Except that he says there's people more intelligent and specialized than he is also working on the project (and possibly bringing more years of experience). I'll give him credit for being the first to post a video of head-tracking from a hacked wii controller, but now he's just one man on a team of several working on a bigger beast.
"On this week's Listen Up podcast we discussed Natal, and David Ellis and I talked about what we've been hearing regarding the new technology -- and how it's actually the cornerstone of Microsoft's next evolution of the Xbox. Microsoft will not only release Natal as an add-on for the Xbox 360, it will come standard with the next Xbox console.
Yes, there will be a new Xbox console next fall.
However, the new console won't just be an Xbox 360 with a camera, though -- we've heard it will be considered a new platform and carry a new name (Xbox Natal?). It's not clear what sort of upgrades we might see, but some have suggested it will be an slight upgrade of the current Xbox 360 technology. Current Xbox 360 games would be playable on it, but future games would be able to take advantage of the added muscle. Similar to what we see in the PC space, games played on the more advanced Xbox would look or perform better, but publishers will still be able to support owners of both systems. Some developers have complained that they've already maxed out the Xbox 360; perhaps this will give them room to expand."
Except that he says there's people more intelligent and specialized than he is also working on the project (and possibly bringing more years of experience). I'll give him credit for being the first to post a video of head-tracking from a hacked wii controller, but now he's just one man on a team of several working on a bigger beast.
...or building a multitouch projector from an inexpensive camera interface (wiimote again), and all sorts of other things that Natal could bring to the table; seeing him on the team, and hearing him say that there are brighter minds than his afoot, is really reassuring. I seem to remember choruses of people saying that nintendo should hire this guy because his videos were shit hot...
syndalis on
SW-4158-3990-6116
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
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MetalbourneInside a cluster b personalityRegistered Userregular
In the new GTA, you're going to be able to take the camera outside and scan your car. Then, you can drive around in the game in your parent's car, running old ladies over and pulling off drive-bys.
THE FUTURE!
What's the point? The goddamn thing will disappear as soon as you turn your back on it.
Except that he says there's people more intelligent and specialized than he is also working on the project (and possibly bringing more years of experience). I'll give him credit for being the first to post a video of head-tracking from a hacked wii controller, but now he's just one man on a team of several working on a bigger beast.
...or building a multitouch projector from an inexpensive camera interface (wiimote again), and all sorts of other things that Natal could bring to the table; seeing him on the team, and hearing him say that there are brighter minds than his afoot, is really reassuring. I seem to remember choruses of people saying that nintendo should hire this guy because his videos were shit hot...
The reason Nintendo didn't hire him was because he brings nothing new to the table. Sure, he's an enthusiast and he made a video about it on the internet, but if his stuff was worthwhile, Nintendo would've taken action
As it stands, hiring this guy is probably more of a marketing stunt than anything else.
I have to say, when it was demoed on Fallon, I thought of an episode of "Better off Ted." They got new high tech security cameras to open the doors and turn on water fountains for people. The system, however, couldn't see black people. HILARIOUS episode. Hope it doesn't track reality...
"On this week's Listen Up podcast we discussed Natal, and David Ellis and I talked about what we've been hearing regarding the new technology -- and how it's actually the cornerstone of Microsoft's next evolution of the Xbox. Microsoft will not only release Natal as an add-on for the Xbox 360, it will come standard with the next Xbox console.
Yes, there will be a new Xbox console next fall.
However, the new console won't just be an Xbox 360 with a camera, though -- we've heard it will be considered a new platform and carry a new name (Xbox Natal?). It's not clear what sort of upgrades we might see, but some have suggested it will be an slight upgrade of the current Xbox 360 technology. Current Xbox 360 games would be playable on it, but future games would be able to take advantage of the added muscle. Similar to what we see in the PC space, games played on the more advanced Xbox would look or perform better, but publishers will still be able to support owners of both systems. Some developers have complained that they've already maxed out the Xbox 360; perhaps this will give them room to expand."
Microsoft's Shane Kim has said that Project Natal is designed to target the "60 per cent of households where a videogame console doesn't exist", rather than current casual gamers "or even PS2 people who haven't upgraded".
Speaking to Kotaku, Kim, who handles Microsoft's long-term console strategy, reiterated the E3 mantra that any controller is a barrier to entry for the sort of people the platform holder is trying to entice.
He also said that the arrival of the company's ambitious motion control system will be comparable to the arrival of the console itself in 2005.
That means making sure that there are really good games there from day one. "That's similar to how you would think of the launch of a new console. It's got to have a great launch line-up," he said. "That's the same thing here."
Yup, those who went with "treating it like the launch of a new console" can sleep easier at night.
So, now I'm confused. On the Jimmy Fallon demonstration, the guy said that Natal would work with existing 360's. Consensus in this thread seems to be that it'll be a new system with subtle upgrades. I don't doubt it will be a new console, but I'm not sure what the official line is.
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AxenMy avatar is Excalibur.Yes, the sword.Registered Userregular
So, now I'm confused. On the Jimmy Fallon demonstration, the guy said that Natal would work with existing 360's. Consensus in this thread seems to be that it'll be a new system with subtle upgrades. I don't doubt it will be a new console, but I'm not sure what the official line is.
Both actually.
Axen on
A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
From what I understand, they'll release it as an add-on that you can buy, but they'll also ship it as standard with all new consoles sold from there on out. At the same time they'll make a few upgrades to the new consoles, but whether those will be in line with the minor improvements they've made to each new package since launch, or whether it'll be a more substantial increase, is unknown.
By the way, they are not really aiming for the college crowd with this one are they? Where would you get the room to wiggle your whole body around if you're just playing in your room?
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KlykaDO you have anySPARE BATTERIES?Registered Userregular
By the way, they are not really aiming for the college crowd with this one are they? Where would you get the room to wiggle your whole body around if you're just playing in your room?
This stuff is constantly being researched in Human Computer Interaction. There are reasons it's usually difficult to push this stuff out to a real market. The big one is familiarity. People are resistant to change and a lot of PC users have been using a mouse and keyboard the entire the time they've been using a PC. Then there's the expense of developing this stuff, marketing it and packaging it, then trying to offer it as a competitor to a $10 mouse/keyboard combo. Tactile feedback is a big one. It makes a big difference being able to feel yourself click on something.
Also mice allow you to make large movements with super-precise motions. You mention that gaming requires subtle movement, but so does regular office work if you want to preserve your hands. Sure something like Natal could track that, but how do you stop it from inadvertently tracking unintended movements. An example is a project one of my lecturers was telling us about awhile ago (I can't remember if it was by one of his PhD students or some whole other university) that tracked eye movement. You stared at a computer screen, and moving your visual focus to a particular position would effectively move the applications focus to that position. They did some testing with it and the major failing they found was that it was too easy to accidentally move your focus. You hear a fly? Your gaze flicks in that direction for a second. You stop to think while you're writing and realise your focus has shifted to the frame of the monitor, etc.
It becomes a problem not really of how much you can capture, but how much you really should be capturing. With a mouse, movements are easily defined as intentional, because the mouse only moves when someone makes an effort to grasp it before shifting it around. It's not going to go haywire if you need to scratch your nose.
edit: ugh slightly off-topic TOTP >.<
You know what I would love? Micromovement recognition. When you think about moving something your body makes unconcious tiny movements towards doing it. So in the future you could put your hands on a pad or something, think about the movement you want to make and the pad would track that along with eye movement ect to interpret what you were thinking of doing.
This is pure starry eyed sci fi though, in a practical sense it would be a huge clusterfuck.
I hope this doesn't become standard in the future.
I'm gonna miss the A and B buttons. And a D-pad.
At least on live you'll never be short of d-bags?
WAIT! Maybe they could make it so that if you make a strangling motion when someone is being an asshat in voicechat, it'll automatically mute them/kick them from the game?
I hope this doesn't become standard in the future.
I'm gonna miss the A and B buttons. And a D-pad.
At least on live you'll never be short of d-bags?
WAIT! Maybe they could make it so that if you make a strangling motion when someone is being an asshat in voicechat, it'll automatically mute them/kick them from the game?
I love the idea of a console that would know when you're flipping it off.
I hope this doesn't become standard in the future.
I'm gonna miss the A and B buttons. And a D-pad.
At least on live you'll never be short of d-bags?
WAIT! Maybe they could make it so that if you make a strangling motion when someone is being an asshat in voicechat, it'll automatically mute them/kick them from the game?
I love the idea of a console that would know when you're flipping it off.
And when you flip it off it would make the game harder.
From what I understand, they'll release it as an add-on that you can buy, but they'll also ship it as standard with all new consoles sold from there on out. At the same time they'll make a few upgrades to the new consoles, but whether those will be in line with the minor improvements they've made to each new package since launch, or whether it'll be a more substantial increase, is unknown.
The 1UP piece there says how "but some have suggested it will be an slight upgrade of the current Xbox 360 technology."
Which is being read as "Microsoft have confirmed unequivocally that there will be a new, upgraded Xbox next year".
Spot the difference! There absolutely will be a 360 model bundled with Natal, and it will be treated like a new console launch (lots of advertising, big E3 presentation, a selection of games made specifically for it), but I would be very surprised if it's an actual new model of xbox 360.
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Dusdais ashamed of this postSLC, UTRegistered Userregular
edited June 2009
Really? It'll be pushing five years since the 360 launched when the next e3 roles around. I would be slightly surprised if they didn't at least mention a new console coming.
Then again, this generation has sort of thrown the whole five year thing into a tornado.
Microsoft and Sony have both sunk a lot of money into designing higher-end machines; they'll probably try to forestall the release of a new console generation for as long as they can.
kedinik on
I made a game! Hotline Maui. Requires mouse and keyboard.
Although I cant remember where the source is at the moment, over E3 I just recently read Microsoft says the 360 life span, for them, is 10 years. They're halfway there.
(woah-oh. Livin' on a prayer.)
mxmarks on
PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
So my main concern about the system is the lag time. In the videos I've seen there is maybe a 1/2 second lag between moving and the response coming on screen. Now this may be adequate for many situations, but the hacked-wii head tracking style stuff would be majorly weird, because you'd move your head and the view would take a little bit to shift into place.
I hope that they're working on reducing the lag here; IMO it's going to be the biggest area of improvement until they get it down to imperceptible.
RandomEngy on
Profile -> Signature Settings -> Hide signatures always. Then you don't have to read this worthless text anymore.
Although I cant remember where the source is at the moment, over E3 I just recently read Microsoft says the 360 life span, for them, is 10 years. They're halfway there.
(woah-oh. Livin' on a prayer.)
Well, the most direct quote is that they won't stop making the 360 until the day after Sony stop making PS3s.
So, the launch details have gotten a little clearer... and believe it or not, it won't cost an arm and a leg.
MCV can this week reveal first details regarding the launch of Microsoft's Project Natal.
Our sources say the innovative controller-free 360 camera will be released worldwide in November 2010.
This and other details have emerged following a behind-closed-doors Microsoft tour of UK publishers and studios – the format-holder has been demoing the tech and detailing its 2010 plans in order to spur more development support.
Microsoft is planning to manufacture 5m units for day one release, with a mix of console and camera plus solus SKUs expected.
The device should cost under £50 when sold solo. One publishing source says Microsoft is “trying to get as close as possible to ‘impulse buy’”. Another even says the camera could even retail for just £30.
14 games are being readied for launch.
Natal was unveiled earlier this year at E3 in Los Angeles. The device uses an array of cameras and microphones to track player movements.
Activision, Bethesda, Capcom, Disney, EA, Konami, MTV, Namco Bandai, Sega, Square Enix, THQ and Ubisoft all committed to make games for the device in an announcement made at last month's Tokyo Game Show.
It’s expected a large chunk of launch games will be first-party offerings from studios such as Rare with third-party games to follow. It is not known if Lionhead’s widely-discussed Milo, which uses advanced AI to create realistic characters, will be in the mix.
Natal will arrive almost five years to the day after the Xbox 360 and is perceived by many, Microsoft included, as a way to lengthen the lifespan of the hardware without resorting to a new console launch. The first Xbox was sold in the UK for only three years before 360 hit.
This summer Xbox studios boss Phil Spencer told MCV the 360 still ‘hasn't peaked’.
“When Natal arrives it will feel like a new generation has come,” he said. “I see it like the launch of 360 in November ‘05. Consumers don’t want another $400 box right now.”
Sony has said it will launch PS3’s motion-sensing wand peripheral – movement of which is tracked by the already-available PlayStation Eye camera – before Microsoft’s kit in spring 2010. However, so far the Japanese firm has kept details of the launch closely under wraps.
So, this is either a fun performance to distract from Natal's shortcomings, or showing you that you can only do what Natal lets you do if you can contort your body and have ballet training.
So, this is either a fun performance to distract from Natal's shortcomings, or showing you that you can only do what Natal lets you do if you can contort your body and have ballet training.
ZephosClimbin in yo ski lifts, snatchin your people up.MichiganRegistered Userregular
edited May 2010
the ridiculous thing about that image is that welll.... aside from the buggy showing (which performed fairly admirably up to that point), last time I checked the Wii didn't do facial recognition and full body tracking...
I'd like for the prices above to be right, thats like 60-100 USD I think and I could see, provided the software is there, picking it up to give it a shot.
Heck, for 60 i'd almost pick it up just for the Sci-fi-esque interface. I wish it would make my xbox talk to me like Jarvis from iron man or the HAL-9000.
"Natal, show me the bottom of my avatars shoe..."
"I'm sorry zephos, i'm afraid i cannot do that..."
Posts
Fuck. Yes.
This has really ramped up my hopes for the platform, considering the awesome shit he has been able to hack out of a Wiimote.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
Steam: TheArcadeBear
Has this already been posted?
PSN: SirGrinchX
Oculus Rift: Sir_Grinch
...or building a multitouch projector from an inexpensive camera interface (wiimote again), and all sorts of other things that Natal could bring to the table; seeing him on the team, and hearing him say that there are brighter minds than his afoot, is really reassuring. I seem to remember choruses of people saying that nintendo should hire this guy because his videos were shit hot...
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
What's the point? The goddamn thing will disappear as soon as you turn your back on it.
The reason Nintendo didn't hire him was because he brings nothing new to the table. Sure, he's an enthusiast and he made a video about it on the internet, but if his stuff was worthwhile, Nintendo would've taken action
As it stands, hiring this guy is probably more of a marketing stunt than anything else.
I have to say, when it was demoed on Fallon, I thought of an episode of "Better off Ted." They got new high tech security cameras to open the doors and turn on water fountains for people. The system, however, couldn't see black people. HILARIOUS episode. Hope it doesn't track reality...
Buh? Why?
edit: oh, cross posted from sales
Both actually.
Forcing you to buy a bundle would limit their sales.
*fapfapfapfapfapfap* ?
I don't think they see it as a bundle. I get the impression that Microsoft views Natal as integral to the "Xbox 360 experience".
You know what I would love? Micromovement recognition. When you think about moving something your body makes unconcious tiny movements towards doing it. So in the future you could put your hands on a pad or something, think about the movement you want to make and the pad would track that along with eye movement ect to interpret what you were thinking of doing.
This is pure starry eyed sci fi though, in a practical sense it would be a huge clusterfuck.
I'm gonna miss the A and B buttons. And a D-pad.
At least on live you'll never be short of d-bags?
WAIT! Maybe they could make it so that if you make a strangling motion when someone is being an asshat in voicechat, it'll automatically mute them/kick them from the game?
I love the idea of a console that would know when you're flipping it off.
And when you flip it off it would make the game harder.
The 1UP piece there says how "but some have suggested it will be an slight upgrade of the current Xbox 360 technology."
Which is being read as "Microsoft have confirmed unequivocally that there will be a new, upgraded Xbox next year".
Spot the difference! There absolutely will be a 360 model bundled with Natal, and it will be treated like a new console launch (lots of advertising, big E3 presentation, a selection of games made specifically for it), but I would be very surprised if it's an actual new model of xbox 360.
Then again, this generation has sort of thrown the whole five year thing into a tornado.
(woah-oh. Livin' on a prayer.)
I hope that they're working on reducing the lag here; IMO it's going to be the biggest area of improvement until they get it down to imperceptible.
Well, the most direct quote is that they won't stop making the 360 until the day after Sony stop making PS3s.
Also, my idea as an upcoming game designer for Natal: AIR GUITAR HERO.
http://www.mcvuk.com/news/36466/Natal-launch-details-leak-from-secret-Microsoft-tour
Keep in mind the UK tends to get raped when it comes to vidja game prices, so it sounds like Natal will be $50 at the very most.
Never going to be that cheap though.
So, this is either a fun performance to distract from Natal's shortcomings, or showing you that you can only do what Natal lets you do if you can contort your body and have ballet training.
Steam: TheArcadeBear
My money's on the first option.
Natal is going to track the cirque performers and the avatars are going to do the CRAZIEST SHIT EVER.
Steam: TheArcadeBear
I'd like for the prices above to be right, thats like 60-100 USD I think and I could see, provided the software is there, picking it up to give it a shot.
Heck, for 60 i'd almost pick it up just for the Sci-fi-esque interface. I wish it would make my xbox talk to me like Jarvis from iron man or the HAL-9000.
"Natal, show me the bottom of my avatars shoe..."
"I'm sorry zephos, i'm afraid i cannot do that..."