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The guns fell silent and men heard the voice of God

124

Posts

  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    why do we have black history month if there are a bunch of other ethnicities too?

    because we fucking do

  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    armistice day, particularly the 2 minute silence, is sacred because all those years ago everyone agreed to stop shooting each other for a bit

    and the weirdest fucking thing happened

    they did

    it is a point in time where humans, LOTS OF HUMANS, took a few minutes to think about the fact that what they were doing was bloody awful and that the other guy was thinking the exact same thing

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Pip I don't particularly care if you disagree with me but you can fuck right off with that comparison sunshine

  • TamTam Registered User regular
    damn if there isn't something chilling about history passing from living memory

  • ArangArang HUEY LEWISRegistered User regular
    Tam wrote: »
    damn if there isn't something chilling about history passing from living memory

    There's a word, saeculum, that means the amount of time between something happening and the last person who remembers it dying, and then their death would be the starting point of a new cycle

    the Etruscans came up with it, and also believed that every civilization had a certain allotted number of saeculums before it, too, would be swept away and forgotten

    thenews.jpg
  • RalgRalg Registered User regular
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    armistice day, particularly the 2 minute silence, is sacred because all those years ago everyone agreed to stop shooting each other for a bit

    and the weirdest fucking thing happened

    they did

    it is a point in time where humans, LOTS OF HUMANS, took a few minutes to think about the fact that what they were doing was bloody awful and that the other guy was thinking the exact same thing

    Considering this was a point in time where humans and LOTS OF THEM were still killing (and raping) each other in massive numbers, your point is actually kind of void

  • TamTam Registered User regular
    that number has become incredibly extended since the advent of mass recorded media

  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    armistice day, particularly the 2 minute silence, is sacred because all those years ago everyone agreed to stop shooting each other for a bit

    and the weirdest fucking thing happened

    they did

    it is a point in time where humans, LOTS OF HUMANS, took a few minutes to think about the fact that what they were doing was bloody awful and that the other guy was thinking the exact same thing

    Considering this was a point in time where humans and LOTS OF THEM were still killing (and raping) each other in massive numbers, your point is actually kind of void

    what

  • RalgRalg Registered User regular
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    armistice day, particularly the 2 minute silence, is sacred because all those years ago everyone agreed to stop shooting each other for a bit

    and the weirdest fucking thing happened

    they did

    it is a point in time where humans, LOTS OF HUMANS, took a few minutes to think about the fact that what they were doing was bloody awful and that the other guy was thinking the exact same thing

    Considering this was a point in time where humans and LOTS OF THEM were still killing (and raping) each other in massive numbers, your point is actually kind of void

    what

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Civil_War

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Turkish_War_(1919–1922)

  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    armistice day, particularly the 2 minute silence, is sacred because all those years ago everyone agreed to stop shooting each other for a bit

    and the weirdest fucking thing happened

    they did

    it is a point in time where humans, LOTS OF HUMANS, took a few minutes to think about the fact that what they were doing was bloody awful and that the other guy was thinking the exact same thing

    Considering this was a point in time where humans and LOTS OF THEM were still killing (and raping) each other in massive numbers, your point is actually kind of void

    what

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Civil_War

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Turkish_War_(1919–1922)

    what

  • TheStigTheStig Registered User regular
    Nah.

    bnet: TheStig#1787 Steam: TheStig
  • TamTam Registered User regular
    how does that void his point?

    he said that one instance of coordinated peace was sacred because it was in contrast to the mayhem that usually occurs

  • RalgRalg Registered User regular
    Well, not everyone agreed to stop shooting each other, for one.

  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    Well, not everyone agreed to stop shooting each other, for one.

    I'm pretty gay too

  • RalgRalg Registered User regular
    edited November 2013
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Ralg wrote: »
    Well, not everyone agreed to stop shooting each other, for one.

    I'm pretty gay too

    Oh, sorry. I made the mistake of viewing you as something other than a silly goose

    Ralg on
  • PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    dude if you wanna make out you just gotta ask

  • TheStigTheStig Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Ralg wrote: »
    Well, not everyone agreed to stop shooting each other, for one.

    I'm pretty gay too

    Oh, sorry. I made the mistake of viewing you as something other than a silly goose

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silliness

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geese

    bnet: TheStig#1787 Steam: TheStig
  • GatsbyGatsby Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    Pip I don't particularly care if you disagree with me but you can fuck right off with that comparison sunshine

    No that's actually a fairly apt comparison to how you sound

  • Typhoid MannyTyphoid Manny Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    armistice day, particularly the 2 minute silence, is sacred because all those years ago everyone agreed to stop shooting each other for a bit

    and the weirdest fucking thing happened

    they did

    it is a point in time where humans, LOTS OF HUMANS, took a few minutes to think about the fact that what they were doing was bloody awful and that the other guy was thinking the exact same thing

    Considering this was a point in time where humans and LOTS OF THEM were still killing (and raping) each other in massive numbers, your point is actually kind of void

    what

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Civil_War

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Turkish_War_(1919–1922)

    where does it get you, being this obtuse? and who said that the two minutes' silence was in remembrance of that magical day when all killing stopped, everywhere? it's specifically in recognition of the armistice that ended WWI, with some added what-is-it-good-for soul searching. none of this requires anything but the armistice that ended WWI and some people willing to actually think about what that meant.

    i mean i think i understand where you're coming from. this kind of thing should not be observed if you don't have a solid idea of why it's observed, otherwise it's the pledge of allegiance where it's just the done thing and no one ever thinks about it any deeper than that. but come on man, you can't think you have a point by saying that there were wars still being fought at the time so obviously the whole thing's meaningless.

    you really don't think there's any value in observing the end of the most destructive war in human history up to that time? a war that shaped the rest of the century it took place in and more or less gave rise to the world we live in now?

    from each according to his ability, to each according to his need
    hitting hot metal with hammers
  • RalgRalg Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    Ralg wrote: »
    PiptheFair wrote: »
    armistice day, particularly the 2 minute silence, is sacred because all those years ago everyone agreed to stop shooting each other for a bit

    and the weirdest fucking thing happened

    they did

    it is a point in time where humans, LOTS OF HUMANS, took a few minutes to think about the fact that what they were doing was bloody awful and that the other guy was thinking the exact same thing

    Considering this was a point in time where humans and LOTS OF THEM were still killing (and raping) each other in massive numbers, your point is actually kind of void

    what

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Civil_War

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Turkish_War_(1919–1922)

    you really don't think there's any value in observing the end of the most destructive war in human history up to that time? a war that shaped the rest of the century it took place in and more or less gave rise to the world we live in now?

    My point is that the war didn't end at that time.

  • Bluedude152Bluedude152 Registered User regular
    Yes, it did

    For a day

    The point is that everyone took a break to think about what they have done before being forced back into fighting

    p0a2ody6sqnt.jpg
  • Typhoid MannyTyphoid Manny Registered User regular
    are you seriously using the russian civil war as evidence that the Great War didn't end? come on man.

    i mean, there are serious, valid arguments to be made for the idea that the two world wars were really the same war with a twenty-year break in between, but that is just absolutely not the same as what you are saying.

    the main belligerent parties signed an accord that said "we are done fighting." soon after, the "losing" side surrendered and was disbanded. the war ended.

    by your logic WWII didn't end when the japanese surrendered because there was a revolution about to happen in china.

    from each according to his ability, to each according to his need
    hitting hot metal with hammers
  • RalgRalg Registered User regular
    are you seriously using the russian civil war as evidence that the Great War didn't end? come on man.

    i mean, there are serious, valid arguments to be made for the idea that the two world wars were really the same war with a twenty-year break in between, but that is just absolutely not the same as what you are saying.

    the main belligerent parties signed an accord that said "we are done fighting." soon after, the "losing" side surrendered and was disbanded. the war ended.

    by your logic WWII didn't end when the japanese surrendered because there was a revolution about to happen in china.

    I'm sorry for being obtuse and not serious.

  • FyndirFyndir Registered User regular
    Hey guys what's going on in this thre-

    8TCLqs8.gif

  • Typhoid MannyTyphoid Manny Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    are you seriously using the russian civil war as evidence that the Great War didn't end? come on man.

    i mean, there are serious, valid arguments to be made for the idea that the two world wars were really the same war with a twenty-year break in between, but that is just absolutely not the same as what you are saying.

    the main belligerent parties signed an accord that said "we are done fighting." soon after, the "losing" side surrendered and was disbanded. the war ended.

    by your logic WWII didn't end when the japanese surrendered because there was a revolution about to happen in china.

    I'm sorry for being obtuse and not serious.

    oh is this the part where you go "jeez it was only a joke, lighten up guys"

    from each according to his ability, to each according to his need
    hitting hot metal with hammers
  • RalgRalg Registered User regular
    Ralg wrote: »
    are you seriously using the russian civil war as evidence that the Great War didn't end? come on man.

    i mean, there are serious, valid arguments to be made for the idea that the two world wars were really the same war with a twenty-year break in between, but that is just absolutely not the same as what you are saying.

    the main belligerent parties signed an accord that said "we are done fighting." soon after, the "losing" side surrendered and was disbanded. the war ended.

    by your logic WWII didn't end when the japanese surrendered because there was a revolution about to happen in china.

    I'm sorry for being obtuse and not serious.

    oh is this the part where you go "jeez it was only a joke, lighten up guys"

    No, this is the part I'll cease arguing with someone who can't discuss without resorting to insults.

  • Typhoid MannyTyphoid Manny Registered User regular
    edited November 2013
    okay, forget i called you obtuse. argue your point. i'll give it a fair shake if you're actually interested in trying to back your shit up

    e: but seriously, you're being obtuse

    Typhoid Manny on
    from each according to his ability, to each according to his need
    hitting hot metal with hammers
  • Donovan PuppyfuckerDonovan Puppyfucker A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    And I can respect that

    But at the same time, a lot of people have died in a lot of wars

    I wasn't talking about the glorification of war but more the emotional significance of the loss

    Do we have two minutes of silence for the Napoleonic Wars? For the Punic Wars? Do we need it? I don't think I do, anyway.

    I dunno, WWI just doesn't have a significance to me. It's pure history. It's got no emotional weight in my mind. I can look at it like I'd look at wars during the medieval period or whenever. As a kid I sat in Assembly and felt, well, nothing at all during that time. Those people who do feel something, that's cool too.

    Yeah, why should we make a point about remembering the 21 million + servicemen and women worldwide that perished in WW1?

    I wasn't alive then, so who cares?

  • HellaJeffHellaJeff FAB FRESH RAIIINBOOWWWWWRegistered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    And I can respect that

    But at the same time, a lot of people have died in a lot of wars

    I wasn't talking about the glorification of war but more the emotional significance of the loss

    Do we have two minutes of silence for the Napoleonic Wars? For the Punic Wars? Do we need it? I don't think I do, anyway.

    I dunno, WWI just doesn't have a significance to me. It's pure history. It's got no emotional weight in my mind. I can look at it like I'd look at wars during the medieval period or whenever. As a kid I sat in Assembly and felt, well, nothing at all during that time. Those people who do feel something, that's cool too.

    Yeah, why should we make a point about remembering the 21 million + servicemen and women worldwide that perished in WW1?

    I wasn't alive then, so who cares?

    Mmmm. Not that I want to take sides, but I think you are being unfair. Armistice day is beautiful because you have an actual example of a seemingly unstoppable conflict where people acknowledged that their humanity and concern for that humanity transcended the primal behavior they were acting in. However, living in an individualistic country, where the media has such a dystopian view on each citizen? It is very easy to not connect with the idea that observing this event can be emotionally relevant to most people in the west.

    I mean yeah, this is a 'product of your environment' point I am making. But I think it is an important one BECAUSE Armistice Day is a day to show that across cultures and political strings people have shown the ability to get past their environment. And with something as important as proving the wonder that is humanity, do you really want to criticize and chastise someone who doesn't connect with this example of the idea? Hell no.

  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    It's interesting how the name World War I and World War II came about and stuck. The number varies based on how you define it, but we have certainly had more than two. The Napoleonic Wars involved every continent (well, except Antarctica I imagine).

  • VeldrinVeldrin Sham bam bamina Registered User regular
    Probably because of how closely related the two wars were.

    People like trendy nicknames.

  • FyndirFyndir Registered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    It's interesting how the name World War I and World War II came about and stuck. The number varies based on how you define it, but we have certainly had more than two. The Napoleonic Wars involved every continent (well, except Antarctica I imagine).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeDjaQNiTog

  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    Veldrin wrote: »
    Probably because of how closely related the two wars were.

    People like trendy nicknames.

    Also, there was a hundred years between the Napoleonic Wars and WWI - there were some who served in both WWI and WWII. Then there's the whole "this isn't peace, it's an armistice for twenty years" quote, and that they had already used The Great War, when the second one happened... The Greater War? Doesn't fit quite as nice

  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    Oh, the names definitely make sense, especially in the context that the names were given. I also just find that the way the names, after the fact, color the perception of history for us, or later generations who were not alive during these times, is interesting. Growing up I figured there had only ever been two world wars, given the names.

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    And I can respect that

    But at the same time, a lot of people have died in a lot of wars

    I wasn't talking about the glorification of war but more the emotional significance of the loss

    Do we have two minutes of silence for the Napoleonic Wars? For the Punic Wars? Do we need it? I don't think I do, anyway.

    I dunno, WWI just doesn't have a significance to me. It's pure history. It's got no emotional weight in my mind. I can look at it like I'd look at wars during the medieval period or whenever. As a kid I sat in Assembly and felt, well, nothing at all during that time. Those people who do feel something, that's cool too.

    Yeah, why should we make a point about remembering the 21 million + servicemen and women worldwide that perished in WW1?

    I wasn't alive then, so who cares?

    Why should we make a point about them but not a point about the millions of people who died in countless other wars around the world? I think all those wars were pretty pointless and stupid, as much so as the First World War was. So why do those particular people at that particular time get a couple of minutes?

    I don't not care that they died. I just don't care that they died any more than I care that anyone else died in a time that neither me nor my parents nor my grandparents remember, that nobody who I know ever lived in or experienced. I feel as far removed from the deaths of WWI as I do from the deaths of the Napoleonic Wars or whatever.

    Some people do feel something special. I guess you do. I don't mind you guys wanting to make a ritual of remembrance out of that. But this thread is about discussing Armistice Day and our feelings regarding Armistice Day and I was just sharing mine, that Armistice Day remembers something that I definitely consider true, but that I don't feel any kind of need to hold a two minutes special silence regarding it, and the deaths of people in WWI don't hold any more emotional weight to them than anyone else's death in history before that.

    You could make the argument that I don't care from that, I guess. It's fair to say that we don't care about the deaths of a lot of people in the past. If we grieved for all the pointless deaths in war that ever were, then we'd never stop grieving.

  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Gatsby wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    Pip I don't particularly care if you disagree with me but you can fuck right off with that comparison sunshine

    No that's actually a fairly apt comparison to how you sound

    It really isn't.

    Black History month is important because Black people suffer from institutional racism right now.

    It's an element of an active fight against social injustice.

    Saying you don't celebrate Black History Month and don't personally see the point of it holds a moral stance which saying you don't celebrate or personally see the point of Armistice Day doesn't. For a start, the former implies, even demands, a degree of racism which the latter does not.

    I am sure you can see why I would feel that being told my views on Armistice Day are, essentially, on a moral par with at least casual racism would be somewhat aggravating!

  • masterofmetroidmasterofmetroid Have you ever looked at a world and seen it as a kind of challenge?Registered User regular
    edited November 2013
    World War I was a horrible tragedy where what amounted to an entire generation of people who, mostly by no choice of their own, where put into the service of their respective countries for what amounted to nothing. And so many of them in that awful situation not only managed to not do horrible things, but be something close to heroes.

    That has never stopped being relevant, and i sure as hell think it's worth remembering.

    masterofmetroid on
  • SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Never said it wasn't relevant or that it wasn't worth remembering.

    Never would say that, either.

  • Donovan PuppyfuckerDonovan Puppyfucker A dagger in the dark is worth a thousand swords in the morningRegistered User regular
    edited November 2013
    Solar wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    And I can respect that

    But at the same time, a lot of people have died in a lot of wars

    I wasn't talking about the glorification of war but more the emotional significance of the loss

    Do we have two minutes of silence for the Napoleonic Wars? For the Punic Wars? Do we need it? I don't think I do, anyway.

    I dunno, WWI just doesn't have a significance to me. It's pure history. It's got no emotional weight in my mind. I can look at it like I'd look at wars during the medieval period or whenever. As a kid I sat in Assembly and felt, well, nothing at all during that time. Those people who do feel something, that's cool too.

    Yeah, why should we make a point about remembering the 21 million + servicemen and women worldwide that perished in WW1?

    I wasn't alive then, so who cares?

    Why should we make a point about them but not a point about the millions of people who died in countless other wars around the world? I think all those wars were pretty pointless and stupid, as much so as the First World War was. So why do those particular people at that particular time get a couple of minutes?

    I don't not care that they died. I just don't care that they died any more than I care that anyone else died in a time that neither me nor my parents nor my grandparents remember, that nobody who I know ever lived in or experienced. I feel as far removed from the deaths of WWI as I do from the deaths of the Napoleonic Wars or whatever.

    Some people do feel something special. I guess you do. I don't mind you guys wanting to make a ritual of remembrance out of that. But this thread is about discussing Armistice Day and our feelings regarding Armistice Day and I was just sharing mine, that Armistice Day remembers something that I definitely consider true, but that I don't feel any kind of need to hold a two minutes special silence regarding it, and the deaths of people in WWI don't hold any more emotional weight to them than anyone else's death in history before that.

    You could make the argument that I don't care from that, I guess. It's fair to say that we don't care about the deaths of a lot of people in the past. If we grieved for all the pointless deaths in war that ever were, then we'd never stop grieving.

    I dunno if I've always read too much into it, but when I was a very young boy, my WW2 vet Grandfather told me that Remembrance Day means a lot more than just being sad about people dying. He said it's more to do with the West coming to the realisation that we'd just hold ourselves back with all this war business, all the fighting ever did was pointlessly kill untold numbers of the youth and cause huge economic damage. He pointed out that even many of the people that come home still have their lives destroyed, like my Great-Grandfather who came back from WW1 missing an arm and couldn't be a mechanic anymore, so he got a job driving trains instead.

    Remembrance Day is sombre, yeah. It's hard not to be with even a cursory thought to the number of lives cut short for absolutely nothing. But it's also a hopeful day for me. We do some incredibly stupid things to each other, for reasons even more stupid than that. But then every so often we realise that there's a better way, and we strive to make the world a better place.

    Observing the two minutes silence is just a matter of respect for the fallen.

    Donovan Puppyfucker on
  • Brovid HasselsmofBrovid Hasselsmof [Growling historic on the fury road] Registered User regular
    edited November 2013
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    Man, the ending to Blackadder is some great television.

    Have you ever heard the behind the scenes stuff about this? I found it pretty fascinating.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbR9-etyN6I


    edit: also that scene still gets me every time.

    Brovid Hasselsmof on
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