Actually. In the interest of fairness, if it was seven eastern and I had a second shift job, I would feel that although it was inconvenient for me, it was at the best time possible for most of the people near the location and would not gripe. You will not see me complaining if pax prime is at seven pacific because that makes sense.
If a shift to eight would be made to accodate central timer people it would affect Europeans on the other end. PA should analyze their previous year data to determine who this affects more.
I see a lot of logic like this: I got my three day pass, not everyone can. Lets do nothing.
There is literally no incentive for them to adjust the time. Any incentive you can come up with is just a round about way of saying "I think it should be better for group C over group Q even though I have literally no data or information about anything to do with those groups other than made up fuzzy statistics."
Why did they allow backdoor methods to be so rampant? In my head, pax east's official site should be where you should go to get information, not to be stonewalled while everyone who follows #RKhoo jumps in line. Even if it was #PAXEast and the site said to follow that tag for best/most up to date info, I would have done that. But until such a declaration is made, isn't it their duty, in the name of fairness, to first post the information to the most logical place?
I was neurotic about getting passes for PAX East this year. I saw how PAX Prime went down. Everyone said PAX East usually doesn't sell out as fast, but I knew that wasn't going to be the case this year.
I was religiously refreshing Official_PAX on twitter, cause I'd seen it was their emergency broadcast system already.
And then they updated Khoo's personal twitter with the links 2 minutes before they updated the official twitter account. I got in line at minute 1 of the link being in the wild, waited 15 minutes, got my 3-day passes, and breathed a sigh of relief.
And I knew a shit storm was coming. Tweeting those links from Khoo's personal account was absolutely the wrong thing to do. I understand their motivation for posting the link to twitter. Their main page was being DDOS'ed by a bunch of F5'ers. They needed to take the pressure off the site so they could update it. But I do not even remotely understand their reasoning for using Khoo's account to do so.
I have been going to PAX East since 2011, and I have had a great time every time.
Like any good show/con, it grows over time, just look at the numbers of when PAX Prime started, it blew up from there.
So naturally since PAX East is a very well run con, I expect it to blow up.
Here is my situation:
I got into a line from a tweet I saw (not from PA) regarding the line. I didn't know it was a separate service, and I assumed it was a faulty website. I then click the official link around 12:10 or so, waiting in line, turned out it was the same thing.
Ok fine, I'm waiting waiting waiting, turns out I can't get a 3 day, so I get 3 single day badges, which is fine, I had to do that last year and I am in a position to do so. I also got a BYOC pass for the first time, super excited!
Then I am trying to book a hotel. While I am work. I wound up being late at a meeting, and wound up booking a hotel while at the meeting (very unprofessional of me) and it was not the Westin or the Seaport, I booked the Hyatt.
I had tried to book a hotel, but OnPeak simply could not handle the bandwidth. Neither could PA website/forums. I had no idea the actual link I clinked was official.
If I had to critique the process, I would make it so the PAX website is updated at the same time as the twitter feed, to avoid confusion.
The challenge with any system is that there is significantly more demand than supply at this time (BCEC expansion can't come fast enough) As such no matter what the system, people will deal without. So as far as any criticism that goes towards the purchasing system, the reality is there will be haves and have nots. I am in a position to not be a have not, and would have eBayed a 3 day pass for a large fee if I had needed to. Not everyone else is so fortunate.
I just wish there was a way to get passes to legitimate customers first, then bulk passes later to minimize scalping. It seems no matter what system is up, scalping will occur regardless.
If you have a really well thought out reason why registration should be a particular way, I suggest putting it in the post-pax survey that they send out after pax. Also I don't think that anyone could possibly have anything to say on the matter that hasn't already been said more times than I can easily count.
No post-PAX survey for me, because of a lack of prerequisites.
I didn't know that this was a huge problem, because I've only done PAX East before and this is the only year I encountered problems.
The only prerequisite is buying at least one pass...
Anyhow, yeah, prime has been dealing with this for awhile now. This debate has *raged* on for awhile and never gets anywhere, because there's not that many unique solutions out there. They know about the options.
The only solution is more space to fit the demand, with scalpers buying passes and getting burned. For Prime especially, this is no easy solution, and for East its not very viable either.
People have the option to purchase from scalpers if they really want to go.
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stebuuCrabs are fucking crazy, and I hate horsesRegistered Userregular
No reason to dwell and vent on the forums long past the point that anything can be done.
I, and others, get the sense that PA management thinks that they handled things adequately.
They made (and repeated!) some shockingly rookie mistakes. They haven't handled the issue adequately from either a PR or technical level, so some drum beating is warranted.
My personal guess is that Khoo has to deal with people unhappy with ticket sales every single PAX, and has lost some ability to differentiate between those unhappy because of random chance and those unhappy because PA completely dropped the ball. The other primary alternative I can see is that he doesn't want to deal with the ultimate question of "what are you going to do for me?" if he admits PA fluffed the launch.
I like the idea said a while ago better. Like 1 or 2 hours before tickets go live, the pax webpage should link directly to the twitter feed pending a link to tickets. Everyone gets the same source and everyone is happy.
Zerzhul:
I would like it to be better for group C over group Q. Because right now, Poland is group Q and they have it better than group C (pax east local time) for the majority of C and Q's population.
And you are right, I don't have statistics. That doesn't mean I can't apply common sense.
No reason to dwell and vent on the forums long past the point that anything can be done.
I, and others, get the sense that PA management thinks that they handled things adequately.
They made (and repeated!) some shockingly rookie mistakes. They haven't handled the issue adequately from either a PR or technical level, so some drum beating is warranted.
My personal guess is that Khoo has to deal with people unhappy with ticket sales every single PAX, and has lost some ability to differentiate between those unhappy because of random chance and those unhappy because PA completely dropped the ball. The other primary alternative I can see is that he doesn't want to deal with the ultimate question of "what are you going to do for me?" if he admits PA fluffed the launch.
I think we can hopefully all agree that whatever sense you feel or get right now is based purely on not getting what you wanted in the end. Had you gotten your badges even after all the issues you would not have made 20+ posts on the subject of holding PA responsible with a public apology or something.
Some people didn't get badges, those people are upset, and rightfully so. However lets not confuse that with legitimate reasoning on how registration should be handled, or how it was handled. We don't know how things went down at onPeak, ShowClix, Reed, or PA. Things will never be 100% fair for everyone, nor is it okay to say fair for one group is more important than being fair to another.
Personally having followed PA so long, and having an idea of how Khoo is, I'm fairly confident he wasn't happy with how things went and will always try his hardest to make things "perfect" as that is who he is.
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stebuuCrabs are fucking crazy, and I hate horsesRegistered Userregular
I think we can hopefully all agree that whatever sense you feel or get right now is based purely on not getting what you wanted in the end. Had you gotten your badges even after all the issues you would not have made 20+ posts on the subject of holding PA responsible with a public apology or something.
Being personally affected (both myself and members of my "party"), I agree than I am significantly more vocal than I would otherwise be. However, I disagree with your characterization that I find fault with their launch solely because I was negatively affected by it, or that only those who were negatively affected COULD find fault.
Zerzhul:
I would like it to be better for group C over group Q. Because right now, Poland is group Q and they have it better than group C (pax east local time) for the majority of C and Q's population.
And you are right, I don't have statistics. That doesn't mean I can't apply common sense.
I totally understand. A rational actor should advocate for one's own advantages. It's just silly to try to apply personal bias to greater population groups about which you have little to no real information. Using the words "common sense" to try to defend a position is just another way to say "I have no real justification."
Unless if everyone is granted the same level of internet connection, with the same free personal time slot available, on the same day, and scalpers are magically banned from the world, AND there are physically enough tickets for every single person who wants one, the end result will always be the same: some people will miss out on tickets. End of story.
The same issues have always been present on some level with PAX East, PAX Prime, Blizzcon, SDCC, NYCC, or any other major convention/concert/event you can think of. The same "solutions" have been presented/tried before.
As harsh of a reality as it is, nobody is guaranteed a badge. No one has a right to purchasing a badge over somebody else. All you can do is be vigilant and ready to roll at the drop of a hat.
My only major criticism was how OnPeak really just broke down this year for PAX East. Coupled with the accidental mobile link that went live prior to sales, it made booking a hotel tough, but manageable.
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stebuuCrabs are fucking crazy, and I hate horsesRegistered Userregular
I think we can hopefully all agree that whatever sense you feel or get right now is based purely on not getting what you wanted in the end. Had you gotten your badges even after all the issues you would not have made 20+ posts on the subject of holding PA responsible with a public apology or something.
I got a 5-pack of 3-day badges for myself, my fiance, and friends. I got a room at the Seaport (my hotel of choice, I really like it over the Westin) for Thurs-Mon. I literally got everything I could have wanted.
So this, coming from me: the processes for both hotels and badges were giant messes.
I think we can hopefully all agree that whatever sense you feel or get right now is based purely on not getting what you wanted in the end. Had you gotten your badges even after all the issues you would not have made 20+ posts on the subject of holding PA responsible with a public apology or something.
I got a 5-pack of 3-day badges for myself, my fiance, and friends. I got a room at the Seaport (my hotel of choice, I really like it over the Westin) for Thurs-Mon. I literally got everything I could have wanted.
So this, coming from me: the processes for both hotels and badges were giant messes.
I apologize for any confusion that caused. It was pretty much directed at stebuu as he has made many posts about this.
I don't think anyone can really say that it wasn't a mess. aBBy is right though, this horse is dead.
I apologize for any confusion that caused. It was pretty much directed at stebuu as he has made many posts about this.
I don't think anyone can really say that it wasn't a mess. aBBy is right though, this horse is dead.
The overall topic is quite dead, yes, but it would still be a fair point to actually acknowledge that not everyone does post solely from the perspective of self-interest. This is especially true when it comes to criticism. It is possible for someone to like a thing enough to want to see it do well and to feel compelled to criticize when it doesn't in hopes that it will improve. This is quite different from just wanting to complain.
I have passes and hotel reservations, but the registration process was fouled in every aspect and felt shockingly amateurish. So yes, I hope they can improve for next year. There will always be people disappointed because demand outstrips supply, but those numbers shouldn't have to be inflated because the registration process itself is flawed.
"I will participate in the game. It's a wonderful, wonderful opera, except that it hurts." - Joseph Campbell
The overall topic is quite dead, yes, but it would still be a fair point to actually acknowledge that not everyone does post solely from the perspective of self-interest. This is especially true when it comes to criticism. It is possible for someone to like a thing enough to want to see it do well and to feel compelled to criticize when it doesn't in hopes that it will improve. This is quite different from just wanting to complain.
I have passes and hotel reservations, but the registration process was fouled in every aspect and felt shockingly amateurish. So yes, I hope they can improve for next year. There will always be people disappointed because demand outstrips supply, but those numbers shouldn't have to be inflated because the registration process itself is flawed.
I have a reservation in the Omni currently, but am looking to switch it to The Seaport or Waterfront.
Has anyone had any luck picking up a reservation since the dust as settled?
I have been checking in with some frequency but have been unsuccessful this far... seaport popped up on Friday but by the time I went through the reservation process it was gone.
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stebuuCrabs are fucking crazy, and I hate horsesRegistered Userregular
Telling people what they are thinking typically does not cause continued rational discourse or, in the short term, reduce the number of comments in a thread.
To go with another internet chestnut, the illogical leap: if Khoo can post a long explanation about a problem essentially beyond his control (PAX East on Easter), but not the multiple ticket/hotel issues more under his control, the answer is clear: Khoo only likes Christians.
I have a reservation in the Omni currently, but am looking to switch it to The Seaport or Waterfront.
Has anyone had any luck picking up a reservation since the dust as settled?
I have been checking in with some frequency but have been unsuccessful this far... seaport popped up on Friday but by the time I went through the reservation process it was gone.
There was a 1 bed room at the Westin that popped up about a half hour ago for the entire weekend (only Monday is left now). I'm sure they'll keep popping up as time goes along. I have a reservation at the Omni right now as well and am hoping another room pops up at the Hyatt that I can take so I can cancel both rooms I have at the Omni (unless by magic two rooms become available at one of the big 3).
saw the Westin briefly on the list this morning but as quickly as it was there it was gone. Have not seen much movement on the Seaport. I have an email addy for them now so I am going to see if I can get some adjustment on my non Onpeak rate but not holding my breath.
PAX East 2016 .... gots my Passes [x] Hotel [x] Flights [x] Packed [..] .... ok we're all good !!!!!
saw the Westin briefly on the list this morning but as quickly as it was there it was gone. Have not seen much movement on the Seaport. I have an email addy for them now so I am going to see if I can get some adjustment on my non Onpeak rate but not holding my breath.
Let me know if you get something with that room rate. I ended up doing the same thing and would really like to get it lowered
saw the Westin briefly on the list this morning but as quickly as it was there it was gone. Have not seen much movement on the Seaport. I have an email addy for them now so I am going to see if I can get some adjustment on my non Onpeak rate but not holding my breath.
I think I have three nights @ $305, one night @ $229. If I can get the OnPeak rate, I think I saw it around $195 for each night. So the difference on the first three nights is substantial. Heck if they would reduce it to what I am paying on that last night I would be happy.
PAX East 2016 .... gots my Passes [x] Hotel [x] Flights [x] Packed [..] .... ok we're all good !!!!!
The dead horse bit feels like a slightly veiled 'shut up.'
I don't know why people hate talks about improvements. Wouldn't the idea about announcing a week time-frame after PAX prime help everyone? How much time did you waste checking every day several times a day because you needed to be sure?
What's it to you if they would update my bill of my 15 one day passes to the cost of 5 three day passes? Are you worried the convention wouldnt have as much money/be as good without mine and my friend's ~250 dollars?
Why shouldn't 3 day passes cost more than 2 one day passes? Doesn't this seem like a big potential for waste? Or do you not care because you have your passes and wasted tickets is less people you have to contend with?
Why shouldn't they have a logical interface for relying on most up to date news? This could be something that stops you from going in the future.
It's all me, me, me. This year, this year, this year. Things can and should be talked about so they can be improved for ultimately everyone.
If only so there are less dead horses for you to complain about next year.
I think I have three nights @ $305, one night @ $229. If I can get the OnPeak rate, I think I saw it around $195 for each night. So the difference on the first three nights is substantial. Heck if they would reduce it to what I am paying on that last night I would be happy.
Better than the price I got. What booking site did you go with?
I have no problem with people venting about issues with registration, hotels, etc. Were there problems, absolutely. Were they handled in the best manner, no. But it is enough to say it once and move on and not engage in an endless rehashing of the same points. This is not directed at any one individual but generally. If you take the "dead horse" meme as an attempt to silence your voice it certainly was not intended that way - however there is a point when as individuals we have said our piece and we should move on to other topics (that is the point I was trying to make). Hopefully PA will take some lessons away from this year as a learning experience to improve future events.
PAX East 2016 .... gots my Passes [x] Hotel [x] Flights [x] Packed [..] .... ok we're all good !!!!!
I don't know why people hate talks about improvements. Wouldn't the idea about announcing a week time-frame after PAX prime help everyone? How much time did you waste checking every day several times a day because you needed to be sure?
I haven't seen anyone arguing against this. Not sure why you're thinking people are. One thing I will wager a guess at though, I don't think that they know within a week timeframe as of the end of pax prime when they are going to do badge sales. Should they? maybe. Anyhow, I don't think this is being heavily contested anywhere.
What's it to you if they would update my bill of my 15 one day passes to the cost of 5 three day passes? Are you worried the convention wouldnt have as much money/be as good without mine and my friend's ~250 dollars?
Again, who is arguing against this? I don't think it will happen, but it isn't exactly like this is a big point of contention either. I think it's far more likely that they will simply stop having multi-day passes.
Why shouldn't 3 day passes cost more than 2 one day passes? Doesn't this seem like a big potential for waste? Or do you not care because you have your passes and wasted tickets is less people you have to contend with?
They should. For Prime, the 4-day pass cost more than 3 single day passes but less than 4 single day passes. I was very surprised to not see that spin over to East. Again though, nobody has argued against this point.
The dead horse bit feels like a slightly veiled 'shut up.'
I don't know why people hate talks about improvements. Wouldn't the idea about announcing a week time-frame after PAX prime help everyone? How much time did you waste checking every day several times a day because you needed to be sure?
What's it to you if they would update my bill of my 15 one day passes to the cost of 5 three day passes? Are you worried the convention wouldnt have as much money/be as good without mine and my friend's ~250 dollars?
Why shouldn't 3 day passes cost more than 2 one day passes? Doesn't this seem like a big potential for waste? Or do you not care because you have your passes and wasted tickets is less people you have to contend with?
Why shouldn't they have a logical interface for relying on most up to date news? This could be something that stops you from going in the future.
It's all me, me, me. This year, this year, this year. Things can and should be talked about so they can be improved for ultimately everyone.
If only so there are less dead horses for you to complain about next year.
I believe the point is that this isn't the forum where your ideas are going to make a difference. These ideas, and many others, have been mentioned both here and in other locations time and time again. If you want your ideas to go somewhere they'll be read and considered by the individuals that have the ability to make them come to fruition, note them in the post-PAX survey.
I can't speak for others, but I feel it's a dead horse because most posts are simply complaints about how it was handled rather than offering constructive criticism on how it can be improved. That said, those constructive posts will probably fall on deaf ears posted on the forums as I'm sure those in charge don't have the time to read all of our rants, opinions, wit, knee-slappers, and other tidbits of knowledge. Are there good ideas out there already that we (as a community) think would help improve the process? You bet! Are there more ideas that haven't been mentioned that are probably genius? Quite possibly. However, zerzhul has mentioned previously that the post PAX surveys that will go out to all that purchased tickets will be the best place to share your opinion on the matter, but even then it's most likely something they've heard before.
Sure, that doesn't make us feel better now when we would all like to say 'woe is me', but what it does do is give you plenty of time to construct a well thought out opinion on the topic without the emotion of how it affected you (and most of us) from making it completely biased and written in a way they'll just skip over it because it's an angry rant.
As for updating one day passes to three day passes, I can't recall a convention, conference, or gathering that will combine tickets from multiple single-day passes to an all-inclusive pass for the entire time. Single day passes are available at a premium for those that want to attend but cannot attend the entire weekend, and they want to make sure they give ample opportunity for people to attend any day that works best for them. Sure, it sucks that you have to pay more for it (part of my group had to get sets of one day passes, so it raised the cost of tickets for our whole group out of 'fairness'), but the amount of three day vs single day passes was probably determined long before passes went on sale. The manpower and cost associated with changing these passes probably isn't worth it (especially when you've already shown your willingness to pay that 'premium' price to attend).
I know a lot of people on this forums got their 3 day passes. Unless you've come off smug about it (and many have), I am happy for you.
But I am unhappy with the system.
After a month and a half of religiously checking the website three or four times a day, it is posted that the next day the tickets will go on sale, and its widely reported that it will be at noon. This saved me a couple of website checks and at the time I felt like, "Well at least i won't miss it."
So I got on my work computer, which is a ridiculously fast connection, and started f5'ing around 11:40.
`~I got in a queue around 12:15, which was the first time the site didnt error, or have a bad link, or no link (saying Soon). I sat in the queue for about 25 minutes, and was told that the 3 day passes were sold out.
So I bought 15 one day passes, because I was buying for my 5 friends at a much higher price. So I'm going, but I have the following complaints:
Why didn't they announce the passes would be sold in a specified week window after PAX prime. I have mixed feelings about them announcing it at all, but by doing it the way they did it, it was like they maximized the amount of time we all had to worry about it.
I do not understand why 3 day passes are sold out when all three days are still available. If PA doesn't care about making a buck (which has been proclaimed in this thread several times), why am I not charged the 3 day rate? Three years in and I've seen no advantage. I saw someone post in this thread that you could get more swag, but this is untrue. It's been my experience that a person could get as many swag bags as you like, even with a 3 day. It says to me that they _are_ trying to make a buck, because I can't see this being too complicated or unusual a situation for a ticket-selling website to implement.
Why is the 3 day five days cheaper than the 2 one day passes? This pushes people to buying a 3 day, even if they are only going Friday and Saturday, but not Sunday. Or only Saturday and Sunday.
Why did they allow backdoor methods to be so rampant? In my head, pax east's official site should be where you should go to get information, not to be stonewalled while everyone who follows #RKhoo jumps in line. Even if it was #PAXEast and the site said to follow that tag for best/most up to date info, I would have done that. But until such a declaration is made, isn't it their duty, in the name of fairness, to first post the information to the most logical place?
Why do the tickets go on sale at noon? I have seen people on this thread talk about 60+ hour work week and rescheduling meetings and such and still being available. But I imagine there are people like me who did all this, didn't follow twitter and got the shaft, and for both of those people, wouldn't their lives be better by not having to put up with that nonsense? I can't have my phone at work. Or else I would have seen the tweet. What about school kids? Wouldn't it be more fair for them?
Assuming that the reduction in 3-day passes sold, and it does seem to be a reduction, is a "stealth price increase" you do realize that price increases are the only way to reduce demand other than "make the con shittier," right?
Thus if demand far outstrips supply, this is a good thing. Provided any increase is within reason, such that it doesn't price out "normal folks," while still significant enough to dissuade people who don't "care enough," you wind up allowing more dedicated fans in.
Also, removing the discount for full weekend attendance (which the limited three day supply does) encourages partial attendance. Same thing. More people going only one or two days means more people get to go those remaining days. My friend went only Saturday to Prime. The full weekend wasn't worth it to him. That means three attendee-days were still available. He still had a blast, and somebody (multiple some bodies) got to enjoy the days he left on the table.
Subtle price increases and a shift to single day badges are basically the only reasonable way to decrease demand and increase effective supply, aside from additional cons.
It's possible that it's just a cash grab, sure. Even if so, it actually works in favor of attendees as well. So if they are dicks, they are at least benevolent dicks.
Undercharging for three day badges is an issue though. That has to change; if any discount is offered, they absolutely should cost more than two one day passes. That's basic Econ.
Undercharging for three day badges is an issue though. That has to change; if any discount is offered, they absolutely should cost more than two one day passes. That's basic Econ.
I feel like in the rush it probably went something like this "Raise the price 5 dollars on all badges this year" random showclix/reed employee "Okay". With no thought to what that actually ended up being. I bet right after they did it it was like "Shit...we messed that up"
I feel like in the rush it probably went something like this "Raise the price 5 dollars on all badges this year"...
That's pretty clearly what happened - it's not like PA is running a full time FP&A department over there. Anyway, saying they fail at "basic econ" is sort of nonsensical in the first place, because they are clearly not pricing the badges for profit maximization in the first place.
SheriResident FlufferMy Living RoomRegistered Userregular
The dead horse is because every thing people are "suggesting" now are things that have pretty much been hashed and rehashed already - especially the price issue. Pretty much everyone has agreed that the 3-day pricing was wiggidy whack and quite possibly an oversight.
stebuuCrabs are fucking crazy, and I hate horsesRegistered Userregular
edited October 2013
Stebuu's master how to fix everything post. This solves the internet.
1) Put contract traps for ShowClix and OnPeak to incentivize not sucking. (I have no idea if this is done or not).
2) Tweak pricing for three day passes and sunday to "spread the load". Maybe something like $45 Friday, $45 Saturday, $40 Sunday and $110 three day.
3) Make PAX website not melt. Do any combo:
3a) During peak load, replace badge availability and registration widgets with @Official_PAX twitter feed and/or link
3b) Static website, to reduce load
3c) Auto-schedule noontime switchover
3d) EC2. For the children.
4) Dance break
(NB: saying "note this on the post-PAX survey" does not help those who were boned by OnPeak/ShowClix/PAX website/ennui)
Posts
PAX Prime 2014 Preparations Complete
I was neurotic about getting passes for PAX East this year. I saw how PAX Prime went down. Everyone said PAX East usually doesn't sell out as fast, but I knew that wasn't going to be the case this year.
I was religiously refreshing Official_PAX on twitter, cause I'd seen it was their emergency broadcast system already.
And then they updated Khoo's personal twitter with the links 2 minutes before they updated the official twitter account. I got in line at minute 1 of the link being in the wild, waited 15 minutes, got my 3-day passes, and breathed a sigh of relief.
And I knew a shit storm was coming. Tweeting those links from Khoo's personal account was absolutely the wrong thing to do. I understand their motivation for posting the link to twitter. Their main page was being DDOS'ed by a bunch of F5'ers. They needed to take the pressure off the site so they could update it. But I do not even remotely understand their reasoning for using Khoo's account to do so.
Except perhaps panic on their part?
I have been going to PAX East since 2011, and I have had a great time every time.
Like any good show/con, it grows over time, just look at the numbers of when PAX Prime started, it blew up from there.
So naturally since PAX East is a very well run con, I expect it to blow up.
Here is my situation:
I got into a line from a tweet I saw (not from PA) regarding the line. I didn't know it was a separate service, and I assumed it was a faulty website. I then click the official link around 12:10 or so, waiting in line, turned out it was the same thing.
Ok fine, I'm waiting waiting waiting, turns out I can't get a 3 day, so I get 3 single day badges, which is fine, I had to do that last year and I am in a position to do so. I also got a BYOC pass for the first time, super excited!
Then I am trying to book a hotel. While I am work. I wound up being late at a meeting, and wound up booking a hotel while at the meeting (very unprofessional of me) and it was not the Westin or the Seaport, I booked the Hyatt.
I had tried to book a hotel, but OnPeak simply could not handle the bandwidth. Neither could PA website/forums. I had no idea the actual link I clinked was official.
If I had to critique the process, I would make it so the PAX website is updated at the same time as the twitter feed, to avoid confusion.
The challenge with any system is that there is significantly more demand than supply at this time (BCEC expansion can't come fast enough) As such no matter what the system, people will deal without. So as far as any criticism that goes towards the purchasing system, the reality is there will be haves and have nots. I am in a position to not be a have not, and would have eBayed a 3 day pass for a large fee if I had needed to. Not everyone else is so fortunate.
I just wish there was a way to get passes to legitimate customers first, then bulk passes later to minimize scalping. It seems no matter what system is up, scalping will occur regardless.
Thanks for reading!
The only solution is more space to fit the demand, with scalpers buying passes and getting burned. For Prime especially, this is no easy solution, and for East its not very viable either.
People have the option to purchase from scalpers if they really want to go.
I, and others, get the sense that PA management thinks that they handled things adequately.
They made (and repeated!) some shockingly rookie mistakes. They haven't handled the issue adequately from either a PR or technical level, so some drum beating is warranted.
My personal guess is that Khoo has to deal with people unhappy with ticket sales every single PAX, and has lost some ability to differentiate between those unhappy because of random chance and those unhappy because PA completely dropped the ball. The other primary alternative I can see is that he doesn't want to deal with the ultimate question of "what are you going to do for me?" if he admits PA fluffed the launch.
I would like it to be better for group C over group Q. Because right now, Poland is group Q and they have it better than group C (pax east local time) for the majority of C and Q's population.
And you are right, I don't have statistics. That doesn't mean I can't apply common sense.
I think we can hopefully all agree that whatever sense you feel or get right now is based purely on not getting what you wanted in the end. Had you gotten your badges even after all the issues you would not have made 20+ posts on the subject of holding PA responsible with a public apology or something.
Some people didn't get badges, those people are upset, and rightfully so. However lets not confuse that with legitimate reasoning on how registration should be handled, or how it was handled. We don't know how things went down at onPeak, ShowClix, Reed, or PA. Things will never be 100% fair for everyone, nor is it okay to say fair for one group is more important than being fair to another.
Personally having followed PA so long, and having an idea of how Khoo is, I'm fairly confident he wasn't happy with how things went and will always try his hardest to make things "perfect" as that is who he is.
Being personally affected (both myself and members of my "party"), I agree than I am significantly more vocal than I would otherwise be. However, I disagree with your characterization that I find fault with their launch solely because I was negatively affected by it, or that only those who were negatively affected COULD find fault.
The same issues have always been present on some level with PAX East, PAX Prime, Blizzcon, SDCC, NYCC, or any other major convention/concert/event you can think of. The same "solutions" have been presented/tried before.
As harsh of a reality as it is, nobody is guaranteed a badge. No one has a right to purchasing a badge over somebody else. All you can do is be vigilant and ready to roll at the drop of a hat.
My only major criticism was how OnPeak really just broke down this year for PAX East. Coupled with the accidental mobile link that went live prior to sales, it made booking a hotel tough, but manageable.
I say thee neigh!
I got a 5-pack of 3-day badges for myself, my fiance, and friends. I got a room at the Seaport (my hotel of choice, I really like it over the Westin) for Thurs-Mon. I literally got everything I could have wanted.
So this, coming from me: the processes for both hotels and badges were giant messes.
I apologize for any confusion that caused. It was pretty much directed at stebuu as he has made many posts about this.
I don't think anyone can really say that it wasn't a mess. aBBy is right though, this horse is dead.
The overall topic is quite dead, yes, but it would still be a fair point to actually acknowledge that not everyone does post solely from the perspective of self-interest. This is especially true when it comes to criticism. It is possible for someone to like a thing enough to want to see it do well and to feel compelled to criticize when it doesn't in hopes that it will improve. This is quite different from just wanting to complain.
I have passes and hotel reservations, but the registration process was fouled in every aspect and felt shockingly amateurish. So yes, I hope they can improve for next year. There will always be people disappointed because demand outstrips supply, but those numbers shouldn't have to be inflated because the registration process itself is flawed.
Agreed and agreed
Has anyone had any luck picking up a reservation since the dust as settled?
I have been checking in with some frequency but have been unsuccessful this far... seaport popped up on Friday but by the time I went through the reservation process it was gone.
To go with another internet chestnut, the illogical leap: if Khoo can post a long explanation about a problem essentially beyond his control (PAX East on Easter), but not the multiple ticket/hotel issues more under his control, the answer is clear: Khoo only likes Christians.
Let me know if you get something with that room rate. I ended up doing the same thing and would really like to get it lowered
damn, what's the non onpeak rate?
Massive Crystal Cavern!
I don't know why people hate talks about improvements. Wouldn't the idea about announcing a week time-frame after PAX prime help everyone? How much time did you waste checking every day several times a day because you needed to be sure?
What's it to you if they would update my bill of my 15 one day passes to the cost of 5 three day passes? Are you worried the convention wouldnt have as much money/be as good without mine and my friend's ~250 dollars?
Why shouldn't 3 day passes cost more than 2 one day passes? Doesn't this seem like a big potential for waste? Or do you not care because you have your passes and wasted tickets is less people you have to contend with?
Why shouldn't they have a logical interface for relying on most up to date news? This could be something that stops you from going in the future.
It's all me, me, me. This year, this year, this year. Things can and should be talked about so they can be improved for ultimately everyone.
If only so there are less dead horses for you to complain about next year.
Better than the price I got. What booking site did you go with?
*breathes*
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Again, who is arguing against this? I don't think it will happen, but it isn't exactly like this is a big point of contention either. I think it's far more likely that they will simply stop having multi-day passes.
They should. For Prime, the 4-day pass cost more than 3 single day passes but less than 4 single day passes. I was very surprised to not see that spin over to East. Again though, nobody has argued against this point.
You are really bad at this. Again, nobody has argued against this.
I believe the point is that this isn't the forum where your ideas are going to make a difference. These ideas, and many others, have been mentioned both here and in other locations time and time again. If you want your ideas to go somewhere they'll be read and considered by the individuals that have the ability to make them come to fruition, note them in the post-PAX survey.
Sure, that doesn't make us feel better now when we would all like to say 'woe is me', but what it does do is give you plenty of time to construct a well thought out opinion on the topic without the emotion of how it affected you (and most of us) from making it completely biased and written in a way they'll just skip over it because it's an angry rant.
As for updating one day passes to three day passes, I can't recall a convention, conference, or gathering that will combine tickets from multiple single-day passes to an all-inclusive pass for the entire time. Single day passes are available at a premium for those that want to attend but cannot attend the entire weekend, and they want to make sure they give ample opportunity for people to attend any day that works best for them. Sure, it sucks that you have to pay more for it (part of my group had to get sets of one day passes, so it raised the cost of tickets for our whole group out of 'fairness'), but the amount of three day vs single day passes was probably determined long before passes went on sale. The manpower and cost associated with changing these passes probably isn't worth it (especially when you've already shown your willingness to pay that 'premium' price to attend).
edit: shit they were probably pretty well known by the end of the day last wednesday.
Assuming that the reduction in 3-day passes sold, and it does seem to be a reduction, is a "stealth price increase" you do realize that price increases are the only way to reduce demand other than "make the con shittier," right?
Thus if demand far outstrips supply, this is a good thing. Provided any increase is within reason, such that it doesn't price out "normal folks," while still significant enough to dissuade people who don't "care enough," you wind up allowing more dedicated fans in.
Also, removing the discount for full weekend attendance (which the limited three day supply does) encourages partial attendance. Same thing. More people going only one or two days means more people get to go those remaining days. My friend went only Saturday to Prime. The full weekend wasn't worth it to him. That means three attendee-days were still available. He still had a blast, and somebody (multiple some bodies) got to enjoy the days he left on the table.
Subtle price increases and a shift to single day badges are basically the only reasonable way to decrease demand and increase effective supply, aside from additional cons.
It's possible that it's just a cash grab, sure. Even if so, it actually works in favor of attendees as well. So if they are dicks, they are at least benevolent dicks.
Don't think they're dicks, though.
I feel like in the rush it probably went something like this "Raise the price 5 dollars on all badges this year" random showclix/reed employee "Okay". With no thought to what that actually ended up being. I bet right after they did it it was like "Shit...we messed that up"
That's pretty clearly what happened - it's not like PA is running a full time FP&A department over there. Anyway, saying they fail at "basic econ" is sort of nonsensical in the first place, because they are clearly not pricing the badges for profit maximization in the first place.
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1) Put contract traps for ShowClix and OnPeak to incentivize not sucking. (I have no idea if this is done or not).
2) Tweak pricing for three day passes and sunday to "spread the load". Maybe something like $45 Friday, $45 Saturday, $40 Sunday and $110 three day.
3) Make PAX website not melt. Do any combo:
3a) During peak load, replace badge availability and registration widgets with @Official_PAX twitter feed and/or link
3b) Static website, to reduce load
3c) Auto-schedule noontime switchover
3d) EC2. For the children.
4) Dance break
(NB: saying "note this on the post-PAX survey" does not help those who were boned by OnPeak/ShowClix/PAX website/ennui)