I like that. They are turrets after all. Though I wouldn't mind seeing them be on C4 destroy. Possibly more xp for a destroy as well to make players want to kill them with tanks so the air can move in.
Not complaining at all about how it is now is fine with me as well. I am pretty laid back when it comes to this game because I enjoy it so much.
So according to the official forums (really bored at work), the Magrider is OP as all hell, the Prowler is UP as all hell, and the Vanguard is perfect.
Umm... not sure how the rest of you feel but I think the Prowler is the only one that needs a bit of help. The Mag is good but not godly and the Vanguard is a mobile bunker that shoots Mack Trucks.
Thoughts? I found this sort of silly because they made it sound like it was such a massive gap that it needed to be changed immediately.
It's a pretty big gap. The Magrider can do several things that no other tank can . The prowler and vanguard can't do anything the magrider cannot...just incremental improvements in armor or rof which are dwarfed by the magriders ability to side strafe to avoid incoming fire and the ability to boost up to where no other tanks can go (not too mention having actual gun stabilization so it can fire on the move, and a pin point accurate long range secondary weapon in the saron).
I can also safely say the Magrider is by far the hardest tank to kill as infantry because it is so mobile. It's pretty easy to get behind a vanguard or prowler and once you are there, the driver can't just spin around in place. Also you can pretty reliably drop mines right behind a vanguard or prowler and expect him to back over them as he reverses. Magriders just sort of float around wherever they want.
It would be like if the TR engineer had tank mines and anti-infantry mines, but the NC engineer had more shield and the VS engineer could fire his gun slightly faster. Doing existing things slightly better is nowhere near as good as doing completely brand new things that expand your arsenal of tools.
That said, I consider the general overpoweredness of liberators to be a much more pressing issue and the general uselessness of MAX to be another more important issue.
I don't know. The Mag is the best of the three but I don't see it THAT far ahead of the Vanguard. You trade maneuverability for a shield, more armor, and more damage. Seems decently fair to me. I also think that the Vanguard is the best looking tank of the 3. I will give you that the Saron does add an advantage and while I am not sure about the secondary guns on the Vanguard, the Prowler has the Vulcan and when I run into one of those, I am usually dead before I realize what the hell it actually is. The Prowler for everything but the secondary gun needs help for sure. The Vanguard just needs a bit more stabilized gun and it is good to me.
Hopefully with the quick fix coming I believe today, Libs will be gimped a bit.
I don't understand why the tanks even need to be balanced against each other. Vanu Tank is great, but Vanu Max stinks. We could argue all day about the weapons for infantry but yeah, they have some differences.
Why can't these just be things we learn to work with?
I mean, obviously VANU have already recognized that their tanks are superior: It's why we never bother with Esamir, which only has one tech plant.
citizen059hello my name is citizenI'm from the InternetRegistered Userregular
The tanks balance out pretty well IMO. In the end it always comes down to player skill and how much support you have from others.
For all the hype about how mobile the Magrider is, it sure does feel pretty damn sluggish when I'm driving one. Maybe if I ever max out the upgrades...
I have just about decided that one engineer repairing can outheal one HA shooting those lock on launchers. Kinda wish you had a few more rockets in your ammo pack. There's not always an engineer around (particularly if you are trying to get behind enemy armor)
I've never honestly hit a tank from a range that couldn't be called "So close the turret gunner will see me" with the dumb-fire rocket. A high perch position might be perfect, but otherwise not so much. With the lock-on I can have the hilarious sight of the tank trying to back up before it gets smacked in the grill. Or trying to drive forward away from it.
I have just about decided that one engineer repairing can outheal one HA shooting those lock on launchers. Kinda wish you had a few more rockets in your ammo pack. There's not always an engineer around (particularly if you are trying to get behind enemy armor)
Assuming the HA isn't hitting the tank from behind, this doesn't seem disproportionally strong. From range, the lock-on rockets should only be a deterrent to a tank unless there is more than one. Ideally, operating at range is where a tank should be at it's strongest.
I would download a car.
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citizen059hello my name is citizenI'm from the InternetRegistered Userregular
I must be the unlucky one then, because I frequently find myself in a Magrider in the exact spot where the enemy force has decided to host the "Heavy Assaults Love Lock-On Launchers" convention.
HAL-LOL membership requires a one-time purchase, from what I hear. Low barrier to entry.
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CarbonFireSee youin the countryRegistered Userregular
it doesn't do much damage, unfortunately. Against tanks my engineer can more or less repair through an annihilator shooting at me, but if you have 10 dudes (as in that video) they are pretty interesting
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
The dual-lock on is garbage for damage. The most powerful rocket does 2000, the second dumbfire does 1700, the single-purpose lock ons do 1500, and the dual does 1100. It's just not a lot of damage.
Some stuff coming in a patch (hopefully) tonight, via Higby's twitter:
- Liberator weapon tuning (shell gravity added & explosion radius adjustments)
- Spotting changes, need to be 'accurate' to spot long distance targets, no blanket spotting.
- NV/IR optics for aircraft range adjustments.
- MAXs will render at a longer distance (more like a vehicle) for players in air vehicles. This will give a better threat indicator to pilots.
Shell gravity is really interesting. Should put a greater skill requirement on the gunner, especially at higher altitudes. Not sure whether the NV/IR change is going to be an improvement or a nerf.
The dual-lock on is garbage for damage. The most powerful rocket does 2000, the second dumbfire does 1700, the single-purpose lock ons do 1500, and the dual does 1100. It's just not a lot of damage.
But, as they say, quantity has a quality all its own.
SOE has nerfed every single thing I have unlocked. HE, reavers, and I'm sure the hacksaw is next.
HE rounds are hilariously slow. Not only that but they have to be a direct fucking hit for them to kill anything. The default ammo is considerably better.
It's a pretty big gap. The Magrider can do several things that no other tank can . The prowler and vanguard can't do anything the magrider cannot...just incremental improvements in armor or rof which are dwarfed by the magriders ability to side strafe to avoid incoming fire and the ability to boost up to where no other tanks can go (not too mention having actual gun stabilization so it can fire on the move, and a pin point accurate long range secondary weapon in the saron).
I can also safely say the Magrider is by far the hardest tank to kill as infantry because it is so mobile. It's pretty easy to get behind a vanguard or prowler and once you are there, the driver can't just spin around in place. Also you can pretty reliably drop mines right behind a vanguard or prowler and expect him to back over them as he reverses. Magriders just sort of float around wherever they want.
It would be like if the TR engineer had tank mines and anti-infantry mines, but the NC engineer had more shield and the VS engineer could fire his gun slightly faster. Doing existing things slightly better is nowhere near as good as doing completely brand new things that expand your arsenal of tools.
That said, I consider the general overpoweredness of liberators to be a much more pressing issue and the general uselessness of MAX to be another more important issue.
The prowler gets a bad rap because 1) people don't realize how powerful the vulcan is now and 2) people don't use it properly.
Prowlers engage a saron magrider or a vanguard from 100m away in a stand up fight and get wrecked; the magrider has the saron and can strafe, the vanguard is just tougher, and the prowler suffers from recoil on its main gun. So the driver takes to the forums to whine about how 'overpowered' the magrider is. But the prowler's faster, and from 50m and in (roughly) a vulcan prowler outdpses both the other tanks and it's not that close. A good prowler driver can literally drive circles around a magrider (and to a lesser extent a vanguard) and they'll never catch up. And against infantry it's no contest; the prowler's main gun is a huge advantage there.
As far as maneuverability/'going places' goes, at this point I kind of prefer the prowler too. Yes the magrider can magburn up cliffs and hover over some low fences if its performance slot is certed up. But burning up a cliff usually isn't all that useful, and hovering over things is counterbalanced by the fact that the magrider turns like rosie o'donnell on ice skates and is just as fat. The prowler doesn't get to hover over little fences but it has a smaller chassis and is almost as quick as the lightning.
The "problem" is that most players drive tanks like they're afraid of the world: sit back, snipe at other tanks, and run away if there's the slightest sign of trouble. The magrider (and to a lesser extent the vanguard) enable this, the prowler doesn't. That doesn't mean there's something wrong with the prowler, it means lots of people are bad at driving them.
The one place the prowler has legitimate beef is with anchor mode, which just sucks in comparison to the other two special utility abilities.
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
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KlykaDO you have anySPARE BATTERIES?Registered Userregular
SOE has nerfed every single thing that was unbalanced and I have unlocked because of that reason. HE, reavers, and I'm sure the hacksaw is next.
My poor 10 KDR.
SOE has nerfed every single thing I have unlocked. HE, reavers, and I'm sure the hacksaw is next.
HE rounds are hilariously slow. Not only that but they have to be a direct fucking hit for them to kill anything. The default ammo is considerably better.
That's probably a statement about your unlocks, not SOE.
Really? Cus I unlocked those as soon as the game launched.
If they offered re-certing then there would be no problem. Dump all my certs into something and when it gets nerfed to uselessness is pretty fucking dumb.
(PS. I always have a 10:1 KDR in FPS games. I play them like its arma, not quake)
Wakkawa is not happy unless there's some sort of hilariously easy, low risk way to farm kills. In other news, I am now running dual EVGA Superclocked 4GB 670s and have bumped my 3770k to 4.5ghz. I can now run this game in high and still get a good frame rate. Huzzah!
Really? Cus I unlocked those as soon as the game launched.
If they offered re-certing then there would be no problem. Dump all my certs into something and when it gets nerfed to uselessness is pretty fucking dumb.
(PS. I always have a 10:1 KDR in FPS games. I play them like its arma, not quake)
It's only useless when you compare them to the launch versions. HE and Reavers are still insanely good at getting you a crazy K/D ratio. Even better they are still great at helping your team out.
Oh, and there is most likely going to be a hacksaw nerf. I'm guessing it's going to be less damage against other MAXs.
it does kind of puzzle me that they haven't offered some kind of cert refund that costs station cash. One would think that would represent a fairly endless font of money, especially considering how reactionary people are about stuff getting nerfed
it was the smallest on the list but
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
Posts
Not complaining at all about how it is now is fine with me as well. I am pretty laid back when it comes to this game because I enjoy it so much.
PSN: Vorpallion Twitch: Vorpallion
Umm... not sure how the rest of you feel but I think the Prowler is the only one that needs a bit of help. The Mag is good but not godly and the Vanguard is a mobile bunker that shoots Mack Trucks.
Thoughts? I found this sort of silly because they made it sound like it was such a massive gap that it needed to be changed immediately.
I can also safely say the Magrider is by far the hardest tank to kill as infantry because it is so mobile. It's pretty easy to get behind a vanguard or prowler and once you are there, the driver can't just spin around in place. Also you can pretty reliably drop mines right behind a vanguard or prowler and expect him to back over them as he reverses. Magriders just sort of float around wherever they want.
It would be like if the TR engineer had tank mines and anti-infantry mines, but the NC engineer had more shield and the VS engineer could fire his gun slightly faster. Doing existing things slightly better is nowhere near as good as doing completely brand new things that expand your arsenal of tools.
That said, I consider the general overpoweredness of liberators to be a much more pressing issue and the general uselessness of MAX to be another more important issue.
PSN: Vorpallion Twitch: Vorpallion
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
Hopefully with the quick fix coming I believe today, Libs will be gimped a bit.
Why can't these just be things we learn to work with?
I mean, obviously VANU have already recognized that their tanks are superior: It's why we never bother with Esamir, which only has one tech plant.
Steam ID: Obos Vent: Obos
For all the hype about how mobile the Magrider is, it sure does feel pretty damn sluggish when I'm driving one. Maybe if I ever max out the upgrades...
PSN: Vorpallion Twitch: Vorpallion
Steam ID: Obos Vent: Obos
PSN: Vorpallion Twitch: Vorpallion
I've never honestly hit a tank from a range that couldn't be called "So close the turret gunner will see me" with the dumb-fire rocket. A high perch position might be perfect, but otherwise not so much. With the lock-on I can have the hilarious sight of the tank trying to back up before it gets smacked in the grill. Or trying to drive forward away from it.
Assuming the HA isn't hitting the tank from behind, this doesn't seem disproportionally strong. From range, the lock-on rockets should only be a deterrent to a tank unless there is more than one. Ideally, operating at range is where a tank should be at it's strongest.
HAL-LOL membership requires a one-time purchase, from what I hear. Low barrier to entry.
Because they're fighting Magriders :rotate:
And the Prowler is indeed the weakest of the 3. The Vangaurd is fine, as is the Magrider.
this might answer your question
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Captain of the SES Comptroller of the State
I missed it too - the Annihilator.
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
All lock on launcher projectiles are faster than the dumbfire ones.
The annihilator also has a huge lock on range, I think it's like, 500m if not more.
I am considering getting the AA lock-on launcher.
Steam (Ansatz) || GW2 officer (Ansatz.6498)
Shell gravity is really interesting. Should put a greater skill requirement on the gunner, especially at higher altitudes. Not sure whether the NV/IR change is going to be an improvement or a nerf.
Steam (Ansatz) || GW2 officer (Ansatz.6498)
But, as they say, quantity has a quality all its own.
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
HE rounds are hilariously slow. Not only that but they have to be a direct fucking hit for them to kill anything. The default ammo is considerably better.
The prowler gets a bad rap because 1) people don't realize how powerful the vulcan is now and 2) people don't use it properly.
Prowlers engage a saron magrider or a vanguard from 100m away in a stand up fight and get wrecked; the magrider has the saron and can strafe, the vanguard is just tougher, and the prowler suffers from recoil on its main gun. So the driver takes to the forums to whine about how 'overpowered' the magrider is. But the prowler's faster, and from 50m and in (roughly) a vulcan prowler outdpses both the other tanks and it's not that close. A good prowler driver can literally drive circles around a magrider (and to a lesser extent a vanguard) and they'll never catch up. And against infantry it's no contest; the prowler's main gun is a huge advantage there.
As far as maneuverability/'going places' goes, at this point I kind of prefer the prowler too. Yes the magrider can magburn up cliffs and hover over some low fences if its performance slot is certed up. But burning up a cliff usually isn't all that useful, and hovering over things is counterbalanced by the fact that the magrider turns like rosie o'donnell on ice skates and is just as fat. The prowler doesn't get to hover over little fences but it has a smaller chassis and is almost as quick as the lightning.
The "problem" is that most players drive tanks like they're afraid of the world: sit back, snipe at other tanks, and run away if there's the slightest sign of trouble. The magrider (and to a lesser extent the vanguard) enable this, the prowler doesn't. That doesn't mean there's something wrong with the prowler, it means lots of people are bad at driving them.
The one place the prowler has legitimate beef is with anchor mode, which just sucks in comparison to the other two special utility abilities.
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
That's probably a statement about your unlocks, not SOE.
If they offered re-certing then there would be no problem. Dump all my certs into something and when it gets nerfed to uselessness is pretty fucking dumb.
(PS. I always have a 10:1 KDR in FPS games. I play them like its arma, not quake)
It's only useless when you compare them to the launch versions. HE and Reavers are still insanely good at getting you a crazy K/D ratio. Even better they are still great at helping your team out.
Oh, and there is most likely going to be a hacksaw nerf. I'm guessing it's going to be less damage against other MAXs.
Pluto was a planet and I'll never forget
Also thermals and nv are going to be nerfed for the Reaver? It's not like infantry don't render until you are directly on top of them already.
It wasn't said whether that would be a nerf, or a buff. And it isn't only the Reaver.
I hope it isn't, but from the way all the other notes in the patch is to make it harder for aircraft to kill infantry.