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Thoughts on Legally Being a Second-Class Canadian Citizen

SkylarkSkylark o7 Vile Rat o7o7 Photon Torpedo o7Registered User regular
edited February 2013 in Social Entropy++
First of, I am fully aware that I am a white, straight male who speaks fluent, unaccented English; my life has been, is, and will continue to be a cakewalk as far as access, privilege, opportunity, and general freedom are concerned. I have no illusions about the fact that my chances of being in any way discriminated against, or hindered, based on my identity are slim to none, and that the entire discussion that follows is purely academic and abstract, as the issue at hand is completely trivial compared to the plight of people who are discriminated and repressed on a daily basis because of who they are, what they look like, who they love, or what they choose to believe. So indulge me in the hyperbolic thread title; this is not a "hurrrrr my rights!" post. It's simply my thoughts on something that happened this week that makes me feel kind of shitty.

The slippery slope of revoking citizenship

In summary, after the passing of Bill C-43 (The Faster Removal of Foreign Criminals Act) in Canada on Wednesday, a Private Member's Bill was brought before Her Majesty's Government which would enable the stripping of Canadian citizenship from Canadian dual-nationals who engage in acts of war against Canadian troops, and engage in the very vague (and in no way legally defined) concept of "acts of terrorism".

This has further spurred public discussion of abolishing dual citizenship for Canadians altogether, and to make Landed Immigrant minors ineligible for citizenship until they reach the age of majority, plus the 3 year naturalization period; to my extreme shock and surprise, this is a position supported by many, both birth and naturalized, citizens.

Obviously, this doesn't directly affect me; I'm not Omar Khadr, and I have no intention of committing acts of terror (whatever the fuck, according to the Conservatives, that means). If the PBM passes, however (and this, in my opinion is extremely unlikely, as it is a blatant contravention of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms), I will no longer be regarded, under law, as equal to a Canadian-born citizen, and I will not have access to the same constitutional and Charter protections.

The Conservative government is framing this as an issue of "Loyalty", the premise being that a dual national, by definition, cannot be loyal to both their birth and adopted country.

This makes me literally tear up when I read it. I have lived here for two decades, and I have spent my entire adult life after university working for the Public Service, forgoing more lucrative positions in the private sector (and the even more lucrative ones I could obtain by going private and additionally pissing away my ethics). I fucking love this country; I literally live to serve it.

Having my loyalty questioned because I was not lucky enough to have been born here is a punch in the gut.

firstworldproblems, etc.

Skylark on

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    A Dabble Of TheloniusA Dabble Of Thelonius It has been a doozy of a dayRegistered User regular
    Yes, Geth. Yesss

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    Steam - Talon Valdez :Blizz - Talonious#1860 : Xbox Live & LoL - Talonious Monk @TaloniousMonk Hail Satan
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    MugginsMuggins Registered User regular
    Close the thread

    Geth won everything

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    hey satan...: thinkgeek amazon My post |
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    NiryaNirya Registered User regular
    I wish I could agree with agrees/awesomes.

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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Is loyalty to the government a necessary aspect of citizenship? Should it be a necessary aspect of citizenship?

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    MeldingMelding Registered User regular
    It's kinda weird with our only growth as a nation coming from immigrants we'd be so hard on them.

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    Crimson KingCrimson King Registered User regular
    saw this thread, saw the poster

    assumed it was about being a brony

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    laughingfuzzballlaughingfuzzball Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    Is loyalty to the government a necessary aspect of citizenship? Should it be a necessary aspect of citizenship?

    The question isn't loyalty to the government, but loyalty to the nation.

    Also: lol Canadia

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    Blake TBlake T Do you have enemies then? Good. That means you’ve stood up for something, sometime in your life.Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    Is loyalty to the government a necessary aspect of citizenship? Should it be a necessary aspect of citizenship?

    I think if you are going to choose your citizenship then yes to an extent. Perhaps more loyaltyto the system in place. Saying that the government also a responsibility to reasonably incorporate the newcomers upturns and viewpoints also.

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    TubeTube Registered User admin
    I'm pretty ok with people losing citizenship if they attack the country.

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    BYToadyBYToady Registered User regular
    Don't worry to much Skylark, it'll take at least 2 more major terrorist attacks against the USA before they start up internment camps in Canada.

    Battletag BYToady#1454
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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    Tube wrote: »
    I'm pretty ok with people losing citizenship if they attack the country.

    I dunno if that is the same as not being loyal, though.

    Like, for example, I'm not loyal to, I dunno

    Armenia

    But I am not attacking them either

    I don't recognize the Queen as my rightful head of state and think the UK government is shit, I don't have any love for my country as an ideal, am I disloyal? I haven't attacked the UK in any way.

    Solar on
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    Lost SalientLost Salient blink twice if you'd like me to mercy kill youRegistered User regular
    As always the devil is in the details

    The potential for this law to be used or applied against unwanted minorities or recent immigrants or their families seems deeply troublesome to me.

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    "Sandra has a good solid anti-murderer vibe. My skin felt very secure and sufficiently attached to my body when I met her. Also my organs." HAIL SATAN
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    laughingfuzzballlaughingfuzzball Registered User regular
    They should just do what America did and tighten up the legal definition of terrorism.
    teenage filesharers totes deserve waterboarding

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    MetalbourneMetalbourne Inside a cluster b personalityRegistered User regular
    They should just do what America did and tighten up the legal definition of terrorism.
    teenage filesharers totes deserve waterboarding

    Well most teenagers do, to be honest.

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    laughingfuzzballlaughingfuzzball Registered User regular
    Yeah, but that clause got cut.

    Compromise: you aren't a terrorist until you touch a comput

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    BedlamBedlam Registered User regular
    Has Canada even been the target of terrorism?

    Like is there someone out there who has a seething hatred of hockey and maple syrup?

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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    don't those Quebecoise have some beef with the rest of Canada?

    is that a bomb-worthy beef?

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    KochikensKochikens Registered User regular
    Bedlam wrote: »
    Has Canada even been the target of terrorism?

    Like is there someone out there who has a seething hatred of hockey and maple syrup?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_Canada

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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Kochikens wrote: »
    Bedlam wrote: »
    Has Canada even been the target of terrorism?

    Like is there someone out there who has a seething hatred of hockey and maple syrup?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_Canada

    huh well it seems some of those guys definitely think it is bomb worthy

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    SkylarkSkylark o7 Vile Rat o7 o7 Photon Torpedo o7Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    Tube wrote: »
    I'm pretty ok with people losing citizenship if they attack the country.
    The issue I see here is the legal demarcation of two distinct tiers or types of citizen, subject to different treatment under the law.
    Blake T wrote: »
    Saying that the government also a responsibility to reasonably incorporate the newcomers upturns and viewpoints also.
    Although debatable, it could be argued that this is enshrined in Canadian law: S. 27 Charter and Canadian Multiculturalism Act.
    Blake T wrote: »
    I think if you are going to choose your citizenship then yes to an extent.
    It is again debatable whether persons who are naturalized as minors can be seen as choosing their citizenship. An argument can be made that they can always return to the county of origin when they reach majority, but this does not account for the fact that unlike my situation, many naturalized minors speak exclusively English and French and have no cultural or family ties to their birth country.
    Bedlam wrote: »
    Has Canada even been the target of terrorism?

    Like is there someone out there who has a seething hatred of hockey and maple syrup?
    As Kochikens pointed out, Canada does have a history of domestic terrorism; there is also debate that, in addition to more recent events, historical figures like Louis Riel were De facto terrorists as well. However, the recent measures are a direct reaction to the cases of Omar Khadr (exacerbated by the Harper government's mismanagement of the extradition proceedings) and the unnamed Lebanese-Canadian implicated in a Hezbollah-sanctioned bombing in Bulgaria. It is in line with the Harper government's largely fictional narrative that our nation's integrity is threatened by "Citizens of Convenience".
    As always the devil is in the details

    The potential for this law to be used or applied against unwanted minorities or recent immigrants or their families seems deeply troublesome to me.
    This pretty much nails it on the head, as the details are left deliberately vague. Does this law apply to a Spanish-Canadian who writes an editorial in favour of Basque Nationalism? A Chinese-Canadian who donates to Ai Weiwei's or Liu Xiaobo's legal defense funds, or a Burmese-Canadian who supported Aung San Suu Kyi in the 1990s? An Irish-Canadian who was previously a member of Sinn Féin? A Sri Lankan-Canadian with family ties to the Tamil Tigers? Given enough legal gymnastics, all of these acts can be construed as sedition, treason, or support of terrorism.

    Many countries, Iran in particular, jail their dual nationals for dubious charges of sedition and terrorism on a regular basis; would conviction in the court of a foreign country with which Canada has no diplomatic relations trigger the provisions set out in the Private Member's Bill, and as a result, would the Canadian diplomatic service not intervene in clemency or repatriation proceedings on behalf of the accused?

    I cannot buy into the "if you are not a terrorist, you have nothing to worry about" argument. The first situation of the abuse of vague anti-terror laws that came to mind when I first read about this was the application, in the United States, of Patriot Act surveillance provisions targeted at fundraisers for environmental and conservation organizations shortly after September 11th, 2001, due to the oil industry's insistence (fraudulent and unsubstantiated) that they had links to violent domestic eco-terrorists.

    Skylark on
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