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[PA Comic] Wednesday, October 30th, 2012 - Your Cosplay Headquarters

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Posts

  • JortalusJortalus Registered User regular
    This entire comic had me in stitches. Every panel is a win.

  • jackaljackal Fuck Yes. That is an orderly anal warehouse. Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    Surface tablets are compelling. WinRT apps running on phones, tablets and desktops is compelling. The way MS is embracing asynchrony at an OS and language level is extremely compelling. Windows 8 as a desktop experience is not terribly compelling. I think MS knows this because they made it cheap as fuck to upgrade, and the ads for the OS are basically, "8 8 8 look Cut the Rope 8 8 8 rocket launching 8 8 8 now a car is spinning."

    At this point I think they need users to install Windows 8 far more than users need Windows 8. They should probably pay us to install it instead of the other way around. Given their gigantic advertising budget it may be a valid strategy. Unlike Vista they can't just wait a few years and repackage it. If Windows 8 fails it fucks this entire device ecosystem that they are trying to build.

    jackal on
  • Groosenat0rGroosenat0r http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sy70Z6x00TM SkyloftRegistered User regular
    edited November 2012
    DivX, Thomas and Fruit Fucker, how I've missed those suckers... how I missed classic penny arcade... Only thing that could've made this better was zombie Jim going as himself. Also looks like Thomas lost weight and grew beaver teeth, good for him...

    Groosenat0r on
  • HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    I wouldn't mind Windows 8 if it had a tablet edition and traditional edition (akin to their habit of Standard, Home, Expert, Super Expert Pro, etc.), but they've taken the interface that's needed of tablets and just apply it to regular computers, be they desktops or laptops, and that is... really jarring. Worse yet, I'm told that in Windows 8 there's no way to change the desktop to go back to a more traditional style - start bar, icons all over the desk top, that sorta thing. And I mean without any strings attached, because I'm told there's a "sort of!" mode of this, but it still isn't it.

    Maybe I truly am an old man now who just hates new shit. Or maybe it's that there's nothing wrong with the UI as it has been for the last couple decades and arbitrary change actually does suck. Look at people's reactions to Facebook and Twitter when they change shit for the sake of changing it. If it isn't broken, don't fix it. I can understand streamlining for people like my mother who are really 'bad' (which is a harsh term, I don't expect people to be skilled by any means) with computers, but don't remove the shit most of us are used to.

  • KalTorakKalTorak One way or another, they all end up in the Undercity.Registered User regular
    DivX, Thomas and Fruit Fucker, how I've missed those suckers... how I missed classic penny arcade... Only thing that could've made this better was zombie Jim going as himself. Also looks like Thomas lost weight and grew beaver teeth, good for him...

    I think that's Thomas' tongue

    What's Tycho dressed as?

  • halkunhalkun Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    Windows RT is one of the silliest geese when it comes to OSs.
    I mean that in the *strongest* term possible.

    When they say that it will only run Metro apps, they are not kidding. I was able to compile a native ARM "Hello World" console executable for RT and tried to run it from the DOS window.

    Nope, even command-line programs require a digital signature. What kind of puts me on-edge about that is the PC version of Windows 8 version *also* has the same digital signature enforcement, it's just turned off.

    halkun on
  • LorahaloLorahalo Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    KalTorak wrote: »
    DivX, Thomas and Fruit Fucker, how I've missed those suckers... how I missed classic penny arcade... Only thing that could've made this better was zombie Jim going as himself. Also looks like Thomas lost weight and grew beaver teeth, good for him...

    I think that's Thomas' tongue

    What's Tycho dressed as?

    Kevin Flynn, played by Jeff Bridges in Tron: Legacy. Div as Finn is brilliant.

    Lorahalo on
    I have a podcast about Digimon called the Digital Moncast, on Audio Entropy.
  • Groosenat0rGroosenat0r http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sy70Z6x00TM SkyloftRegistered User regular
    edited November 2012
    Lorahalo wrote: »
    KalTorak wrote: »
    DivX, Thomas and Fruit Fucker, how I've missed those suckers... how I missed classic penny arcade... Only thing that could've made this better was zombie Jim going as himself. Also looks like Thomas lost weight and grew beaver teeth, good for him...

    I think that's Thomas' tongue

    What's Tycho dressed as?

    Kevin Flynn, played by Jeff Bridges in Tron: Legacy. Div as Finn is brilliant.

    Would've been neat if Div dressed his plug up like a tiny Jake

    Groosenat0r on
  • HRDSalami654HRDSalami654 Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    jackal wrote: »
    ... Windows 8 as a desktop experience is not terribly compelling. I think MS knows this because they made it cheap as fuck to upgrade, and the ads for the OS are basically, "8 8 8 look Cut the Rope 8 8 8 rocket launching 8 8 8 now a car is spinning."

    At this point I think they need users to install Windows 8 far more than users need Windows 8. They should probably pay us to install it instead of the other way around. Given their gigantic advertising budget it may be a valid strategy. Unlike Vista they can't just wait a few years and repackage it. If Windows 8 fails it fucks this entire device ecosystem that they are trying to build.

    They are only temporarily selling it cheap during a promotional period, it will be $199. Also, I have been using Windows 8 for a while (Consumer Preview actually) and it is actually kind of hard to go back to Windows 7 now. There are a few reasons for this, one of which is the fact that the move from Windows 7 to 8 was about the same experience as moving from Vista to 7. Windows 8 is faster, has better file system management by a large degree, and it syncs across the OS, even if you are on someone else's computer you can log in as yourself and have your desktop history in front of you. The touch aspect does take getting used to, but like I've said I have used it for a while and barely notice it now.

    I have to say, and I really don't mean to insult anyone, it just seem like those that don't like the idea of Windows 8/RT are those that are scared of change. I mean, cavemen were probably pretty comfortable once they got used to living in caves, but that does not mean they should have stayed there.

    HRDSalami654 on
  • DurkhanusDurkhanus Commander Registered User regular
    Wednesday, October 30th?

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    jackal wrote: »
    ... Windows 8 as a desktop experience is not terribly compelling. I think MS knows this because they made it cheap as fuck to upgrade, and the ads for the OS are basically, "8 8 8 look Cut the Rope 8 8 8 rocket launching 8 8 8 now a car is spinning."

    At this point I think they need users to install Windows 8 far more than users need Windows 8. They should probably pay us to install it instead of the other way around. Given their gigantic advertising budget it may be a valid strategy. Unlike Vista they can't just wait a few years and repackage it. If Windows 8 fails it fucks this entire device ecosystem that they are trying to build.

    They are only temporarily selling it cheap during a promotional period, it will be $199. Also, I have been using Windows 8 for a while (Consumer Preview actually) and it is actually kind of hard to go back to Windows 7 now. There are a few reasons for this, one of which is the fact that the move from Windows 7 to 8 was about the same experience as moving from Vista to 7. Windows 8 is faster, has better file system management by a large degree, and it syncs across the OS, even if you are on someone else's computer you can log in as yourself and have your desktop history in front of you. The touch aspect does take getting used to, but like I've said I have used it for a while and barely notice it now.

    I have to say, and I really don't mean to insult anyone, it just seem like those that don't like the idea of Windows 8/RT are those that are scared of change. I mean, cavemen were probably pretty comfortable once they got used to living in caves, but that does not mean they should have stayed there.

    The problem isn't that people don't like the idea of Windows 8, it's that no one gives a fuck.

  • jackaljackal Fuck Yes. That is an orderly anal warehouse. Registered User regular
    I kind of want to upgrade my wife's laptop to take advantage of the syncing, but I think she would cut me.

  • Bill_PeschelBill_Peschel Registered User regular
    "I have to say, and I really don't mean to insult anyone, it just seem like those that don't like the idea of Windows 8/RT are those that are scared of change."

    No offense taken, but since I've been working with computers since the punch-card days, I think I can tell the difference between an upgrade that benefits the user, and an upgrade that benefits the company's revenue stream.

    I have no incentive to upgrade, except to wonder about the file-management system. Does that mean, if I search for a fucking word that exists in a fucking Word document, Windows will actually find it?

  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    Based on my experience with the Win8 preview (albeit a version from a while ago) and every review/rundown I've seen or read, I see nothing that it offers which gives me an incentive to switch that will outweigh the things I dislike about it.

    I understand their strategy in trying to move towards a semi-unified ecosystem between their desktop operating system and their mobile platform, but I don't use a Windows Phone, have no interest in getting a Surface, and the resulting experience in the PC environment seems half-baked and compromised.

  • HRDSalami654HRDSalami654 Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    What I mean by better file management is that, while the basics of Windows 7 are still there, when you transfer a file over a network or to another HDD/SSD you can see how much of your data pipe you are currently using, and if you want to you can pause the transfer and come back to later. It also allows for better version detection, so if there is a group of files transferring to a folder that has files with the same name the OS will let you select whether you want to keep the old or new files with the same name and it will only do it if there is a large difference between the two files (like size for example), instead of being done with every file that matches. It will also ask if you want to create a second version of the same file with a different name (adds a number in parentheses) if you want to keep the file. The search function itself is much the same, but it is a bit faster, and with the Metro search you can actually search within an app if the developer enables the correct API (the store, music, or mail is a good example of that).

    The task manager is also much more vast than in Window 7, even if initially it looks like a kid's toy, when you show more detail it becomes a powerful tool for determining what program is in need of attention. The task manager even breaks programs into different categories like which are background processes, Windows processes, and active processes (and all of them show how much of the computer resources they are using with a different highlight color). There are more differences, but I do not abide writing an essay in the PA forums.

    To be clear, and possibly clarify what I said earlier, the criticism that gets to me is how people complain that Windows 8 is of no use with a mouse and keyboard. The mouse and keyboard part is a key point that I have a hard time tolerating because it just says to me that the person making the criticism has not used the platform, nor do they even wish to try it and see if it grows on them. If you are happy with Windows 7 that's fine, I'm not trying to convert anyone to the Windows 8 cult here, I just want to clear up the air because there are a LOT of Microsoft trolls out there that act lie their whole family was murdered by Microsoft. Windows 8 is an improvement over Windows 7, the touch UI is not meant for mouse and keyboard (though it is not entirely unlikeable either), and I only wish that those who criticize the platform at least use it so they can make original criticisms rather than regurgitating the same tired shit that EVERY ELSE HAS FUCKING SAID ALREADY. It's starting to sound like the Apple antennagate thing. The touch UI in Windows 8 is not an actual problem, it is just different.

    This turned out longer than what I originally intended, sorry.

    HRDSalami654 on
  • The Good Doctor TranThe Good Doctor Tran Registered User regular
    What I mean by better file management is that, while the basics of Windows 7 are still there, when you transfer a file over a network or to another HDD/SSD you can see how much of your data pipe you are currently using, and if you want to you can pause the transfer and come back to later. It also allows for better version detection, so if there is a group of files transferring to a folder that has files with the same name the OS will let you select whether you want to keep the old or new files with the same name and it will only do it if there is a large difference between the two files (like size for example), instead of being done with every file that matches. It will also ask if you want to create a second version of the same file with a different name (adds a number in parentheses) if you want to keep the file. The search function itself is much the same, but it is a bit faster, and with the Metro search you can actually search within an app if the developer enables the correct API (the store, music, or mail is a good example of that).

    The task manager is also much more vast than in Window 7, even if initially it looks like a kid's toy, when you show more detail it becomes a powerful tool for determining what program is in need of attention. The task manager even breaks programs into different categories like which are background processes, Windows processes, and active processes (and all of them show how much of the computer resources they are using with a different highlight color). There are more differences, but I do not abide writing an essay in the PA forums.

    To be clear, and possibly clarify what I said earlier, the criticism that gets to me is how people complain that Windows 8 is of no use with a mouse and keyboard. The mouse and keyboard part is a key point that I have a hard time tolerating because it just says to me that the person making the criticism has not used the platform, nor do they even wish to try it and see if it grows on them. If you are happy with Windows 7 that's fine, I'm not trying to convert anyone to the Windows 8 cult here, I just want to clear up the air because there are a LOT of Microsoft trolls out there that act lie their whole family was murdered by Microsoft. Windows 8 is an improvement over Windows 7, the touch UI is not meant for mouse and keyboard (though it is not entirely unlikeable either), and I only wish that those who criticize the platform at least use it so they can make original criticisms rather than regurgitating the same tired shit that EVERY ELSE HAS FUCKING SAID ALREADY. It's starting to sound like the Apple antennagate thing. The touch UI in Windows 8 is not an actual problem, it is just different.

    This turned out longer than what I originally intended, sorry.

    Right but people aren't trying it because there simply isn't any reason to. The existing system works fine - hell, I still have a perfectly viable gaming rig running XP 64. I do not like what Microsoft is doing with the Games for Windows thing, I do not like the way the new UI looks, and I don't partake of their existing product ecosystem beyond the OS. Also, let me be clear that I'm a PC person - I think Apple is as guilty of this OS refresh bullshit as Microsoft currently is. If there were any compelling reason for me to actually spend the time to like the thing, I would do so, but at this time there is no such reason.

    LoL & Spiral Knights & MC & SMNC: Carrington - Origin: CarringtonPlus - Steam: skdrtran
  • jackaljackal Fuck Yes. That is an orderly anal warehouse. Registered User regular
    XP worked fine, but it sucks compared to Vista and up. Good enough isn't good enough.

  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    jackal wrote: »
    XP worked fine, but it sucks compared to Vista and up. Good enough isn't good enough.

    The crux of your post is that Vista and up were better than XP, had advantages over it which on balance made them superior (which in the case of Vista many people would dispute, incidentally). The issue is that many people do not believe this to be the case with Win8 compared to Win7.

  • jackaljackal Fuck Yes. That is an orderly anal warehouse. Registered User regular
    The step from 7 to 8 is far larger than the step from Vista to 7. I'll admit it's unclear if it was a step in the right direction.

  • halkunhalkun Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    jackal wrote: »
    The step from 7 to 8 is far larger than the step from Vista to 7. I'll admit it's unclear if it was a step in the right direction.
    Vista is version 6.0, Win7 is 6.1 and win8 is 6.2. (Open a command prompt and type "ver", you'll see I'm not kidding) The only thing I see that is any different is that the interface shell has changed. Much of the core systems are pretty much exactly the same.. Stripping away the metro nonsense, I can write an application that fiddles with kernel functions and almost all the services between Vista, 7 and 8, and you would be hard pressed to find any difference at all. So far the only real difference I found inside Win8 is the RT broker (That is what "plugs" Metro into Windows), and all that really does is open an API to the CLR which C#, VB.net, and the other .net whoizts sit on anyway.

    The Kernel was left pretty much untouched again

    halkun on
  • HRDSalami654HRDSalami654 Registered User regular
    halkun wrote: »
    jackal wrote: »
    The step from 7 to 8 is far larger than the step from Vista to 7. I'll admit it's unclear if it was a step in the right direction.
    Vista is version 6.0, Win7 is 6.1 and win8 is 6.2. (Open a command prompt and type "ver", you'll see I'm not kidding) The only thing I see that is any different is that the interface shell has changed. Much of the core systems are pretty much exactly the same.. Stripping away the metro nonsense, I can write an application that fiddles with kernel functions and almost all the services between Vista, 7 and 8, and you would be hard pressed to find any difference at all. So far the only real difference I found inside Win8 is the RT broker (That is what "plugs" Metro into Windows), and all that really does is open an API to the CLR which C#, VB.net, and the other .net whoizts sit on anyway.

    The Kernel was left pretty much untouched again

    And the kernel will probably not change for quite a while.

  • LegendofLinkLegendofLink Registered User regular
    What I mean by better file management is that, while the basics of Windows 7 are still there, when you transfer a file over a network or to another HDD/SSD you can see how much of your data pipe you are currently using, and if you want to you can pause the transfer and come back to later. It also allows for better version detection, so if there is a group of files transferring to a folder that has files with the same name the OS will let you select whether you want to keep the old or new files with the same name and it will only do it if there is a large difference between the two files (like size for example), instead of being done with every file that matches. It will also ask if you want to create a second version of the same file with a different name (adds a number in parentheses) if you want to keep the file. The search function itself is much the same, but it is a bit faster, and with the Metro search you can actually search within an app if the developer enables the correct API (the store, music, or mail is a good example of that).

    The task manager is also much more vast than in Window 7, even if initially it looks like a kid's toy, when you show more detail it becomes a powerful tool for determining what program is in need of attention. The task manager even breaks programs into different categories like which are background processes, Windows processes, and active processes (and all of them show how much of the computer resources they are using with a different highlight color). There are more differences, but I do not abide writing an essay in the PA forums.

    To be clear, and possibly clarify what I said earlier, the criticism that gets to me is how people complain that Windows 8 is of no use with a mouse and keyboard. The mouse and keyboard part is a key point that I have a hard time tolerating because it just says to me that the person making the criticism has not used the platform, nor do they even wish to try it and see if it grows on them. If you are happy with Windows 7 that's fine, I'm not trying to convert anyone to the Windows 8 cult here, I just want to clear up the air because there are a LOT of Microsoft trolls out there that act lie their whole family was murdered by Microsoft. Windows 8 is an improvement over Windows 7, the touch UI is not meant for mouse and keyboard (though it is not entirely unlikeable either), and I only wish that those who criticize the platform at least use it so they can make original criticisms rather than regurgitating the same tired shit that EVERY ELSE HAS FUCKING SAID ALREADY. It's starting to sound like the Apple antennagate thing. The touch UI in Windows 8 is not an actual problem, it is just different.

    This turned out longer than what I originally intended, sorry.

    Right but people aren't trying it because there simply isn't any reason to. The existing system works fine - hell, I still have a perfectly viable gaming rig running XP 64. I do not like what Microsoft is doing with the Games for Windows thing, I do not like the way the new UI looks, and I don't partake of their existing product ecosystem beyond the OS. Also, let me be clear that I'm a PC person - I think Apple is as guilty of this OS refresh bullshit as Microsoft currently is. If there were any compelling reason for me to actually spend the time to like the thing, I would do so, but at this time there is no such reason.

    And at least Apple's OS refreshes are rather cheap (or at least they are nowadays, they used to be similarly expensive). Mountain Lion is only $30.

  • JormungandrJormungandr Registered User regular
    To be clear, and possibly clarify what I said earlier, the criticism that gets to me is how people complain that Windows 8 is of no use with a mouse and keyboard. The mouse and keyboard part is a key point that I have a hard time tolerating because it just says to me that the person making the criticism has not used the platform, nor do they even wish to try it and see if it grows on them. If you are happy with Windows 7 that's fine, I'm not trying to convert anyone to the Windows 8 cult here, I just want to clear up the air because there are a LOT of Microsoft trolls out there that act lie their whole family was murdered by Microsoft. Windows 8 is an improvement over Windows 7, the touch UI is not meant for mouse and keyboard (though it is not entirely unlikeable either), and I only wish that those who criticize the platform at least use it so they can make original criticisms rather than regurgitating the same tired shit that EVERY ELSE HAS FUCKING SAID ALREADY. It's starting to sound like the Apple antennagate thing. The touch UI in Windows 8 is not an actual problem, it is just different.

    So I guess I have two questions, then.

    1. What hardware are you using Windows 8 on currently where you're having a good experience? It sounds like it's something with a touch screen, so maybe a tablet? A smart phone? I doubt it's a laptop or desktop with a touch screen interface, but if it is, I'm sure you're aware that that's not a typical setup, right?

    2. I think most people aren't resistant to Windows 8 on a hardware platform that has a touch screen interface because it seems like it's borrowing in a lot of ways from existing iOS / Android / etc control schemes, which absolutely work. The resistance is mainly from people who have a desktop computer, or laptop computer where their current interface is keyboard/mouse. So the obvious question from those desktop/laptop users is "Is Windows 8 for us?".

    My current take on it is that it seems like a perfectly functional OS if I had the control scheme that it was designed for. Since I really don't, I'm going to stay Windows 7 for a while and see what happens. Maybe Windows 8 SP 1 will include a "classic" interface or something, at which point I'd consider it.

  • FramlingFramling FaceHead Geebs has bad ideas.Registered User regular
    halkun wrote: »
    jackal wrote: »
    The step from 7 to 8 is far larger than the step from Vista to 7. I'll admit it's unclear if it was a step in the right direction.
    Vista is version 6.0, Win7 is 6.1 and win8 is 6.2. (Open a command prompt and type "ver", you'll see I'm not kidding) The only thing I see that is any different is that the interface shell has changed. Much of the core systems are pretty much exactly the same.. Stripping away the metro nonsense, I can write an application that fiddles with kernel functions and almost all the services between Vista, 7 and 8, and you would be hard pressed to find any difference at all. So far the only real difference I found inside Win8 is the RT broker (That is what "plugs" Metro into Windows), and all that really does is open an API to the CLR which C#, VB.net, and the other .net whoizts sit on anyway.

    The Kernel was left pretty much untouched again

    Vista made a whole bunch of the changes you're griping about not happening here, including the major version number going from 5 to 6. Know what happened? A whole bunch of people's shit quit working. Compatibility was a big reason for Vista getting the reputation it got. The version number specifically caused a preposterous number of issues. 3rd-party software would check the major version number, and if it didn't find "5", it would bomb out, assuming it was being run on a legacy OS.

    Is your complaint seriously that you can write something for 7 and it still works the same on 8? God, what a nightmare.

    FULL DISCLOSURE: I AM A FULL-TIME EMPLOYEE OF MICROSOFT CORPORATION. ANY OPINIONS EXPRESSED HEREIN ARE MY OWN, AND NOT THOSE OF MICROSOFT CORPORATION OR ITS SUBSIDIARIES OR AFFILIATES. I DID NOT ACTUALLY WORK ON ANY OF THE PRODUCTS MENTIONED ABOVE; ANY STATEMENTS MADE THEREIN ARE PROBABLY BASED LARGELY ON CRAP I READ ONLINE OR IN OTHER PUBLIC SOURCES. ANY LIKENESS TO ANY PERSONS OR EVENTS, LIVING OR DEAD, ARE COINCIDENTAL. THIS DISCLAIMER NOT TO BE REMOVED UNDER PENALTY OF LAW EXCEPT BY THE END CONSUMER. THIS TELECAST IS COPYRIGHTED BY THE NFL FOR THE PRIVATE USE OF OUR AUDIENCE. ANY OTHER USE OF THIS TELECAST, OR OF ANY PICTURES, DESCRIPTIONS, OR ACCOUNTS OF THE GAME WITHOUT THE NFL'S CONSENT IS PROHIBITED.

    you're = you are
    your = belonging to you

    their = belonging to them
    there = not here
    they're = they are
  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    halkun wrote: »
    The only thing I see that is any different is that the interface shell has changed.
    And since it's the UI that I have issues with, I'll be sticking with 7, just like I stuck with XP for the longest time.

  • mattvernonmattvernon Registered User new member
    Speaking briefly as an IT person. I have used all the various flavors of windows for quite a while. I have a week of Windows 8 under my belt at this point, and I do not like it. The issue I have is not touch screen based, I have a touch screen tablet/lappy thing. My issue is they have hidden the tools that make my life as an IT person easy. Installing devices, when they don't auto install is a nightmare, even installing windows applications is not easy, and once you do get something like Office installed it puts every .exe in the slides on the main screen. This creates a huge mess. I am going to spend time on every clients PC on just cleaning the interface, much less if I have to install a device that windows cant find drivers for.
    I will stick with 7 as long as I can, but sadly, as a MS technet subscriber, they disbaled all the versions of 7 excluding pro that I was able to download the week before. They are pushing 8 very hard not just to consumers but limiting access to professionals of the older OSes as well. It looks like it is here to stay for better or for worse.

  • ApolloinApolloin Registered User regular
    I am not at all happy with the direction that MS has moved in with regards to Windows 8 and I'll be seriously considering whether my next OS change is going to be a Microsoft product at all, at the very least I'll be sticking with 7 for as long as humanly possible.

    And to the poster who suggested I should just install a trial and use it before daring to have an opinion on what I consider to be a good use of my money I can only point out that researching a purchase I wish to make is my job. It is not my job to install Windows 8 and see if I can stomach using it. Installing OS upgrades for shits and giggles is not a hobby of mine - if MS wants me to upgrade to Win 8 it has to show me that there is some tangible benefit to ME that compensates me for shelling out the time, energy and money.

    As things stand, based on common opinion and on the advertising I've seen for Windows 8, I believe it to have been designed to maximise sales of Microsoft consoles, tablets, phones and other devices that will all be able to integrate into some sort of cloud-based lifestyle. As things stand, I use my mobile for phoning peeps, gmail for emailing peeps and if I want to share pictures with my friends, there's facebook.

    I wish to interface with my computer in the most DIRECTED AND SUCCINCT method possible. I don't want to interface with it by standing on one leg and waving my arms around, so you can keep KINECT. I don't want to interface with it by smooshing bodyparts across the screen of my viewing device like some sort of half-trained chimpanzee, so you can keep your Touchscreen interface.

  • halkunhalkun Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    Framling wrote: »
    halkun wrote: »
    jackal wrote: »
    The step from 7 to 8 is far larger than the step from Vista to 7. I'll admit it's unclear if it was a step in the right direction.
    Vista is version 6.0, Win7 is 6.1 and win8 is 6.2. (Open a command prompt and type "ver", you'll see I'm not kidding) The only thing I see that is any different is that the interface shell has changed. Much of the core systems are pretty much exactly the same.. Stripping away the metro nonsense, I can write an application that fiddles with kernel functions and almost all the services between Vista, 7 and 8, and you would be hard pressed to find any difference at all. So far the only real difference I found inside Win8 is the RT broker (That is what "plugs" Metro into Windows), and all that really does is open an API to the CLR which C#, VB.net, and the other .net whoizts sit on anyway.

    The Kernel was left pretty much untouched again

    Vista made a whole bunch of the changes you're griping about not happening here, including the major version number going from 5 to 6. Know what happened? A whole bunch of people's shit quit working. Compatibility was a big reason for Vista getting the reputation it got. The version number specifically caused a preposterous number of issues. 3rd-party software would check the major version number, and if it didn't find "5", it would bomb out, assuming it was being run on a legacy OS.

    Is your complaint seriously that you can write something for 7 and it still works the same on 8? God, what a nightmare.

    FULL DISCLOSURE: I AM A FULL-TIME EMPLOYEE OF MICROSOFT CORPORATION. ANY OPINIONS EXPRESSED HEREIN ARE MY OWN, AND NOT THOSE OF MICROSOFT CORPORATION OR ITS SUBSIDIARIES OR AFFILIATES. I DID NOT ACTUALLY WORK ON ANY OF THE PRODUCTS MENTIONED ABOVE; ANY STATEMENTS MADE THEREIN ARE PROBABLY BASED LARGELY ON CRAP I READ ONLINE OR IN OTHER PUBLIC SOURCES. ANY LIKENESS TO ANY PERSONS OR EVENTS, LIVING OR DEAD, ARE COINCIDENTAL. THIS DISCLAIMER NOT TO BE REMOVED UNDER PENALTY OF LAW EXCEPT BY THE END CONSUMER. THIS TELECAST IS COPYRIGHTED BY THE NFL FOR THE PRIVATE USE OF OUR AUDIENCE. ANY OTHER USE OF THIS TELECAST, OR OF ANY PICTURES, DESCRIPTIONS, OR ACCOUNTS OF THE GAME WITHOUT THE NFL'S CONSENT IS PROHIBITED.

    I wasn't complaining at all, in fact I was saying that people complaining that win 8 is some horrible plague from Microsoft are just whining about windows dressing. The guts of the system has not changed much from Vista, in fact it's trivial to just add the start button back with a utility and never ever see the metro interface on boot if it's that bad for you.

    When The kernel went from version 5 (win2k/XP) to version 6(vista/7/8) lots changed under the hood. The big thing was the change to driver architecture. However, that wasn't Microsoft's problem either. They had to update the driver system because it was massively archaic, and told manufacturers for two years previous that it was going to happen. If the hardware manufacturers wrote their drivers using the up-to-date specs they would of worked on XP and on 7, but they didn't. Many of the printer and scanner manufacturers found it an awesome "out" to use the driver change to obsolete their hardware. To make an updated driver would of cost them money, and to sell them a new printer would of made them money. It was an easy decision to make for them.

    The other major change was system access separation. If you program was trying to drop DLLs in c:\windows\system or trying to run as the SYSTEM user, STOP IT! Is a service trying to use GUI components to pop something on your screen or alert you in the systray, CUT IT OUT! Is the program trying to do something you don't have access to, ESCALATE! UAC was a nice compromise for normal users. It was either UAC popups, or forcing you to put in a password every single time that prompt comes up.

    In fact, from what I can gather, as Vista was getting such a bad rap, MS did an experiment to see if it was just a perception issue. They rolled out Project Mojave and told everyone in a blind test that it was the next version of the OS, when, in fact, it was just Vista. Lo and behold, everyone like it, even though it was the same OS.

    I think what happened was Microsoft decided to throw Vista under the bus, tweak explorer with a new theme and windows snaps, and called it windows 7.

    TL;DR: For all intents and purposes Windows Vista, 7, and 8 are the exact same OS with simple cosmetic changes. Windows 8 hate is dumb.

    halkun on
  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    halkun wrote: »
    TL;DR: For all intents and purposes Windows Vista, 7, and 8 are the exact same OS with simple cosmetic changes. Windows 8 hate is dumb.

    This is kind of like saying that if three cars all have the same engine under the hood, it's dumb for people to pick between them on the basis of interior features like leather seats, amount of legroom, power windows and locks, etc. Guess what, those may not be the essential features which make the car go, but they are the ones which define a huge part of your everyday use of and experience of the car.

  • halkunhalkun Registered User regular
    If that's the case, just put the start button back and use like you always had. :)

    Amusingly enough, cars also share base platforms too. Which means My Chevy Cobalt most likely drives exactly like a Saturn Ion.

  • GaslightGaslight Registered User regular
    edited November 2012
    halkun wrote: »
    If that's the case, just put the start button back and use like you always had.

    Or I could stick with Win7 and save myself some cash instead of buying a new operating system which is, as you've pointed out, essentially the same anyway and modding it to look like what I had before.

    I...guess that might be amusing if you're discovering it for the first time? :-/
    Which means My Chevy Cobalt most likely drives exactly like a Saturn Ion.

    And yet, more people bought the Chevy than the Saturn. In fact, the Saturn brand no longer exists.

    Can't imagine why, it's the same platform!

    Gaslight on
  • fightinfilipinofightinfilipino Angry as Hell #BLMRegistered User regular
    halkun wrote: »
    If that's the case, just put the start button back and use like you always had. :)

    Amusingly enough, cars also share base platforms too. Which means My Chevy Cobalt most likely drives exactly like a Saturn Ion.

    or i can save money and stick with an OS i've come to be familiar with and even *gasp* like :P

    i'm not seeing myself jumping to Win8 any time soon. if the kernel is more or less the same, and the interface requires some getting used to, and admin tools are even more hidden, i don't see the benefit upgrading.

    if WinXP : Windows Vista, then Win7 : Win8. not so much hate of anything new, or anything "M$", just more of saving $$$ and unnecessary effort.

    ffNewSig.png
    steam | Dokkan: 868846562
  • FramlingFramling FaceHead Geebs has bad ideas.Registered User regular
    halkun wrote: »
    TL;DR: For all intents and purposes Windows Vista, 7, and 8 are the exact same OS with simple cosmetic changes. Windows 8 hate is dumb.

    ("would have". I don't want to sound like an asshole, it's just one of my pet peeves.)

    I think that's a bit oversimplified. Everything on top of the kernel is just cosmetics? Storage pools, bootable thumbdrives, WinRT, Refresh/Reset... There are a lot of feature-level additions and improvements.

    I mean, I obviously agree that irrational hate is dumb, but you're basically saying "Everything is the same except the UI, which a lot of people don't like or don't want to bother getting used to." Kinda damning with faint praise, you know? There are actual reasons to switch beyond it being newer.

    FULL DISCLOSURE: THAT THING I SAID BEFORE. I WORK FOR MICROSOFT. I WOULDN'T HAVE PUT THIS ON HERE AGAIN, BUT I DON'T WANT TO GET IN TROUBLE IF THIS ENDS UP ON THE NEXT PAGE OR SOMETHING AND SOMEONE GETS THE WRONG IDEA OR SOMETHING AND I END UP LIVING ONE OF THOSE STANDARDS AND PRACTICES VIDEOS THAT END WITH SOMEONE ALL LIKE "OH NO, NOW I GOTTA TALK TO LAAAAWYERSSSS" THAT ALWAYS MAKE ME FEEL BAD FOR THE LEGAL DEPARTMENT BECAUSE THE PREMISE IS ALWAYS BASICALLY THAT TALKING TO LAWYERS IS THE WORST THING THAT CAN HAPPEN OH WAIT AM I NOT SUPPOSED TO TALK ABOUT THOSE VIDEOS OH NO FORGET I SAID ANYTHING.

    you're = you are
    your = belonging to you

    their = belonging to them
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    they're = they are
  • SuperJerrad92SuperJerrad92 Registered User new member
    This comic had me laughing! Such a truly great idea though!

  • XagarXagar Registered User regular
    The slight UI changes in Win7 and the addition of the windows search thingy drastically improved my efficiency and ease of use in managing my stuff compared to Vista. I don't see that same sort of thing out of 8.

  • girlgamer88girlgamer88 Registered User regular
    I didn't see this until just now but this is brilliant and amazing at the same time.

    8BitBek

    Future game art lady!
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