AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
I had a whole analysis of why it might be a good idea for Obama to take the coin off the table now, but then I remembered that neither Republicans nor Democrats believe he'll do what he says anymore. So nothing is off the table! He might negotiate to fuck the poor; he might have minted the coin already and at the 11th hour he'll take it out of his pocket and show it--one side Boehner's crying face, one side Boehner's crying face x'd out with a knife--and then start making executive decisions Two-Face style. Or he might start guillotining House Republicans on the White House lawn. Nobody knows! You call him weak on negotiation; I say he's carefully cultivated his image such that he's the wildcard, bitches!
Taking it off the table gives Obama the perfect opportunity:
"Default? I already minted it 35 minutes ago"
PAD ID - 328,762,218
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
So. Forgive me if this seems like a simplistic question and it may have already been asked and I just missed the reasons in the walls o text.
Is there a reason to, if the coin were to be minted, that it would only be for $1Trillion. Why not do $2Trillion and give ourselves a bit more breathing room? I know that goes down a crazy slippery slope of minting a $10 trillion, etc coin. But I'm wondering where the $1Trillion figure came from? Is it because of the national Debt is at that limit? and if that's the case, why not go just a little bit higher?
And please, try to explain it to me like I am a child. because I will not understand it in any other way.
Basically because that's a year's extension, AFAIK.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
It's roughly a year's extension and it relies upon the Fed actually having $1 Trillion in bonds.
Allegedly a voice of reason.
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
Ok. that makes sense.
But, and again I'm being silly in the head about this and I know it and I'm not thinking critically about it at all, but bear with me.
If that's one year, and this is likely to be seen as a possible recurring issue (i know it will probably be fixed if the coin is minted, but right now that's not an option on the table), then why not be preemptive and make it a 2 year extension? Or a 1.5 year extension?
Again, I know that there are probably really really really good economic and political reasons for that not to be the case, but I'm trying to think like a simple voter, because in this case that's what I am.
oh man. There's a tremendous amount of faith that the Republicans will eat the blame when we throw that wrench into great economic gears. Maybe the Mayans were just off by a few months.
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lonelyahavaCall me Ahava ~~She/Her~~Move to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
So basically one of three things is going to happen:
1) We default.
2) Obama reneges on one of his promises (whether it be negotiating with terrorists or minting the coin).
3) Republicans raise the debt ceiling with no strings attached. Also, free ponies for everyone.
So basically one of three things is going to happen:
1) We default.
2) Obama reneges on one of his promises (whether it be negotiating with terrorists or minting the coin).
3) Republicans raise the debt ceiling with no strings attached. Also, free ponies for everyone.
Shoot me now.
one in three positive outcomes isn't good...
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spacekungfumanPoor and minority-filledRegistered User, __BANNED USERSregular
My guess is we compromise on spending cuts AGAIN. We'll probably even kick the actual cuts down the road again, creating another fiscal cliff (with luck, the last one if we can get a deal to automatically raise it as part of the budget from now on).
My guess is we compromise on spending cuts AGAIN. We'll probably even kick the actual cuts down the road again, creating another fiscal cliff (with luck, the last one if we can get a deal to automatically raise it as part of the budget from now on).
It really cheese me off that the GOP has apparently figured out a way to force another round of concessions after already negotiating the concessions made in the actual budget.
Like, "Okay, you gave us the five duffel bags full of unmarked untraceable bills and a plane to Cuba is idling on the runway. In return, we agreed to not shoot the hostages.
"...Oh! But we never said we wouldn't strangle the hostages! For that we want... a shrubbery!"
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKERS
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
It's because the GOP is a bag of dicks.
Allegedly a voice of reason.
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spacekungfumanPoor and minority-filledRegistered User, __BANNED USERSregular
The worst part is we keep validating their hostage taking, since its the only time they win things instead if just making us lose. On their own, they can block progress by Dems. With these hostage situations, they actually advance their causes.
So basically one of three things is going to happen:
1) We default.
2) Obama reneges on one of his promises (whether it be negotiating with terrorists or minting the coin).
3) Republicans raise the debt ceiling with no strings attached. Also, free ponies for everyone.
Shoot me now.
Ugh, I really hope its not number 3, I really cant afford to take care of a horse right now.
Look, I've seen Mad Max a few times so I'm a bit of an expert on surviving postapocolyptia - you're going to want leather and lots of it. And no, it can't be full leather suits, they have to be strip and stuff.
ill buy a bunch of football gear and black spraypaint and spikes
guys if the end comes we should get some dune buggies and hit the desert, whoever has the most manly abs gets to wear the hockey mask
override367 on
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No-QuarterNothing To FearBut Fear ItselfRegistered Userregular
God damn. A lot of y'all need to take a step back from the ledge. No wonder Democrats don't stand up for themselves, this hasn't even happened yet and we're already declaring defeat.
ill buy a bunch of football gear and black spraypaint and spikes
guys if the end comes we should get some dune buggies and hit the desert, whoever has the most manly abs gets to wear the hockey mask
That's a good idea, if the shit hits the fan you're prepared, if it doesn't you can use your dune buggy to follow Raiders fans around and sell them your shit!
ill buy a bunch of football gear and black spraypaint and spikes
guys if the end comes we should get some dune buggies and hit the desert, whoever has the most manly abs gets to wear the hockey mask
That's a good idea, if the shit hits the fan you're prepared, if it doesn't you can use your dune buggy to follow Raiders fans around and sell them your shit!
Yeah, if the world ends, I'm gonna steal an MATV and put a couple car seats in it for my kids. Then I'm gonna teach them how to use the weapons and we'll roam the country as a wandering family of vigilante zombie/gang killers. I'll do the long range sniping and setting up bombs, drawing them into the kill zone while my wife handle the CROW system, cutting down the filthy masses.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
God damn. A lot of y'all need to take a step back from the ledge. No wonder Democrats don't stand up for themselves, this hasn't even happened yet and we're already declaring defeat.
Because if you take the administration at its word the only way we win this is if the Republicans roll over for no reason whatsoever. Well OK, preventing total economic collapse is a good reason to sane non-sociopaths, but we're talking about Republican congresspeople here.
Best realistic case (if Obama breaks his word) is probably more austerity. Yippie.
Edit: Incidentally, the only thing keeping me from yelling incoherent (but non-threatening) swears into Boehner's voicemail tonight was my inability to find a payphone. You win this time, orange man.
God damn. A lot of y'all need to take a step back from the ledge. No wonder Democrats don't stand up for themselves, this hasn't even happened yet and we're already declaring defeat.
Because if you take the administration at its word the only way we win this is if the Republicans roll over for no reason whatsoever. Well OK, preventing total economic collapse is a good reason to sane non-sociopaths, but we're talking about Republican congresspeople here.
Best realistic case (if Obama breaks his word) is probably more austerity. Yippie.
Edit: Incidentally, the only thing keeping me from yelling incoherent (but non-threatening) swears into Boehner's voicemail tonight was my inability to find a payphone. You win this time, orange man.
God damn. A lot of y'all need to take a step back from the ledge. No wonder Democrats don't stand up for themselves, this hasn't even happened yet and we're already declaring defeat.
Because if you take the administration at its word the only way we win this is if the Republicans roll over for no reason whatsoever. Well OK, preventing total economic collapse is a good reason to sane non-sociopaths, but we're talking about Republican congresspeople here.
Best realistic case (if Obama breaks his word) is probably more austerity. Yippie.
Edit: Incidentally, the only thing keeping me from yelling incoherent (but non-threatening) swears into Boehner's voicemail tonight was my inability to find a payphone. You win this time, orange man.
Stringer Bell says you should use a burner.
He also says you shouldn't take notes on post about a motherfuckin' criminal conspiracy!
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKERS
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spacekungfumanPoor and minority-filledRegistered User, __BANNED USERSregular
God damn. A lot of y'all need to take a step back from the ledge. No wonder Democrats don't stand up for themselves, this hasn't even happened yet and we're already declaring defeat.
Because if you take the administration at its word the only way we win this is if the Republicans roll over for no reason whatsoever. Well OK, preventing total economic collapse is a good reason to sane non-sociopaths, but we're talking about Republican congresspeople here.
Best realistic case (if Obama breaks his word) is probably more austerity. Yippie.
Edit: Incidentally, the only thing keeping me from yelling incoherent (but non-threatening) swears into Boehner's voicemail tonight was my inability to find a payphone. You win this time, orange man.
I agree. The administration has said (1) it will not bargain over the debt ceiling, (2) it will not use the 14th amendment and (3) it will not mint the coin. The only stand I can are them changing is (1).
As I said in the last thread, I'm in full on "burn it down" mode. They're clearly willing to destroy everything, I feel like right now we can exercise at least some control over how it happens. Lets do this.
Posts
"Default? I already minted it 35 minutes ago"
Is there a reason to, if the coin were to be minted, that it would only be for $1Trillion. Why not do $2Trillion and give ourselves a bit more breathing room? I know that goes down a crazy slippery slope of minting a $10 trillion, etc coin. But I'm wondering where the $1Trillion figure came from? Is it because of the national Debt is at that limit? and if that's the case, why not go just a little bit higher?
And please, try to explain it to me like I am a child. because I will not understand it in any other way.
Democrats Abroad! || Vote From Abroad
But, and again I'm being silly in the head about this and I know it and I'm not thinking critically about it at all, but bear with me.
If that's one year, and this is likely to be seen as a possible recurring issue (i know it will probably be fixed if the coin is minted, but right now that's not an option on the table), then why not be preemptive and make it a 2 year extension? Or a 1.5 year extension?
Again, I know that there are probably really really really good economic and political reasons for that not to be the case, but I'm trying to think like a simple voter, because in this case that's what I am.
Democrats Abroad! || Vote From Abroad
Not brushing you off, just don't want to feed you wrong info when I know it's already here.
Cheers. I'll go back and try to find it. I read the thread but sometimes the salient details in big walls of text and economics speech go through me.
Democrats Abroad! || Vote From Abroad
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/25430725/#Comment_25430725
1) We default.
2) Obama reneges on one of his promises (whether it be negotiating with terrorists or minting the coin).
3) Republicans raise the debt ceiling with no strings attached. Also, free ponies for everyone.
Shoot me now.
one in three positive outcomes isn't good...
It really cheese me off that the GOP has apparently figured out a way to force another round of concessions after already negotiating the concessions made in the actual budget.
Like, "Okay, you gave us the five duffel bags full of unmarked untraceable bills and a plane to Cuba is idling on the runway. In return, we agreed to not shoot the hostages.
"...Oh! But we never said we wouldn't strangle the hostages! For that we want... a shrubbery!"
Yeah, they are pretty embarrassing at the whole politics thing.
Ugh, I really hope its not number 3, I really cant afford to take care of a horse right now.
I hear that milk tastes delicious at twenty a gallon.
What commodity is most likely to retain value after we become mad max, should I buy bullets and cigs
Duh.
guys if the end comes we should get some dune buggies and hit the desert, whoever has the most manly abs gets to wear the hockey mask
That's a good idea, if the shit hits the fan you're prepared, if it doesn't you can use your dune buggy to follow Raiders fans around and sell them your shit!
Yeah, if the world ends, I'm gonna steal an MATV and put a couple car seats in it for my kids. Then I'm gonna teach them how to use the weapons and we'll roam the country as a wandering family of vigilante zombie/gang killers. I'll do the long range sniping and setting up bombs, drawing them into the kill zone while my wife handle the CROW system, cutting down the filthy masses.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
Buy gun stocks. As long as the GOP doesn't win big in every election that it coming, it's guaranteed to see growth.
Because if you take the administration at its word the only way we win this is if the Republicans roll over for no reason whatsoever. Well OK, preventing total economic collapse is a good reason to sane non-sociopaths, but we're talking about Republican congresspeople here.
Best realistic case (if Obama breaks his word) is probably more austerity. Yippie.
Edit: Incidentally, the only thing keeping me from yelling incoherent (but non-threatening) swears into Boehner's voicemail tonight was my inability to find a payphone. You win this time, orange man.
Stringer Bell says you should use a burner.
Invest in bottlecaps.
He also says you shouldn't take notes on post about a motherfuckin' criminal conspiracy!
I agree. The administration has said (1) it will not bargain over the debt ceiling, (2) it will not use the 14th amendment and (3) it will not mint the coin. The only stand I can are them changing is (1).
― John Locke
Just kidding.
About the guillotines that is. We'll use guns. We ain't French.
- John Locke