and then here's the finalized fox spirit. I'm not sure if I like or hate this one yet, so I want some crits on it please! I gave myself way too difficult a task drawing a yellow ethereal spirit in late afternoon... but hopefully it works?
i'd Bring the values in the back ground a little closer together for the fox one.
I feel its a little to, in the middle. Either crop in on the girl and foxhead-- or pull out more and really push how the fox tail is huge and all around her.
I love the style you've got going, but I'm not really getting a late afternoon-vibe from it. The palette just seems like it gets a bit washed out, and I'm not feeling any hues that I associate with late afternoon, like reds. The fox spirit especially - which I love - seems like it could have some more ethereal quality to it if it wasn't surrounded by such a uniform yellow. I think you could quite some mileage out of adjusting the colours in post, I had a quick stab at it to show what I mean but I'm sure someone less heavy-handed could do much better:
I find it odd that you have pretty much one dark area in the composition to capitalize on pushing the glowy spiritishness of the fox and have chosen not to make use of it.
@cakemikz I tried adding some glowyness into the blues of the igloo but it looked muddy to me, do you have suggestions? I think I'm just doing it wrong
edit... holy hell... blogger destroys colors! or maybe it's just the internet.. hmmmm
@kevindee I like the reds you've added i think i'll do more of a reddish hue to the snow and keep the fox more yellowy.
looking good. Im losing the fox a big due to how bright he against the snow. Crank up snow brightness.
The background is also kind of plane looking. Search for more dynamic tundra images for ideas. Right now its flat, with same sized mountains on the border.
I went ahead and did a quick and dirty version of what I meant. Not so much working more orange light into the shadows as literally rolling the fox spirit right through them. I also went ahead and brightened the snow as PROX suggested. I think it's a good idea though changes the time of day.
I totally understand the too many cooks in one kitchen type of thing, your work has a natural tendency to draw criticism (constructive) because I think people all connect with it on one level or another. I have seen something like 10 paintovers of just one of your paintings before. So I will qualify this by saying I obviously won't be hurt if you don't care for my idea.
That is perfect! It adds depth that I was missing and just really works for me. Using it. Thanks cake/prox!
I'll admit there are days when my mind just feels completely overloaded by the different, sometimes conflicting crits I get. I also have a bad tendency to want to make everyone like what I do so it leads to me fiddling with something till I ruin it but I've also learned a lot from that.
It's made me stronger and I always do appreciate the feedback I'm not just saying that. So even if I don't use people's crits I still appreciate people telling me what they like/don't like
I do worry that I rely too heavily on it. Sometimes I feel like I can't do something great on my own and need other artists to help me. It makes me feel like if you put me in a room by myself and told me to go concept to completion it wouldn't look good and maybe I'm lying by putting this stuff into portfolios because people help me so much. Like the first version of this and the final are completely different... In such a good way! I think it's a product of learning it all this way maybe... Or just the fact that I still have a shit ton to learn.
Even as I type that it sounds crazy but... I can't be the only one who kicks myself for not seeing such an obvious thing to make it look better?
Eh... Crazy ramblings but I'd be interested in hearing how other people feel or if I'm just alone in my craziness haha
Also don't let that stop you from critting me! I needs it haha!
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BroloBroseidonLord of the BroceanRegistered Userregular
I love her "please just let me finish my igloo" expression.
I dont like crits but know I need em. Feedback is important. But you also have to have an internal filter. Being an artist is a crazy balance between accepting peer review, but maintaining your own voice. You are not alone in your insanity.
I think your images are somewhat restrained though. Your sketches are really wild. I'd like to see what happens if you were to cut loose on a painting.
Yeah you're right I need to loosen up and gain the confidence I have in painting that I do in drawing. Unfortunately I think that really just takes time. I practice drawing way more than I do painting which is why i take landscape and figure painting classes. Those are helping me a lot though and I feel the benefits of painting with oils starting to come through in my digital work. I'll try to be a bit looser with the next one
Hmmm are you in CMYK or rgb mode? That does stuff. Also what color profile are you using? That'll change your values. This is good looking though beavs. I think you are at the point where you need to think : New piece or continue noodling this one? There a few minor tweaks that you could spend hours on or you could make an entirely new thing.
Looking good, but I would work harder to make sure that it doesn't feel like you are painting 'around' the fox with the snow. Paint those chunkier white strokes right through him and then erase the areas they overlap him if necessary. I wouldn't worry about needing input to produce good stuff. Beyond that I don't think that's true, I also don't think it's a big deal. Getting input and then implementing or learning from it is a large part of how we get better... which is why we take classes and post on art forums where really handsome dwarves lurk.
Actually what I find particularly interesting is that you are doing some traditional painting, including plein air. I would love to see some of those efforts. What school if any are you taking those classes with? I have a buddy who works in animation who has a good sized group of people who go out drawing/painting landscapes every Sunday in and around LA if you are looking for more opportunities.
@cakemiks: I agree about the snow. I'm going to leave it for now because as prox says i've picked it to pieces. I'm going to return to it in a couple of days to do some tweaking when I've had some distance from it mentally.
The painting stuff: Actually, I'm taking some classes at a community college. I really respect the prof I have, she's an amazing figurative painter. I also go to a tuesday/thursday session in santa ana. I'm signing up for some stuff in LA when this semester ends as well. I'm doing the plein aire just on my own. I'd love to meet up with folks, definitely send over the contact! I'd really appreciate it.
But yeah I'll post the work I've done when I get pics taken of it. I decided I needed to get away from digital for a bit and I'm really glad I did. I'm learning so much about color and value. There's something about having to mix your own colors that really forces you to think hard about the choices you're making. I'm not just sticking to oils either, though that's what I prefer. I'm also using pastel which is really interesting. Basically I'm exploring right now. I was in a rut, I needed out of it so I turned to traditional and I'm pretty obsessed with it now. I wish I started sooner.
So you can give me an "I told you so" from a couple years ago hahah
Moving on though! Here's the caribou spirit design:
I like this one a lot personally, though travis thinks it's hard to tell what's going on.. that's sort of the goal... sort of? I want this spirit to appear as a whole herd since caribou don't travel alone, they have strength in numbers. I wanted it to be somewhat confusing, like you can't tell which arm belongs to who (actually the three in the front each share an arm with their neighbor)
anyways, I'd love your thoughts
I am just excited I might be able to add a Beavotron original to my collection someday. I'll hang it next to my Justin Gerard and Larry McDougal paintings.
I like the new spirit though he is right that it is a little chaotic. It will be hard to tell if it really works until it's in context to be honest.
yeah i sort of figured that cake, I'm doing the painting of this spirit tomorrow, so we'll see!
Hahaha man that's super flattering, larry macdougall has an incredible style, he's like animation meets arthur rackham
I like the caribou design. I think the chaotic feel works, considering how hard it can be to pick out an individual from a herd. But if you do want to simplify, maybe just make the antlers a bit less branchy, and lose a line or two in the necks of the first few. (But really I think it flows fine as it is. ^_^)
Were you going with a yellow and reddish hue for this spirit similar to the fox, or something different like green?
thanks sier! this spirit is orangey/red with yellow. sort of similar to the fox, i pick the colors based on how the character relates to the story. the caribou herd represents warmth and community so...orangey.
the lemming spirit is green, cause his message to her is to be humble. i think green is a humble color.
thanks tynic!
kazu taught me something that has really stuck with me
you can't have warmth in a painting without cool
so as soon as i remember that, things just happen for me
he also tells me to tell myself i'm lighting a scene not painting it
that also helps tremendously
the guy is a fountain of knowledge.
BroloBroseidonLord of the BroceanRegistered Userregular
Not sure if that initally reads as a heard of Caribou, rather than as one three-headed Caribou. The perspective makes it a little difficult to gauge the scale of what's going on as well, it seems a little more like a tiny Ilug in front of a normal size Caribou.
Dropping the perspective down to her level might do a better job of conveying the size difference:
that's a good point rolo but it's too late at this point to drop the perspective on this. that'd require starting from scratch.
prox i had it pushed to the left and got the crit from my studio mates that it needed to come more center and I agreed with them on that. it looks better more centered with her off to the side than it did with a lot of space on the side.
I don't know what to do about the santa's sleigh thing
I like rolo's idea, I might do another painting of this scene from that more dramatic angle later. i still want to fix this one though.
I dunno about having it so left, i feel like it breaks the composition straight down the middle and it's really left heavy. thoughts?
edit: It does lead your eye into the distance. I think as a comic panel it would be a stronger composition that way. However as a stand-alone illustration I'm less convinced.
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and then here's the finalized fox spirit. I'm not sure if I like or hate this one yet, so I want some crits on it please! I gave myself way too difficult a task drawing a yellow ethereal spirit in late afternoon... but hopefully it works?
i'd Bring the values in the back ground a little closer together for the fox one.
I feel its a little to, in the middle. Either crop in on the girl and foxhead-- or pull out more and really push how the fox tail is huge and all around her.
@cakemikz I tried adding some glowyness into the blues of the igloo but it looked muddy to me, do you have suggestions? I think I'm just doing it wrong
edit... holy hell... blogger destroys colors! or maybe it's just the internet.. hmmmm
@kevindee I like the reds you've added i think i'll do more of a reddish hue to the snow and keep the fox more yellowy.
The background is also kind of plane looking. Search for more dynamic tundra images for ideas. Right now its flat, with same sized mountains on the border.
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
I totally understand the too many cooks in one kitchen type of thing, your work has a natural tendency to draw criticism (constructive) because I think people all connect with it on one level or another. I have seen something like 10 paintovers of just one of your paintings before. So I will qualify this by saying I obviously won't be hurt if you don't care for my idea.
I'll admit there are days when my mind just feels completely overloaded by the different, sometimes conflicting crits I get. I also have a bad tendency to want to make everyone like what I do so it leads to me fiddling with something till I ruin it but I've also learned a lot from that.
It's made me stronger and I always do appreciate the feedback I'm not just saying that. So even if I don't use people's crits I still appreciate people telling me what they like/don't like
I do worry that I rely too heavily on it. Sometimes I feel like I can't do something great on my own and need other artists to help me. It makes me feel like if you put me in a room by myself and told me to go concept to completion it wouldn't look good and maybe I'm lying by putting this stuff into portfolios because people help me so much. Like the first version of this and the final are completely different... In such a good way! I think it's a product of learning it all this way maybe... Or just the fact that I still have a shit ton to learn.
Even as I type that it sounds crazy but... I can't be the only one who kicks myself for not seeing such an obvious thing to make it look better?
Eh... Crazy ramblings but I'd be interested in hearing how other people feel or if I'm just alone in my craziness haha
Also don't let that stop you from critting me! I needs it haha!
I think your images are somewhat restrained though. Your sketches are really wild. I'd like to see what happens if you were to cut loose on a painting.
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
Thanks!
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
man i swear the snow is whiter on my screen... it's like neutralizing it when i put it on the internet.
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
Actually what I find particularly interesting is that you are doing some traditional painting, including plein air. I would love to see some of those efforts. What school if any are you taking those classes with? I have a buddy who works in animation who has a good sized group of people who go out drawing/painting landscapes every Sunday in and around LA if you are looking for more opportunities.
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
The painting stuff: Actually, I'm taking some classes at a community college. I really respect the prof I have, she's an amazing figurative painter. I also go to a tuesday/thursday session in santa ana. I'm signing up for some stuff in LA when this semester ends as well. I'm doing the plein aire just on my own. I'd love to meet up with folks, definitely send over the contact! I'd really appreciate it.
But yeah I'll post the work I've done when I get pics taken of it. I decided I needed to get away from digital for a bit and I'm really glad I did. I'm learning so much about color and value. There's something about having to mix your own colors that really forces you to think hard about the choices you're making. I'm not just sticking to oils either, though that's what I prefer. I'm also using pastel which is really interesting. Basically I'm exploring right now. I was in a rut, I needed out of it so I turned to traditional and I'm pretty obsessed with it now. I wish I started sooner.
So you can give me an "I told you so" from a couple years ago hahah
Moving on though! Here's the caribou spirit design:
I like this one a lot personally, though travis thinks it's hard to tell what's going on.. that's sort of the goal... sort of? I want this spirit to appear as a whole herd since caribou don't travel alone, they have strength in numbers. I wanted it to be somewhat confusing, like you can't tell which arm belongs to who (actually the three in the front each share an arm with their neighbor)
anyways, I'd love your thoughts
I would spend some time refining the shapes to be more graceful and direct.
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
I like the new spirit though he is right that it is a little chaotic. It will be hard to tell if it really works until it's in context to be honest.
Hahaha man that's super flattering, larry macdougall has an incredible style, he's like animation meets arthur rackham
Were you going with a yellow and reddish hue for this spirit similar to the fox, or something different like green?
the lemming spirit is green, cause his message to her is to be humble. i think green is a humble color.
and the caribou painting!
also I updated my portfolio website! It's gotten a facelift: http://alexneonakis.com
Love the pallette you've got going there, the fox one is really popping now and it's beautiful.
kazu taught me something that has really stuck with me
you can't have warmth in a painting without cool
so as soon as i remember that, things just happen for me
he also tells me to tell myself i'm lighting a scene not painting it
that also helps tremendously
the guy is a fountain of knowledge.
Dropping the perspective down to her level might do a better job of conveying the size difference:
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
prox i had it pushed to the left and got the crit from my studio mates that it needed to come more center and I agreed with them on that. it looks better more centered with her off to the side than it did with a lot of space on the side.
I don't know what to do about the santa's sleigh thing
artistjeffc.tumblr.com http://www.etsy.com/shop/artistjeffc
I like rolo's idea, I might do another painting of this scene from that more dramatic angle later. i still want to fix this one though.
I dunno about having it so left, i feel like it breaks the composition straight down the middle and it's really left heavy. thoughts?
edit: It does lead your eye into the distance. I think as a comic panel it would be a stronger composition that way. However as a stand-alone illustration I'm less convinced.