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Paint the Line return/advantage question

alexhollizalexholliz Registered User
edited August 2012 in Penny Arcade Games
Does the advantage/disad apply on a return shot even if that return shot has advantage over the last card played?
Ex: I play a lob card that confers a -2 Dis to the return, if the other player plays a drive do they still take the -2, then add their shot bonus?

alexholliz on


  • olanmillsolanmills Registered User regular
    *Disclaimer: This is just my own interpretation of the rules

    Yes, I think so. The idea is that lobs are defensive, drives are offensive, and spins are somewhere in between.

    Now, by "defensive shot", it's meant that you will have an easier time returning the ball. You get a +x added to your roll, to help you make a successful hit, but the shot is not any more difficult for your opponent to return (hence the -0 penalty on all lob shots).

    "Offensive shot" means that your opponent will have a harder time returning your shot. Your opponent faces a -x added to his die roll, which makes it harder for him to successfully hit, but you don't get any extra help in hitting the offensive shot (hence the +0 bonus on all drive shots).

    Spin shots have a bonus for the hitter and a penalty for the receiver, but the values of either are generally lower than bonuses on lobs and penalties on drives.

    The reason I explained all that without yet explaining my answer is because your example is not one that can happen in the game unless you use an Enhancement card, so I just wanted to set up a more basic example.

    When it comes to Advantage, the Advantage only applies when you are:

    -using any shot card after your opponent hit a Default Shot at you
    -using a shot card with a type that "beats" the shot type that your opponent just hit at you

    When returning a shot, the +Bonus applies to you, and the -Penalty applies to your opponent, regardless of what they use to return your shot (unless they play an ability that has some special effect in this regard)

    So for a more realistic example:
    (EI = Escalation Index)

    EI = 6
    Your opponent serves with Default Shot
    -he rolls something larger than 6, so he succeeds

    You return with Drive Shot
    -You have Advantage, since you are returning a Default Shot
    -Advantage bonus for Drive Shot is +0, so you must roll at least an 8 to succeed
    -You roll something larger than an 8, so you succeed
    -The Advantage also has a -2 penalty for your opponent, which you'll see in just a second

    Your opponent returns with High Lob
    -Your opponent has Advantage, since he is returning a Drive Shot with a Lob Shot
    -Because you had Advantage when you hit, the -2 penalty applies to your opponent
    -Because he has Advantage now, he gets a +3 bonus
    -The EI is 10, with a -2 penalty, and + 3 bonus, so your opponent only needs to roll a 9 to succeed ( [die roll] - 2 + 3 >= 10)

    Does that make sense? Based on what the rule book says, I don't think you can "cancel out" Advantage from your opponent by hitting with Advantage back. When it is your turn to hit, you either have Advantage, or you don't. That determines which set of numbers you'll use. The +Bonus applies the die roll that you are just about to perform in order to try to hit, regardless of whether you have Advantage or not. The -Penalty will apply to your opponent's very next die roll, regardless of whether or not he has Advantage.

    You use Advantage only to increase the value of the bonus and penalty.

    Of course, special abilities can alter bonuses and penalties.

  • billwertbillwert Registered User regular
    This was a sticking point in the rules for me as well. Thinking through it logically, I think this is the only reasonable explanation. It would be nice if there was an official PTL FAQ somewhere.

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