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Computer upgrading: Old Motherboard and Video Card Compatibility.
zerg rush
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
My current machine is an aging system with a P35-DS3P motherboard. I've got three problems
1) My current videocard (8800 GTS) is constantly overheating and I'd like to play ToR and other new games. Max graphics isn't an issue, but not getting red-screen hard crashes is important (known problem with that card). The only reason my machine isn't dead right now is that I've got a temperature monitor that auto-closes any games when I start to get around 90 degrees Celsius.
2) I don't have a lot of cash, which means I want a good deal. I want something that will last for a decent price, but I don't know what's good. Apparently a 440 GT ($70) is worse than what I already have, even though it came out 1 year ago vs 5 years for my current card (I'm confused how that is). It seems like a 550 GTX ($125) is the best bang for the buck.
3) I don't have enough money to replace my whole system in one go. I got a little windfall for christmas, so a new videocard would be nice. However, I eventually plan on replacing the motherboard/CPU, getting more RAM, etc. I need something that will work with both my current machine and a newer machine. My current machine has a PCI Express 1.0 x16 slot, but all the new ones are PCI Express 2.0. I've heard conflicting reports about compatibility, that sometimes they'll work (but be slower) and other times that BIOS's will just fail to boot. Is there a compatibility checker I can use to know for sure?
I used to be all savvy with stuff, but I haven't checked for years since I built this machine. Any other advice like things to watch out for or other cards to look at would be very welcome. Thanks in advance.
1) My current videocard (8800 GTS) is constantly overheating and I'd like to play ToR and other new games. Max graphics isn't an issue, but not getting red-screen hard crashes is important (known problem with that card). The only reason my machine isn't dead right now is that I've got a temperature monitor that auto-closes any games when I start to get around 90 degrees Celsius.
2) I don't have a lot of cash, which means I want a good deal. I want something that will last for a decent price, but I don't know what's good. Apparently a 440 GT ($70) is worse than what I already have, even though it came out 1 year ago vs 5 years for my current card (I'm confused how that is). It seems like a 550 GTX ($125) is the best bang for the buck.
3) I don't have enough money to replace my whole system in one go. I got a little windfall for christmas, so a new videocard would be nice. However, I eventually plan on replacing the motherboard/CPU, getting more RAM, etc. I need something that will work with both my current machine and a newer machine. My current machine has a PCI Express 1.0 x16 slot, but all the new ones are PCI Express 2.0. I've heard conflicting reports about compatibility, that sometimes they'll work (but be slower) and other times that BIOS's will just fail to boot. Is there a compatibility checker I can use to know for sure?
I used to be all savvy with stuff, but I haven't checked for years since I built this machine. Any other advice like things to watch out for or other cards to look at would be very welcome. Thanks in advance.
zerg rush on
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http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/150453/computer-build-thread-amd-disappoints-and-other-obvious-statements#Item_1897
PCI-E 2.0 has twice the bandwidth of PCI-E 1.0, but unless you are planning to put a rather powerful (let's say an overclocked GTX 560Ti) in your 1.0 slot, it shouldn't throttle the card very much at all.
And thanks for informing me about compatibility between the two. I feel much safer knowing someone who's already done it, even if the specs say it should be fine.
If a game is CPU bottlenecked it usually means you're free to maximise resolution and graphics settings without loss of FPS, due to the GPU taking the load. If he's running TOR already without major framerate issues then any card upgrade will be beneficial. The fact that a faster CPU would push say, a 40-FPS CPU cap to 90-FPS won't make the game more playable, and he'll have a great card when he does find money to upgrade the rest of the system.
This is incorrect entirely. All the data must go through the CPU first before hitting the video card, the slower the CPU, the slower the FPS will go. If your CPU sucks, no amount of awesome video card will gain you more than moderate FPS. Parts need to match up in performance, or else you bottleneck, buying a super high end video card when you have a crappy CPU is a waste of money.
I'm not sure how it's incorrect. My statement was that the CPU WILL bottleneck your FPS. However high screen resolutions, and graphical effects such as FSAA, texture filtering, lighting etcetra are 99% handled by the GPU so while the FPS may not go up, you'll be able to turn those effects up without your FPS going down.
The goal is not to make the FPS go from playable to pointlessly fast. It's to make the game look a lot nicer. It sure beats buying a moderate graphics card now to 'match' the old CPU then upgrading both later.
Its still incorrect though. He might see a slight boost but nothing more. He wont be able to crank anything up other than possibly the resolution due to more video memory.
I am saying that buying a high end card is pointless if he cant utilize it properly. He is wasting his money. It seems you dont understand how a bottleneck works. So here:[url=" http://benchmarkextreme.com/Articles/CPU Bottleneck Analysis/P1.html
"] http://benchmarkextreme.com/Articles/CPU Bottleneck Analysis/P1.html
[/url]
This may help you (and the op.) out in why a purchase such as the one you are suggesting would simply be wasted funds.
For some games though, once a CPU hits the higher marks ( 3.0 and above in ghz.) it starts to depend on the game engine itself and how it utilizes each piece of hardware. In this case I can't really speak for it since I don't know the inner workings of TOR's game engine. Though I do know it isnt very intensive graphically (Not a lot of bells and whistles to turn up.)
Personally i'd say hes already in the right mindset. Nothing higher end than a 450/550 ( which are actually very similar cards.) as any more than that is wasted potential.
The motherboard is only PCI-E 2.0, but that shouldn't be an issue for operability.
Do you have the separate power connection to the GPU from the power supply?
Do you have your onboard graphics disabled in the BIOS?
Are you getting a black screen after POST, or is there no display at all?
You can't give someone a pirate ship in one game, and then take it back in the next game. It's rude.
Now on the new CPU being a must or not it sure depends on what the old one is, what the graphics card is and what resolution you're playing. An extreme example - I run with a five+ year old CPU, a Core i7-870, and a Fury X and the CPU is not a bottle neck since I play in 4K resolution.
I think that often it is overlooked that unless one has a really fast graphics card and play with low to medium resolutions then only the slow CPU's are much of an bottle neck. So if one is wanting an old rig to live a bit longer often it is better to like replace the monitor or maybe add a second one.