Unfair comparison! The chimps who ate people's faces weren't domesticated. I don't believe there are any domesticated species of primates though of course the slow lori is
Slow loris are awesome until you read about how they are obtained to be pets and how persons catch them, pull out their teeth with pliars, and then do generally unpleasant things to them.
It's really hard to have a language without an artificially huge consensus of communication. There is no reason why dolphins born hundreds of miles from eachother would have anything to talk about before they meet.
Paladin on
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
It's really hard to have a language without an artificially huge consensus of communication. There is no reason why dolphins born hundreds of miles from eachother would have anything to talk about before they meet.
Whoa there.
That's not really the best articulation of language theory.
So Slow Loris are only 'slow' because they've had their spirits thoroughly broken and have resigned themselves to a slow hopeless death in confinement?
So Slow Loris are only 'slow' because they've had their spirits thoroughly broken and have resigned themselves to a slow hopeless death in confinement?
Basically.
They catch them pull out their teeth with pliars, cut out their venom sacks, and then stuff them into a box and ship them to be sold.
And people be all "aww...that's adorable. I wants one!"
Which seems to entirely ignore the whole pliars thing.
Edit: Also ignores that they naturally come equipped with venom.
It's really hard to have a language without an artificially huge consensus of communication. There is no reason why dolphins born hundreds of miles from eachother would have anything to talk about before they meet.
I'm pretty sure whales can (could, before we invented heavy shipping) carry on "conversations" slowly across thousands of miles of water. At any given time one individual would be in contact with many others, even for asocial whales. And dolphins meet in groups of hundreds or even thousands, which seems to put them on at least equal footing with early humans in that area.
[Edit: I don't think "asocial" is the right word for this, but I think the meaning is clear. Maybe "less social" or whatever; I'm talking about the species that spend most of their lives alone.]
Slow loris are awesome until you read about how they are obtained to be pets and how persons catch them, pull out their teeth with pliars, and then do generally unpleasant things to them.
Slow loris are awesome until you read about how they are obtained to be pets and how persons catch them, pull out their teeth with pliars, and then do generally unpleasant things to them.
Noooooo!
Not the slow loris in the video, right?
Totally the slow loris in that video.
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Tiger BurningDig if you will, the pictureRegistered User, SolidSaints Tuberegular
A terrible joke but also kinda what happens when you treat godless killing machines like tamagachis.
Breaking News! Killer Whale Tries to Kill! Everyone Shocked!
I first heard the news on the radio, and when they gave the whale's name, "Tilly", I thought that they said, "Killy". Like, "Killy the Killer Whale". I was very disappointed when I discovered my error.
A terrible joke but also kinda what happens when you treat godless killing machines like tamagachis.
Breaking News! Killer Whale Tries to Kill! Everyone Shocked!
I first heard the news on the radio, and when they gave the whale's name, "Tilly", I thought that they said, "Killy". Like, "Killy the Killer Whale". I was very disappointed when I discovered my error.
Yeah. I am glad the whale was too valueable to be put down.
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JuliusCaptain of Serenityon my shipRegistered Userregular
I think about this question all the time with my cat, because I love him more than all the jewels beneath the earth, and I worry that I am depriving him—via domestication—of a life he would rather live in the wild.
Your cat wouldn't rather want to live in the wild. Seriously, that's why he comes back every time. It's like "man hell yeah i gets food i don't have to hunt for and mad cozy places to sleep".
I think about this question all the time with my cat, because I love him more than all the jewels beneath the earth, and I worry that I am depriving him—via domestication—of a life he would rather live in the wild.
Your cat wouldn't rather want to live in the wild. Seriously, that's why he comes back every time. It's like "man hell yeah i gets food i don't have to hunt for and mad cozy places to sleep".
Why not do the same with bears? And lions? And panthers, and other great beasts of legend that are endangered? Who wouldn't love a snow leopard as a pet?
Assuming a future where genetic engineering allows us to do this with little danger to either humans or beasts, would you be in favor?
Animal ethics is crazy as a result of the sorts of ontologies persons create while articulating what one ought or ought not do with a particular animal. So, with regard to domesticating animals...basically I think all sides are nuts, given how crazy the arguments are on both sides.
My argument is that I prefer to not be tiger lunch. Or dinner, I guess.
Why not do the same with bears? And lions? And panthers, and other great beasts of legend that are endangered? Who wouldn't love a snow leopard as a pet?
Assuming a future where genetic engineering allows us to do this with little danger to either humans or beasts, would you be in favor?
Animal ethics is crazy as a result of the sorts of ontologies persons create while articulating what one ought or ought not do with a particular animal. So, with regard to domesticating animals...basically I think all sides are nuts, given how crazy the arguments are on both sides.
My argument is that I prefer to not be tiger lunch. Or dinner, I guess.
So if someone prefers to fuck sheep, they are permitted to fuck sheep.
Why not do the same with bears? And lions? And panthers, and other great beasts of legend that are endangered? Who wouldn't love a snow leopard as a pet?
Assuming a future where genetic engineering allows us to do this with little danger to either humans or beasts, would you be in favor?
Animal ethics is crazy as a result of the sorts of ontologies persons create while articulating what one ought or ought not do with a particular animal. So, with regard to domesticating animals...basically I think all sides are nuts, given how crazy the arguments are on both sides.
My argument is that I prefer to not be tiger lunch. Or dinner, I guess.
So if someone prefers to fuck sheep, they are permitted to fuck sheep.
I don't feel it has much to do with this, or me being eaten.
I think the comparison to the domestication of dogs is great, because people are (too often) horrible dog owners. Just imagine translating dog ownership habits to tiger owning habits... yeah, that sounds great.
This program would need to be accompanied by mandatory killing of bad pet owners; also mandatory abortions for non-intelligent non-empathetic parents while we're at it.
Edit: to respond more seriously, can't you make the same argument against bad parents? Isn't it basically the same problem? A poorly-raised child can also be quite dangerous.
Babies are: necessary to society.
Restricting their makings: a logistical/privacy nightmare, and brings up ze old problems of racism/sexism/'ism.
I think the comparison to the domestication of dogs is great, because people are (too often) horrible dog owners. Just imagine translating dog ownership habits to tiger owning habits... yeah, that sounds great.
This program would need to be accompanied by mandatory killing of bad pet owners; also mandatory abortions for non-intelligent non-empathetic parents while we're at it.
Edit: to respond more seriously, can't you make the same argument against bad parents? Isn't it basically the same problem? A poorly-raised child can also be quite dangerous.
Babies are: necessary to society.
Restricting their makings: a logistical/privacy nightmare, and brings up ze old problems of racism/sexism/'ism.
Tiger pets: Just cool.
It's only a problem for the people who are told they can't reproduce.
Non-domesticated existence demonstrably sucks in a huge number of ways. Also, wild animals are often subject to power relationships/dominance hierarchies in which they are subjugated to a greater extent than most human pet owners subjugate their pets.
Calling non-domesticated existence "freedom" is more than a little bit loaded and inaccurate.
How so?
Perhaps it would help if you defined what you meant by "freedom."
Not being captive.
Do you think humans who spend most of their lives indoors in cities are "captive"?
Yes. If you're in a city and you don't go to a park or a nice restaurant once in a while you will go insane
Paladin on
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Have we domesticated any asocial predators before? I can't think of any off the top of my head. I suspect it'd be extremely hard to get anything resembling "domestication" from a bear. Lions, maybe... eh, I don't really know.
"Asocial" meaning non-pack predators?
Cats and ferrets.
That's it. For the entirety of human existence.
Two.
And cats only sort of count.
So barring some use of applied phlogiston to domesticate lions, tigers and bears* via magic, I doubt it's going to happen anytime ever.
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
At our old homestead, cats and dogs were outside unless specifically brought inside for some reason. They were also fed regularly, taken care of medically, got to go on rides when we felt like it and even watch the occasional baseball game in town. I mean, we basically run a socialist state with a population of 3 dogs and 4 cats.
Are those animals more or less free than a feral version of the same species would be?
Posts
Slow loris are awesome until you read about how they are obtained to be pets and how persons catch them, pull out their teeth with pliars, and then do generally unpleasant things to them.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Whoa there.
That's not really the best articulation of language theory.
Fantastic idea.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Basically.
They catch them pull out their teeth with pliars, cut out their venom sacks, and then stuff them into a box and ship them to be sold.
And people be all "aww...that's adorable. I wants one!"
Which seems to entirely ignore the whole pliars thing.
Edit: Also ignores that they naturally come equipped with venom.
[Edit: I don't think "asocial" is the right word for this, but I think the meaning is clear. Maybe "less social" or whatever; I'm talking about the species that spend most of their lives alone.]
Not the slow loris in the video, right?
Totally the slow loris in that video.
I first heard the news on the radio, and when they gave the whale's name, "Tilly", I thought that they said, "Killy". Like, "Killy the Killer Whale". I was very disappointed when I discovered my error.
Yeah. I am glad the whale was too valueable to be put down.
Your cat wouldn't rather want to live in the wild. Seriously, that's why he comes back every time. It's like "man hell yeah i gets food i don't have to hunt for and mad cozy places to sleep".
Yeah. Freedom sucks.
My argument is that I prefer to not be tiger lunch. Or dinner, I guess.
So if someone prefers to fuck sheep, they are permitted to fuck sheep.
I don't feel it has much to do with this, or me being eaten.
Babies are: necessary to society.
Restricting their makings: a logistical/privacy nightmare, and brings up ze old problems of racism/sexism/'ism.
Tiger pets: Just cool.
It's only a problem for the people who are told they can't reproduce.
And their kind will not be around for long.
How so?
Not being captive.
I'm not sure "free" really applies to a creature with a cat's level of self-determination.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Non-domesticated existence demonstrably sucks in a huge number of ways. Also, wild animals are often subject to power relationships/dominance hierarchies in which they are subjugated to a greater extent than most human pet owners subjugate their pets.
Yes. If you're in a city and you don't go to a park or a nice restaurant once in a while you will go insane
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
My cat is an indoor-outdoor cat. If she wanted to leave, she could.
That's probably because you don't want it get run over by a car, as opposed to feeling like an evil captor.
Intent matters.
They would open on the way out, but not on the way back in (as in, they might fire him).
"Asocial" meaning non-pack predators?
Cats and ferrets.
That's it. For the entirety of human existence.
Two.
And cats only sort of count.
So barring some use of applied phlogiston to domesticate lions, tigers and bears* via magic, I doubt it's going to happen anytime ever.
*Oh my.
He doesn't know that.
that you eat
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Are those animals more or less free than a feral version of the same species would be?
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.