I don't agree with almost any of that, so I guess your mileage may vary, GnomeTank.
What specifically bugs you about the game?
Me?
Nothing really bugs me. So far it's been fine, it just feels like the whole thing could come off the rails really easy and take a left at Kooky Town. So far it hasn't though, and your original post is some reinforcement that it won't.
So is this the Persona thread? Because I just picked up Persona 3 on my Vita...and it's...well, it's a thing. The story has a pretty good hook to it, and it's definitely got me interested to see more....but I could also see it taking a horrible turn for the worst very quickly. So far it seems to be walking a fine line between interesting and hokey.
It's an inferior version of a great game, but better than nothing. All the cutscenes/story events were removed in favor of visual novel style storytelling.
So is this the Persona thread? Because I just picked up Persona 3 on my Vita...and it's...well, it's a thing. The story has a pretty good hook to it, and it's definitely got me interested to see more....but I could also see it taking a horrible turn for the worst very quickly. So far it seems to be walking a fine line between interesting and hokey.
It's an inferior version of a great game, but better than nothing. All the cutscenes/story events were removed in favor of visual novel style storytelling.
It's a bit misleading to say that. Cutscenes were removed, yes, but those and all other story events were translated to a different narrative format. How much that impacts the experience is debatable, but the only thing they outright removed is The Answer.
I hate to beat a dead horse but I definitely consider it the superior version, if only because it eliminates all the incessant walking.
I'm not trying to be a dick there - walking around Iwatodai was literally my biggest pet peeve in pre-P3P Persona 3. Even if you ignored non-essential NPCs, it was so goddamned tedious.
Drez on
Switch: SW-7690-2320-9238Steam/PSN/Xbox: Drezdar
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cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
edited April 2012
I don't think it's debatable at all. You're removing visual immersion in favor of talking portraits. There is something lost there. You don't even SEE the most crucial events in the plot, it relies strictly on dialogue and sound effects.
Does anything special happen if... (DS1 Day 5 spoilers)
You actuall manage to kill all six demon teams in three turns?
Is it even possible? Those fuckers keep binding me.
It's possible to do it in one, but you have to follow a very specific strategy to pull it off, and I'm not even sure if you get anything special for doing it.
Anyway, a couple of things to note about the fight:
1) the turn count is based on the MC's turns, so if you need to stall for time you can have him draw aggro and let him get attacked, since that pushes you further back in the turn order;
2) if you run out of turns, you still clear the mission; the only thing you miss out on is Naoya's route.
Does anything special happen if... (DS1 Day 5 spoilers)
You actuall manage to kill all six demon teams in three turns?
Is it even possible? Those fuckers keep binding me.
It's possible to do it in one, but you have to follow a very specific strategy to pull it off, and I'm not even sure if you get anything special for doing it.
Anyway, a couple of things to note about the fight:
1) the turn count is based on the MC's turns, so if you need to stall for time you can have him draw aggro and let him get attacked, since that pushes you further back in the turn order;
2) if you run out of turns, you still clear the mission; the only thing you miss out on is Naoya's route.
I don't remember if it works like this in DS1, but Devil Speed should counteract Bind, too, so you can always fill your teams with demons that have that skill and use it to up your movement range if you're binded.
So is this the Persona thread? Because I just picked up Persona 3 on my Vita...and it's...well, it's a thing. The story has a pretty good hook to it, and it's definitely got me interested to see more....but I could also see it taking a horrible turn for the worst very quickly. So far it seems to be walking a fine line between interesting and hokey.
It's an inferior version of a great game, but better than nothing. All the cutscenes/story events were removed in favor of visual novel style storytelling.
Removing the anime cutscenes and the Answer are really the only ways that P3P is inferior...and some would argue that removing The Answer is actually a plus.
But I'll gladly take those two omissions for all of the improvements that P3P has over the PS2 versions. Instant travel, direct control of teammates, and reduced load times make it much more playable. Throw in the random extras and the Female MC option and I'd say P3P is the best version.
And yeah, though Persona 3 is a great game, it definitely has its flaws, most of which Blackjack has mentioned.
Persona 3->4 feels a lot to me like Uncharted 1->2 in that at its core, you're basically playing the same game, but they did a lot better with the formula the second time around.
Does anything special happen if... (DS1 Day 5 spoilers)
You actuall manage to kill all six demon teams in three turns?
Is it even possible? Those fuckers keep binding me.
It's possible to do it in one, but you have to follow a very specific strategy to pull it off, and I'm not even sure if you get anything special for doing it.
Anyway, a couple of things to note about the fight:
1) the turn count is based on the MC's turns, so if you need to stall for time you can have him draw aggro and let him get attacked, since that pushes you further back in the turn order;
2) if you run out of turns, you still clear the mission; the only thing you miss out on is Naoya's route.
I don't remember if it works like this in DS1, but Devil Speed should counteract Bind, too, so you can always fill your teams with demons that have that skill and use it to up your movement range if you're binded.
Thanks, guys. I actually figured out a much cheaper way of getting through this.
Using a Vile demon and attacking at least on your first turn with Chaos Wave will bump you WAAAAAY back in the turn order.
Was cake once I did that.
And yes,
Devil Speed unbinds you, too. The only problem is, Devil Speed is a Wilder skill, and the Wilder demons up to level 40 kind of suck.
Playing through the original version of Nocturne at the moment. It's going to be really strange not having the fiend battles. Interested to see which other changes I really notice.
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cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
Interesting. The Fiend battles seem so integral to the experience, hard to imagine the game without them.
Eh...it definitely has problems. The main villains are largely uninteresting, and never really become threatening. The entire second half of the party (basically, everyone that joins after Fuuka except for one person) is boring and pointless at best and absolutely insufferable at worst. The pacing is awful. Tartarus is ridiculously repetitive. Most of the social links suck.
Pretty much. Though I will say that as far as the party members after Fuuka thing goes Ken and Aigis make up like 90% of the suck.\
So is this the Persona thread? Because I just picked up Persona 3 on my Vita...and it's...well, it's a thing. The story has a pretty good hook to it, and it's definitely got me interested to see more....but I could also see it taking a horrible turn for the worst very quickly. So far it seems to be walking a fine line between interesting and hokey.
It's an inferior version of a great game, but better than nothing. All the cutscenes/story events were removed in favor of visual novel style storytelling.
Removing the anime cutscenes and the Answer are really the only ways that P3P is inferior...and some would argue that removing The Answer is actually a plus.
But I'll gladly take those two omissions for all of the improvements that P3P has over the PS2 versions. Instant travel, direct control of teammates, and reduced load times make it much more playable. Throw in the random extras and the Female MC option and I'd say P3P is the best version.
And yeah, though Persona 3 is a great game, it definitely has its flaws, most of which Blackjack has mentioned.
Persona 3->4 feels a lot to me like Uncharted 1->2 in that at its core, you're basically playing the same game, but they did a lot better with the formula the second time around.
They didn't just remove the anime cutscenes, though. They removed almost all movement in story scenes altogether. It's a pretty big shift.
If they only removed the anime bits it would be a lot easier to call it the best version.
cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
Eternal Punishment's EX Dungeon is craaaazy. I'm in the final stretch, and it's all L90 demons you can't contact with AOE Death spells, and you get to use progressively less party members the deeper into the dungeon you get.
Eh...it definitely has problems. The main villains are largely uninteresting, and never really become threatening. The entire second half of the party (basically, everyone that joins after Fuuka except for one person) is boring and pointless at best and absolutely insufferable at worst. The pacing is awful. Tartarus is ridiculously repetitive. Most of the social links suck.
Pretty much. Though I will say that as far as the party members after Fuuka thing goes Ken and Aigis make up like 90% of the suck.\
Edit: Actually more like 99.9%
I have a bias against most dog characters in RPGs so I include the dumb dog, too. But yeah, Ken and Aigis are the largest offenders.
And yet, even with all the complaints about P3, it's still Filet Mignon compared to the ground chuck of 99% of all other RPGs out there.
I don't remember having these problems with Ken/Aigis/Koromaru that y'all have. Not as good as Yukari and Akihiko? Sure, but they're not this terribleness you're hyping it into. This thread is as bad as the FF thread.
And I liked Yuzu too.
Opinions etc whatever.
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited April 2012
Naw. They were pretty bad. Also every scene that involved them to a great deal was horrible or at best just lame.
Honestly, I really did think the gameplay for the answer made up for the story. It's just pure dungeon crawling RPG. Mostly because you don't have to fuck around with the social links or getting tired.
I honestly enjoyed fighting things in the answer much more than P3 proper.
So is this the Persona thread? Because I just picked up Persona 3 on my Vita...and it's...well, it's a thing. The story has a pretty good hook to it, and it's definitely got me interested to see more....but I could also see it taking a horrible turn for the worst very quickly. So far it seems to be walking a fine line between interesting and hokey.
It's an inferior version of a great game, but better than nothing. All the cutscenes/story events were removed in favor of visual novel style storytelling.
Removing the anime cutscenes and the Answer are really the only ways that P3P is inferior...and some would argue that removing The Answer is actually a plus.
But I'll gladly take those two omissions for all of the improvements that P3P has over the PS2 versions. Instant travel, direct control of teammates, and reduced load times make it much more playable. Throw in the random extras and the Female MC option and I'd say P3P is the best version.
And yeah, though Persona 3 is a great game, it definitely has its flaws, most of which Blackjack has mentioned.
Persona 3->4 feels a lot to me like Uncharted 1->2 in that at its core, you're basically playing the same game, but they did a lot better with the formula the second time around.
They didn't just remove the anime cutscenes, though. They removed almost all movement in story scenes altogether. It's a pretty big shift.
If they only removed the anime bits it would be a lot easier to call it the best version.
The narrative importance of this is grossly overstated, in my opinion.
I will admit that I like the movements better than storyboards. I had played P3 and FES long before P3P and when I beat P3P, I more or less went right into The Answer. The difference is very obvious, but painting the storyboard method as significantly inferior is not something I can agree with.
Is it inferior? Yes. Is it substantially inferior? Not in my opinion, no.
The story is more than adequately carried in the dialogue, characters, and vocal expression. The animations are by far the least important aspect of conveying the story.
Getting close to the end of DS2, and certainly think this game is more cruel than the first one. Might be because I cleared ds1 like 8 times though, and only remember it when I had overpowered demons from the start :P. Day 6 fight was won with MC squeaking a kill on the last required mob turn before he would go down after running a gauntlet over the entire map when the rest of the team died.
How many ending paths are there? I only had 3 to choose from, and I'm pretty sure I had a *really* bad run.
Jungo, other dude in osaka dead, not bothered talking much to anguished one. Managed to save everyone else, but my thought that fumi was somehow the key to an ending seemed mistaken. Just got daichi/yamato/ronaldo paths unlocked. Took daichi, but seems to be the failure ending so far, which annoys me. I figured it would be more like atsuros ending in ds1 where you use the power to essentially take the world back to normalcy but improve it somewhat at least.
I just started Day 4 in DS2, and I have to say that I'm kind of having trouble connecting to any of the characters. I mean, to be fair, I guess I was kind of ambivalent about most of DS1's playable cast too, but I liked Haru and that was enough to give me a sense of direction in terms of choosing which events to focus on. Right now I'm kind of just grasping at straws in hopes that someone will grow on me eventually, which probably isn't too smart when you consider how the Fate system works and everything.
The deranged stat distribution methods aren't exactly helping, either. You've got people like Fumi and Jungo whose stats are so laser-focused that you're pretty much gimping yourself by not using them (but I haven't been given a reason to like them very much in terms of personality or story), but a calculator could vomit on a character sheet and produce something less abysmal than Daichi or Hinako entirely by chance.
Makoto is probably the only one I have above-average feelings about so far, mostly because I want to see if I can turn her when JPs and I inevitably betray each other further down the road, but it feels a little bad knowing that Keita and Jungo would outperform her in almost every respect (maybe if I'm lucky I can figure out a way to leverage her uniquely decent MP pool into something cool). Ronaldo might have some promise too, but I forgot to check his stats when he showed up, so there's a pretty good chance that he's another resident of Suckytown and I didn't notice.
I'd probably feel better about all of this if I could just advance the damn plot and see how things develop instead of dwelling on it so much with the information I have now, but I can't help it. I've got the Fusion Fever. I can play these games for hours or even days without fighting a battle or even saving, completely paralyzed by the need to figure out optimal fusion paths. Some of my demons are so inbred that their inherited bonuses were enough to nearly double their main offensive stat.
Posts
Me?
Nothing really bugs me. So far it's been fine, it just feels like the whole thing could come off the rails really easy and take a left at Kooky Town. So far it hasn't though, and your original post is some reinforcement that it won't.
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
It's an inferior version of a great game, but better than nothing. All the cutscenes/story events were removed in favor of visual novel style storytelling.
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
It's a bit misleading to say that. Cutscenes were removed, yes, but those and all other story events were translated to a different narrative format. How much that impacts the experience is debatable, but the only thing they outright removed is The Answer.
I hate to beat a dead horse but I definitely consider it the superior version, if only because it eliminates all the incessant walking.
I'm not trying to be a dick there - walking around Iwatodai was literally my biggest pet peeve in pre-P3P Persona 3. Even if you ignored non-essential NPCs, it was so goddamned tedious.
That said,
Memento Mori.
Catherine ending spoilers:
That would be amazing.
Let me just crush your dreams now, then, because they aren't.
PSN: Wstfgl | GamerTag: An Evil Plan | Battle.net: FallenIdle#1970
Hit me up on BoardGameArena! User: Loaded D1
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
PSN: Wstfgl | GamerTag: An Evil Plan | Battle.net: FallenIdle#1970
Hit me up on BoardGameArena! User: Loaded D1
PSN: Wstfgl | GamerTag: An Evil Plan | Battle.net: FallenIdle#1970
Hit me up on BoardGameArena! User: Loaded D1
(Fingers crossed for Mr. Tager as the announcer again.)
Anyway, a couple of things to note about the fight:
1) the turn count is based on the MC's turns, so if you need to stall for time you can have him draw aggro and let him get attacked, since that pushes you further back in the turn order;
2) if you run out of turns, you still clear the mission; the only thing you miss out on is Naoya's route.
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
Removing the anime cutscenes and the Answer are really the only ways that P3P is inferior...and some would argue that removing The Answer is actually a plus.
But I'll gladly take those two omissions for all of the improvements that P3P has over the PS2 versions. Instant travel, direct control of teammates, and reduced load times make it much more playable. Throw in the random extras and the Female MC option and I'd say P3P is the best version.
And yeah, though Persona 3 is a great game, it definitely has its flaws, most of which Blackjack has mentioned.
Persona 3->4 feels a lot to me like Uncharted 1->2 in that at its core, you're basically playing the same game, but they did a lot better with the formula the second time around.
Zeboyd Games Development Blog
Steam ID : rwb36, Twitter : Werezompire, Facebook : Zeboyd Games
P3 spoilers
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
Thanks, guys. I actually figured out a much cheaper way of getting through this.
Was cake once I did that.
And yes,
FFXIV: Tchel Fay
Nintendo ID: Tortalius
Steam: Tortalius
Stream: twitch.tv/tortalius
Pretty much. Though I will say that as far as the party members after Fuuka thing goes Ken and Aigis make up like 90% of the suck.\
Edit: Actually more like 99.9%
If they only removed the anime bits it would be a lot easier to call it the best version.
My Let's Play Channel: https://youtube.com/channel/UC2go70QLfwGq-hW4nvUqmog
Yay.
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
I don't remember having these problems with Ken/Aigis/Koromaru that y'all have. Not as good as Yukari and Akihiko? Sure, but they're not this terribleness you're hyping it into. This thread is as bad as the FF thread.
And I liked Yuzu too.
Opinions etc whatever.
That being said, PS3P is still the better game. Fuck The Answer.
I honestly enjoyed fighting things in the answer much more than P3 proper.
My Let's Play Channel: https://youtube.com/channel/UC2go70QLfwGq-hW4nvUqmog
The narrative importance of this is grossly overstated, in my opinion.
I will admit that I like the movements better than storyboards. I had played P3 and FES long before P3P and when I beat P3P, I more or less went right into The Answer. The difference is very obvious, but painting the storyboard method as significantly inferior is not something I can agree with.
Is it inferior? Yes. Is it substantially inferior? Not in my opinion, no.
The story is more than adequately carried in the dialogue, characters, and vocal expression. The animations are by far the least important aspect of conveying the story.
How many ending paths are there? I only had 3 to choose from, and I'm pretty sure I had a *really* bad run.
The deranged stat distribution methods aren't exactly helping, either. You've got people like Fumi and Jungo whose stats are so laser-focused that you're pretty much gimping yourself by not using them (but I haven't been given a reason to like them very much in terms of personality or story), but a calculator could vomit on a character sheet and produce something less abysmal than Daichi or Hinako entirely by chance.
I'd probably feel better about all of this if I could just advance the damn plot and see how things develop instead of dwelling on it so much with the information I have now, but I can't help it. I've got the Fusion Fever. I can play these games for hours or even days without fighting a battle or even saving, completely paralyzed by the need to figure out optimal fusion paths. Some of my demons are so inbred that their inherited bonuses were enough to nearly double their main offensive stat.