To play devils advocate, when you get on welfare here in Oklahoma they have something called 'section 8'.
Basically what it is, is 'free' houses, furnished with all appliances you need (save for microwave). Then on top of the section 8, most of the welfare folks houses I've been to were getting roughly $800 - $1000 a month.
Now utilities usually run about $300 (gas, water, electricity, etc) which leaves $700 of 'playing around' money each month.
That is a lot of playing around money. And before anyone jumps in with, "But food and cars."
The people I've talked to had their food (not all of the food, but most of it) and cars paid for.
So these people are sitting around getting $700 a month (plus an extra $250 for each kid) and living with their 'baby daddy' so that they don't have to file as married (thus reducing the amount gained). THAT isn't right.
And most of these people tear these houses UP! I mean, I would install a stove and have to come back days later because they were too stupid to push the knob IN and THEN turn it, so they just busted the thermostat, which they then didn't have to pay for, but the landlord did.
Oh and these houses have to be in good shape when they get them, but they can tear them up to their hearts content with no repercussions. That's right, they rip the doors off, punch holes in the wall, break knobs and then move out after 12 months (how long the section 8 contract is good for, per house) and move into another house that has to be pristine, so they can tear that one up too.
So don't fool yourself, living on welfare isn't as crappy as some of you guys are making it outto be.
Seriously. This one guy I knew knew this guy in Rhode Island who knew this other guy in Nebraska who told him that his friend had a cousin in law in Mississippi on welfare who would get all his basic expenses paid (including a Ferrari), $3000 a month just to spend on hookers and blow, plus stock options!
Living off the ever abundant American welfare state really is the way to go.
To play devils advocate, when you get on welfare here in Oklahoma they have something called 'section 8'.
Basically what it is, is 'free' houses, furnished with all appliances you need (save for microwave). Then on top of the section 8, most of the welfare folks houses I've been to were getting roughly $800 - $1000 a month.
Now utilities usually run about $300 (gas, water, electricity, etc) which leaves $700 of 'playing around' money each month.
That is a lot of playing around money. And before anyone jumps in with, "But food and cars."
The people I've talked to had their food (not all of the food, but most of it) and cars paid for.
So these people are sitting around getting $700 a month (plus an extra $250 for each kid) and living with their 'baby daddy' so that they don't have to file as married (thus reducing the amount gained). THAT isn't right.
And most of these people tear these houses UP! I mean, I would install a stove and have to come back days later because they were too stupid to push the knob IN and THEN turn it, so they just busted the thermostat, which they then didn't have to pay for, but the landlord did.
Oh and these houses have to be in good shape when they get them, but they can tear them up to their hearts content with no repercussions. That's right, they rip the doors off, punch holes in the wall, break knobs and then move out after 12 months (how long the section 8 contract is good for, per house) and move into another house that has to be pristine, so they can tear that one up too.
So don't fool yourself, living on welfare isn't as crappy as some of you guys are making it outto be.
Seriously. This one guy I knew knew this guy in Rhode Island who knew this other guy in Nebraska who told him that his friend had a cousin in law in Mississippi on welfare who would get all his basic expenses paid (including a Ferrari), $3000 a month just to spend on hookers and blow, plus stock options!
Living off the ever abundant American welfare state really is the way to go.
Yeah, too bad I'm quoting from first hand experience as I worked on the appliances. My cousin is also one of my references as she is one of the fat lazy bums that got a free car, paid for house, food stamps and over $1000 a month. As she put it, "Why the hell would I want to get a job, I make more not having one."
Seriously though, I know a woman who keeps having kids to get more benefits. She intentionally misses payments to get more benefits. It happens.
When I worked at Legal Services I helped a bunch of terrible people, people who "couldn't afford" their $40/month Section 8 rent because they had just bought a new car.
When I worked at a convenience store in a poor town women would come in all the time and buy $15 worth of candy bars with EBT, and then buy a ton of lottery tickets and cigarettes. So yeah, there needs to be better policing of the system.
Since when can you buy candy bars with EBT? I've tried it, it doesn't work
To play devils advocate, when you get on welfare here in Oklahoma they have something called 'section 8'.
Basically what it is, is 'free' houses, furnished with all appliances you need (save for microwave). Then on top of the section 8, most of the welfare folks houses I've been to were getting roughly $800 - $1000 a month.
Now utilities usually run about $300 (gas, water, electricity, etc) which leaves $700 of 'playing around' money each month.
That is a lot of playing around money. And before anyone jumps in with, "But food and cars."
The people I've talked to had their food (not all of the food, but most of it) and cars paid for.
So these people are sitting around getting $700 a month (plus an extra $250 for each kid) and living with their 'baby daddy' so that they don't have to file as married (thus reducing the amount gained). THAT isn't right.
And most of these people tear these houses UP! I mean, I would install a stove and have to come back days later because they were too stupid to push the knob IN and THEN turn it, so they just busted the thermostat, which they then didn't have to pay for, but the landlord did.
Oh and these houses have to be in good shape when they get them, but they can tear them up to their hearts content with no repercussions. That's right, they rip the doors off, punch holes in the wall, break knobs and then move out after 12 months (how long the section 8 contract is good for, per house) and move into another house that has to be pristine, so they can tear that one up too.
So don't fool yourself, living on welfare isn't as crappy as some of you guys are making it outto be.
Seriously. This one guy I knew knew this guy in Rhode Island who knew this other guy in Nebraska who told him that his friend had a cousin in law in Mississippi on welfare who would get all his basic expenses paid (including a Ferrari), $3000 a month just to spend on hookers and blow, plus stock options!
Living off the ever abundant American welfare state really is the way to go.
Yeah, too bad I'm quoting from first hand experience as I worked on the appliances. My cousin is also one of my references as she is one of the fat lazy bums that got a free car, paid for house, food stamps and over $1000 a month. As she put it, "Why the hell would I want to get a job, I make more not having one."
I don't get why you'd care (beyond the illegality of fraud). It's not like my goal in life is to pull in as much as I can per month for as little work as I can. So long as these people aren't applying to grad school, they aren't competing with me.
Oklahoma also has pretty generous welfare for $1000/month for an individual, that's $400/month more than wisconsin's and you have to have a kid here to even qualify (assuming the story is 100% accurate)
I pay $5/month by going in with my dad, brother, and mom on a family plan. And welfare is absolute hell. You go on it when you need it then realize how painful it is living on so little, so you get out ASAP.
It's not sustainable unless you find an extreme aesthetic lifestyle enjoyable.
Ascetic, but yeah, that's true. Welfare/unemployment is not an enjoyable program to be on.
I pay $5/month by going in with my dad, brother, and mom on a family plan. And welfare is absolute hell. You go on it when you need it then realize how painful it is living on so little, so you get out ASAP.
It's not sustainable unless you find an extreme aesthetic lifestyle enjoyable.
Ascetic, but yeah, that's true. Welfare/unemployment is not an enjoyable program to be on.
I wasn't sure, and Google wasn't being any sort of help.
To play devils advocate, when you get on welfare here in Oklahoma they have something called 'section 8'.
Basically what it is, is 'free' houses, furnished with all appliances you need (save for microwave). Then on top of the section 8, most of the welfare folks houses I've been to were getting roughly $800 - $1000 a month.
Now utilities usually run about $300 (gas, water, electricity, etc) which leaves $700 of 'playing around' money each month.
That is a lot of playing around money. And before anyone jumps in with, "But food and cars."
The people I've talked to had their food (not all of the food, but most of it) and cars paid for.
So these people are sitting around getting $700 a month (plus an extra $250 for each kid) and living with their 'baby daddy' so that they don't have to file as married (thus reducing the amount gained). THAT isn't right.
And most of these people tear these houses UP! I mean, I would install a stove and have to come back days later because they were too stupid to push the knob IN and THEN turn it, so they just busted the thermostat, which they then didn't have to pay for, but the landlord did.
Oh and these houses have to be in good shape when they get them, but they can tear them up to their hearts content with no repercussions. That's right, they rip the doors off, punch holes in the wall, break knobs and then move out after 12 months (how long the section 8 contract is good for, per house) and move into another house that has to be pristine, so they can tear that one up too.
So don't fool yourself, living on welfare isn't as crappy as some of you guys are making it outto be.
Seriously. This one guy I knew knew this guy in Rhode Island who knew this other guy in Nebraska who told him that his friend had a cousin in law in Mississippi on welfare who would get all his basic expenses paid (including a Ferrari), $3000 a month just to spend on hookers and blow, plus stock options!
Living off the ever abundant American welfare state really is the way to go.
Yeah, too bad I'm quoting from first hand experience as I worked on the appliances. My cousin is also one of my references as she is one of the fat lazy bums that got a free car, paid for house, food stamps and over $1000 a month. As she put it, "Why the hell would I want to get a job, I make more not having one."
Oh, well, if a guy on the internet is saying it, it must be true.
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Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited April 2010
Sorry, been away working all day.
Gonna need citations if you want to argue something weird.
I personally believe it when I hear that the fraud rate is low, but I can't combat ignorance without some statistics. And there is a lot of ignorance around here, myself included.
My co-worked got a chain E-Mail today saying that all "real Americans" should refuse the new dollar coin that they are stamping. When she showed it to me my response was unflattering. This is the kind of thing I have to try to batter past with such feeble weapons as logic and reason.
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I don't get why you'd care (beyond the illegality of fraud). It's not like my goal in life is to pull in as much as I can per month for as little work as I can. So long as these people aren't applying to grad school, they aren't competing with me.
Welfare queens might not be the best people, but they aren't the worst ... graduate students are the worst. From 30 Rock
To play devils advocate, when you get on welfare here in Oklahoma they have something called 'section 8'.
Basically what it is, is 'free' houses, furnished with all appliances you need (save for microwave). Then on top of the section 8, most of the welfare folks houses I've been to were getting roughly $800 - $1000 a month.
Now utilities usually run about $300 (gas, water, electricity, etc) which leaves $700 of 'playing around' money each month.
That is a lot of playing around money. And before anyone jumps in with, "But food and cars."
The people I've talked to had their food (not all of the food, but most of it) and cars paid for.
So these people are sitting around getting $700 a month (plus an extra $250 for each kid) and living with their 'baby daddy' so that they don't have to file as married (thus reducing the amount gained). THAT isn't right.
And most of these people tear these houses UP! I mean, I would install a stove and have to come back days later because they were too stupid to push the knob IN and THEN turn it, so they just busted the thermostat, which they then didn't have to pay for, but the landlord did.
Oh and these houses have to be in good shape when they get them, but they can tear them up to their hearts content with no repercussions. That's right, they rip the doors off, punch holes in the wall, break knobs and then move out after 12 months (how long the section 8 contract is good for, per house) and move into another house that has to be pristine, so they can tear that one up too.
So don't fool yourself, living on welfare isn't as crappy as some of you guys are making it out to be.
I knew a guy who was livin' large on welfare. He skirted jobs at every opportunity, would apply all over the place, but make sure he was undesirable at all costs. Always wore nice new clothes, drove a fairly nice car.
Today he's still living off the government, but in much worse conditions over all I'd say. Apparently the feds frown on you when they find out you've been collecting welfare checks as well as selling drugs. They set him up with a nice little room though, and he always gets fed, & still doesn't have a job, so he's probably happy.
Other than that one example though, most of the people I've known on welfare had shit living standards, and nearly never anything new. THere was one family when I was growing up though, that had a really nice house, kids always had nice new shiny things etc, and the mom was on "permanent disability", not sure how much more/less money that gets from the government, but I couldn't figure out how they did it. Looking back now though, I think the mom may have also been a prostitute.
EWom on
Whether they find a life there or not, I think Jupiter should be called an enemy planet.
I knew a guy who was livin' large on welfare. He skirted jobs at every opportunity, would apply all over the place, but make sure he was undesirable at all costs. Always wore nice new clothes, drove a fairly nice car.
Today he's still living off the government, but in much worse conditions over all I'd say. Apparently the feds frown on you when they find out you've been collecting welfare checks as well as selling drugs. They set him up with a nice little room though, and he always gets fed, & still doesn't have a job, so he's probably happy.
Other than that one example though, most of the people I've known on welfare had shit living standards, and nearly never anything new. THere was one family when I was growing up though, that had a really nice house, kids always had nice new shiny things etc, and the mom was on "permanent disability", not sure how much more/less money that gets from the government, but I couldn't figure out how they did it. Looking back now though, I think the mom may have also been a prostitute.
And I just remember i used to hang out with that kid (hell he was one of the first kids to get a sega in the neighborhood). I say the mom might be a prostitute now, based entirely off the fact that there were quite often different dudes at her house when we'd go over to play sega, just a totally random thought that popped into my head 20 some years later
As for the other guy he got busted with a large amount of cocaine, weed, and small amount of meth IIRC. All I remember thinking is the world is probably better off with him in prison, than out.. he wasn't a very good type of person.
EWom on
Whether they find a life there or not, I think Jupiter should be called an enemy planet.
Here are the groups eligible for welfare in Montana
* Minor children;
* Certain relatives with whom minor children are living, including siblings;
* Women in their last trimester of pregnancy who have no other eligible children; and
* Refugees with minor dependent children.
So the guy living large on the government told the HHS of the state that he's a pregnant migrant or something? I mean really how come all of these anecdotes of welfare queens people have are totally inconsistent with either the listed benefit amounts, eligibility, or both?
Here are the groups eligible for welfare in Montana
* Minor children;
* Certain relatives with whom minor children are living, including siblings;
* Women in their last trimester of pregnancy who have no other eligible children; and
* Refugees with minor dependent children.
So the guy living large on the government told the HHS of the state that he's a pregnant migrant or something? I mean really how come all of these anecdotes of welfare queens people have are totally inconsistent with either the listed benefit amounts, eligibility, or both?
I know he had a "baby momma" I said I knew the guy, not that I did his finances personaly, and I know he got his groceries from a EBT card for a fact (I checked him and his "baby mama" out while working at a grocery store a few years back). Its quite possible he was living off his "baby momma" welfare checks(well... welfare debit) in addition to his drug selling.
My point isn't that people make it "livin' large on welfare" its that people on welfare may have other sources of income. I've personally known one person who ran an auto repair shop out of their own garage, illegally and would only take cash payment. They made a shit load of money in addition to their real mechanic job where they were properly taxed. They've long since moved out of state, and I have no idea how they are living now, but the point remains, people can make money and have the government not know about it for a long damn time, and just because they're on some sort of government assistance doesn't mean that's the only money they get.
Whether its whoring, selling drugs, or fixing peoples computers for cheap "as a friend" tons of people make money on the side. Fuck I've been offered a 10$/hour job "under the table" walking by small landscaping outfit that was doing some work and needed extra help before.
The other day a kid was going around town passing out flyers doorstep to doorstep, offering complete computer diagnostics, spyware and malware removal, for a flat 20$ per computer. I'm guessing he didn't have a business license and doesn't report all the money he makes to the government to be taxed, and hell he might even do pretty well. Maybe better than all the other kids trying to mow and rake peoples lawns.
EWom on
Whether they find a life there or not, I think Jupiter should be called an enemy planet.
Here are the groups eligible for welfare in Montana
* Minor children;
* Certain relatives with whom minor children are living, including siblings;
* Women in their last trimester of pregnancy who have no other eligible children; and
* Refugees with minor dependent children.
So the guy living large on the government told the HHS of the state that he's a pregnant migrant or something? I mean really how come all of these anecdotes of welfare queens people have are totally inconsistent with either the listed benefit amounts, eligibility, or both?
Well there's always gonna be a few people that slip the cracks in the system, especially when the system is run by overworked bureaucrats. There was also a case where a 106 year old woman got a letter telling her she need to start attending kindergarten, but it's not like that's the standard either.
If you're really living like a queen you're either
1) Not on fucking welfare, because around here it tops out at $750 a month
or
2) Committing fucking fraud
I never understand why people bitch about this - if you masses of people could live the good life on welfare without giving up shit, they'd do it. That simple. Living in luxury for doing nothing, legitimately? Sweet, where do we sign up? You know why they don't actually quit their jobs and get on the welfare rolls ASAP? Because you have to be poor as dirt to get it, after which you remain poor as dirt but are now mandated to spend 40 hrs/wk in retraining/remedial job skills/basic ed/other qualifying activities or else have your benefits summarily yanked.
This. About the only way to "live large" on welfare is to make cash on the side and not report it. Which is, you know, illegal. And in this case, I wholly support the "if you see something, say something" mentality.
Instead of using the term "unemployment" you should use therm "suckling at the goverment teat" when you reference her husband. Ask her if he's planning to keep his cell phone. Or their nice house/ apartment/ condo. You know that they have projects for those people?
Everyone seems to think that government support is evil and wasteful until it's them that need a hand up.
As mentioned, cellphones are no longer a luxury. Nor are they particularly expensive. And people also flip out when people on Section 8, WIC, etc. have "new" cars, completely ignoring the fact that a cheaper new car (or newer used car) can wind up costing no more than a used piece of shit, on a monthly basis...as I've learned since buying my first used car that's still under warranty.
I mean yeah, I pay $170 a month in car payments. But that's it. Whereas with my truck most years I'd wind up spending $1500 (or more!) on repairs, and at irregular intervals.
Seriously though, I know a woman who keeps having kids to get more benefits. She intentionally misses payments to get more benefits. It happens.
When I worked at Legal Services I helped a bunch of terrible people, people who "couldn't afford" their $40/month Section 8 rent because they had just bought a new car.
When I worked at a convenience store in a poor town women would come in all the time and buy $15 worth of candy bars with EBT, and then buy a ton of lottery tickets and cigarettes. So yeah, there needs to be better policing of the system.
Man, the second Cleveland video is just as good, if not better. I love the slogan: "Cleveland...We're Not Detroit!"
As for fraud, I have no doubt it happens. But nobody has shown me that it happens often. Everything I read suggests single-digit percentages...so yeah, if I have to hand a few hundred a month to a few drug dealers in order to help out 97 other people who actually need it...oh fucking well.
Well if anyone knows anecdotal examples of fraud they should report it. In the earlier anecdote from OK, their regulations are if you have more than $1000 in liquid assets it starts rapidly chipping away at your benefit unless its reported for crying out loud. Furthermore, (at least in WI) they are amazing at finding changes in income. I misreported my hours at work and she actually already had the information on her computer and corrected me (misremembering not deceiving). If someone is living like a king on welfare they're probably selling drugs or a family member is unloading large amounts of cash on them (which makes them both guilty of a crime)
I'm aware people fraud the system. People doing this are (by every source that wasn't a libertarian masturbatorium) the small, small minority. I would bet money that there is more fraud in the private sector in almost every area of business than there is in most state's welfare.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
edited April 2010
"Fraud" is a hard term to prove, especially when it comes to nuclear family scenarios.
I see a lot of what I would call fraud at my job, but I also know that reporting it is usually a waste of time. If people want to go to the trouble of living their lives to the point of welfare qualification, it's often difficult determining which came first, the fraud or the condition that they now live in.
The thing is, a lot of able-bodied people and a lot of fairly-affluent people scam the system simply by not working within its boundaries. The question I have is whether or not the cost of the significant amount of oversight it would take to better enforce policies and audit Medicare/welfare qualifiers wouldn't eat up every penny you save from keeping the standards stricter.
Which isn't to say that we should just let shit slide. But like Feral said, if you seeing happening, tell somebody. Otherwise, get your ass back to work.
Chances are, no reasoned argument is ever going to sway this woman into not being an ignorant dillweed. The best thing for you to do is tell her that you don't feel comfortable discussing politics in the workplace, or you don't think it's appropriate to do so. When people try to draw me into a political (or religious, when they find out I'm pagan) debate, that is my default response.
If she persists, report it to your supervisor and tell him that it's making you uncomfortable and/or you don't feel it's appropriate/professional.
On the subject of death and daemons disappearing: arrows sure are effective in Lyra's universe. Seems like if you get shot once, you're dead - no lingering deaths with your daemon huddling pitifully in your arms, just *thunk* *argh* *whoosh*. A battlefield full of the dying would just be so much more depressing when you add in wailing gerbils and dogs.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
Chances are, no reasoned argument is ever going to sway this woman into not being an ignorant dillweed.
The thing is, I wouldn't go so far to call this woman ignorant. She's actually pretty on-the-money. Millions of people game the system everyday to survive without working. It's not even all that rare.
The difference is, "surviving" is about all those people are doing. And unless they're drug dealers, those people probably aren't making all that much money on the side. They definitely aren't using their scam money to buy high-end appliances or build good credit or drive the newest cars or going on long weekends to Napa Valley.
They live like low-lifes because usually that's what someone who works very hard at not having to work is.
The Welfare Queen isn't a fictional character. She exists, wallowing in a pile of filth and depravity. But that's not who we want to be, so we all do the right thing. And life goes on.
"Wingnut welfare" is the term used to describe the money you get for, say, having a right-wing blog that repeats talking points. You might not have any ads or a lot of traffic, but you can still get paid to talk about death panels or something. Or welfare queens, for that matter.
Don't worry pony, most of us aren't arguing that those on welfare/assistance are welfare queens although there is the one guy who complained because a woman was on disability if you want to tear into him.
it's been my experience that the so-called "welfare queens" do exist, but they're also always fraudsters
they exploit the system and use it in a way it wasn't intended. they're committing a crime, they're criminals and should be prosecuted.
people who use the system the way it is intended are never in the position of truly being affluent or even particularly comfortable on it
unless, of course, they do shitty things like spend the money they should get for food for their three kids on a new TV
it's easy for someone on welfare to have the appearance of wealth if they're willing to forgo a lot and live a shitty life and, presumably, abuse their children
While I don't doubt that some of the cases you've seen support this view how can you be sure that every case you claim stems from this situation unless you know the family in question? Do you have a situation which allows you insight into these families?
Seriously, that's a real question, not sarcasm. There was a guy who did repair for section 8 housing a few pages back so I was curious if you have something similar which gives you this insight.
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Living off the ever abundant American welfare state really is the way to go.
Yeah, too bad I'm quoting from first hand experience as I worked on the appliances. My cousin is also one of my references as she is one of the fat lazy bums that got a free car, paid for house, food stamps and over $1000 a month. As she put it, "Why the hell would I want to get a job, I make more not having one."
Since when can you buy candy bars with EBT? I've tried it, it doesn't work
You can't buy energy drinks either
Kindly stop making shit up, please.
I could tell you some stories about the nastiest places I have cleaned out and the rent on the house was $900/mth.
The reason people complain more is that it takes the same amount of work but they can't ask the renter for a huge deposit.
Also, a lot of section 8 housing are scamming the government by providing shitty housing and pocketing the extra.
Ascetic, but yeah, that's true. Welfare/unemployment is not an enjoyable program to be on.
I wasn't sure, and Google wasn't being any sort of help.
Oh, well, if a guy on the internet is saying it, it must be true.
Gonna need citations if you want to argue something weird.
I personally believe it when I hear that the fraud rate is low, but I can't combat ignorance without some statistics. And there is a lot of ignorance around here, myself included.
My co-worked got a chain E-Mail today saying that all "real Americans" should refuse the new dollar coin that they are stamping. When she showed it to me my response was unflattering. This is the kind of thing I have to try to batter past with such feeble weapons as logic and reason.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Welfare queens might not be the best people, but they aren't the worst ... graduate students are the worst.
From 30 Rock
But people do that to normal apartments.
But blanket statements are fun!
And when you get on it, it's not "free" rent, it's subsidized. You still have to pay the lion's share yourself.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
Welfare and EI are different in Canada, but that doesn't stop people from fucking up and calling them the same thing
Today he's still living off the government, but in much worse conditions over all I'd say. Apparently the feds frown on you when they find out you've been collecting welfare checks as well as selling drugs. They set him up with a nice little room though, and he always gets fed, & still doesn't have a job, so he's probably happy.
Other than that one example though, most of the people I've known on welfare had shit living standards, and nearly never anything new. THere was one family when I was growing up though, that had a really nice house, kids always had nice new shiny things etc, and the mom was on "permanent disability", not sure how much more/less money that gets from the government, but I couldn't figure out how they did it. Looking back now though, I think the mom may have also been a prostitute.
What state is this in?
And I just remember i used to hang out with that kid (hell he was one of the first kids to get a sega in the neighborhood). I say the mom might be a prostitute now, based entirely off the fact that there were quite often different dudes at her house when we'd go over to play sega, just a totally random thought that popped into my head 20 some years later
As for the other guy he got busted with a large amount of cocaine, weed, and small amount of meth IIRC. All I remember thinking is the world is probably better off with him in prison, than out.. he wasn't a very good type of person.
So the guy living large on the government told the HHS of the state that he's a pregnant migrant or something? I mean really how come all of these anecdotes of welfare queens people have are totally inconsistent with either the listed benefit amounts, eligibility, or both?
I know he had a "baby momma" I said I knew the guy, not that I did his finances personaly, and I know he got his groceries from a EBT card for a fact (I checked him and his "baby mama" out while working at a grocery store a few years back). Its quite possible he was living off his "baby momma" welfare checks(well... welfare debit) in addition to his drug selling.
My point isn't that people make it "livin' large on welfare" its that people on welfare may have other sources of income. I've personally known one person who ran an auto repair shop out of their own garage, illegally and would only take cash payment. They made a shit load of money in addition to their real mechanic job where they were properly taxed. They've long since moved out of state, and I have no idea how they are living now, but the point remains, people can make money and have the government not know about it for a long damn time, and just because they're on some sort of government assistance doesn't mean that's the only money they get.
Whether its whoring, selling drugs, or fixing peoples computers for cheap "as a friend" tons of people make money on the side. Fuck I've been offered a 10$/hour job "under the table" walking by small landscaping outfit that was doing some work and needed extra help before.
The other day a kid was going around town passing out flyers doorstep to doorstep, offering complete computer diagnostics, spyware and malware removal, for a flat 20$ per computer. I'm guessing he didn't have a business license and doesn't report all the money he makes to the government to be taxed, and hell he might even do pretty well. Maybe better than all the other kids trying to mow and rake peoples lawns.
This. About the only way to "live large" on welfare is to make cash on the side and not report it. Which is, you know, illegal. And in this case, I wholly support the "if you see something, say something" mentality.
As mentioned, cellphones are no longer a luxury. Nor are they particularly expensive. And people also flip out when people on Section 8, WIC, etc. have "new" cars, completely ignoring the fact that a cheaper new car (or newer used car) can wind up costing no more than a used piece of shit, on a monthly basis...as I've learned since buying my first used car that's still under warranty.
I mean yeah, I pay $170 a month in car payments. But that's it. Whereas with my truck most years I'd wind up spending $1500 (or more!) on repairs, and at irregular intervals.
Man, the second Cleveland video is just as good, if not better. I love the slogan: "Cleveland...We're Not Detroit!"
As for fraud, I have no doubt it happens. But nobody has shown me that it happens often. Everything I read suggests single-digit percentages...so yeah, if I have to hand a few hundred a month to a few drug dealers in order to help out 97 other people who actually need it...oh fucking well.
I'm aware people fraud the system. People doing this are (by every source that wasn't a libertarian masturbatorium) the small, small minority. I would bet money that there is more fraud in the private sector in almost every area of business than there is in most state's welfare.
I see a lot of what I would call fraud at my job, but I also know that reporting it is usually a waste of time. If people want to go to the trouble of living their lives to the point of welfare qualification, it's often difficult determining which came first, the fraud or the condition that they now live in.
The thing is, a lot of able-bodied people and a lot of fairly-affluent people scam the system simply by not working within its boundaries. The question I have is whether or not the cost of the significant amount of oversight it would take to better enforce policies and audit Medicare/welfare qualifiers wouldn't eat up every penny you save from keeping the standards stricter.
Which isn't to say that we should just let shit slide. But like Feral said, if you seeing happening, tell somebody. Otherwise, get your ass back to work.
If she persists, report it to your supervisor and tell him that it's making you uncomfortable and/or you don't feel it's appropriate/professional.
The thing is, I wouldn't go so far to call this woman ignorant. She's actually pretty on-the-money. Millions of people game the system everyday to survive without working. It's not even all that rare.
The difference is, "surviving" is about all those people are doing. And unless they're drug dealers, those people probably aren't making all that much money on the side. They definitely aren't using their scam money to buy high-end appliances or build good credit or drive the newest cars or going on long weekends to Napa Valley.
They live like low-lifes because usually that's what someone who works very hard at not having to work is.
The Welfare Queen isn't a fictional character. She exists, wallowing in a pile of filth and depravity. But that's not who we want to be, so we all do the right thing. And life goes on.
Also on Steam and PSN: twobadcats
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Wingnut welfare exists in the same reality where everyone is born with the same opportunities and only needs to work hard enough.
"Wingnut welfare" is the term used to describe the money you get for, say, having a right-wing blog that repeats talking points. You might not have any ads or a lot of traffic, but you can still get paid to talk about death panels or something. Or welfare queens, for that matter.
Also on Steam and PSN: twobadcats
i get about $1k a month from the guv'ment to live off of
who here thinks that allows me to be a "welfare queen"?
because after rent and utilities i actually have very little money left for food let alone anything else
so
they exploit the system and use it in a way it wasn't intended. they're committing a crime, they're criminals and should be prosecuted.
people who use the system the way it is intended are never in the position of truly being affluent or even particularly comfortable on it
unless, of course, they do shitty things like spend the money they should get for food for their three kids on a new TV
it's easy for someone on welfare to have the appearance of wealth if they're willing to forgo a lot and live a shitty life and, presumably, abuse their children
Shit man, I see it EVERY DAY in my city.
While I don't doubt that some of the cases you've seen support this view how can you be sure that every case you claim stems from this situation unless you know the family in question? Do you have a situation which allows you insight into these families?
Seriously, that's a real question, not sarcasm. There was a guy who did repair for section 8 housing a few pages back so I was curious if you have something similar which gives you this insight.