Divorce Questions

Veevee · May 2012

So my wife, well now ex-wife I guess, and I have decided that our marriage needs to end. We may still have feelings for each other, but we just aren't truly compatible and end up sucking the fun and joy out of each others life. We want to do this without lawyers, we already know how we want to split assets and debts and thankfully we don't have any children or even pets. I'm not here for pity or anything. It's a thing, it happened, now trying to move on and learn from mistakes that were made.

I just have two questions that I don't know how to find the answers for.

1) We were married in Nevada, I am currently a resident of Wisconsin, she is currently a resident of Florida. Where do we file the actually divorce, or better yet where would be the best place to file?

2) How do we actually separate our debts? How do we tell our creditors "Yeah I'm responsible for X, She's responsible for Y," or is this even possible?

godmode · May 2012

Sorry that things didn't work out

I would recommend seeing a divorce lawyer. They can give you the best advice on where to file, plus they will help settle asset allocation, to include debts.

Veevee · May 2012

We were honestly hoping to keep this lawyer free. Finances don't really allow it, and we already know exactly who gets what.

If that honestly is the best solution, then so be it and I'll find a way to pay for it. I'd just rather it didn't come to it

MetroidZoid · May 2012

Check to see if there's any free or reduced rate services for groups in the area that will give you the general steps for a clean divorce.

As far as the creditors, when I got my divorce in Oregon, there was a good stack of paperwork and on it there were section(s) where you could list out outstanding debts. Didn't have any though, so I can't comment on how that was processed, but as longs as both parties agree (eg you file the same paperwork and sign the same paperwork, stipulating that you both agree to the split), then when you get proof of that divorce back, I'd imagine that's what you have as proof to your creditors.

Also, depending on what debts you have, and the fact that it doesn't take much to make things messy and/or heated, a divorce lawyer may actually be the easier route, and doesn't have to be the most expensive either. I know my ex was all sugar and butterflies when we first filed, and then she started pointing out things in the house she was taking.

godmode · May 2012

That's along the line I was thinking too, just to make sure things are in writing. It's always better to have things in writing.

MetroidZoid · May 2012

Yes. Even if it's your own contract worked out between you; I have a quick note that says (in the most formal language I could muster) that basically if I agreed to file taxes jointly and split the return (even when I was making more, but in the long run, I would've paid more singularly), and if I paid for the $200 to file for divorce (she ponied up the other $60), that she wouldn't ask for any more funds to the divorce, truck, or anything. She begrudgingly accepted, and we signed and dated it and both had copies. Also, I had no issue with her taking the original to make a copy of, because if she destroyed it, (A) I had a picture on my phone and (B) I'd refuse to sign the tax forms.

Enc · May 2012

Even with the cost problems, go to a divorce lawyer. Most will scale their wages based upon your income, or if they wont take your case due to you being beneath their minimum rate, they will likely refer you to another firm that handles low income scenarios.

Usagi · May 2012

What you're looking for is called pro se divorce, and you should check and see if either of your states offer it as a legal option (some don't). Your local judicial branch's website will probably has all of the info you need, including forms and instructions and possibly a help desk type situation with the court clerk.

WildEEP · May 2012

You file for divorce in your state of residence. You two just need to figure out who is going to be doing the filing / trips to the courthouse. You will not need to see each other or travel to one-or-the-others home state to make this happen. This is assuming that the divorce is completely uncontested...because if either of you want to fight over debts, assets, or children - be prepared for a long process that will definitely involve travel.

At each step of the way - from the first paper you file, you must provide notice to your spouse that you are filing it/recording it/that its going to happen, etc. Notice is huge and its regimented - its not enough to tell her, you have to record that your telling her via a piece of paper and then turn that paper in saying that you provided notice.

As for the division of stuff / bills. When you file for divorce, it will ask for a copy of the separation agreement - most states, this is a document that will be included with the final divorce decree (the thing that makes you unmarried). Some states have this down to a form, some states allow you to just write something up. There are templates on the web - just make sure it works with whatever state you're in.

This is where you write it all out - who is responsible for what and in what amounts. Not just bills, but assets too. Who gets the bank account, who gets the furniture, who gets the photos, etc. Also - don't forget benefits - write in that neither of you are seeking the other for healthcare, retirement accounts, or other spousal support (alimony) after the divorce.

I gotta get to work - I'll stop back in this thread and drop some detailed info for you later.

Darkewolfe · May 2012

One of the big things to note is that any sort of agreement you guys come to, if contested, won't necessarily hold up in court. If a year from now there's a fight over debt or something, for instance, and you go before a judge, he's not actually going to place much weight on the contract you drew up informally without a lawyer. Contracts that don't have legal advice supporting each party aren't given much weight, because those situations are the ones where someone is more often being taken advantage of. If you're pretty sure that won't happen, you could risk it, but just be aware that if you end up in court you'll basically be at square one.

EggyToast · May 2012

My girlfriend is divorced, and her ex-husband resided in Wisconsin. They could have technically gotten divorced in Illinois, Indiana, Wisconsin, or Maryland, and her ex-husband researched it and found that Wisconsin had the most favorable terms for divorce.

In general, what you'll do is file a no-fault, uncontested divorce which is simply both parties agreeing to get divorced. You'll file it in Wisconsin, and then you'll have to have your wife served with a defendant's affidavit, which she'll have signed and notarized stating that she agrees and does not contest the action, and then you'll submit everything to the court. You'll have to go to your county courthouse to get the paperwork started, so it may be best to go there first to simply get the paperwork and ask the clerk what your first step is.

mythago · May 2012

Veevee wrote: »

We were honestly hoping to keep this lawyer free. Finances don't really allow it, and we already know exactly who gets what.

If that honestly is the best solution, then so be it and I'll find a way to pay for it. I'd just rather it didn't come to it

You absolutely, positively must talk to a lawyer.

BUT.

That doesn't mean that you have to each have a lawyer to do the whole divorce. You can do a divorce yourself (every state allows pro se filings, it's just rarely a good idea). But to answer questions like "Where should I file?" and "Are there any potential traps to be aware of because we live in different states?" then you MUST meet with a lawyer initially.

This doesn't have to be expensive, by the way. Many state and county bar associations have free or low-cost referral services. In my state it's routine for this to cost you maybe $50 for an hour with a lawyer who specializes in the matter in question (family law, in your case). After you have an idea of what to do, then you can look at your state courts' self-help information. For example, Wisconsin has a Modest Means Program. (That page also has information about lawyer referrals.)

If you get anything online, stick to Nolo, their stuff is actually very good and you won't just be getting out of date forms.

Hotandnerdy · May 2012

godmode wrote: »

Sorry that things didn't work out

I would recommend seeing a divorce lawyer. They can give you the best advice on where to file, plus they will help settle asset allocation, to include debts.

This, plus where ever you file should have paperwork and details how to seperate debt.

You could always call a lawyer, they usually give you a free consult over the phone.

Veevee · May 2012

Thanks for the advice, and it looks like I will be looking for a lawyer to sit down with and make sure all our ducks are in a row.

badpoet · May 2012

For sure in Wisconsin, you have to actually appear in court for a court date when the divorce is finalized. Make sure you take that into account, especially since she's living that far away.

My ex-wife and I divided assets and debts without a lawyer (we didn't have a lot of either, like $8000 debt and our assets were just things we divided up). When I paid off my side (used my car as collateral for a loan), we met at the bank and had notarized a statement saying neither she nor I owed anything to each other and no further debts could or would be accrued in the others' name.

I've been divorced for 10 years and have had no issues whatsoever.

XArchangelX · May 2012

Yeah, treat this like dissolving a business arrangement. Make sure you get each others names off any debt, as you're liable for anything with your signature on it, and there are countless stories of debt, usually a mortgage, that one side agrees to pay on, then doesn't, then they come for the other side and both sides credit gets a head shot. You basically have to do a deal with each creditor to convince them to take her/your name off of whatever, and relies on your individual credit scores. This is easier with small amounts, difficult with larger amounts.

Might be worth doing some research, but I believe it's easiest to divorce in the state in which you filed the marriage certificate. Since it's Nevada, you could probably do it through the mail, as I imagine it's a fairly common thing there.

GnomeTank · May 2012

We used a pro se divorce service here in Washington that essentially mailed us all the forms, walked us through some stuff, filed for us, called us whenever something else needed to be sent in, and generally did the things a divorce lawyer is going to tell their legal assistant to do, but charge you his rate for. Every state is different though, and Washington allows us to divorce without ever really stepping foot in court. If you guys are like my wife and I, and completely agree on everything, you don't need a lawyer, but you still need to do things legally, which you can do alone, but using a cheap legal filing service helps.

The documents you fill out and sign will codify the various agreements you've made, so that you are both protected and everything is nice and legal.

LaPuzza · May 2012

One note on debts - the creditors do not have to honor your arrangements with your ex.

For example, let's say she has a credit card she has always used but you are named on the account as an owner as well. If she stops paying the bills, you do not have a defense against the credit card companies just because she agreed to pay that bill. Visa will say "that's between you and your ex, pay us and sue her."

You can stop the hole from getting deeper by having the bank take you off of the account - new charges won't be your problem - but the old debt is yours until it is paid.

Penny Arcade

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