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[Mass Effect]: Victory & Commendation Packs out! Mark ALL spoilers or BANSHEES!!

2456798

Posts

  • DeaderinredDeaderinred Registered User regular
    lol that suggestion page at bioware is giving out some great stuff, i like the idea that you should see your war assets, gun mounted elcors and the
    indoc theory
    seem to be the top suggestions.

  • AegeriAegeri Tiny wee bacteriums Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    new threadddd.

    heard the endings are great, approved by the deception guy.

    Wouldn't it be so awesome if he did have something to do with it? It would totally explain a lot.

    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    Man...I'm psychic.

  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    Krathoon wrote: »
    The PA pretty much encapsulated my sentiment on the ending silliness. People need to learn that they are not entitled to change someone else's work.

    Neither should Bioware think they're somehow above petty things like a logical, rational ending which people will enjoy. I mean, I certainly agree with the notion that Bioware owns the work and not the fans. I have no debate on that issue.

    However, after two games, something on the order of three hundred dollars, and dozens upon dozens of hours, yeah, I think the average fan has every right to expect an ending in line with all the effort they've put it into the series. But that's an expectation, not an entitlement. At the end of the day, the Mass Effect franchise is a product. If the product doesn't meet the expectations, then it's not a good product.

    Though it should be pointed out that the part where the product fails is relatively small compared to where the product succeeds.

  • AegeriAegeri Tiny wee bacteriums Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    The unfortunate and real debate in this is in how important is an ending to somethings quality. It's indisputable to me that ME3 is one of the best games ever made and certainly one of the deepest (taken in the context of all three games) RPGs ever made. Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two. I can't determine if this is irrational or rational or not, because ordinarily I don't really care about if a story is stupid or not - only if the gameplay is fun. I guess this is just how well Bioware succeeded in getting me invested in the story and characters as well as the gameplay. It just doesn't feel the same game anymore and the sense of satisfaction I got out of them before is now gone.

    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
  • CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Dox the PI wrote: »
    Drell Adept is the master class
    there can be only one and he is it

    Drell Adept: "Oh man, I'm so awesome with my flips and kicks. Oh no, I'm dead because I have no barriers."

    Ninjas are not made for frontal assaults!
    Unless they have a gunship backing them up, I guess?

    Cambiata on
    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
  • JucJuc EdmontonRegistered User regular
    edited March 2012
    I personally hate the ending, I'm also not trying to get it changed.
    But I'm sure saying the ending is ass.
    I'm trying to let people know when they decide to play the game that hey, watch out, the ending has a fair chance of pissing you off ... but the rest of the game is super awesome.

    I've already had a few people angrily messaging me at 2am as they finnish the game.
    and that got me wondering.
    How many bloody people finish games at 2am? (this post, also made at 2am)

    Juc on
  • KrathoonKrathoon Registered User regular
    Forar wrote: »
    Krathoon wrote:
    People need to learn that they are not entitled to change someone else's work.

    http://masseffect.livejournal.com/1365476.html
    A Message From Casey Hudson
    'There’s been a lot of discussion and debate about the conclusion of Mass Effect 3, so I thought I’d share my perspective with you here. I’ll avoid outright spoilers, but I’d still recommend finishing the game and experiencing it for yourself before reading this.

    For the last eight years, Mass Effect has been a labor of love for our team; love for the characters we’ve created, for the medium of video games, and for the fans that have supported us. For us and for you, Mass Effect 3 had to live up to a lot of expectations, not only for a great gaming experience, but for a resolution to the countless storylines and decisions you’ve made as a player since the journey began in 2007. So we designed Mass Effect 3 to be a series of endings to key plots and storylines, each culminating in scenes that show you the consequences of your actions. You then carry the knowledge of these consequences with you as you complete the final moments of your journey.

    We always intended that the scale of the conflict and the underlying theme of sacrifice would lead to a bittersweet ending—to do otherwise would betray the agonizing decisions Shepard had to make along the way. Still, we wanted to give players the chance to experience an inspiring and uplifting ending; in a story where you face a hopeless struggle for basic survival, we see the final moments and imagery as offering victory and hope in the context of sacrifice and reflection.

    We've had some incredibly positive reactions to Mass Effect 3, from the New York Times declaring it “a gripping, coherent triumph”, to Penny Arcade calling it “an amazing accomplishment”, to emails and tweets from players who have given us the most profound words of appreciation we've ever received.

    But we also recognize that some of our most passionate fans needed more closure, more answers, and more time to say goodbye to their stories—and these comments are equally valid. Player feedback such as this has always been an essential ingredient in the development of the series.

    I am extremely proud of what this team has accomplished, from the first art concepts for the Mass Effect universe to the final moments of Mass Effect 3. But we didn't do it on our own. Over the course of the series, Mass Effect has been a shared experience between the development team and our fans—not just a shared experience in playing the games, but in designing and developing them. An outpouring of love for Garrus and Tali led to their inclusion as love interests in Mass Effect 2. A request for deeper RPG systems led to key design changes in Mass Effect 3. Your feedback has always mattered. Mass Effect is a collaboration between developers and players, and we continue to listen.

    So where do we go from here? Throughout the next year, we will support Mass Effect 3 by working on new content. And we’ll keep listening, because your insights and constructive feedback will help determine what that content should be. This is not the last you’ll hear of Commander Shepard.

    We look forward to your continued support and involvement as we work together to shape the remaining experiences in the story of the Mass Effect trilogy.

    Thanks for taking this journey with us.

    Casey Hudson

    Emphasis mine.

    See the bolded? It appears that the very creators agree that the fanbase has a vested interest in how the story was shaped, and they are acknowledging the displeasure presented by those same fans.

    So... match point.

    I am fine with them acknowledging the fans, just as long as they don't end up catering to them. That is when they lose their creative integrity. From your quote, it looks like they plan to maintain that.

  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Really, I just hope Bioware handles this situation correctly.

    Because I don't think it is right to leave things the way they are.

    But neither do I think they should get into the habit of letting people think they can get their way as long as they complain loud enough.

    It is a strange situation they've gotten themselves into.

    Dragkonias on
  • -Tal-Tal Registered User regular
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    PNk1Ml4.png
  • chiasaur11chiasaur11 Never doubt a raccoon. Do you think it's trademarked?Registered User regular
    Juc wrote: »
    I personally hate the ending, I'm also not trying to get it changed.
    But I'm sure saying the ending is ass.
    I'm trying to let people know when they decide to play the game that hey, watch out, the ending has a fair chance of pissing you off ... but the rest of the game is super awesome.

    I've already had a few people angrily messaging me at 2am as they finnish the game.
    and that got me wondering.
    How many bloody people finish games at 2am? (this post, also made at 2am)

    Well, I'm in the gang. Or maybe it was a little later.
    Just couldn't stop midway through London.

  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    Juc wrote: »
    I personally hate the ending, I'm also not trying to get it changed.
    But I'm sure saying the ending is ass.
    I'm trying to let people know when they decide to play the game that hey, watch out, the ending has a fair chance of pissing you off ... but the rest of the game is super awesome.

    I've already had a few people angrily messaging me at 2am as they finnish the game.
    and that got me wondering.
    How many bloody people finish games at 2am? (this post, also made at 2am)

    I pretty much stayed up playing ME3 until 5am for 3 days straight.

  • OrcaOrca Also known as Espressosaurus WrexRegistered User regular
    edited March 2012
    -Tal wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    Yeah.

    Usually in second+ times through, I'll turn on subtitles and spacebar through conversations.

    I...don't really have the desire to do that this time.

    I mean, I want to get to the shooty, but I also want to hear the interactions and stuff.

    Orca on
  • HeisenbergHeisenberg Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    I finished the game at like 5am because once I started the endgame there was no way I was going to bed without finishing, and it took way longer than expected. Going to bed after that ending was bizarre.

    I think my immediate reaction was just shaking my head and laughing.

    Heisenberg on
  • ShenShen Registered User regular
    What are the different relationship fights that can occur in the game? I know that if you haven't confirmed a relationship with anyone but flirted with both, your love interests from the first and second game take nasty digs at each other. I'm presuming Ashley/Tali, Liara/Tali, Kaidan/Garrus and Liara/Garrus? I find the last one hard to believe, we're all bros here :(

    3DS: 2234-8122-8398 | Battle.net (EU): Ladi#2485
    ladi.png
  • eeSanGeeSanG I slice like a goddamn hammer. Registered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    I'm having a lot of trouble continuing my second playthrough.
    Because the multiplayer is so fun!

    LFMGb.jpg
    Slice like a god damn hammer. LoL: Rafflesia / BNet: Talonflame#11979
  • CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Krathoon wrote: »
    Forar wrote: »
    Krathoon wrote:
    People need to learn that they are not entitled to change someone else's work.

    http://masseffect.livejournal.com/1365476.html
    A Message From Casey Hudson
    'There’s been a lot of discussion and debate about the conclusion of Mass Effect 3, so I thought I’d share my perspective with you here. I’ll avoid outright spoilers, but I’d still recommend finishing the game and experiencing it for yourself before reading this.

    For the last eight years, Mass Effect has been a labor of love for our team; love for the characters we’ve created, for the medium of video games, and for the fans that have supported us. For us and for you, Mass Effect 3 had to live up to a lot of expectations, not only for a great gaming experience, but for a resolution to the countless storylines and decisions you’ve made as a player since the journey began in 2007. So we designed Mass Effect 3 to be a series of endings to key plots and storylines, each culminating in scenes that show you the consequences of your actions. You then carry the knowledge of these consequences with you as you complete the final moments of your journey.

    We always intended that the scale of the conflict and the underlying theme of sacrifice would lead to a bittersweet ending—to do otherwise would betray the agonizing decisions Shepard had to make along the way. Still, we wanted to give players the chance to experience an inspiring and uplifting ending; in a story where you face a hopeless struggle for basic survival, we see the final moments and imagery as offering victory and hope in the context of sacrifice and reflection.

    We've had some incredibly positive reactions to Mass Effect 3, from the New York Times declaring it “a gripping, coherent triumph”, to Penny Arcade calling it “an amazing accomplishment”, to emails and tweets from players who have given us the most profound words of appreciation we've ever received.

    But we also recognize that some of our most passionate fans needed more closure, more answers, and more time to say goodbye to their stories—and these comments are equally valid. Player feedback such as this has always been an essential ingredient in the development of the series.

    I am extremely proud of what this team has accomplished, from the first art concepts for the Mass Effect universe to the final moments of Mass Effect 3. But we didn't do it on our own. Over the course of the series, Mass Effect has been a shared experience between the development team and our fans—not just a shared experience in playing the games, but in designing and developing them. An outpouring of love for Garrus and Tali led to their inclusion as love interests in Mass Effect 2. A request for deeper RPG systems led to key design changes in Mass Effect 3. Your feedback has always mattered. Mass Effect is a collaboration between developers and players, and we continue to listen.

    So where do we go from here? Throughout the next year, we will support Mass Effect 3 by working on new content. And we’ll keep listening, because your insights and constructive feedback will help determine what that content should be. This is not the last you’ll hear of Commander Shepard.

    We look forward to your continued support and involvement as we work together to shape the remaining experiences in the story of the Mass Effect trilogy.

    Thanks for taking this journey with us.

    Casey Hudson

    Emphasis mine.

    See the bolded? It appears that the very creators agree that the fanbase has a vested interest in how the story was shaped, and they are acknowledging the displeasure presented by those same fans.

    So... match point.

    I am fine with them acknowledging the fans, just as long as they don't end up catering to them. That is when they lose their creative integrity. From your quote, it looks like they plan to maintain that.

    Except... Bioware's PR is built around catering to the fans. People wanted Garrus and Tali to be love interests; they became love interests. People felt like there wasn't enough customization in ME2; customization was expanded for ME3. Bioware has crafted a lovely image of themselves as a company that listens when the fans complain about something. And to their credit, when they listen to fan "demands", even the times I looked at the demands and thought myself "Oh, that is so stupid, just shut up", the thing that Bioware came up with in answer to the 'demand' was almost always amazing. I mean look at the complaints from ME2 that they address in ME3: More 'friend' conversations with the crew, more of the crew being friendly with each other. More callbacks to past decisions. Better written 'relationships' for people who have had one for more than one game. Insane improvements in gameplay. The list goes on.

    Maybe Bioware just pretended to be listening to the fans, and these were things they were going to implement from their own creative desires. I don't actually know. But they've cultivated the image that they listen to the fans. Now they are facing the other side of that coin, which is when they make a serious writing misstep, then the fans who have been invited in as "collaborators" will feel like they have a right to say "No, that's just bad. Write something that makes sense. This is your peer review: revise what was written, please."

    And I don't see anything wrong with that, personally. Any writer who feels like they are above peer review is kind of a goose.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    eeSanG wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    I'm having a lot of trouble continuing my second playthrough.
    Because the multiplayer is so fun!

    This is what's happening with me too.

    Every time I go to start my second playthrough I'm like, "You know I could be unlocking crates right now."

    >_>

  • CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    eeSanG wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    I'm having a lot of trouble continuing my second playthrough.
    Because the multiplayer is so fun!

    This is what's happening with me too.

    Every time I go to start my second playthrough I'm like, "You know I could be unlocking crates right now."

    >_>

    Ha ha, this is happening to me with some frequency.

    The only reason I don't do more MP is probably because I can never seem to get together with enough PA folk, and I hate doing pubs.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
  • MatriasMatrias Registered User regular
    I don't really think Bioware has any responsibility to change the ending and I think petitions are silly, but I will throw my voice into the whining on the off chance they succumb to pressure. After such an amazing back to back experience with ME2 and ME3, I really can't stomach the ending.

    at the very least, I think Bioware needs to throw out some content that smooths things over. doesn't have to be a retcon but it has to be something.

    3DS/Pokemon Friend Code - 2122-5878-9273 - Kyle
  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Krathoon wrote: »
    Forar wrote: »
    Krathoon wrote:
    People need to learn that they are not entitled to change someone else's work.

    http://masseffect.livejournal.com/1365476.html
    A Message From Casey Hudson
    'There’s been a lot of discussion and debate about the conclusion of Mass Effect 3, so I thought I’d share my perspective with you here. I’ll avoid outright spoilers, but I’d still recommend finishing the game and experiencing it for yourself before reading this.

    For the last eight years, Mass Effect has been a labor of love for our team; love for the characters we’ve created, for the medium of video games, and for the fans that have supported us. For us and for you, Mass Effect 3 had to live up to a lot of expectations, not only for a great gaming experience, but for a resolution to the countless storylines and decisions you’ve made as a player since the journey began in 2007. So we designed Mass Effect 3 to be a series of endings to key plots and storylines, each culminating in scenes that show you the consequences of your actions. You then carry the knowledge of these consequences with you as you complete the final moments of your journey.

    We always intended that the scale of the conflict and the underlying theme of sacrifice would lead to a bittersweet ending—to do otherwise would betray the agonizing decisions Shepard had to make along the way. Still, we wanted to give players the chance to experience an inspiring and uplifting ending; in a story where you face a hopeless struggle for basic survival, we see the final moments and imagery as offering victory and hope in the context of sacrifice and reflection.

    We've had some incredibly positive reactions to Mass Effect 3, from the New York Times declaring it “a gripping, coherent triumph”, to Penny Arcade calling it “an amazing accomplishment”, to emails and tweets from players who have given us the most profound words of appreciation we've ever received.

    But we also recognize that some of our most passionate fans needed more closure, more answers, and more time to say goodbye to their stories—and these comments are equally valid. Player feedback such as this has always been an essential ingredient in the development of the series.

    I am extremely proud of what this team has accomplished, from the first art concepts for the Mass Effect universe to the final moments of Mass Effect 3. But we didn't do it on our own. Over the course of the series, Mass Effect has been a shared experience between the development team and our fans—not just a shared experience in playing the games, but in designing and developing them. An outpouring of love for Garrus and Tali led to their inclusion as love interests in Mass Effect 2. A request for deeper RPG systems led to key design changes in Mass Effect 3. Your feedback has always mattered. Mass Effect is a collaboration between developers and players, and we continue to listen.

    So where do we go from here? Throughout the next year, we will support Mass Effect 3 by working on new content. And we’ll keep listening, because your insights and constructive feedback will help determine what that content should be. This is not the last you’ll hear of Commander Shepard.

    We look forward to your continued support and involvement as we work together to shape the remaining experiences in the story of the Mass Effect trilogy.

    Thanks for taking this journey with us.

    Casey Hudson

    Emphasis mine.

    See the bolded? It appears that the very creators agree that the fanbase has a vested interest in how the story was shaped, and they are acknowledging the displeasure presented by those same fans.

    So... match point.

    I am fine with them acknowledging the fans, just as long as they don't end up catering to them. That is when they lose their creative integrity. From your quote, it looks like they plan to maintain that.

    Except... Bioware's PR is built around catering to the fans. People wanted Garrus and Tali to be love interests; they became love interests. People felt like there wasn't enough customization in ME2; customization was expanded for ME3. Bioware has crafted a lovely image of themselves as a company that listens when the fans complain about something. And to their credit, when they listen to fan "demands", even the times I looked at the demands and thought myself "Oh, that is so stupid, just shut up", the thing that Bioware came up with in answer to the 'demand' was almost always amazing. I mean look at the complaints from ME2 that they address in ME3: More 'friend' conversations with the crew, more of the crew being friendly with each other. More callbacks to past decisions. Better written 'relationships' for people who have had one for more than one game. Insane improvements in gameplay. The list goes on.

    Maybe Bioware just pretended to be listening to the fans, and these were things they were going to implement from their own creative desires. I don't actually know. But they've cultivated the image that they listen to the fans. Now they are facing the other side of that coin, which is when they make a serious writing misstep, then the fans who have been invited in as "collaborators" will feel like they have a right to say "No, that's just bad. Write something that makes sense. This is your peer review: revise what was written, please."

    And I don't see anything wrong with that, personally. Any writer who feels like they are above peer review is kind of a goose.

    Well. There still has to be some disconnect between the creator and consumer.

    It's about creating a happy medium and I would say for the most part Bioware is good at that.

    Why I'm interested in seeing what they do.

    Dragkonias on
  • AegeriAegeri Tiny wee bacteriums Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    Even though I said it, I can't fathom it but I just have no desire anymore. I played the game, got to the trial and then thought "This has no point" and turned the game off. I wanted to go through ME->ME2 again so I had a true "canon" shep and see all the differences - then remembered that the ending shit all over that anyway.

    I loved ME because I was invested in the universe, characters and story. The ending has taken all of that away and in the end it leaves a very very good TPS (in ME3), but nothing else. Frankly if I just want to shoot things I have Gears of War 3.
    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    I am as well and it's why the whole "ARTISTIC INTEGRITY" argument is dumber than rocks. The ending takes away from an achievement in RPG design and video games - which is what ME3 should have been but denies due to the ending.

    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
  • CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Matrias wrote: »
    I don't really think Bioware has any responsibility to change the ending

    I don't think they do either. I doubt that very many think that Bioware is required to change or elaborate on the ending just because they want it done.

    But saying that you don't even have the right to politely request a rewrite, because Every Art is Sacred, strikes me as a bit silly.

    Cambiata on
    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
  • DeaderinredDeaderinred Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Juc wrote: »
    I personally hate the ending, I'm also not trying to get it changed.
    But I'm sure saying the ending is ass.
    I'm trying to let people know when they decide to play the game that hey, watch out, the ending has a fair chance of pissing you off ... but the rest of the game is super awesome.

    I've already had a few people angrily messaging me at 2am as they finnish the game.
    and that got me wondering.
    How many bloody people finish games at 2am? (this post, also made at 2am)

    its awesome when you finish games at 2am during sleep deprivation. so mind-fuckingly awesome.

    Deaderinred on
  • -Tal-Tal Registered User regular
    Now that I think about it, I pretty much always finish big games late at night

    the dark and quiet gives it a special feeling

    PNk1Ml4.png
  • CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    -Tal wrote: »
    Now that I think about it, I pretty much always finish big games late at night

    the dark and quiet gives it a special feeling

    I seem to always finish in the AM as well, but not because I plan it that way, it just happens. How peculiar.

    I think it has to do with realizing you're near the end, and even if you should be in bed by that point you can't possibly sleep because, dammit, this is the final push!

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    Hmm...I forgot when I finished ME3...I think it was at night because I remember being tired but powering through because I knew I was close to the end.

  • The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    Ok, so it's their story, and if you don't like how it goes then tough noogies for you, it's not yours and you get no say, and there's the door if you think otherwise.

    That's... not an unreasonable conclusion. It is Bioware's story and they can do whatever they want with it.

    But then George Lucas walks in. Makes yet another unfathomable change to Star Wars while simultaneously refusing to release the original print. And everybody rises up against the bad man, and the argument is that that original story belongs to the fans, and George should not be allowed to make more dumb story edits every 10 years to it.

    Am I wrong in thinking these two statements are in direct opposition to each other, despite both using the exact same argument?

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
  • CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Krathoon wrote: »
    Forar wrote: »
    Krathoon wrote:
    People need to learn that they are not entitled to change someone else's work.

    http://masseffect.livejournal.com/1365476.html
    A Message From Casey Hudson
    'There’s been a lot of discussion and debate about the conclusion of Mass Effect 3, so I thought I’d share my perspective with you here. I’ll avoid outright spoilers, but I’d still recommend finishing the game and experiencing it for yourself before reading this.

    For the last eight years, Mass Effect has been a labor of love for our team; love for the characters we’ve created, for the medium of video games, and for the fans that have supported us. For us and for you, Mass Effect 3 had to live up to a lot of expectations, not only for a great gaming experience, but for a resolution to the countless storylines and decisions you’ve made as a player since the journey began in 2007. So we designed Mass Effect 3 to be a series of endings to key plots and storylines, each culminating in scenes that show you the consequences of your actions. You then carry the knowledge of these consequences with you as you complete the final moments of your journey.

    We always intended that the scale of the conflict and the underlying theme of sacrifice would lead to a bittersweet ending—to do otherwise would betray the agonizing decisions Shepard had to make along the way. Still, we wanted to give players the chance to experience an inspiring and uplifting ending; in a story where you face a hopeless struggle for basic survival, we see the final moments and imagery as offering victory and hope in the context of sacrifice and reflection.

    We've had some incredibly positive reactions to Mass Effect 3, from the New York Times declaring it “a gripping, coherent triumph”, to Penny Arcade calling it “an amazing accomplishment”, to emails and tweets from players who have given us the most profound words of appreciation we've ever received.

    But we also recognize that some of our most passionate fans needed more closure, more answers, and more time to say goodbye to their stories—and these comments are equally valid. Player feedback such as this has always been an essential ingredient in the development of the series.

    I am extremely proud of what this team has accomplished, from the first art concepts for the Mass Effect universe to the final moments of Mass Effect 3. But we didn't do it on our own. Over the course of the series, Mass Effect has been a shared experience between the development team and our fans—not just a shared experience in playing the games, but in designing and developing them. An outpouring of love for Garrus and Tali led to their inclusion as love interests in Mass Effect 2. A request for deeper RPG systems led to key design changes in Mass Effect 3. Your feedback has always mattered. Mass Effect is a collaboration between developers and players, and we continue to listen.

    So where do we go from here? Throughout the next year, we will support Mass Effect 3 by working on new content. And we’ll keep listening, because your insights and constructive feedback will help determine what that content should be. This is not the last you’ll hear of Commander Shepard.

    We look forward to your continued support and involvement as we work together to shape the remaining experiences in the story of the Mass Effect trilogy.

    Thanks for taking this journey with us.

    Casey Hudson

    Emphasis mine.

    See the bolded? It appears that the very creators agree that the fanbase has a vested interest in how the story was shaped, and they are acknowledging the displeasure presented by those same fans.

    So... match point.

    I am fine with them acknowledging the fans, just as long as they don't end up catering to them. That is when they lose their creative integrity. From your quote, it looks like they plan to maintain that.

    Except... Bioware's PR is built around catering to the fans. People wanted Garrus and Tali to be love interests; they became love interests. People felt like there wasn't enough customization in ME2; customization was expanded for ME3. Bioware has crafted a lovely image of themselves as a company that listens when the fans complain about something. And to their credit, when they listen to fan "demands", even the times I looked at the demands and thought myself "Oh, that is so stupid, just shut up", the thing that Bioware came up with in answer to the 'demand' was almost always amazing. I mean look at the complaints from ME2 that they address in ME3: More 'friend' conversations with the crew, more of the crew being friendly with each other. More callbacks to past decisions. Better written 'relationships' for people who have had one for more than one game. Insane improvements in gameplay. The list goes on.

    Maybe Bioware just pretended to be listening to the fans, and these were things they were going to implement from their own creative desires. I don't actually know. But they've cultivated the image that they listen to the fans. Now they are facing the other side of that coin, which is when they make a serious writing misstep, then the fans who have been invited in as "collaborators" will feel like they have a right to say "No, that's just bad. Write something that makes sense. This is your peer review: revise what was written, please."

    And I don't see anything wrong with that, personally. Any writer who feels like they are above peer review is kind of a goose.

    Well. There still has to be some disconnect between the creator and consumer.

    It's about creating a happy medium and I would say for the most part Bioware is good at that.

    Why I'm interested in seeing what they do.

    Agreed.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
  • AegeriAegeri Tiny wee bacteriums Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    The thing for me is Bioware are more than welcome to tell me to shut up and deal with it. I'm equally entitled to tell them they don't get any more of my money and their whole "Buy the DLC please" becomes "You can stick your DLC". With a remotely better ending - frankly I can't see how they could do worse - I would be absolutely buying any DLC for ME3 automatically (just like how I loved nearly all of the ME2 DLC, even if I was a bit lukewarm on Arrival it had an awesome decision at least).

    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
  • SchrodingerSchrodinger Registered User regular
    Look, every creative team on Earth is infallible. Especially when you have a team of hundreds or thousands of people each focusing on separate components of the big picture.

    It's completely wrong for fans to imply that the ending given might not be ideal.

  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    That being said I'm generally a fan of the work Bioware is doing since I feel like they're pushing interactive storytelling in the right direction. But it is still pretty new so I expect some missteps here and there.

    That being said, I get what Aegeri is saying. The fact that they did such a good job with ME3 and the ending fumbles like that is really annoying.

  • President RexPresident Rex Registered User regular
    Dragkonias wrote: »
    eeSanG wrote: »
    -Tal wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    I'm having a lot of trouble continuing my second playthrough.
    Because the multiplayer is so fun!

    This is what's happening with me too.

    Every time I go to start my second playthrough I'm like, "You know I could be unlocking crates right now."

    >_>

    That's sort of happening with me. I am partially looking forward to Hale-voice femshep run to contrast with my well-acted Meer paragon. But I'm not even sure where the logic of the ending souring the game comes from, but for some reason I have it.

    I will steal the cake analogy from before: you may be eating a slice of the most delicious cake ever made, but once you find out that there's a giant foot-long chunk of fecal matter in the middle of the cake, you're going to reassess what you've been eating.

    (although it's really not that terrible, it just doesn't mesh well with the rest of the game and series...like finding a rusty ingot in your cake)



    But the multiplayer storyline is downright terrible (in that there isn't one, really), and that's all kinds of fun. So I will bounce around as vanguards and snipe things in their faces/armpits/groins/spines and create biotic explosions until the ending fervor dies out or there's some concerted response to improve it. And when either of those things happen, I feel I can experience the Haleshep. Plus the interim wait will help keep the rest of the excellent part of the game fresh.

  • JohnDoeJohnDoe Registered User regular
    Does anything else think the Banshees would have been scarier without the screams? I know it would have made the name a bit inaccurate, but the screams just sound campy.

  • MatriasMatrias Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Matrias wrote: »
    I don't really think Bioware has any responsibility to change the ending

    I don't think they do either. I doubt that very many think that Bioware is required to change or elaborate on the ending just because they want it done.

    But saying that you don't even have the right to politely request a rewrite, because Every Art is Sacred, strikes me as a bit silly.
    Game devs are usually flexible with this sort of thing. We live in a digital age and Bioware makes products for commercial assumption.

    Usually. I've worked with some crazy egos.

    Matrias on
    3DS/Pokemon Friend Code - 2122-5878-9273 - Kyle
  • AegeriAegeri Tiny wee bacteriums Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    Can we really have a moratorium on cake fecal matter analogies please? I am actually currently EATING cake.

    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    Look, every creative team on Earth is infallible. Especially when you have a team of hundreds or thousands of people each focusing on separate components of the big picture.

    It's completely wrong for fans to imply that the ending given might not be ideal.

    Well...I think the problem most people have with the ending is that. For all intents and purposes it sounds rushed.

    They didn't finish it until near the game's release.

    It didn't go through peer review, etc.

    Honestly, while there are some people complaining because they didn't get the game they wanted. I feel(at least here) most peoples hearts are in the right place and they just want the game to be the best game it could be.

  • AegeriAegeri Tiny wee bacteriums Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    Schrondinger is being sarcastic I would assume.

    It still baffles me that the ending didn't get peer review like the rest of the writing in the game. It really shows as well.

    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    -Tal wrote: »
    Aegeri wrote: »
    Yet the ending is so bad, I don't want to play the game again and I've even lost interest in replaying the other two.

    I've heard this a lot and I just cannot fathom it at all

    I hate that the ending is overshadowing the awesomeness of 99.9% of the game

    Conversely, it's pretty hard to be excited about any sort of story where you already know that you aren't going to get an ending anything like you'd hoped for and looked forward to. On a smaller scale, I'm certainly not going to be too excited about watching a great movie all over again with an ending that's pretty awful and doesn't fit the rest of the movie. Even with the rest of the game being good, a fitting ending is vitally important. Stories aren't piecemeal things where you just ignore the bad bits; they're inclusive things where every element matters.

    And since the Mass Effect games are so enormously story-centered, then it makes complete sense to me that the current ending could sour the entire franchise for folks. If somebody puts just one drop of piss in your drink, are you really just going to ignore it because you like the rest of what's in there? Because I think that sort of example could apply to how people are viewing what the ending does to their experience.

    Ninja Snarl P on
  • DragkoniasDragkonias That Guy Who Does Stuff You Know, There. Registered User regular
    edited March 2012
    JohnDoe wrote: »
    Does anything else think the Banshees would have been scarier without the screams? I know it would have made the name a bit inaccurate, but the screams just sound campy.

    Goodness, no. Last thing I need is one of those things sneaking up on me.

    Edit: You guys really have a thing for releasing waste in your food products don't you?

    Dragkonias on
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