i had some ideas on sentinel when i was up way too late at night while i couldn't sleep. I'm currently trying to formulate the ideas into words, but an easy fix to the sentinels need two implements is either remove a reliance on weapons entirely and/or "No they don't" and you can use either implement for either type of power. sure, you don't get the full benefit from a biotic amp when using a tech power through it, but you should be able to add the enchantment modifier. It's how implements work in the base game last i checked.
as well making is a binary choice seems to make for more interesting powers, from my dabbling anyway.
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
Sounds like some ideas worth fleshing out, Melding. That's definitely how it works in the base 4e, and we could put some fluff in the Sentinel's description to justify it.
Here's my (very) rough take on a Leader Engineer. I based a bit of it on the Artificer, but I also threw in some Wizard and Bard type powers. Also found a good place for my quote.
ENGINEER
“Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.” -Mordin Solus
CLASS TRAITS
Role: Leader. You use your omni-tool to support your allies as well as send your enemies into disarray.
Power Source: High Tech. You are second to none with an omni-tool, but you’re not too bad with a gun.
Key Abilities: Intelligence, Dexterity, Constitution
HP at First Level: 12 + Con score
HP per level: 5
Healing surges per day: 6 + Con mod
Trained Skills: TBA (Computers/hacking free, four others)
Build Options: Medic (controller secondary) or Operative (striker secondary)
Class Features: Shield Recharge, Targeting Hack, Choose Medic or Operative
Shield Recharge: Twice per encounter, use Shield Recharge
-One ally within 5 regains 1d6+Int mod shields/barriers
Targeting Hack: Once per day, spend a short rest with a weapon or implement. You install a targeting hack. Regain use of this after every milestone.
The wielder of the item can use a free action after making an attack roll to activate the hack to gain a +2 bonus to that attack roll. An item can only be hacked once per day in this way.
Medic: Add +2 (or Con mod?) to any healing you do with medi-gel. Gain the Reactive Hologram power.
Reactive Hologram: Once per encounter, as an immediate interrupt, when an enemy hits one ally within 5 squares of you, you grant that ally a power bonus equal to your Con mod to the defense targeted by the enemy until the end of that enemy’s turn.
Operative: Add +1 to your Targeting Hack ability. Gain the Emergency Recharge power.
Emergency Recharge: Once per day, regain one encounter power as a standard action.
Powers:
At-Will Powers:
Targeting Dart
At-Will * High Tech, Weapon
Standard Action, Ranged Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Int mod damage, and the target takes a -2 penalty to the defense of your choice until the end of your next turn.
Incinerate
At-Will * High Tech, Implement, Fire, Tech detonator
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod fire damage. The target takes Int mod fire damage at the start of its next turn. A tech burst detonated by this power deals Fire and Electric damage.
Cryo Burst
At-Will * High Tech, Implement, Cold
Standard Action, Area burst 1 within 10 squares
Target: Each creature in the burst
Attack: Intelligence vs. Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod cold damage, and the target is slowed until the end of your next turn. A tech burst detonated by this power deals Cold and Electric damage.
Holographic Ambush
At-Will * High Tech, Implement, Illusion, Tech detonator
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. Will
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod electric damage, and the target takes -2 penalty to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
Infectious Targeting VI
At-Will * High Tech, Weapon
Standard Action, Ranged weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Intelligence vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Int mod damage, and each ally adjacent to you gains a +1 power bonus to attack rolls and a power bonus to damage rolls equal to your Con or Dex mod until the end of your next turn.
Encounter Powers:
Neural Shock
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Radioactive
Standard Action, Area Burst 1 within 10
Target: Creatures in burst
Attack: Int vs. Will
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod radioactive damage, and the target is immobilized until the end of your next turn. If the target is organic, it is instead immobilized (save ends)
Medic Rider: The target takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
Overload
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Electric, Tech Primer
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. Fort
Hit: 1d8 + Int mod electric damage, and the target is Dazed until the end of your next turn. If the target is synthetic, it is instead Dazed (save ends).
Operative Rider: May target one or two creatures.
Energy Drain
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Tech Primer
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Hit: 1d10 + Int mod damage. If this power deals damage to shields, barriers, or a synthetic target, regain shields equal to the damage done.
Daily Powers:
Light Combat Drone
Summon a Light Combat Drone within 10
(shares your defenses, has shields equal to half your hp, speed 5)
When you take a move action, the Drone can move up to its speed.
Minor: Ranged 5; one creature; target’s shield/barrier takes Int mod damage..
Standard: Ranged 5: one creature: Int vs. Fort; 1d6 + Int damage, target is slowed (save ends)
Simple Decoy
Summon a Simple Decoy within 5
(shares your defenses, has shields equal to half your hp + 4, Speed 0)
Aura 2: Enemies starting within the aura take 2 electric damage. Allies within the aura may, as an immediate interrupt, redirect a ranged attack targeting them to the decoy.
Move Action: Lose up to your Int modifier in shields. Your decoy regains that amount.
Support Turret
Summon a Support Turret within 5
(shares your defenses, has shields equal to half your hp, Speed 0)
Aura 1: Allies starting within the aura regain 2 shields.
Standard Action: Ranged 10; one creature. Int vs. Reflex; 2d6 + Int damage.
Opportunity Attack: Ranged 10; one creature who attacked an ally within range; Int vs. Reflex; 1d6 + Int damage.
Scanning Shot
Daily * High Tech, Weapon
Standard Action, Ranged Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Charisma Mod
Miss: Half damage
Effect: Until the end of the encounter, you and your allies gain a +2 power bonus to attack and damage rolls against the target, as well as ignoring cover (but not superior cover).
Not sure if this has already been addressed, but will you be able to advance your basic skills down different research trees?
For example, can overload be upgraded to either jump from enemy to enemy or do more damage to a single target?
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
I was thinking about stuff like that, and here's how I think it will go.
With the Adept, if we end up using psionic power points, those evolutions can be done as Augmentations.
For everyone else, higher level powers will just replace lower level ones. For instance, higher up in levels, the Engineer's Overload choice might look like this:
Overload (level 7 version)
Overload
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Electric, Tech Primer
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One or two creatures
Attack: Int vs. Fort
Hit: 2d8 + Int mod electric damage, and the target is Dazed until the end of your next turn. If the target is synthetic, it is instead Dazed (save ends).
Operative Rider: May target one, two or three creatures.
I've played <10 sessions of dnd and I'm not very familiar with augmentations.
Operative rider? It looks like the only choice is how many targets the ability can hit and that choosing to attack just one offers no bonus.
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
Augments is a special thing for most Psionic classes. Instead of encounter powers, they get some Power Points, and all of their At-Wills have options you can spend points on, sometimes for more damage, a bigger area of effect, or other effects.
The Operative is a class feature you can choose (like a Two Sword ranger vs. a Bow & Arrow Ranger), and the 4e wording is clunky. Something like, "If you chose the Two Sword ranger class feature, do this."
I thought "Operative Rider: Do this." was more succinct. All of this stuff is pretty early beta, so you could add a line to Overload to say something like, do an extra 1d8 damage if you only targeted one creature.
This is what i got so far. It all needs to be tweaked, and i still got other ideas but this is what has found form.
Sentinel
"Weakening Their Integrity!" - Pretty much everyone
Class Traits
Role: Leader. Your abilities leave your enemies weakened and your allies ready to strike.
Power Source: Technology, Biotics. You are trained for every situation, you often favour a power source, but ultimately you can use every tool to reach your goals.
Key Abilities: Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom
Armour Proficiency: Medium? (I'm sure sure the the armour idea is, but i'm figuring up to whatever we have in the place of chainmail works here)
Weapon Proficiency: Basic. You have received basic military training, or what ever counts for that in your species, but never went on to learn more advanced weaponry.
Implements: Omni-tools, Biotic Amps.
Bonus to Defence: +1 Will, +1 Reflex (or, since it's basically a wizard class, maybe +2 Will)
HP at First Level: 12 + Con score
HP per level: 5
Healing surges per day: 6 + Con mod
Trained Skills: Whatever fits for a hacker wizard
Build Options: I Don't have clever named for these yet.
Class Features: Healing Word Stand In, Tech Armour, Armour Burst, Discipline Mastery
Healing Word Stand In: This is where where the description for the healing word stand in goes.
Tech Armour: Tech Armour gives you a +2 bonus to you AC While active. It can re activated as a move action at-will.You must have access to either Kinetic shields or Biotic barriers to use this ability.
Armour Burst: Pick one of the following powers
Repulsing Burst
Encounter, Immediate Interrupt
Close Burst 1 Each Enemy In burst
Trigger: You are hit with an Attack
Attack: Constitution vs Fortitude
Hit:The Target takes Constitution Modifier Force Damage and is pushed 1 square.
Effect: Your Tech Armour is Deactivated
Assault Blast
Encounter, Immediate Interrupt
Close Burst 1 Each Enemy In burst
Trigger: You are hit with an Attack
Attack: Constitution vs Reflex
Hit: The Target takes 1d6 + Constitution Modifier Force Damage and is Marked Until the end of your turn.
Effect: Your Tech Armour is Deactivated
Discipline Mastery:
Pick one of the following
Tech Mastery: you are the master of Technology among your peers. When using biotic powers you may treat them as tech powers for the purpose of your omni tool. When you use Healing Word Stand In the target receives extra healing Equal to your intelligence modifier. As well their shields are restored by this amount
And then it scales, this is less important the the moment.
Biotic Mastery: Your Biotics are second to none and have even augmented yoru technical prowess. When using a tech power through your biotic amp you can count it as a biotic power for the purposes of your biotic amp. When you use you use your Healing Word Stand In the target adds your Wisdom Modifier to their attack roll.
this does not scale, because +3 to hit is always pretty great.
Powers:
Cryo Blast
At-Will* High Tech, Cold, Implement
Standard Action, Close Blast 3
Target: every creature in blast
Attack: Con vs Fort
Hit: Target takes Con Cold damage and is slowed until the end of yoru turn.
Tech Mastery: Target is immobilized instead of Slowed.
Weakening Warp
At-Will * Biotic, Implement, Bitoic Primer, Biotic Detonation
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One Enemy
Attack: Con Vs Will
Hit: Target Takes 1d6 + con mod Biotic Damage, the target also takes -2 to the defence of your choice until end of turn.
Bitoic Mastery: Target gains vulnerable 5 to the next attack that hits it.
Biotic Toss
At-Will * Biotic, Implement, Biotic Detonation
Standard Action, Ranged 20
Target: One Enemy
Attack: Con Vs Reflex
Hit: Target takes 1d8+con mod Bitoic Damage.
Special This counts as a Basic Ranged Attack
I'm figuring incinerate, shock wave, and lift grenades as encounter powers. but haven't figured out how to do shock wave yet.
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
Not a bad start. Here's how I statted up Shockwave for the Vanguard I was putting together.
Shockwave - Vanguard Attack 1
At-Will * Augmentable, Biotic, Biotic Detonator, Implement
Standard Action Close Line 4
Target: Each enemy in line
Attack: Charisma vs. Fortitude
Hit: 1d6 + Charisma modifier force damage
Augment 1
Effect: Increase range to Line 6
Augment 2
Hit: 2d6 + Charisma modifier force damage, and the target is restrained until the end of your next turn.
So, if we're changing it to an encounter power - Close Line 6 (not in 4e, but there's some straight line powers/effects in ME3, figure it should be easy enough); creatures in line; 2d6 + mod damage, target is restrained until end of your next turn. Maybe?
hm, yeah making it a straight line might work. Had i know that was going to be a thing i probably would have done something. Also, it's an encounter power for a leader, so the damage buff isn't as huge of a deal. I'm also a big fan of riders. As you might have gotten a hint of. I was thinking like d8 and knocked prone, unless i can think of something that works for staggered. dazed maybe.
Also for later along in the project: Shaman engineer. Spirit bear drone.
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
I was really thinking of doing a Shaman as the base class for my engineer, but I've never played one, and I have no idea how their spirit animal stuff works.
Doesn't one of the evolutions of Shockwave lift them for a few seconds? That's why I went with restrained.
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AntimatterDevo Was RightGates of SteelRegistered Userregular
well, the last mass effect 3 multiplayer DLC came out today.
final look at all of the races, some new ones that could maybe get statted out. spoilers for Reckoning, there's a couple of surprising classes/kits that they added.
Human
Salarian
Asari
Turian
Krogan
Quarian
Drell
Geth
Batarian
Vorcha
Volus
Awakened Collector
Alliance Infiltration Unit/AI
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
With the last of the (single player) DLCs finally arriving (soon), I might finally do my complete trilogy run, which mean I can motivate myself to get back into working on this project again.
Initial thoughts regarding new classes/races (also some spoilers):
Volus: Can't say much about Volus combat-wise (I only played the MP up till the Earth DLC was released, and haven't touched MP since then) but, taking what we've seen about em throughout the trilogy, and the information from the ME wiki article, they make excellent candidates for biotics (remember the biotic god anyone?) and traders/merchants. So a Charisma bonus as their main stat is a given (since it's the main Biotics stat), followed by either Intelligence/Wisdom (shrewd business dealers) or Constitution (Their suits offer them protection from the outside world, making them sturdy). Racial feats would probably be a bonus to Charisma skills, or the ability to re-roll a Diplomacy check once a day, or maybe even a discount bonus when buying/selling goods from a local merchant. Racial power would be a choice between Combat Roll or Defensive Stance power. What's the situation regarding large weapons like Assault rifles and Shotguns in the MP? Can small races like Volus wield them?
Collectors: I'm not so certain to make this a playable race to be honest. They were pretty much the antagonists in ME2, not to mention their inclusion as villains once more in the Retaliation MP DLC (then again, so were the Geth, but Legion did say they were led astray by the Reapers, whereas the Collectors were practically hard-coded in their genetics to obey the Reapers outright). From it's Leviathan description, it sounds like Bioware created an alternative way for players to play Protheans while not actually implementing proper Protheans (Sure, you can be a Prothean kids... just not like Javik!). Its pretty clear that Collectors (as well as actual Protheans) should be regulated as a 'non-core race for Mass Effect (much like Orcs, Kenkus and Bugbears are in D&D's Monster Manual), and even then, I'd rather focus on balancing the 'core' races first before I dip my proverbial finger into this particular pool. Still, it would make a far more 'lore' acceptable race than the Protheans suddenly popping out of nowhere. A racial feat would give them a hive mind or psychic powers ala the Kalashtar. Racial Power would definitely be flight oriented (maybe even the Githyanki Telekinetic Leap Racial Power).
Alliance Infiltration Unit (AKA the notEDI): I'm thinking of the AIU as the poor man's Geth. Less powerful, but will have more versatility to compensate. Thinking on using the Changeling Racial Power to 'disguise' oneself via SPACE MAGIC advance holographic emitters, since Pre-ME3, most people were still afraid of machine sentience back then (remember when Saren raided the Citadel with his Geth army oh yes, 'Reapers' lol). Post-ME3 it could work. Or just scrap this 'race' entirely. Or just not make it a non-core race. So many choices.
Juggernaut: I was planning a Geth Juggernaut Advance Class (read: Paragon Path) since I was writing up the Geth back in 2011. One feature it had was the PC's size would increase to Large as a result of the Juggernaut's size, as well as gaining a powerful Charge power in the process.
Also, a few things I did consider during my (ME) hiatus in 2012:
- I think Reapers (as in the capital ships) should never be given stats. Kind of like the Lady of Pain from the Planescape setting. The reason being that, "if you stat it, they (the PCs) will find a way to kill it" - Spoony. And never underestimate the persistence (or stupidity) of PCs. I think even a Destroyer-class Reaper ALONE would be more than a challenge for even the most elite of Advance Class players (I'm thinking how gods in DnD 4th ed. were treated to combat endgame epic PCs; some were well above the level 30 mark, like Tiamat and Vecna).
- No Epic levels or classes: Once a PC hits level 11, he/she/it chooses an 'Advance Class'. Once he/she/it reached level 20, that's it.
- Elcor as a playable race. Maybe even have the option of Mounted weapons for them (I'm thinking of mobile platforms, or maybe even have the ability to carry a Volus on top). Design wise, I was thinking something of a hybrid between Dwarf and Goliaths.
- Hanar as a playable race? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA... nope.
- Prothean as a race. See my discussion regarding Collectors above.
-Armor, weapons and overall equipment: Regarding items, I think PCs should be regulated to Suits and helmets for armor (kind of a mixture of the armor system from ME1, and the helmet systems implemented in ME2/3). For weapons, I was still thinking what load outs PCs should/could be allowed, but I DO know that PCs should be limited to one type of melee weapon... be it dagger, blade, shotgun attachment, or even something 'exotic' such as the Cerberus lash and Krogan Hammer (both of which I think deserve a Proficiency feat to use, unless of course you chose the Advance Class that supports that weapon [like say, a Krogan Battlemaster or Warlord]).
But that's just my 2 cents on the matter. Once I get back into playing some good old ME, I'll get my brain juices flowin' back into this project. I DO have two classes left to complete (Adept and Sentinel iirc), and I still need to write up the final skills the PCs will use.
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AntimatterDevo Was RightGates of SteelRegistered Userregular
edited February 2013
I agree with a lot of that stuff right there, fo sho. glad to see this back up and running, and i'll be glad to help put stuff back on the wiki.
edit: Volus can use all weapons, but they can't use melee attacks. instead, their light melee lets them temporarily cloak and their heavy melee is a shield boost. they also can't use cover, but they're small enough that they really dont need to worry about that.
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
All sounds like solid ideas. I'll keep on eye on this, and I might try to get a local game here to test some of the stuff out. I'm just not sure a PbP would go quickly enough to really get some testing done.
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AntimatterDevo Was RightGates of SteelRegistered Userregular
an item that would be interesting to see statted up, if not entirely feasible, would be the Batarian Gauntlet.
Changes the standard heavy melee attack to the slow moving, very powerful batarian heavy melee attack, which means the typically melee-less Volus can gain a melee attack with it. it also means that the juggernaut's effective heavy melee is replaced by a weaker attack. possibly worth considering, as a feat or something?
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
Might just work as a "wondrous item" (or whatever we want to call it in ME) that takes up the Hand slot for magic items. Maybe a +1 damage to melee attacks passive ability, with a daily/encounter of a big Standard melee attack with knockback.
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
I was sick at the start of this week, but I managed to complete the Elcor and Volus races during last weekend.
Critique is welcomed, since these are Alpha builds of the races so far.
Gonna try and complete the Vanguard class by Friday, with the Adept this coming weekend.
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
an item that would be interesting to see statted up, if not entirely feasible, would be the Batarian Gauntlet.
Changes the standard heavy melee attack to the slow moving, very powerful batarian heavy melee attack, which means the typically melee-less Volus can gain a melee attack with it. it also means that the juggernaut's effective heavy melee is replaced by a weaker attack. possibly worth considering, as a feat or something?
Hmm, I was thinking on different proficiency feats, but I think that would complicate matters. A wondrous item is much more feasible, though it would have a number of 'special rules' depending on which character wields it (I could think of 3 special rules: 'Large creature', 'Small creature' and 'Medium creature').
But I think we can focus on that issue once we stat out weapons (both melee and range) properly.
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
edited March 2013
Just adding the finishing touches to the Vanguard (mostly just descriptions and such).
Also one idea I had going on was detailing what type of shielding a class has (e.g. normal shielding for Tech and Martial classes, with Barriers for biotic classes). That way, when a PC gains temprary shield points, they instead gain the points based on their shielding. This is important, as certain ammo types and powers have their strengths and weaknesses against what shielding a PC has. A few good examples are Disruptor ammo dealing extra damage to shields, while Warp ammo deals additional damage to players that have barriers on.
Edit: Anyone got some good splash images for a Soldier, Sentinel and perhaps Vanguard? I'm kind of inspiring-looking for images akin to the introduction image I used for Infiltrator. Any help would be appreciated.
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
That does seem a good thing to list by class.
Should class alone determine health and number of shields/barrier, or should we take a page from the game and let health be based on race and shields by class?
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
edited March 2013
Hit points will be dictated, like in the original 4th Edition, by class, along with Shield Type (the exact values of shield points won't be dictated by class, but rather what items grant additional bonuses; Shield Type is merely discussed as to what shield type the class uses e.g. Shields or Barriers).
I was thinking on shields more akin to temporary hit points that would be completely filled before a fight, but would fluctuate throughout combat (e.g. taking hits, gaining points back via powers). Once their shield/barrier points are spent, PCs will start to take damage normally, decreasing their hit points as normal, much like regular DnD fights. I was also thinking on selling said Shield/Barrier generators as items that PCs could buy throughout their adventures.
Example (this is just theoretical, so subject to change; also using different terms here than Mass Effect):
All 4 PCs (yeah, decided to make 4 the default for a regular game, with 3 the 'classic' ME loadout) start with default generators that offer a maximum 10 shield/barrier points. In DnD terms, this means that PCs start with 10 'temporary hit points' at the start of any encounter. Note that this only dictates as to how much shield/barrier points they can have on themselves as a PC (but not during an encounter). Say PC #1 uses a power that grants 5 shield points to PC #2, whose shield points are already at max (10). Suddenly, PC #2 now has 15 shield points (15). This means that they can (theoretically) still gain more shield points in a fight as much as they want, however the extra shield points gained this way disappears after an encounter, ergo defaulting back to 10. The party managed to finish the fight, with PC #2 not even taking a scratch (15). The generators 'vent' any extra shield points, thus regulating it back to 10. PC #2 therefore starts the next fight with 10 shield points, and not 15.
Note however, that this only applies to shield points. Hit points will still need to be healed as normal (either through Healing surges or via medicinal items or medical tools; Unless they have Regeneration as a class/racial feature).
Just my thoughts on the matter. Just me applying vidja game logic to the issue.
Edit: In other news, the new XCOM game looks awesome, and it's system looks perfect for a ME tabletop game to duplicate from.
Hit Points are so nebulous in 4e that I don't even think you need to worry about "shield points" as a separate thing. If you have powers that would recharge shields, simply have them gain Temporary Hit Points. [/twocents]
I have been wanting/thinking about a 4e ME implementation lately! What a coincidence! I'd love to help contribute.
I had some thoughts about weapons, first off, the implementation of ammo and such that has been discussed a bit: My idea was instead of having a RoF like psolms suggested(I don't think rolling attacks and damage 10 times for an smg sounds very feasible) you say a gun has X clip size and each attack made with it uses Y ammo, with reload being a free or minor action, depending on the weapon. So for example, say an Avenger; it has a clip size of 30 and it fires somewhat fast so it uses like 5 ammo per shot, it reloads pretty quick in game so we can make it have the reload free property, so after 6 shots using the Avenger you have to spend a free action to reload it. Then take a weapon on the opposite like a Claymore or Widow, in game they shoot 1 big shot and take a long time to reload, so they get a clip size of 1 and ammo use per shot of 1 and you have to take a minor to reload them(or possibly move or something, depending on how it needs to be balanced)
As for the actual weapon items, I was thinking just make each weapon in multiplayer into it's own weapon. Commons could be simple weapons, uncommons/some rares are military weapons and some rares/URs are superior, and then they just level up instead of getting +1s and such. So like a Mattock II would be the equivalent of a Longsword +1 or you can take a superior weapon feat to be proficient in the Widow, etc. That way you can give them their own properties without having to give a blanket statement of all shotguns have X range, when in game not every weapon of a class fits perfectly into that class (ex. Crusader, Talon)
Just some ideas! I'd love to throw some more out if you guys want some help with classes and mechanics and such!
EDIT, I didn't notice the discussion I was reading on the first page was 6 months old, so I dunno how relevant this stuff is anymore but oh well!
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3DS Friend Code: 3325-2367-6821
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
Yeah, we started kicking this around awhile back, but it seems like we have time again. I definitely have a ton of time this week, so I was going to try and help with the write ups.
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
edited March 2013
Well, it's finally done: The Alpha Vanguard Hope you guys enjoy reading it and finding any game breaking issues (this is an alpha build, so I'd expect some to appear regardless).
Some Design Notes regarding Vanguard:
- Even before I was classifying what ME classes would be inspired by DnD, I immediately knew Vanguards would be the Barbarians of the world. The savage and brutish class seemed to fit well with the offensive minded vanguards, who'd prefer to get into people's faces rather than hide behind boxes or crates for cover. Hopefully it's high-risk, high reward playstyle will fit right at home with other players' playstyles on the table. I also added some sprinkling of Warlord support to the class (most notably movement bonuses for allies; I intend to keep most buffs/debuffs and extra attack granting powers for the Sentinel), as well as Ardents and even a few Battlemind powers.
- Just like any other ME class that I was developing, I knew that the 'gimmick' for Vanguards was charging. Lots and lots of charging. Whereas Infiltrators like to move around to set up perfect ambushes and advantages for themselves and their allies, Vanguards love to move around just to smack targets around. Future class feats would focus on giving Vanguards extra speed when charging, finding ways to boost defenses so as to avoid attacks of opportunity, and generally increasing ways to become a mobile 'tank' as it were.
- Overall, the Vanguard is probably my favorite of the 6 so far.
Now to get to work on the Adept class. Expect it to be completed next weekend at the least.
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
Hit Points are so nebulous in 4e that I don't even think you need to worry about "shield points" as a separate thing. If you have powers that would recharge shields, simply have them gain Temporary Hit Points. [/twocents]
I was originally going to just leave it as Temporary Hit Points, but I'm certain a number of players would find ways to abuse it to their advantage when playing ("Did I say shield points? I meant I'm a Barrier user! Therefore the Geth's EMP ammo does nothing to me!" and so forth). Also, I wanted to add the different shield types in so as to allow the use of different ammo powers that litter the ME universe.
Case in point: How will Warp Ammo (which is effective against barrier type shielding) work against a target that has temporary hit points, or say even? Certainly it would make sense for a synthetic like Geth to have regular shields, but what if they face off against Eclipse mercenaries, or even Blood Pack mercenaries, both of whom often mix their units with different shield types? Or how will PCs differentiate between Armor piercing Ammo or Disruptor Ammo when deciding whats best to use against armored targets or even Mechs (who might have a lot more temporary hit points since they are armored)?
I understand that regular ME players would understand these differences, but I do need to take into account (even if its a slim chance) that there could be players who never played ME before and have only played this tabletop. I know it sounds kind of egotistical, thinking EVERYONE might play the tabletop, but I'd like to take a lot (if not everything) into account, even IF there might not be such a case.
Edit: Also, with two different Shield types (i.e. temporary 'hit points') on the table, PCs will have to think more tactically when using certain restorative powers.
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TiamatZGhost punsThe Banette of my existenceRegistered Userregular
I had some thoughts about weapons, first off, the implementation of ammo and such that has been discussed a bit: My idea was instead of having a RoF like psolms suggested(I don't think rolling attacks and damage 10 times for an smg sounds very feasible) you say a gun has X clip size and each attack made with it uses Y ammo, with reload being a free or minor action, depending on the weapon. So for example, say an Avenger; it has a clip size of 30 and it fires somewhat fast so it uses like 5 ammo per shot, it reloads pretty quick in game so we can make it have the reload free property, so after 6 shots using the Avenger you have to spend a free action to reload it. Then take a weapon on the opposite like a Claymore or Widow, in game they shoot 1 big shot and take a long time to reload, so they get a clip size of 1 and ammo use per shot of 1 and you have to take a minor to reload them(or possibly move or something, depending on how it needs to be balanced)
As for the actual weapon items, I was thinking just make each weapon in multiplayer into it's own weapon. Commons could be simple weapons, uncommons/some rares are military weapons and some rares/URs are superior, and then they just level up instead of getting +1s and such. So like a Mattock II would be the equivalent of a Longsword +1 or you can take a superior weapon feat to be proficient in the Widow, etc. That way you can give them their own properties without having to give a blanket statement of all shotguns have X range, when in game not every weapon of a class fits perfectly into that class (ex. Crusader, Talon)
Just some ideas! I'd love to throw some more out if you guys want some help with classes and mechanics and such!
EDIT, I didn't notice the discussion I was reading on the first page was 6 months old, so I dunno how relevant this stuff is anymore but oh well!
Huh, never thought about that.
I'll look into it! I'll see what I can make of it once we hit said weapons (won't be long, since there are only 2 classes lefft to stat out). Thanks for the input!
Hit Points are so nebulous in 4e that I don't even think you need to worry about "shield points" as a separate thing. If you have powers that would recharge shields, simply have them gain Temporary Hit Points. [/twocents]
I was originally going to just leave it as Temporary Hit Points, but I'm certain a number of players would find ways to abuse it to their advantage when playing ("Did I say shield points? I meant I'm a Barrier user! Therefore the Geth's EMP ammo does nothing to me!" and so forth). Also, I wanted to add the different shield types in so as to allow the use of different ammo powers that litter the ME universe.
Case in point: How will Warp Ammo (which is effective against barrier type shielding) work against a target that has temporary hit points, or say even? Certainly it would make sense for a synthetic like Geth to have regular shields, but what if they face off against Eclipse mercenaries, or even Blood Pack mercenaries, both of whom often mix their units with different shield types? Or how will PCs differentiate between Armor piercing Ammo or Disruptor Ammo when deciding whats best to use against armored targets or even Mechs (who might have a lot more temporary hit points since they are armored)?
I understand that regular ME players would understand these differences, but I do need to take into account (even if its a slim chance) that there could be players who never played ME before and have only played this tabletop. I know it sounds kind of egotistical, thinking EVERYONE might play the tabletop, but I'd like to take a lot (if not everything) into account, even IF there might not be such a case.
Edit: Also, with two different Shield types (i.e. temporary 'hit points') on the table, PCs will have to think more tactically when using certain restorative powers.
Ah, you're going to have shields and barriers be separate but similar for mechanical reasons to allow for greater enemy/power variety. I can understand the philosophy behind this now. Thanks for elaborating.
Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
edited March 2013
Yeah, the barrier/shield distinction works pretty well for me. The only thing I see is if we let shields/barriers increase past the item's allowance, things could get crazy quickly. Most powers in the multiplayer only allow shields to regenerate faster or be filled up to their maximum level.
So if your shield generator gives you 10 THP at the start of the fight, the Volus should probably wait until you've sustained damage before activating their recharge ability. There's certainly room for some powers to overcharge a shield, but I think that should be the exception, not the rule.
EDIT: Just looked over the vanguard. I do like the barbarian flavor to the kit, but I am wondering if Momentum Shot (an At-Will) is supposed to grant 2 attacks. If so, shouldn't it read more like some of the other 4e two attack powers, which have some limitations? Like no +strength damage or something. Other than that I would love to try these guys out. I'll see if I can get some dudes together for a playtest this week.
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AntimatterDevo Was RightGates of SteelRegistered Userregular
did you ever get the playtest going, Palington?
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Lord Palingtonhe.him.hisHistory-loving pal!Registered Userregular
It didn't end up really happening, not a ton of interest to play that over Gamma World, and then a trip out of town for a few weeks.
I might be able to make something work out in the next couple of weeks though.
Apologies for commenting on such an old thread, but this idea seems pretty cool and I was wondering if it was being worked on elsewhere at all? And if not, who could I talk to about gathering the work done so far and trying my hand at finishing it?
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as well making is a binary choice seems to make for more interesting powers, from my dabbling anyway.
Here's my (very) rough take on a Leader Engineer. I based a bit of it on the Artificer, but I also threw in some Wizard and Bard type powers. Also found a good place for my quote.
“Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.” -Mordin Solus
CLASS TRAITS
Role: Leader. You use your omni-tool to support your allies as well as send your enemies into disarray.
Power Source: High Tech. You are second to none with an omni-tool, but you’re not too bad with a gun.
Key Abilities: Intelligence, Dexterity, Constitution
Armor Proficiencies: Light
Weapon Proficiencies:
Implements: Omni-tools
Bonus to Defense: +1 Fort, +1 Reflex
HP at First Level: 12 + Con score
HP per level: 5
Healing surges per day: 6 + Con mod
Trained Skills: TBA (Computers/hacking free, four others)
Build Options: Medic (controller secondary) or Operative (striker secondary)
Class Features: Shield Recharge, Targeting Hack, Choose Medic or Operative
Shield Recharge: Twice per encounter, use Shield Recharge
-One ally within 5 regains 1d6+Int mod shields/barriers
Targeting Hack: Once per day, spend a short rest with a weapon or implement. You install a targeting hack. Regain use of this after every milestone.
The wielder of the item can use a free action after making an attack roll to activate the hack to gain a +2 bonus to that attack roll. An item can only be hacked once per day in this way.
Medic: Add +2 (or Con mod?) to any healing you do with medi-gel. Gain the Reactive Hologram power.
Reactive Hologram: Once per encounter, as an immediate interrupt, when an enemy hits one ally within 5 squares of you, you grant that ally a power bonus equal to your Con mod to the defense targeted by the enemy until the end of that enemy’s turn.
Operative: Add +1 to your Targeting Hack ability. Gain the Emergency Recharge power.
Emergency Recharge: Once per day, regain one encounter power as a standard action.
Powers:
At-Will Powers:
Targeting Dart
At-Will * High Tech, Weapon
Standard Action, Ranged Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Int mod damage, and the target takes a -2 penalty to the defense of your choice until the end of your next turn.
Incinerate
At-Will * High Tech, Implement, Fire, Tech detonator
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod fire damage. The target takes Int mod fire damage at the start of its next turn. A tech burst detonated by this power deals Fire and Electric damage.
Cryo Burst
At-Will * High Tech, Implement, Cold
Standard Action, Area burst 1 within 10 squares
Target: Each creature in the burst
Attack: Intelligence vs. Reflex
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod cold damage, and the target is slowed until the end of your next turn. A tech burst detonated by this power deals Cold and Electric damage.
Holographic Ambush
At-Will * High Tech, Implement, Illusion, Tech detonator
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. Will
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod electric damage, and the target takes -2 penalty to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
Infectious Targeting VI
At-Will * High Tech, Weapon
Standard Action, Ranged weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Intelligence vs. AC
Hit: 1[W] + Int mod damage, and each ally adjacent to you gains a +1 power bonus to attack rolls and a power bonus to damage rolls equal to your Con or Dex mod until the end of your next turn.
Encounter Powers:
Neural Shock
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Radioactive
Standard Action, Area Burst 1 within 10
Target: Creatures in burst
Attack: Int vs. Will
Hit: 1d6 + Int mod radioactive damage, and the target is immobilized until the end of your next turn. If the target is organic, it is instead immobilized (save ends)
Medic Rider: The target takes a -2 penalty to attack rolls until the end of your next turn.
Overload
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Electric, Tech Primer
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. Fort
Hit: 1d8 + Int mod electric damage, and the target is Dazed until the end of your next turn. If the target is synthetic, it is instead Dazed (save ends).
Operative Rider: May target one or two creatures.
Energy Drain
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Tech Primer
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One creature
Hit: 1d10 + Int mod damage. If this power deals damage to shields, barriers, or a synthetic target, regain shields equal to the damage done.
Daily Powers:
Light Combat Drone
Summon a Light Combat Drone within 10
(shares your defenses, has shields equal to half your hp, speed 5)
When you take a move action, the Drone can move up to its speed.
Minor: Ranged 5; one creature; target’s shield/barrier takes Int mod damage..
Standard: Ranged 5: one creature: Int vs. Fort; 1d6 + Int damage, target is slowed (save ends)
Simple Decoy
Summon a Simple Decoy within 5
(shares your defenses, has shields equal to half your hp + 4, Speed 0)
Aura 2: Enemies starting within the aura take 2 electric damage. Allies within the aura may, as an immediate interrupt, redirect a ranged attack targeting them to the decoy.
Move Action: Lose up to your Int modifier in shields. Your decoy regains that amount.
Support Turret
Summon a Support Turret within 5
(shares your defenses, has shields equal to half your hp, Speed 0)
Aura 1: Allies starting within the aura regain 2 shields.
Standard Action: Ranged 10; one creature. Int vs. Reflex; 2d6 + Int damage.
Opportunity Attack: Ranged 10; one creature who attacked an ally within range; Int vs. Reflex; 1d6 + Int damage.
Scanning Shot
Daily * High Tech, Weapon
Standard Action, Ranged Weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Int vs. AC
Hit: 2[W] + Charisma Mod
Miss: Half damage
Effect: Until the end of the encounter, you and your allies gain a +2 power bonus to attack and damage rolls against the target, as well as ignoring cover (but not superior cover).
For example, can overload be upgraded to either jump from enemy to enemy or do more damage to a single target?
With the Adept, if we end up using psionic power points, those evolutions can be done as Augmentations.
For everyone else, higher level powers will just replace lower level ones. For instance, higher up in levels, the Engineer's Overload choice might look like this:
Overload (level 7 version)
Overload
Encounter * High Tech, Implement, Electric, Tech Primer
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One or two creatures
Attack: Int vs. Fort
Hit: 2d8 + Int mod electric damage, and the target is Dazed until the end of your next turn. If the target is synthetic, it is instead Dazed (save ends).
Operative Rider: May target one, two or three creatures.
Operative rider? It looks like the only choice is how many targets the ability can hit and that choosing to attack just one offers no bonus.
The Operative is a class feature you can choose (like a Two Sword ranger vs. a Bow & Arrow Ranger), and the 4e wording is clunky. Something like, "If you chose the Two Sword ranger class feature, do this."
I thought "Operative Rider: Do this." was more succinct. All of this stuff is pretty early beta, so you could add a line to Overload to say something like, do an extra 1d8 damage if you only targeted one creature.
I like the idea of power points. Sounds like a pretty neat system.
"Weakening Their Integrity!" - Pretty much everyone
Class Traits
Role: Leader. Your abilities leave your enemies weakened and your allies ready to strike.
Power Source: Technology, Biotics. You are trained for every situation, you often favour a power source, but ultimately you can use every tool to reach your goals.
Key Abilities: Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom
Armour Proficiency: Medium? (I'm sure sure the the armour idea is, but i'm figuring up to whatever we have in the place of chainmail works here)
Weapon Proficiency: Basic. You have received basic military training, or what ever counts for that in your species, but never went on to learn more advanced weaponry.
Implements: Omni-tools, Biotic Amps.
Bonus to Defence: +1 Will, +1 Reflex (or, since it's basically a wizard class, maybe +2 Will)
HP at First Level: 12 + Con score
HP per level: 5
Healing surges per day: 6 + Con mod
Trained Skills: Whatever fits for a hacker wizard
Build Options: I Don't have clever named for these yet.
Class Features: Healing Word Stand In, Tech Armour, Armour Burst, Discipline Mastery
Healing Word Stand In: This is where where the description for the healing word stand in goes.
Tech Armour: Tech Armour gives you a +2 bonus to you AC While active. It can re activated as a move action at-will.You must have access to either Kinetic shields or Biotic barriers to use this ability.
Armour Burst: Pick one of the following powers
Repulsing Burst
Encounter, Immediate Interrupt
Close Burst 1 Each Enemy In burst
Trigger: You are hit with an Attack
Attack: Constitution vs Fortitude
Hit:The Target takes Constitution Modifier Force Damage and is pushed 1 square.
Effect: Your Tech Armour is Deactivated
Assault Blast
Encounter, Immediate Interrupt
Close Burst 1 Each Enemy In burst
Trigger: You are hit with an Attack
Attack: Constitution vs Reflex
Hit: The Target takes 1d6 + Constitution Modifier Force Damage and is Marked Until the end of your turn.
Effect: Your Tech Armour is Deactivated
Discipline Mastery:
Pick one of the following
Tech Mastery: you are the master of Technology among your peers. When using biotic powers you may treat them as tech powers for the purpose of your omni tool. When you use Healing Word Stand In the target receives extra healing Equal to your intelligence modifier. As well their shields are restored by this amount
And then it scales, this is less important the the moment.
Biotic Mastery: Your Biotics are second to none and have even augmented yoru technical prowess. When using a tech power through your biotic amp you can count it as a biotic power for the purposes of your biotic amp. When you use you use your Healing Word Stand In the target adds your Wisdom Modifier to their attack roll.
this does not scale, because +3 to hit is always pretty great.
Powers:
Cryo Blast
At-Will* High Tech, Cold, Implement
Standard Action, Close Blast 3
Target: every creature in blast
Attack: Con vs Fort
Hit: Target takes Con Cold damage and is slowed until the end of yoru turn.
Tech Mastery: Target is immobilized instead of Slowed.
Weakening Warp
At-Will * Biotic, Implement, Bitoic Primer, Biotic Detonation
Standard Action, Ranged 10
Target: One Enemy
Attack: Con Vs Will
Hit: Target Takes 1d6 + con mod Biotic Damage, the target also takes -2 to the defence of your choice until end of turn.
Bitoic Mastery: Target gains vulnerable 5 to the next attack that hits it.
Biotic Toss
At-Will * Biotic, Implement, Biotic Detonation
Standard Action, Ranged 20
Target: One Enemy
Attack: Con Vs Reflex
Hit: Target takes 1d8+con mod Bitoic Damage.
Special This counts as a Basic Ranged Attack
I'm figuring incinerate, shock wave, and lift grenades as encounter powers. but haven't figured out how to do shock wave yet.
Shockwave - Vanguard Attack 1
At-Will * Augmentable, Biotic, Biotic Detonator, Implement
Standard Action Close Line 4
Target: Each enemy in line
Attack: Charisma vs. Fortitude
Hit: 1d6 + Charisma modifier force damage
Augment 1
Effect: Increase range to Line 6
Augment 2
Hit: 2d6 + Charisma modifier force damage, and the target is restrained until the end of your next turn.
So, if we're changing it to an encounter power - Close Line 6 (not in 4e, but there's some straight line powers/effects in ME3, figure it should be easy enough); creatures in line; 2d6 + mod damage, target is restrained until end of your next turn. Maybe?
Also for later along in the project: Shaman engineer. Spirit bear drone.
Doesn't one of the evolutions of Shockwave lift them for a few seconds? That's why I went with restrained.
final look at all of the races, some new ones that could maybe get statted out. spoilers for Reckoning, there's a couple of surprising classes/kits that they added.
Salarian
Asari
Turian
Krogan
Quarian
Drell
Geth
Batarian
Vorcha
Volus
Awakened Collector
Alliance Infiltration Unit/AI
Initial thoughts regarding new classes/races (also some spoilers):
Collectors: I'm not so certain to make this a playable race to be honest. They were pretty much the antagonists in ME2, not to mention their inclusion as villains once more in the Retaliation MP DLC (then again, so were the Geth, but Legion did say they were led astray by the Reapers, whereas the Collectors were practically hard-coded in their genetics to obey the Reapers outright). From it's Leviathan description, it sounds like Bioware created an alternative way for players to play Protheans while not actually implementing proper Protheans (Sure, you can be a Prothean kids... just not like Javik!). Its pretty clear that Collectors (as well as actual Protheans) should be regulated as a 'non-core race for Mass Effect (much like Orcs, Kenkus and Bugbears are in D&D's Monster Manual), and even then, I'd rather focus on balancing the 'core' races first before I dip my proverbial finger into this particular pool. Still, it would make a far more 'lore' acceptable race than the Protheans suddenly popping out of nowhere. A racial feat would give them a hive mind or psychic powers ala the Kalashtar. Racial Power would definitely be flight oriented (maybe even the Githyanki Telekinetic Leap Racial Power).
Alliance Infiltration Unit (AKA the notEDI): I'm thinking of the AIU as the poor man's Geth. Less powerful, but will have more versatility to compensate. Thinking on using the Changeling Racial Power to 'disguise' oneself via SPACE MAGIC advance holographic emitters, since Pre-ME3, most people were still afraid of machine sentience back then (remember when Saren raided the Citadel with his Geth army oh yes, 'Reapers' lol). Post-ME3 it could work. Or just scrap this 'race' entirely. Or just not make it a non-core race. So many choices.
Juggernaut: I was planning a Geth Juggernaut Advance Class (read: Paragon Path) since I was writing up the Geth back in 2011. One feature it had was the PC's size would increase to Large as a result of the Juggernaut's size, as well as gaining a powerful Charge power in the process.
Also, a few things I did consider during my (ME) hiatus in 2012:
- I think Reapers (as in the capital ships) should never be given stats. Kind of like the Lady of Pain from the Planescape setting. The reason being that, "if you stat it, they (the PCs) will find a way to kill it" - Spoony. And never underestimate the persistence (or stupidity) of PCs. I think even a Destroyer-class Reaper ALONE would be more than a challenge for even the most elite of Advance Class players (I'm thinking how gods in DnD 4th ed. were treated to combat endgame epic PCs; some were well above the level 30 mark, like Tiamat and Vecna).
- No Epic levels or classes: Once a PC hits level 11, he/she/it chooses an 'Advance Class'. Once he/she/it reached level 20, that's it.
- Elcor as a playable race. Maybe even have the option of Mounted weapons for them (I'm thinking of mobile platforms, or maybe even have the ability to carry a Volus on top). Design wise, I was thinking something of a hybrid between Dwarf and Goliaths.
- Hanar as a playable race? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA... nope.
- Prothean as a race. See my discussion regarding Collectors above.
-Armor, weapons and overall equipment: Regarding items, I think PCs should be regulated to Suits and helmets for armor (kind of a mixture of the armor system from ME1, and the helmet systems implemented in ME2/3). For weapons, I was still thinking what load outs PCs should/could be allowed, but I DO know that PCs should be limited to one type of melee weapon... be it dagger, blade, shotgun attachment, or even something 'exotic' such as the Cerberus lash and Krogan Hammer (both of which I think deserve a Proficiency feat to use, unless of course you chose the Advance Class that supports that weapon [like say, a Krogan Battlemaster or Warlord]).
But that's just my 2 cents on the matter. Once I get back into playing some good old ME, I'll get my brain juices flowin' back into this project. I DO have two classes left to complete (Adept and Sentinel iirc), and I still need to write up the final skills the PCs will use.
edit: Volus can use all weapons, but they can't use melee attacks. instead, their light melee lets them temporarily cloak and their heavy melee is a shield boost. they also can't use cover, but they're small enough that they really dont need to worry about that.
Changes the standard heavy melee attack to the slow moving, very powerful batarian heavy melee attack, which means the typically melee-less Volus can gain a melee attack with it. it also means that the juggernaut's effective heavy melee is replaced by a weaker attack. possibly worth considering, as a feat or something?
Critique is welcomed, since these are Alpha builds of the races so far.
Gonna try and complete the Vanguard class by Friday, with the Adept this coming weekend.
Hmm, I was thinking on different proficiency feats, but I think that would complicate matters. A wondrous item is much more feasible, though it would have a number of 'special rules' depending on which character wields it (I could think of 3 special rules: 'Large creature', 'Small creature' and 'Medium creature').
But I think we can focus on that issue once we stat out weapons (both melee and range) properly.
Also one idea I had going on was detailing what type of shielding a class has (e.g. normal shielding for Tech and Martial classes, with Barriers for biotic classes). That way, when a PC gains temprary shield points, they instead gain the points based on their shielding. This is important, as certain ammo types and powers have their strengths and weaknesses against what shielding a PC has. A few good examples are Disruptor ammo dealing extra damage to shields, while Warp ammo deals additional damage to players that have barriers on.
Edit: Anyone got some good splash images for a Soldier, Sentinel and perhaps Vanguard? I'm kind of inspiring-looking for images akin to the introduction image I used for Infiltrator. Any help would be appreciated.
Should class alone determine health and number of shields/barrier, or should we take a page from the game and let health be based on race and shields by class?
I was thinking on shields more akin to temporary hit points that would be completely filled before a fight, but would fluctuate throughout combat (e.g. taking hits, gaining points back via powers). Once their shield/barrier points are spent, PCs will start to take damage normally, decreasing their hit points as normal, much like regular DnD fights. I was also thinking on selling said Shield/Barrier generators as items that PCs could buy throughout their adventures.
Example (this is just theoretical, so subject to change; also using different terms here than Mass Effect):
All 4 PCs (yeah, decided to make 4 the default for a regular game, with 3 the 'classic' ME loadout) start with default generators that offer a maximum 10 shield/barrier points. In DnD terms, this means that PCs start with 10 'temporary hit points' at the start of any encounter. Note that this only dictates as to how much shield/barrier points they can have on themselves as a PC (but not during an encounter). Say PC #1 uses a power that grants 5 shield points to PC #2, whose shield points are already at max (10). Suddenly, PC #2 now has 15 shield points (15). This means that they can (theoretically) still gain more shield points in a fight as much as they want, however the extra shield points gained this way disappears after an encounter, ergo defaulting back to 10. The party managed to finish the fight, with PC #2 not even taking a scratch (15). The generators 'vent' any extra shield points, thus regulating it back to 10. PC #2 therefore starts the next fight with 10 shield points, and not 15.
Note however, that this only applies to shield points. Hit points will still need to be healed as normal (either through Healing surges or via medicinal items or medical tools; Unless they have Regeneration as a class/racial feature).
Just my thoughts on the matter. Just me applying vidja game logic to the issue.
Edit: In other news, the new XCOM game looks awesome, and it's system looks perfect for a ME tabletop game to duplicate from.
Thoughts/ideas on this?
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
I had some thoughts about weapons, first off, the implementation of ammo and such that has been discussed a bit: My idea was instead of having a RoF like psolms suggested(I don't think rolling attacks and damage 10 times for an smg sounds very feasible) you say a gun has X clip size and each attack made with it uses Y ammo, with reload being a free or minor action, depending on the weapon. So for example, say an Avenger; it has a clip size of 30 and it fires somewhat fast so it uses like 5 ammo per shot, it reloads pretty quick in game so we can make it have the reload free property, so after 6 shots using the Avenger you have to spend a free action to reload it. Then take a weapon on the opposite like a Claymore or Widow, in game they shoot 1 big shot and take a long time to reload, so they get a clip size of 1 and ammo use per shot of 1 and you have to take a minor to reload them(or possibly move or something, depending on how it needs to be balanced)
As for the actual weapon items, I was thinking just make each weapon in multiplayer into it's own weapon. Commons could be simple weapons, uncommons/some rares are military weapons and some rares/URs are superior, and then they just level up instead of getting +1s and such. So like a Mattock II would be the equivalent of a Longsword +1 or you can take a superior weapon feat to be proficient in the Widow, etc. That way you can give them their own properties without having to give a blanket statement of all shotguns have X range, when in game not every weapon of a class fits perfectly into that class (ex. Crusader, Talon)
Just some ideas! I'd love to throw some more out if you guys want some help with classes and mechanics and such!
EDIT, I didn't notice the discussion I was reading on the first page was 6 months old, so I dunno how relevant this stuff is anymore but oh well!
Some Design Notes regarding Vanguard:
- Even before I was classifying what ME classes would be inspired by DnD, I immediately knew Vanguards would be the Barbarians of the world. The savage and brutish class seemed to fit well with the offensive minded vanguards, who'd prefer to get into people's faces rather than hide behind boxes or crates for cover. Hopefully it's high-risk, high reward playstyle will fit right at home with other players' playstyles on the table. I also added some sprinkling of Warlord support to the class (most notably movement bonuses for allies; I intend to keep most buffs/debuffs and extra attack granting powers for the Sentinel), as well as Ardents and even a few Battlemind powers.
- Just like any other ME class that I was developing, I knew that the 'gimmick' for Vanguards was charging. Lots and lots of charging. Whereas Infiltrators like to move around to set up perfect ambushes and advantages for themselves and their allies, Vanguards love to move around just to smack targets around. Future class feats would focus on giving Vanguards extra speed when charging, finding ways to boost defenses so as to avoid attacks of opportunity, and generally increasing ways to become a mobile 'tank' as it were.
- Overall, the Vanguard is probably my favorite of the 6 so far.
Now to get to work on the Adept class. Expect it to be completed next weekend at the least.
I was originally going to just leave it as Temporary Hit Points, but I'm certain a number of players would find ways to abuse it to their advantage when playing ("Did I say shield points? I meant I'm a Barrier user! Therefore the Geth's EMP ammo does nothing to me!" and so forth). Also, I wanted to add the different shield types in so as to allow the use of different ammo powers that litter the ME universe.
Case in point: How will Warp Ammo (which is effective against barrier type shielding) work against a target that has temporary hit points, or say even? Certainly it would make sense for a synthetic like Geth to have regular shields, but what if they face off against Eclipse mercenaries, or even Blood Pack mercenaries, both of whom often mix their units with different shield types? Or how will PCs differentiate between Armor piercing Ammo or Disruptor Ammo when deciding whats best to use against armored targets or even Mechs (who might have a lot more temporary hit points since they are armored)?
I understand that regular ME players would understand these differences, but I do need to take into account (even if its a slim chance) that there could be players who never played ME before and have only played this tabletop. I know it sounds kind of egotistical, thinking EVERYONE might play the tabletop, but I'd like to take a lot (if not everything) into account, even IF there might not be such a case.
Edit: Also, with two different Shield types (i.e. temporary 'hit points') on the table, PCs will have to think more tactically when using certain restorative powers.
Huh, never thought about that.
I'll look into it! I'll see what I can make of it once we hit said weapons (won't be long, since there are only 2 classes lefft to stat out). Thanks for the input!
Ah, you're going to have shields and barriers be separate but similar for mechanical reasons to allow for greater enemy/power variety. I can understand the philosophy behind this now. Thanks for elaborating.
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So if your shield generator gives you 10 THP at the start of the fight, the Volus should probably wait until you've sustained damage before activating their recharge ability. There's certainly room for some powers to overcharge a shield, but I think that should be the exception, not the rule.
EDIT: Just looked over the vanguard. I do like the barbarian flavor to the kit, but I am wondering if Momentum Shot (an At-Will) is supposed to grant 2 attacks. If so, shouldn't it read more like some of the other 4e two attack powers, which have some limitations? Like no +strength damage or something. Other than that I would love to try these guys out. I'll see if I can get some dudes together for a playtest this week.
I might be able to make something work out in the next couple of weeks though.
Also concur with @Melding
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