Yeah, people did pick up that kime was not village, right?
He reveals as "village" without proving his ability at all, seemingly to preempt others from proving theirs first
He does NOT prove his ability
He dies purple
Anyways I'm guessing that if the village had voted out teepo (hahaha) the cultist faction would have been eliminated? Only way victory would be possible on the day langly thought it was impossible.
Maybe host clarifications were overly misleading, but as someone who was just looking at the players act kime was being kime at his worst :P
He did prove his ability? He was a gene who showed knowledge of being a gene, and showed a real connection to a brood.
So
I don't know what you're talking about.
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FiggyFighter of the night manChampion of the sunRegistered Userregular
Yeah, people did pick up that kime was not village, right?
He reveals as "village" without proving his ability at all, seemingly to preempt others from proving theirs first
He does NOT prove his ability
He dies purple
Anyways I'm guessing that if the village had voted out teepo (hahaha) the cultist faction would have been eliminated? Only way victory would be possible on the day langly thought it was impossible.
Maybe host clarifications were overly misleading, but as someone who was just looking at the players act kime was being kime at his worst :P
He did prove his ability? He was a gene who showed knowledge of being a gene, and showed a real connection to a brood.
So
I don't know what you're talking about.
I had all the knowledge of the Brood, etc. the fact that I was a gene and not a Brood is not a point to stick on, I was converted, that part didn't matter at all since I had the same condition as my Brood. It's everything else that matters. You should have just foregone all logic, went with your gut, and killed me as soon as you saw that I was unseerable. Asking me about it is just asking to be lied to :P
(Nrmally what you did is right, but not heeerre :P)
Well, Day 1 voting kime is a time-honored tradition around here.
I won't be doing that, though. Grudge voting someone for them playing well is petty.
I will, however, be voting for Dumpshock.
Which is a different kind of petty.
Ouch... Is this because I tried to vig you We did get on the same page the next night and got a mafia together. Thats got to count for something.... right.... right?
His Fusion is different than yours, since, as you say, he has no one sharing his VC. He could target dead players with it (once, though he didn't know that ) and get their abilities.
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ObiFettUse the ForceAs You WishRegistered Userregular
I could only target a player once?
So that last night I was pretty screwed anyways. Baidol would have gotten me nothing, same with Gaslight. I guess I could have targeted Dumpshock?
Didn't you have enough genes to form stuff like Trygon? I didn't check exactly, but you had at least one wildcard, and lots of other genes.
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ObiFettUse the ForceAs You WishRegistered Userregular
I had two wildcards and a TON of defensive genes. I could create alot of invincible stuff but that seemed pretty worthless since I thought for sure I was going to die to the vote.
The way I looked at it we needed two vigs and Trygon only gave us one so I took that off the table pretty early.
What I would like to note is that, as far as i'm aware, standard phalla rules do not prohibit role-calls. Generally they're accounted for with cover roles or public villager PM. If you want to outlaw them, make it bold and clear in your OP.
Secondly, role-calls tend to be used to referring to someone (generally confirmed village) asking every player to contact them with their name/role. This is different to asking who a name/role is and in my opinion wouldn't fall under the category of a role call.
I thought they did, but even still, I think I said no rolecalls, though it may not have been very strongly stated.
And I know that's the true definition of a rolecall, but the idea behind doing a rolecall is that anyone who claims the same role as someone else must be mafia, so by forcing people into either doing that, or not, its a weird way of confirming, because if the mafia come forward, they are effectively taking a 50-50 shot at dying. I was harsh on it in this game because in sportz' game the exact same thing happened, and it basically made it impossible for the mafia to hide anymore.
It's a strange line, and there were plenty of ways for the village to confirm people, I don't think they really needed another
It was thrown in with all the other standard rules and very easy to miss.
The main difference is that in a role call, you have no idea what exists and just wait a see what people send you. It forces mafia to lean on their cover roles or make something up. Two people claiming the same power doesn't necessarily mean mafia either, but two people claiming the same name could. Either way, this is very different saying 'I know role X exists with this name, who is it' and I wouldn't consider the latter a form of role call at all.
That's not to say that you can't outlaw it in your game, and it was probably the right move to do so, but you should try and be specific about rules like that from the outset because they aren't the norm.
This is where I have to say something: You cannot say "it was thrown in with all the other standard rules..." I always get griped at if I misread or don't read a rule or whatever. That's horrible to treat like it's a defence of any sort... READ THE RULES. If you were joe-nub rather than Roman, no one would take this very seriously. "I had to read all of the rules and it was too much!" C'mon now roman.
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??? There are standard definitions of the terms, like cultists. If the host's particular interpretation of them differs, how are we supposed to know unless they spell it out for us?
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ObiFettUse the ForceAs You WishRegistered Userregular
Did you really need the extra vigs? You had half the vote, so even if it tied, with your singular vig you still would have won, right?
Yeah, I was looking at the worst case scenario: Me getting voted out and one of the cult genes getting vigged. That would have put it at 3 cult v 2 village (if my vig actually killed my target, we didn't know how much health langly or farangu had) v 1 mafia. At that point the village+mafia has as much vote power as the cult and the mafia has a kill left. One more turn of voting and vigging and the cult would have been all but gone and left at 1v2 or 1v1v1.
In order to maintain control, I thought we needed to tie the vote and kill two people (one from village and one from mafia). Even if I got voted out, the mafia hopefully would have been gone and it would have been 3v2, advantage cult.
What I would like to note is that, as far as i'm aware, standard phalla rules do not prohibit role-calls. Generally they're accounted for with cover roles or public villager PM. If you want to outlaw them, make it bold and clear in your OP.
Secondly, role-calls tend to be used to referring to someone (generally confirmed village) asking every player to contact them with their name/role. This is different to asking who a name/role is and in my opinion wouldn't fall under the category of a role call.
I thought they did, but even still, I think I said no rolecalls, though it may not have been very strongly stated.
And I know that's the true definition of a rolecall, but the idea behind doing a rolecall is that anyone who claims the same role as someone else must be mafia, so by forcing people into either doing that, or not, its a weird way of confirming, because if the mafia come forward, they are effectively taking a 50-50 shot at dying. I was harsh on it in this game because in sportz' game the exact same thing happened, and it basically made it impossible for the mafia to hide anymore.
It's a strange line, and there were plenty of ways for the village to confirm people, I don't think they really needed another
It was thrown in with all the other standard rules and very easy to miss.
The main difference is that in a role call, you have no idea what exists and just wait a see what people send you. It forces mafia to lean on their cover roles or make something up. Two people claiming the same power doesn't necessarily mean mafia either, but two people claiming the same name could. Either way, this is very different saying 'I know role X exists with this name, who is it' and I wouldn't consider the latter a form of role call at all.
That's not to say that you can't outlaw it in your game, and it was probably the right move to do so, but you should try and be specific about rules like that from the outset because they aren't the norm.
This is where I have to say something: You cannot say "it was thrown in with all the other standard rules..." I always get griped at if I misread or don't read a rule or whatever. That's horrible to treat like it's a defence of any sort... READ THE RULES. If you were joe-nub rather than Roman, no one would take this very seriously. "I had to read all of the rules and it was too much!" C'mon now roman.
this is insanity. The definition of a role call is for the players to make people, all people, reveal their roles to the network. Asking for someone to come forward if they are role X, first of all isn't socially pressured (since it's a single role and the person can ignore the network), and also isn't trying to root out mafia among villagers. It's trying to see if one specific person is lying.
If akimbo didn't want that happening, either, then that's fine, it's his game. But that isn't what role calling is, so roman isn't off base, and you're being silly.
I don't know exactly what you're talking about but i was trying to make a point out of the fact that, if mafia have cover roles, role calls shouldnt do anything and hence wouldn't need to be outlawed. It feels like people are starting to outlaw role calls more often (or assume they're banned by default) now just because hosts are getting lazy about cover roles which i think is a shame.
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
I don't know exactly what you're talking about but i was trying to make a point out of the fact that, if mafia have cover roles, role calls shouldnt do anything and hence wouldn't need to be outlawed. It feels like people are starting to outlaw role calls more often (or assume they're banned by default) now just because hosts are getting lazy about cover roles which i think is a shame.
There were never cover roles back in the day (this is back in like '08). Honestly, it feels like laziness for the mafia to get cover roles; almost no risk for them at that point other than voting records.
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TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
I don't know exactly what you're talking about but i was trying to make a point out of the fact that, if mafia have cover roles, role calls shouldnt do anything and hence wouldn't need to be outlawed. It feels like people are starting to outlaw role calls more often (or assume they're banned by default) now just because hosts are getting lazy about cover roles which i think is a shame.
There were never cover roles back in the day (this is back in like '08). Honestly, it feels like laziness for the mafia to get cover roles; almost no risk for them at that point other than voting records.
Games also used to have more villagers.
In general I would agree, however the mafia absolutely need the exact wording of the villager win condition. Then again, i'm also of the opinion that mafia should have to work for a victory rather than having an equal chance as the village.
We have a bunch of conventions and rules that didn't exist in the past. Because it is an ongoing organic game that people get creative with.
Quite literally someone starts the first role call and then people are like "well fuck, that would break the whole thing..."
So people either make it against the rules, or make sure their game won't break cause of it. I recommend the latter, if possible. My games don't more specific than roles defined by power/faction and don't really have that problem, or they have named roles for everyone that have no connection to alignment (Mario Kart and League of Legend minis).
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BaidolI will hold him offEscape while you canRegistered Userregular
Which is one reason why phallas based on original material are nice, because you don't need cover roles.
Anybody with access to a wiki can lie, but easier to get caught because somebody else may have that role. But that can make games interesting.
I think Akimbo may have/had a different definition of what it is/what was being asked. As a host I don't outlaw role calls, but they would have been fruitless because I've always had vanilla roles.
Nothing broken here, just learning!
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
I don't know exactly what you're talking about but i was trying to make a point out of the fact that, if mafia have cover roles, role calls shouldnt do anything and hence wouldn't need to be outlawed. It feels like people are starting to outlaw role calls more often (or assume they're banned by default) now just because hosts are getting lazy about cover roles which i think is a shame.
There were never cover roles back in the day (this is back in like '08). Honestly, it feels like laziness for the mafia to get cover roles; almost no risk for them at that point other than voting records.
Games also used to have more villagers.
In general I would agree, however the mafia absolutely need the exact wording of the villager win condition. Then again, i'm also of the opinion that mafia should have to work for a victory rather than having an equal chance as the village.
Yes, I like generic PMs too (but sent out so you know it's started! I've never had it make me miss a day, but I like it check!). I'm just stuck on the idea that covers are just a given. It's really weird to me.
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I actually agree that having a game such that role calls wouldn't do anything is better, but I really like certain settings more than I care about certain rules, especially since I feel like I can make narrations better in that aspect, so I make that tradeoff, I also like to give the characters in those worlds a place, even if I could just use villagers (like this game, the villagers all had rolenames, but definitely didn't need to).
I probably didn't need to outlaw rolecalls or whatever the thing kime and langly did was, but the mafia were already understrength, so I wanted to make it at least a little easier to hide.
I don't know exactly what you're talking about but i was trying to make a point out of the fact that, if mafia have cover roles, role calls shouldnt do anything and hence wouldn't need to be outlawed. It feels like people are starting to outlaw role calls more often (or assume they're banned by default) now just because hosts are getting lazy about cover roles which i think is a shame.
There were never cover roles back in the day (this is back in like '08). Honestly, it feels like laziness for the mafia to get cover roles; almost no risk for them at that point other than voting records.
Games also used to have more villagers.
In general I would agree, however the mafia absolutely need the exact wording of the villager win condition. Then again, i'm also of the opinion that mafia should have to work for a victory rather than having an equal chance as the village.
Yes, I like generic PMs too (but sent out so you know it's started! I've never had it make me miss a day, but I like it check!). I'm just stuck on the idea that covers are just a given. It's really weird to me.
To have generic PMs, don't you need vanillagers? :P
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FiggyFighter of the night manChampion of the sunRegistered Userregular
This is all moot because Akimbo did provide us with ample cover roles on our proboards. My comment (if anyone is referring to that) on our proboards regarding "role calls" was based on a misunderstanding on my part. I thought a "role call" was basically just telling everyone "contact me with your roles, thanks." That's obviously not what it is, and a simple cover role is fine in that case.
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The game is over! But thank you.
Mmm what kind is my grudge? :P
The list of people I definetly dont hate until they screw me over has swollen to two
Please tell me the first person on that list is yourself.
He did prove his ability? He was a gene who showed knowledge of being a gene, and showed a real connection to a brood.
So
I don't know what you're talking about.
This is getting deep.
Oh gosh! Who is this "Reteba"? I want to meet them now! They sound amazing. 8->
Impotent.
I had all the knowledge of the Brood, etc. the fact that I was a gene and not a Brood is not a point to stick on, I was converted, that part didn't matter at all since I had the same condition as my Brood. It's everything else that matters. You should have just foregone all logic, went with your gut, and killed me as soon as you saw that I was unseerable. Asking me about it is just asking to be lied to :P
(Nrmally what you did is right, but not heeerre :P)
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I really am sorry for my unreliability. Life got seriously in the way starting on Friday afternoon through the weekend, very unexpectedly.
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I lied, obviously, about how fusion worked for me and was cussing so hard when you got fusion for that last day's "???" power.
So that last night I was pretty screwed anyways. Baidol would have gotten me nothing, same with Gaslight. I guess I could have targeted Dumpshock?
The way I looked at it we needed two vigs and Trygon only gave us one so I took that off the table pretty early.
This is where I have to say something: You cannot say "it was thrown in with all the other standard rules..." I always get griped at if I misread or don't read a rule or whatever. That's horrible to treat like it's a defence of any sort... READ THE RULES. If you were joe-nub rather than Roman, no one would take this very seriously. "I had to read all of the rules and it was too much!" C'mon now roman.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
Yeah, I was looking at the worst case scenario: Me getting voted out and one of the cult genes getting vigged. That would have put it at 3 cult v 2 village (if my vig actually killed my target, we didn't know how much health langly or farangu had) v 1 mafia. At that point the village+mafia has as much vote power as the cult and the mafia has a kill left. One more turn of voting and vigging and the cult would have been all but gone and left at 1v2 or 1v1v1.
In order to maintain control, I thought we needed to tie the vote and kill two people (one from village and one from mafia). Even if I got voted out, the mafia hopefully would have been gone and it would have been 3v2, advantage cult.
Totes real.
this is insanity. The definition of a role call is for the players to make people, all people, reveal their roles to the network. Asking for someone to come forward if they are role X, first of all isn't socially pressured (since it's a single role and the person can ignore the network), and also isn't trying to root out mafia among villagers. It's trying to see if one specific person is lying.
If akimbo didn't want that happening, either, then that's fine, it's his game. But that isn't what role calling is, so roman isn't off base, and you're being silly.
There were never cover roles back in the day (this is back in like '08). Honestly, it feels like laziness for the mafia to get cover roles; almost no risk for them at that point other than voting records.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
In general I would agree, however the mafia absolutely need the exact wording of the villager win condition. Then again, i'm also of the opinion that mafia should have to work for a victory rather than having an equal chance as the village.
Quite literally someone starts the first role call and then people are like "well fuck, that would break the whole thing..."
So people either make it against the rules, or make sure their game won't break cause of it. I recommend the latter, if possible. My games don't more specific than roles defined by power/faction and don't really have that problem, or they have named roles for everyone that have no connection to alignment (Mario Kart and League of Legend minis).
I think Akimbo may have/had a different definition of what it is/what was being asked. As a host I don't outlaw role calls, but they would have been fruitless because I've always had vanilla roles.
Nothing broken here, just learning!
Yes, I like generic PMs too (but sent out so you know it's started! I've never had it make me miss a day, but I like it check!). I'm just stuck on the idea that covers are just a given. It's really weird to me.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
I probably didn't need to outlaw rolecalls or whatever the thing kime and langly did was, but the mafia were already understrength, so I wanted to make it at least a little easier to hide.