    psyck0 on
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  • RobmanRobman Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    psyck0 wrote: »
    I think what the liberals need to do is get off their asses and start attacking like mad. Take a month, think of the topic, and just go to town on the conservatives for a single topic. They need to stop changing their target, though, because the public is just getting confused and thinking "wait, now this new thing? If the last one was so bad, why did they drop it? There's so many things they can't possibly all be true, I bet they're lying".

    Also, more coalition. And more Rae. I thought it was a coin-toss between Rae and Iggy for effective leadership but Iggy has proved generally incompetent. Rae has looked really good.

    If the Liberals put Rae in the leadership position, they'll lose at least ten seats in Ontario to both the NDP and the CPC. At least.

    Robman on
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    The Liberals lack an effective leader, are still feeling the after-effects of their corruption while in power and are behaving stupidly on the attack.

    As an earlier article in this thread pointed out, they are basically going "Will this attack win an election on it's own? No? Well then we're ignoring it".

    shryke on
  • Torso BoyTorso Boy Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    He might be in a similar situation to Chrétien in 93, 97 and 2000, although less secure- essentially, he leads the only electable party.

    I love Bob Rae, but there are no second chances for major leadership. He'd be impossible to sell to Ontarian voters who remember the clusterfuck that was his administration. And voters are still confused by the idea of a politician switching parties.

    And Iggy is as telegenic as a bowl of wet hair.

    Maybe we can wear down all the major national parties so far that none of them will be able to win. I, for one, welcome Prime Minister Duceppe with open arms.

    Torso Boy on
    Rent wrote: »
    So that's what having no idea what you are talking about looks like
  • AzioAzio Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Aegis wrote: »
    Azio wrote: »
    Disco11 wrote: »
    Are the libs ready to elect Justin Trudeau as party leader yet? It's the only way they will be getting more votes next election.

    who the fuck is justin trudeau and what qualifies him to lead a party

    The Saviour of the Liberal Party, the Lord reincarnate, come down from on High to restore Heaven upon earth (and Marshall Law upon Quebec). Surely you have heard of him.
    that's pretty much michael ignatieff ca. 2008 so you can probably tell why I am leery of this whole "trudeau's son will use his genes to save the liberals and canada" business

    the guy is more like his mother anyway

    Azio on
  • hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Robman wrote: »
    psyck0 wrote: »
    I think what the liberals need to do is get off their asses and start attacking like mad. Take a month, think of the topic, and just go to town on the conservatives for a single topic. They need to stop changing their target, though, because the public is just getting confused and thinking "wait, now this new thing? If the last one was so bad, why did they drop it? There's so many things they can't possibly all be true, I bet they're lying".

    Also, more coalition. And more Rae. I thought it was a coin-toss between Rae and Iggy for effective leadership but Iggy has proved generally incompetent. Rae has looked really good.

    If the Liberals put Rae in the leadership position, they'll lose at least ten seats in Ontario to both the NDP and the CPC. At least.

    Why do you think that? Wouldn't he pull NDP and CPC votes and push votes towards the Conservatives? (I assume you're talking about his political history here...)

    hippofant on
  • psyck0psyck0 Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Rae was in charge of the biggest debacle in Ontario history for 50 years, maybe more. I didn't live there at the time, so I don't know how much was his fault exactly (he came into power at the shittiest of all possible timings when the economy absolutely tanked and tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs, eg. car-makers, were lost) but he is reviled. Still, I like him in the Liberal party- he's been really on the ball lately, saying all the right things, not making any gaffes (that I've heard of) and being a very intelligent leader. I know it's not realistic for him to take over, but I wish he would.

    I wish even more that Canadians would think of the NDP as a serious contender.

    So is the prorogation official? I can't really find confirmation- just articles from 5 days ago saying he is trying to. Although those articles sound like a fait accomplit, which is terribly depressing.

    psyck0 on
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  • hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Bob Rae came to speak at our school once in a large-ish classroom (I attended the same school as his daughter). Granted I was only in high school then, but he seemed pretty intelligent and on the ball about a lot of things.

    hippofant on
  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Man, we need a cult of personality candidate to show up. Basically, we need a Canadian Obama to get people interested in Canadian politics again.

    Nova_C on
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Nova_C wrote: »
    Man, we need a cult of personality candidate to show up. Basically, we need a Canadian Obama to get people interested in Canadian politics again.

    Well, we currently have Canadian Bush, so I'm hoping the trend of being a few years behind the US continues.

    shryke on
  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    psyck0 wrote: »
    So is the prorogation official? I can't really find confirmation- just articles from 5 days ago saying he is trying to. Although those articles sound like a fait accomplit, which is terribly depressing.
    Aegis wrote: »
    Well it's official now.

    Yup.

    Aegis on
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  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Nova_C wrote: »
    Man, we need a cult of personality candidate to show up. Basically, we need a Canadian Obama to get people interested in Canadian politics again.

    I think it would be fairly easy to do, especially if they played up the Canadian Unity card in the right ways, like Obama played up the bipartisan card. Then it would be a matter of ignoring regionally divisive issues like Obama ignored the racially dividing issues.

    Gnome-Interruptus on
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  • ImperfectImperfect Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    psyck0 wrote: »
    Rae was in charge of the biggest debacle in Ontario history for 50 years, maybe more. I didn't live there at the time, so I don't know how much was his fault exactly (he came into power at the shittiest of all possible timings when the economy absolutely tanked and tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs, eg. car-makers, were lost) but he is reviled. Still, I like him in the Liberal party- he's been really on the ball lately, saying all the right things, not making any gaffes (that I've heard of) and being a very intelligent leader. I know it's not realistic for him to take over, but I wish he would.

    Rae Days

    That is why he won't be able to run for PM right there.

    Imperfect on
  • hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Imperfect wrote: »
    psyck0 wrote: »
    Rae was in charge of the biggest debacle in Ontario history for 50 years, maybe more. I didn't live there at the time, so I don't know how much was his fault exactly (he came into power at the shittiest of all possible timings when the economy absolutely tanked and tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs, eg. car-makers, were lost) but he is reviled. Still, I like him in the Liberal party- he's been really on the ball lately, saying all the right things, not making any gaffes (that I've heard of) and being a very intelligent leader. I know it's not realistic for him to take over, but I wish he would.

    Rae Days

    That is why he won't be able to run for PM right there.

    I don't get why there's so much anger towards Rae, but not Harris. Or just, in general, why anything negative the NDP does seems to stick to them, but washes off the PCs/Conservatives.

    hippofant on
  • Edith_Bagot-DixEdith_Bagot-Dix Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    hippofant wrote: »
    Imperfect wrote: »
    psyck0 wrote: »
    Rae was in charge of the biggest debacle in Ontario history for 50 years, maybe more. I didn't live there at the time, so I don't know how much was his fault exactly (he came into power at the shittiest of all possible timings when the economy absolutely tanked and tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs, eg. car-makers, were lost) but he is reviled. Still, I like him in the Liberal party- he's been really on the ball lately, saying all the right things, not making any gaffes (that I've heard of) and being a very intelligent leader. I know it's not realistic for him to take over, but I wish he would.

    Rae Days

    That is why he won't be able to run for PM right there.

    I don't get why there's so much anger towards Rae, but not Harris. Or just, in general, why anything negative the NDP does seems to stick to them, but washes off the PCs/Conservatives.

    The better established parties get a pass, really. Both the Tories and the Liberals have had leaders who have fucked up better circumstances than Rae had in worse ways than Rae did. Unfortunately for Rae and the NDP, he held what was arguably the highest office the NDP has ever been elected to and the results were less than stellar, whereas all the disappointing Liberal and Tory politicians can benefit both from the anonymity afforded by the company of their lackluster peers and the reflected glory of their betters.

    Edith_Bagot-Dix on


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  • ImperfectImperfect Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    hippofant wrote: »
    Imperfect wrote: »
    psyck0 wrote: »
    Rae was in charge of the biggest debacle in Ontario history for 50 years, maybe more. I didn't live there at the time, so I don't know how much was his fault exactly (he came into power at the shittiest of all possible timings when the economy absolutely tanked and tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs, eg. car-makers, were lost) but he is reviled. Still, I like him in the Liberal party- he's been really on the ball lately, saying all the right things, not making any gaffes (that I've heard of) and being a very intelligent leader. I know it's not realistic for him to take over, but I wish he would.

    Rae Days

    That is why he won't be able to run for PM right there.

    I don't get why there's so much anger towards Rae, but not Harris. Or just, in general, why anything negative the NDP does seems to stick to them, but washes off the PCs/Conservatives.

    Dude, he fucked with the UNIONS.

    Regular joe Canadians have a super-short memories, but union members remember FOREVER.

    I have a friend whose father's union lost six days of work to some NDP nonsense FOREVER ago and my friend won't vote for any NDP party, whether Provincial or Federal. UNIONS.

    Imperfect on
  • Disco11Disco11 Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    psyck0 wrote: »

    I wish even more that Canadians would think of the NDP as a serious contender.

    Well, first of they would have to act like a contender. In any election they act like they know they won't be in power but will act like they will have the balance of power. No one wants to vote for a guy that doesn't think he can win but is happy with second place.

    Disco11 on
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  • RichyRichy Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Richy on
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  • Catullus 16Catullus 16 Registered User
    edited January 2010
    This is the most depressing thread I have ever seen. When I clicked on page one this morning I didn't know very much about my country's politics, and now I know quite a bit more and I hate it all.

    Thanks, Richy, for providing some evidence that Canadians might be done taking shit from Prime Minister Palpatine.

    Catullus 16 on
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  • CanadianWolverineCanadianWolverine Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    My MP's office worker / aide returned a call and left a message:
    "Hello, uh, Mr. Randall. Its Susan Wilkinson phoning you from Jean Crowder's office. You left a message for us over the holidays and, um, we're back up and running again. So I'm phoning you to say thank you for doing that. Um, I, Jean, totally agrees with the tone and intent of your message. Um, I don't believe that they, uh, are going to go seat in their seats even though that would be brilliant ... move, um, but yes it's undemocratic and, you know, not a very good thing that's happening and they're working on some other stuff in the background. So, anyway, please give us a call if you would like to speak on the issue a bit more, um, our hours are tuesdays through fridays between 10 and 3 in the afternoon and if we are already on the line we will call you back as soon as we can. Take care and thanks for calling." January 4, 2010 at 12:05 PM

    Any advice on what I should talk with them about when I call back? I really don't want to come off raving mad lunatic, just PO'd even more than usual with the PMO and gov.

    Also, I big time encourage everyone with even an inclination of sense to phone up their MP and give them an earful about telling the PMO to shove this prorogue shit (and the accompanying baggage they are trying to dump with it) where the sun don't shine. We can do more than just vote, democracy happens even when we don't just go or not to put an X beside a name.

    Also, check out the Facebook group that was mentioned in Richy's linked article, 50 thousand FB names signed up so far in just a few days since the prorogue happened again. Protests are apparently being planned, to hopefully raise awareness of this BS. I encourage others to also join that if they are into the FB group thing and pissed at this ... even if you don't there is a letter you can copy paste to your email and/or print off to send into your MP and the various ministers.

    That's about all the impotent rage I can come up with so far, impotent as in we Canadians don't try to put down our PMs by force, right? We don't do so well with the whole rebellion thing if I recall correctly some vague history.

    CanadianWolverine on
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  • ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    If Canada wins the gold at the WJHC, odds that the Conservatives will attempt to issue a congratulatory statement or whatever those are called in a representative government that somehow gives credit to Stephen Harper when Parliament resumes?

    EDIT: ...he said, thereby cursing the team.

    Shadowen on
  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Thanks alot.

    Nova_C on
  • TrusTrus Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Shadowen wrote: »
    If Canada wins the gold at the WJHC, odds that the Conservatives will attempt to issue a congratulatory statement or whatever those are called in a representative government that somehow gives credit to Stephen Harper when Parliament resumes?

    EDIT: ...he said, thereby cursing the team.

    Get out of my country

    Trus on
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  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    This is all Shadowen's fault. :(

    Nova_C on
  • ImperfectImperfect Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Shadowen wrote: »
    If Canada wins the gold at the WJHC, odds that the Conservatives will attempt to issue a congratulatory statement or whatever those are called in a representative government that somehow gives credit to Stephen Harper when Parliament resumes?

    EDIT: ...he said, thereby cursing the team.

    WHAT THE FUCK MAN WHAT THE FUCK

    Imperfect on
  • ShadowenShadowen Snores in the morning Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I am ashamed.

    I'd commit seppuku, but that would make me weeaboo.

    I'll just go drink some beers and sit in the car with a tube attached to the exhaust pipe leading into the window, eh?

    Shadowen on
  • MeissnerdMeissnerd Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I'd call my MP, but that's Laurrie Hawn. :l

    Meissnerd on
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  • AegisAegis Not Quite TorontoRegistered User regular
    edited January 2010
    Honest question to any Albertans as I saw this in the paper today, remembered hearing about the party in this thread, and am honestly curious:

    2 Alberta MLAs join upstart Wildrose party

    Is this just an isolated thing or is there more going on in Alberta provincial politics (though I do note that the article does mention there's still like a 80% PC majority in the province)?

    Aegis on
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  • AzioAzio Registered User regular
    edited January 2010
    I think I figured out who's been posting all those insane right-wing news comments.

    o0tsnq.png

    Here he is choking a small child.

    bef23m.jpg

    Azio on
This discussion has been closed.