Complain about bad things, but I'm not really that excited about calling the designers 'dumb'.
there are some pretty dumb decisions that continue to exist
for example, we had to actually ask for chat channels in this game
thats pretty fucking dumb design decision
we are still asking for more reliable connections for tournaments
as for gameplay, warpgates sure are a good mechanic, huh?
how about forcefields? those aren't dumb at all
The problem with calling people dumb based on decisions made in the development of a game (or anything really) is that unless you understand exactly how and why those decisions were made or came to be made, there isn't really any proper reason to be throwing around labels like dumb or stupid or incompetent. There could be all manner of reasons, all sorts of factors, a whole heap of variables as to why these decisions were made or have not been fixed yet. Unless we know what they are, we can't really go around making objective statements like saying XYZ persons are dumb.
Be subjective all you want, sure, but then you're saying stuff like "I think they're being dumb". Maybe I'm just being picky about terminology, but this is sort of how my train of thought runs when I see these sorts of things said.
Complain about bad things, but I'm not really that excited about calling the designers 'dumb'.
there are some pretty dumb decisions that continue to exist
for example, we had to actually ask for chat channels in this game
thats pretty fucking dumb design decision
we are still asking for more reliable connections for tournaments
as for gameplay, warpgates sure are a good mechanic, huh?
how about forcefields? those aren't dumb at all
I'll agree that the interface design and certain other options (lack of lan or an alternative) is pretty awful, but as far as gameplay is concerned there are very few glaring problems that I can think of that I don't particularly like. Funnily enough most of them have to do with Protoss eheheh
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TannerMS "I'm confidence cause I'm zerg!"Registered Userregular
edited April 2012
Even though 100 things about this game piss me off
It's pretty cool how little balancing Blizzard has actually done.
Every other game that I've played competitively was dominated by whoever could react fastest to monthly balance overhauls
I guess it is a reflection on how good BW was that the developers of one of the best designed and balanced RTS games ever made are considered 'dumb' for design decisions that have been shown to not be that good after a year of play.
did we really just go from complaining about dimaga turtling when that was the best way to win to praising it because the few other companies that still make rts games are absolutely god awful at it?
Okay, sorry, let me clarify. Despite ZvP lategame being not as good as I'd wish, Starcraft 2 is still a really fucking good game, regardless of the quality of other RTS games. And yes, this style of ZvP lategame didn't come about until fairly recently due to a constantly evolving metagame. I can't believe Blizzard didn't forsee this happening when they designed the game! They are so dumb.
The deathball problem was apparent as soon as people started playing on maps that allowed a third base, it isn't something new.
I'm not saying it's a problem that should have been fixed by now because it's clearly got a number of different causes from various stages of the game but it's silly to pretend that this stuff has just come up and caught everyone off guard.
Though I'll often bemoan on skype during a match that I, "fucking hate this bullshit game goddamn," I actually love playing this game. I hope hots doesn't fuck shit up.
This isn't a deathball problem, it is the problem that lategame battles are balanced around vortex and the synergy between infestors, broodlords and spine crawlers making it near impossible for Protoss to attack an entrenched Zerg army. Mass spine crawlers hasn't been around for that long, and I'm pretty sure people didn't see it coming until Stephano and Dimaga started rolling over Protoss with it.
The deathball problem was apparent as soon as people started playing on maps that allowed a third base, it isn't something new.
I'm not saying it's a problem that should have been fixed by now because it's clearly got a number of different causes from various stages of the game but it's silly to pretend that this stuff has just come up and caught everyone off guard.
The problem is though, that everything you think is a problem. Hell everything that the PA community as a whole might think is a problem either might be something that
1. Isn't easy or tenable to fix (like Warpgate)
2. Isn't a problem to an equal number of people
Not to say that you can't complain. That you can't suggest changes, or even that you aren't right when you point out things that are broken. But it's always with those two considerations, I hope.
LoserForHireX on
"The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
This isn't a deathball problem, it is the problem that lategame battles are balanced around vortex and the synergy between infestors, broodlords and spine crawlers making it near impossible for Protoss to attack an entrenched Zerg army. Mass spine crawlers hasn't been around for that long, and I'm pretty sure people didn't see it coming until Stephano and Dimaga started rolling over Protoss with it.
pretty sure i saw nestea mass spines back in like, april 2011
although that might have been vs terran
Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
I have seen you leave games at absurd times, jaziek. I can't think of any examples right now, but I know I've done a huge analysis of a bunch of your games and in several of them you weren't dead when you left.
I have seen you leave games at absurd times, jaziek. I can't think of any examples right now, but I know I've done a huge analysis of a bunch of your games and in several of them you weren't dead when you left.
I may not have been dead, but it would require me to take stupid big risks, or a MASSIVE fuck up on my opponent's part to get me into a position where I could win.
Like, zerg kills my third.
Yes, he may not actually be able to kill me completely at that moment, but at this point me staying in the game is just stalling the inevitable.
If someone fucks you up just make DTs and hope they're ill-prepared.
It is by no means a sound strategy but it is a chance, and if you have no other you may as well take it.
Complain about bad things, but I'm not really that excited about calling the designers 'dumb'.
this is more how I feel.
warpgate and FF are fucking awesome in a way. they are cool concepts. it turns out that they lead to frustrating gameplay sometimes and are incredibly difficult to balance around. however... they've been balanced around. because of that you can't just rip em out of the game.
jaziekBad at everythingAnd mad about it.Registered Userregular
It is SO HARD to not just play another game when your third loss of the day is to a 6 pool. But nope. Gotta stop. 5-3 is a good score. Don't push your luck.
Especially when I did a retarded defence that even a bronze league player could tell me wouldn't work, all pylons and cannons everywhere around the bottom of my ramp.
I KNOW how to hold one, but my brain just goes "nope, not doing that today, sorry."
Posts
this is the part that always irks me.
think you can design and balance better? do it.
in the mean time let us never complain about anything bad
there are some pretty dumb decisions that continue to exist
for example, we had to actually ask for chat channels in this game
thats pretty fucking dumb design decision
we are still asking for more reliable connections for tournaments
as for gameplay, warpgates sure are a good mechanic, huh?
how about forcefields? those aren't dumb at all
exactly.
The problem with calling people dumb based on decisions made in the development of a game (or anything really) is that unless you understand exactly how and why those decisions were made or came to be made, there isn't really any proper reason to be throwing around labels like dumb or stupid or incompetent. There could be all manner of reasons, all sorts of factors, a whole heap of variables as to why these decisions were made or have not been fixed yet. Unless we know what they are, we can't really go around making objective statements like saying XYZ persons are dumb.
Be subjective all you want, sure, but then you're saying stuff like "I think they're being dumb". Maybe I'm just being picky about terminology, but this is sort of how my train of thought runs when I see these sorts of things said.
I'll agree that the interface design and certain other options (lack of lan or an alternative) is pretty awful, but as far as gameplay is concerned there are very few glaring problems that I can think of that I don't particularly like. Funnily enough most of them have to do with Protoss eheheh
It's pretty cool how little balancing Blizzard has actually done.
Every other game that I've played competitively was dominated by whoever could react fastest to monthly balance overhauls
that was dumb
i don't think i should have to specify each time that its my opinion
I'm not saying it's a problem that should have been fixed by now because it's clearly got a number of different causes from various stages of the game but it's silly to pretend that this stuff has just come up and caught everyone off guard.
The problem is though, that everything you think is a problem. Hell everything that the PA community as a whole might think is a problem either might be something that
1. Isn't easy or tenable to fix (like Warpgate)
2. Isn't a problem to an equal number of people
Not to say that you can't complain. That you can't suggest changes, or even that you aren't right when you point out things that are broken. But it's always with those two considerations, I hope.
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
pretty sure i saw nestea mass spines back in like, april 2011
although that might have been vs terran
reducing the oversaturation and meaning people are more likely to watch more matches
but i gotta tell you
it fucking sucks that it always seems to be days when I really feel like watching some GSL - its not on.
VODs arent the same
because most of the time I am behind.
Yeah quite a bit actually.
I type stuff in and then scroll through the stuff looking for what I am after. Sub-par, but it works.
maybe they've done something with it recently? im sure i nearly killed someone in frustration the last time i tried to use it
I may not have been dead, but it would require me to take stupid big risks, or a MASSIVE fuck up on my opponent's part to get me into a position where I could win.
Like, zerg kills my third.
Yes, he may not actually be able to kill me completely at that moment, but at this point me staying in the game is just stalling the inevitable.
It is by no means a sound strategy but it is a chance, and if you have no other you may as well take it.
If someone isn't prepared for DTs and they fend it off, they won't expect you to go DTs again.
don't leave until there are lings in your main man. it won't hurt you.
this is more how I feel.
warpgate and FF are fucking awesome in a way. they are cool concepts. it turns out that they lead to frustrating gameplay sometimes and are incredibly difficult to balance around. however... they've been balanced around. because of that you can't just rip em out of the game.
Especially when I did a retarded defence that even a bronze league player could tell me wouldn't work, all pylons and cannons everywhere around the bottom of my ramp.
I KNOW how to hold one, but my brain just goes "nope, not doing that today, sorry."
sounds like you had a good day but it's always hard to stop on something frustrating.
I felt extra satisfied beating him because it turns out on top of being random he rolled terran, the double sin.
So anyway I'm still diamond SEA. Feels good mang.
It's just
"methods" are usually for ways to improve chances of getting pregnant, or diet, or something