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[Game OFF] Company of Heroes Online: Over faster than a blitzkreig

Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
edited February 2011 in Games and Technology
cohologo.jpg

OPEN BETA IS HERE
You account will not be wiped on release day!
get out there and play!


Q: What the goose is this?

A: Well, you might remember a little award winning RTS known as Company of Heroes. Looks like those dogs at Relic and THQ are trying to drum a little more out of the game by expanding it and making it free to play.

Q: What's that? Free to play?

A: Yeah, COHO is going to be a free to play game. If you've ever played a game like League of Legends, it has a similar system. You can do pretty much anything in the game for free with a little time and effort; shell out some real cash though can get you there faster or easier.


Q: Well, what's it like then? Surely they didn't just give us the game for free?

A: If you've played Company of Heroes, you'll recognize it instantly. It has all the usual squad based combat that you're used to.

There are differences between the original company of heroes and COHO though! You have a new commander avatar, a persistent level, a completely different company set up.

Hmmm. Why don't we go through the creation of a character to explore this further:

Spoiler'd for big:
To start off, you choose a side and doctrine.

You get up to four commanders, so you're not permanently stuck with one side or doctrine:

creation1.jpg

You can even do silly customization like your looks and name.

creation2i.jpg

There's a whole new doctrine set up for COHO. For those unfamiliar, doctrines in company of heroes were a way to customize your forces to your style of play. Doctrines give commanders unique and thematic powers.

The American doctrines focus on unit types: Infantry, Airborne and Armor doctrines.
The Wehrmacht doctrines focus on an overall strategy: Defensive, Blitzkrieg, and Terror doctrines.

When you level up in COHO you are given new power slots and improvement points that let you choose and customize your doctrine powers in new ways:

spoiler'd for big pictures:

Choosing a power:

infantryabilities.jpg


Spending Improvement points to upgrade and specialize a power:
infantrytrees.jpg


Q: New doctrines you say? Is that all?

A: There are also new hero units and army items! Hero units are normal units with a twist or two: they might be more accurate, tough, or have new abilities. They can level up in battle, and retain those levels between battles. They unlock new abilities as they level up.

Hero units have disadvantages as well. Hero units don't have access to the same equipment as normal units. A heroic engineer or pioneer might not be able to get a flamethrower upgrade. A heroic rifleman will not get BARs when other riflemen do. Some doctrine abilities don't work on hero units. They also cannot gain veterancy like normal units and tend to be worse later on.

Items are another way to customize one's army. You can have 8 items in effect, each can provide passive bonuses to certain units.

Pictures spoil'd for big:

Equipping an item in the depot:
itemsdepot.jpg


A heroic jeep crew resides in my barracks:
heroesdepot.jpg

Propaganda District:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3BOpupv8CE

Corp.Shephard on
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Posts

  • Two Headed BoyTwo Headed Boy Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Got myself a key. I haven't played this game before, but I remember people fawning over it back when it came out. I only plan to really play the single player, though, as I haven't played an RTS since Warcraft 2. Am I missing out, or is the single player enjoyable?

    Two Headed Boy on
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  • PolloDiabloPolloDiablo Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    This looks interesting. I could see this either being kind of cool or really abysmal. I'll give it a shot.

    edit: The single player was good. You really owe it to yourself to play the original. Relic really evolved the genre way past archaic stuff like Warcraft.

    PolloDiablo on
    Be excellent to each other you stupid cunts.
  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Singleplayer is pretty nice. I enjoyed it when I went through it.

    COHO has campaign play(it even gives experience and supply for your multiplayer) but I think it stops after a certain number of missions?

    I played like 3-4 missions before I quit to play some multiplayer. Each mission does have a THQ dollars and supply cost, although for all the missions I played they were free.


    You might be able to get the campaign through micro transactions or for free. Not really sure right now.

    I doubt the whole campaign is currently in due to it being beta.

    Corp.Shephard on
  • Captain KCaptain K Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    I'm shocked a campaign is even included in a game designed in the Asian online free-to-play-but-we-hope-you-pay style. It's admirable that they even bothered!

    I loved CoH and I'm certainly interested in this. Gonna investigate the beta key availability.

    Captain K on
  • PolloDiabloPolloDiablo Registered User regular
    edited July 2010
    Whatever happened to Hours of War? This kind of reminds me of that, with the multiplayer ww2 gameplay. It was an operational wargame, each player commanding a battalion if I remember right. It looked really cool, but the website is gone now. They were already out of beta, it's weird they'd have canceled. Maybe this isn't the right thread to ask in.

    PolloDiablo on
    Be excellent to each other you stupid cunts.
  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited August 2010
    Played some more of this today.

    It's getting more interesting the more powers I unlock. As infantry I dumped Camouflage for Infantry Attrition and Heroic charge. Also unlocked two interesting new heroes, although I'll need to level up considerably to use them.

    Heroic charge is pretty great. AOE squad boost to accuracy, speed and fire rate. I've upgraded the attack speed, although I don't really see the difference. I think I might just respec and throw more points into it for evasion and suppression immunity. Perfect for those big dumb hero charges on MGs.

    I'm a bit mixed on infantry attrition though. I picked it up because I could upgrade it and make it so when snipers died I could get them refunded instantly: allied war machine style. Snipers have always been great, but prone to horrific deaths that cost so much. There's no point in heroic charge usage on most WSC units though. Doesn't even seem to work on mortars. I've been forced to spam heroic charge on allied units mostly, to reasonable effect, but I always feel like I hit it too late.

    Plus, many snipers die to unforeseen attacks, like a lucky rocket hitting them or another sniper shot. It's tricky business... but infantry attrition is cheap.

    Still, I really like all the flexibility these powers give. I just wish allies stood a damn chance against axis late game.

    It's just a joke once they get all those veteran units. 4v4 matches just don't end quickly.

    Corp.Shephard on
  • TychoCelchuuuTychoCelchuuu PIGEON IndiaRegistered User regular
    edited August 2010
    Everything you love about CoH, now with grinding or microtransactions!

    So... maybe not so great.

    The timing vis a vis Starcraft 2 is pretty unfortunate. I'll keep one eye on it but I'm not sure what would make me want to play this over actual CoH.

    TychoCelchuuu on
  • Two Headed BoyTwo Headed Boy Registered User regular
    edited August 2010
    Oh, awesome. Didn't realize the game closes when you lose internet connection in single player.

    [EDIT] Also, changing any settings will restart the game, fail to authenticate your login info, and shut down. Grrreat first impression.

    Two Headed Boy on
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  • rtsrts Registered User regular
    edited August 2010
    Oh man, I played a really long 1v1 this morning on Beaux Lowlands and managed to win. When he got down to 5 points, he declared I was a hacker and quit immediately.

    Man that makes me feel good.

    I am not sure what exactly he thought I was doing that was indicative of hacking though.

    rts on
    skype: rtschutter
  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited August 2010
    Yeah, so I sorta composed a huge post on the official forums while taking a break from studying for my final.

    It's just a bunch of infantry commander ability analysis. One of these days I will control myself.

    edit: On second though, I think I'll just spoiler this monster and people can enter at their own risk.
    I had the same sort of issues that you did when I first started COHO. (these issues being finding good uses for infantry commander)

    I'm a long time COH player. I wanted to go armored, but all my friends were pickin' that, so I went with my second favorite and picked up infantry.

    I'm the only one who did so, I've had to figure things out myself.

    As a point of reference, I am a level 25 infantry commander. The system says I'm in the top 1% of infantry commanders, but this system seems to be full of horse[filtered] to be honest. I was in the top 10% after two wins.

    Maybe people just suck? Anyways...

    There are several lackluster abilities in the infantry tree, but there are also gems.

    You're quite right about the artillery barrage: the timer for inbound shells is so long that it can be tricky to catch things. However, this ability has my most improvement points and I definitely suggest it. Allied artillery is far and few between. Sometimes there are entrenched positions that you just need to crack or force a retreat on. With full points in the artillery damage part of the improvement tree, you can really put on the hurt. One direct hit will kill a StuG IV outright. I hit a vet 1 or 2 panther with it today and got 50% of it's health down instantly. You just have to keep an attentive eye and look for opportunities where he'll be slow. Did his vehicle just ram a building on accident? It might be stuck, hit it. Does he have a huge clump of infantry and vehicles? They'll probably get in the way of each other. Hit the artillery.

    You have to be wise and judicious in your usage, but artillery is one of the better powers.

    I've played around with Heroic Charge and Camouflage as well. They can be quite excellent in their own rights. Camouflage is more of a 1v1 ability in my experience. It allows for hero riflemen and rangers to pull off some dirty tricks on MG teams and other isolated squads. It has other nifty advantages too, like you can use it on AT guns and pretend you're a pak38! Or use it on a setup MG to surprise suppress an opponent. Another one of my favorite uses of camouflage was on engineers. Engineers could plant mines while camouflaged. This allowed for easy mining opportunities that could really [filtered] up quick pumas and make sure flanks were safe. With a flamethrower, a cloaked squad of engineers can make a nasty flank. These uses are hard to pull off reliably, but there's a great deal of creative potential with camo.

    I don't take camo anymore however, I find it very lackluster late game and hard to really manage. Units are simply too slow whilst camouflaged, and they tend to slow down my pushes in general. If this ability could be cast on allies, I would consider that.

    Heroic charge is sort of nifty, but I really only use it as an AoE fire-up. It's expensive in improvement points if you ask me: I don't want to spend 75 munitions for such a lackluster bonus so you need about 6 points invested minimum to get the -25 munition upgrade. It does have some nice uses: faster riflemen can actually catch and stickybomb tanks, early game suppression immunity and bonuses can mince MGs, etc. What's really nice about this power is that it works on allies too. So if you see an allied blob of rifles in trouble, you can bail them out and save another fight.

    I don't use heroic charge anymore though because I like to save munitions for rangers and artillery. Additionally, like I said, it uses too many improvement points. Nice power, but it will be a while before I pick it up again.


    Forward Barracks sounds kinda lame, but it's actually quite good. With a few invested points you can forgo a triage center. You can also pull some quick tricks on an axis player going for a building with an MG. The HQ is immediately set up, and he cannot enter the building. On some maps, like Rails and Metal, securing a key building can be a huge help! This ability has a CP requirement of 0 with improvements: you can use it right away. No other ability will give you a good early game advantage at holding a key fuel sector or the like. It's also great for big maps with team fights: if an ally's area is in trouble, drop one and start producing useful units out of it. It can heal his troops too.

    Rangers. They're expensive in improvement points... but they can exceed their old forms with enough (although they are more expensive). I suggest rangers: they help mid game with pumas and the like. Now that my rangers are quite good I tend to skip motor pool for faster shermans. Rangers are just as good as they've always been and can fit in just fine.

    Infantry Attrition. I get the least use of this power, however it is one I use. The nice thing about Inf. Atrr. is that it is pretty good with zero improvement points. It will save up to two engineers, riflemen or rangers at it's most basic form. That's pretty useful for 50 munitions. However, it's dangerous to rely on it. Units that are replaced lose upgrades and veterancy. Be careful when sacrificing Rangers with SMGs or engineers with flamers. Other infantry abilities require many improvement points to get really good, so I suggest this as a "low maintenance" power.

    Engineer Riflemen: I don't have the most experience with these, but they seem alright for a WSC infantry commander. Big problem with these is that they're a big improvement point sink. It takes many points to get them up to normal rifleman power and more to get stickies and grenades. They're actually quite nice once powered up, and they can build the only allied artillery unit in the game. The mighty howitzer. The howitzer sucks without it's improvements though (making this power even more of a sink). 50 munitions per shot, very inaccurate without the range booster (which makes your effective accurate range better). Good for a WSC-> fast shermans sort of build I'd bet, but I'm not too familiar with them.

    Off-map reinforcements: Okay, this power really is useless. You get a handful of riflemen at 5 CPs? Upgraded, you get a bunch of engineers with bazookas (what? engineers get suppressed by the top mg on just about anything and die instantly to pumas. What the hell are these going to do?), and some weapon support squads?

    Upgrading this ability actually makes it come later. It goes up to CP 7 with two upgrades, and you have to buy two more to bring it back down!

    The only saving grace of the ability is that you might get some snipers. Those are useful! Nothing is guaranteed though. At the end of this power you're spending 900 manpower on a dice roll of questionably useful units. Bad idea! Late game is when you should be diversifying your core army of infantry with some tanks! Not throwing more infantry into the axis artillery.

    Just to make this power even remotely worthwhile takes a huge number of improvement points and you get really nothing useful out of it. Ignore at all costs~!

    So yeah, infantry commander's pretty cool. I miss some of his passive things like riflemen with the ability to lay mines. I miss that a great deal. Still, he's got his strong points, even if some of his powers are a bit odd.


    On a less incredibly long and strained note, this game is pretty fun when you're not suffering to infinite axis artillery barrages and the like.

    Operation Overload seems to have brought in new blood and games seem to be picking up a little faster.

    I think keys are still available...?

    Corp.Shephard on
  • rtsrts Registered User regular
    edited August 2010
    Does anybody know of any other places giving out keys? Besides fileplanet and raptr?

    rts on
    skype: rtschutter
  • Steel-AngelSteel-Angel Registered User regular
    edited August 2010
    you know it's really awesome to fight superhighlevel americans who get 6CP pershings that also have some bullshit "Long Range Shot" spell that insta-gibs my anti tank guns

    really awesome

    oh, and recon jeep/destructive mortar are really cool too.

    the game balance is so out of whack it's rly depressing. i saw a teammate with a piosquad that had two panzer schrecks and laid out tellermines.

    edit: also the people online are so bad. so so bad.

    sooooo bad.

    because of them the ostwind's rate of fire is the same as the M8 greyhound's. and the shell capacity was cut down by 2/3s.

    too many terribles used to attack-move from SC2 fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

    Steel-Angel on
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  • Steel-AngelSteel-Angel Registered User regular
    edited August 2010
    lolwuty.jpg

    i mean really come on

    Steel-Angel on
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  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Well open beta starts tomorrow. Anyone can sign up and play, so if you were interested in this before but couldn't get a key, now is a great chance to jump in while the playing field is about as even as it will ever be.

    Tweaked the OP a bit to reflect it.

    Now I have no idea which commander to settle on. Doesn't look like they're going to reset accounts again. I've grown quite accustomed to Infantry's play style, but I miss armored shenanigans. Axis is the same, Terror has been so good with it's incredibly cheap and effective abilities. Yet I always enjoyed Blitz more in vCoH.

    Corp.Shephard on
  • RoyceSraphimRoyceSraphim Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    So happy when this finishes updating off my clearwire....


    I'm not going to be able to connect, am I?

    RoyceSraphim on
  • Steel-AngelSteel-Angel Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I've grown quite accustomed to Infantry's play style

    i wish i could hate you to death

    that forward healing HQ is retarded as shit, don't even get me started on offmap combat group with bazooka-wielding engineers heroic charging my MGs and killing them fffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

    Steel-Angel on
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  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I don't use forward HQ. They've said they're going to remove the ability to plop it down in neutral territory, which will greatly weaken the cheesier rush strategies. Of course, given Relic's time tables, who knows when that'll be. I really assumed it would happen like... now. When they had a great chance to introduce a patch.

    Alas.

    I did use off-map bazooka engineers because they are the best. They are both hilarious and surprisingly useful. If you can't deal with those though I dunno what to say! Particularly with an MG squad... heroic charge makes them better, but what? Not that good.

    Playing up armor now. It's really quite enjoyable to run over the enemy with early game jeeps. I can't wait until I get Allied War Machine at 12 and get to recycle 4 jeeps a minute.

    It's gonna be good!

    For those who are interested, there's a free little bundle up (limited time only..?) for the new open beta.

    Just go to http://www.companyofheroes.com/openbeta and grab a code for freebie items for one of your commanders.

    Comes with
    * 3,000 Free Supply Points
    * 500 Experience Points
    * 1 Free Hero Unit
    * 1 Free Army Item

    Corp.Shephard on
  • local flavor policelocal flavor police Registered User
    edited September 2010
    so i just bought COH on steam for 2.50 i guess thats pretty rockin' then i come here to check the steam thread to see if anyone else has bought it and i see this thread... i guess i know why its on sale now.

    not that i really mind, i mean the game is less than the cheapest bottle of whiskey at my liquor store. but i signed up for the open beta and lookin' forward to good times.

    local flavor police on
    Steam: LocalFlavorPolice
  • Steel-AngelSteel-Angel Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    It's really quite enjoyable to run over the enemy with early game jeeps.

    every time you use a recon jeep to gib a garrisonned MG42 with the laser-guided artillery shell of skill

    jesus dies a little bit

    Steel-Angel on
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  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    every time you use a recon jeep to gib a garrisonned MG42 with the laser-guided artillery shell of skill

    jesus dies a little bit

    I've never actually used recon jeep before! I was talking about Assault Jeep and like 3-4 normal jeeps. I'm planning on giving the recon jeep a shot this go around though.

    Hopefully by level 35 I shall be using the Skilled Jeep, Assault Jeep and Recon jeep in ultimate jeep tandum.
    so i just bought COH on steam for 2.50 i guess thats pretty rockin' then i come here to check the steam thread to see if anyone else has bought it and i see this thread... i guess i know why its on sale now.

    not that i really mind, i mean the game is less than the cheapest bottle of whiskey at my liquor store. but i signed up for the open beta and lookin' forward to good times.

    Well, if you got the expansion and all that jazz for 2.50 it's still a great deal. The open beta only has two of the four factions. The British and panzer elite are not in COHO right now.

    Additionally you probably don't get the whole campaign in COHO (I've not traveled to the bottom of that rabbit hole though), so you've got all the single player content for what is an excellent price.

    Corp.Shephard on
  • local flavor policelocal flavor police Registered User
    edited September 2010
    didnt get any of the xpacs, but im still cool with it. I loves me some singleplayer

    local flavor police on
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  • MelksterMelkster Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I think I'll be playing CoH this weekend a little bit. I'll make it a little real time strategy weekend -- a bit of StarCraft 2, a bit of League of Legends, and a bit of Company of Heroes.

    Anyone who wants to play should add me on Steam!

    Melkster on
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Open beta is here!

    I am looking forward to jumping back into multiplayer and getting destroyed while I work my way back up to my previous skill level.

    Evil Multifarious on
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
  • MelksterMelkster Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Yeah, that's pretty horrible.

    Even more horrible than this game, which seems to become progressively more stupid as one levels up. The various buffs and abilities are seemingly designed to take out all the best parts if the game - suppression, AT emplacements, infantry fleeing from tanks - by making units able to do everything by themselves.

    Evil Multifarious on
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
  • Steel-AngelSteel-Angel Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Yeah, that's pretty horrible.

    Even more horrible than this game, which seems to become proggressively more stupid as one levels up. The various buffs and abilities are seemingly designed to take out all the best parts if the game - suppression, AT emplacements, infantry fleeing from tanks - by making units able to do everything by themselves.

    hey look it's what happened with opposing fronts

    also RIP mr. wood :(

    Steel-Angel on
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  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Yeah opposing fronts ruined the game IMO

    Evil Multifarious on
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
  • local flavor policelocal flavor police Registered User
    edited September 2010
    yeah. some guy eviscerated me last night, all he needed was engineers.

    local flavor police on
    Steam: LocalFlavorPolice
  • Steel-AngelSteel-Angel Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    yeah. some guy eviscerated me last night, all he needed was engineers.

    having fun with the double-BAR deathsquads that also roll with elite armor and toss grenades

    yeah i am too.

    Steel-Angel on
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  • SF_DhalsimSF_Dhalsim Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Yeah, so I am terrible at this. I can't figure out how to get better. I do so many things bad that I can't figure what is right.

    So I'm asking is for the basics.

    How are manpower and munitions manipulated for maximum efficiency, it just seems like you're not rewarded for building tons of "teir 1" units (riflemen etc.)

    I understand that fuel and munitions points are taken based on dependency for the build to be efficient i.e. more fuel needs more fuel points etc. What am I looking for when creating a build for when I need to see how much fuel I'm going to need - am I looking for a unit per minute or building 2 per minute etc.

    Basic tactics on unit use. I understand this is as close as it gets as far as an actual war, so would actually using flanking units etc be of benefit.

    Lastly, do I need to actually guard my points with point defenses? Put up sand bags etc. so as to better protect it? Or do I just need to constantly be on the attack and take their points and not really care about what they.

    I generally play Americans either as Infantry or Airborne.

    SF_Dhalsim on
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  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Grabbed a key, started researching the game, saw that the designer died in a horrible car crash.

    What a weird series of events.

    Darkewolfe on
    What is this I don't even.
  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    SF_Dhalsim wrote: »
    Yeah, so I am terrible at this. I can't figure out how to get better. I do so many things bad that I can't figure what is right.

    So I'm asking is for the basics.

    I generally play Americans either as Infantry or Airborne.

    Let me try and help you out then.
    How are manpower and munitions manipulated for maximum efficiency, it just seems like you're not rewarded for building tons of "teir 1" units (riflemen etc.)

    There is a penalty for fielding a large number of troops, it's one that the Americans have to wrestle with more than the Wehrmacht. Every unit has a certain "upkeep" cost which detracts from your manpower income. If you have a large number of troops, you'll start to feel the burn when your usually 300 manpower per minute is a measly 200 per minute.

    That being said, I would encourage you not to skimp on your tier one units. One of the most popular (and powerful) strategies is to use 4-6 rifleman squads as your first unit. With a large number of squads you can be constantly on the offensive, and set up deadly flanks with multiple squads making pincer strikes. It's a very aggressive play-style that plays to the American strengths well. The rifleman squad is one of the most powerful and well scaling units in the game. There's no need to shy away from it.

    I understand that fuel and munitions points are taken based on dependency for the build to be efficient i.e. more fuel needs more fuel points etc. What am I looking for when creating a build for when I need to see how much fuel I'm going to need - am I looking for a unit per minute or building 2 per minute etc.

    Hmm, not sure what you mean here.

    When you're approaching a build, you do need to look at what you want to get. What you need to get quickly to stay aggressive/competitive.

    I'll use a simple build that I like a lot. BARs into fast Sherman.. This build emphasizes fuel as a priority. I start with a barracks and produce 4-6 riflemen. My primary objective is to secure fuel, while trying to minimize my opponent's fuel income. My first 60 fuel I get will go to the BAR research: which will instantly give all rifleman squads BARs in the field. This will give me a large early game advantage that will keep me in the fight and able to secure/hold fuel points. Munitions are not as important, but they shouldn't be completely ignored. Aside from commander abilities that might need them, the munitions can be used on the BAR's special suppressing fire ability to keep enemy troops in line.

    My next 50 fuel will go into a Supply yard, which keeps my upkeep problems lower. Now I must go for shermans as fast as possible. Tank depot for 90 fuel, and 90 more for a tank (less with a hero tank, but I've not unlocked him yet.)

    Now I've hit the field with a double threat: a powerful veteran rifleman army and a relatively fast medium tank that will require significant anti-armor weapons to deal with. Pick your battles and use the two to neutralize the other's threats. Pick up more Shermans as fuel demands and let your commander abilities fill the gaps. That's the general plan.

    What's important is to have a plan. And to recognize what can counter your plan. I emphasize fuel here not only because I need it to get my Sherman up and BARs up and running quicker, but because he needs a good supply of fuel to access anti-Sherman weapons.
    Basic tactics on unit use. I understand this is as close as it gets as far as an actual war, so would actually using flanking units etc be of benefit.

    Oh yeah. Well timed flanks are the best tool you have as an American player. The cover system in CoH is directional. If you hit them from their side of the cover they get no benefit. One of the biggest hurdles an American player deals with is the MG42. A well timed flank with riflemen can stop MG42s from pinning your troops. It's all about coordination. Like I mentioned earlier, having a large amount of rifleman squads means you can split them into robust combat groups, two or three squads each, and then send them around the enemy from different directions. If one gets in trouble, the enemy will shift to finish it off, leaving their flank exposed for the other group to come in and save the day.
    Lastly, do I need to actually guard my points with point defenses? Put up sand bags etc. so as to better protect it? Or do I just need to constantly be on the attack and take their points and not really care about what they.

    As Americans, it's generally a poor idea to "hunker down" too much. Sandbags can give you better cover, but unless you build the weapon support center, the enemy's long range weapons will force you to move out of that cover in order to fight them. Your strengths lie in mobility and deadly close combat ability. Your riflemen will beat most german units in a close range fight. Range matters in CoH. Units at long range do less damage. Some weapons, like sub-machine guns, need to be close to do their damage.

    Static defenses aren't useless for Americans though. If you push the enemy far back, and capture several of "their points" (most maps are relatively symmetrical, so there are points that are easier for them to control than you), hunkering down can help. Landmines are also a good static defense. They allow you to set traps and defend territory, without committing troops to sit behind walls. It's almost always worth 25 munitions to put landmines on a point that is hotly contested, or through a road that you suspect a nasty vehicular surprise will come through.

    Corp.Shephard on
  • SF_DhalsimSF_Dhalsim Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Shep thanks man, this was exactly what I needed.

    SF_Dhalsim on
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  • DemiurgeDemiurge Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    This game is pretty awesome, but it being Relic the balance is naturally out of whack :P Most glaring concern (to me) is the level system because we often get grouped against much lower level or much higher level guys. Its especially evident when I hit level 20 the other day and got rifles for my engineers, if your opponent doesn't have it you win the first engagement, hands down.

    Demiurge on
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  • Steel-AngelSteel-Angel Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Demiurge wrote: »
    rifles for my engineers

    i hate you and everyone else who uses these on a personal level

    and i have BARs on mine so i hate myself the most :/

    Steel-Angel on
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  • rtsrts Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    You have elite engineers already in Open Beta? I had them in closed beta. I would never use them though because their high cost massively delays your first unit, which against good players makes for a dreadful start to the game.

    Also there is a fund for Brian's wife/unborn child if anyone wants to donate some money. I don't know what kind of life insurance Relic offers it's employees but assuming it isn't amazing, especially for someone who is going to be unable to work for awhile... I think every little bit probably helps a lot.

    rts on
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  • AlegisAlegis Impeckable Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Started to play solo, starting to like infantry doctrine: RANGERS are kickass awesome.

    Fuck yes RANGERS. Opponent kept fielding stugs and pumas. They didn't last.

    Haven't decided yet on which support troop to field with my riflemen (usually mortar vs building MGs), I lose em early to negligence so I got room of improvement on that front. Trying to wield in the assault jeep into my play but my focus is usally on the riflemen/rangers. Only going with 3 riflemen so far.


    Have artillery barrage as third ability but it hurts me. I spend too much ammunition on grenades etc to deal with blobs instead. May have to replace it for something like .. engineer riflemen? Munitions I prefer to spend on grenades and infantry attrition to regain my troops.

    Alegis on
  • DemiurgeDemiurge Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    cakemikz wrote: »
    You have elite engineers already in Open Beta? I had them in closed beta. I would never use them though because their high cost massively delays your first unit, which against good players makes for a dreadful start to the game.

    Retzinsky got Elite engineers along with level 33 so I wouldn't find that terribly surprising.
    Alegis wrote: »
    Started to play solo, starting to like infantry doctrine: RANGERS are kickass awesome.

    Fuck yes RANGERS. Opponent kept fielding stugs and pumas. They didn't last.

    Haven't decided yet on which support troop to field with my riflemen (usually mortar vs building MGs), I lose em early to negligence so I got room of improvement on that front. Trying to wield in the assault jeep into my play but my focus is usally on the riflemen/rangers. Only going with 3 riflemen so far.


    Have artillery barrage as third ability but it hurts me. I spend too much ammunition on grenades etc to deal with blobs instead. May have to replace it for something like .. engineer riflemen? Munitions I prefer to spend on grenades and infantry attrition to regain my troops.

    Assault jeeps are all kinds of awesome, my level 5 jeep is gunning around the map constantly capping points, wasting snipers and getting killed by panzerfaust engineers ( :( )

    Demiurge on
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  • AlegisAlegis Impeckable Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Someone on the CoHO forums mentioned the elite vests on rangers do jack shit, this any true? Rather sad for +75mp if so.

    Not sure what to waste improv points on. Don't want to make the artillery strike more expensive and I'm not that concerned about the recharge rate - don't often float much munition.

    Forward healing barracks maybe. Not sure if engineer riflemen fits my boat, I don't like to stand still as my infantry blob is vulnerable that way.

    Undecided between Advanced Defenses Engineer and Repair Engineers. The latter better for team games so I can aid with the pershing repairs. Does the 25% cost decrease of adv def engineers apply to base buildings as well?
    Assault Jeep is lvl 5 now thanks to custom game farming.

    Alegis on
  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I suggest the defense engineers unless you're playing armored company. Even then the trade offs for repair engineers are quite hefty.

    Lets look at the advantages of the two.

    Both engineer squads end up with +20% health (repairs might get 121% max health if it is a multiplicative bonus, but not a big deal).

    Repair:
    Repairs at the rate of 1.5 engineer squads
    Takes reduced (maybe none) bonus damage while repairing

    Advanced Defense Engineers:
    25% faster build times on all buildings
    50% faster build times on basic defensive buildings (anything in the basic defensive build menu)
    25% less resources spent on defensive buildings (this one is a big deal, let's break it down)
    - Mines built by these engineers cost 18 each (very cheap)
    - Observation posts cost a mere 150 manpower
    - MG emplacements are 150/15

    These are some pretty crazy bonuses. I can place two observation posts up early game for roughly the price of a single rifle squad. That's not a hefty price, and the observation posts are done in less than half the time. Likewise, the usually terrible allied MG post becomes super fast to erect and pretty reasonably priced. Additionally, you can never have too many mines. Particularly for Infantry doctrine, who can camouflage engineers and have them lay landmines under the relative safety of the camo.

    The only real edge that repair engineers hold is in the early game where the squad could be conceivably repairing a jeep while fighting early squads. Their bonuses seem pretty minor in the late game. I'd honestly rather build a normal squad and give it a flamethrower late game. Advanced Defense Engineers have unique utility that remains useful throughout the game though.

    Plus, if you're silly like our group you might send your starting squad to the battlefield to fight and take building spots from the axis. Advanced defense engineers will help offset your later barracks with a faster construction speed.

    Corp.Shephard on
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