AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited February 2014
Just as I was thinking of a way to succintly compare the two things, I found this terrific article that sums up the entire problem and makes it clear what the original was like. Wouldn't anyone prefer an updated version of the original on iOS instead of a meaningless soulless remake that has nothing in common with the original game? Because I would buy an updated version of the original, or even an entirely new version with the originals great gameplay and the art style the iOS game uses any day. It's games like Dungeon Keeper that have killed my enthusiasm for games on iOS and why I haven't bought anything on iOS in so long now I don't even bother checking the online stores anymore. It's filled with garbage like this and is becoming so bloated with it, that it's not worth my time digging through the sheer volume of utter crap to find the precious gems hidden in it (like Ocean Horn), when I don't have to dig through that to find numerous fantastic games on my vita or other gaming platforms.
minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
edited February 2014
So, if it wasn't called "Dungeon Keeper" everyone would be way less mad? I mean, I understand the frustration, but I pretty much just write off all iOS f2p games as being kinda shitty from the get go, so I don't really have any expectations to be disappointed from. And in the grand scheme, I supposed I'm more bummed about a shitty star wars game being released as a reskinned Tiny Tower than I am a Dungeon Keeper remake/sequel. But yes, at the end of the day, I'd really like a more "proper" Dungeon Keeper game on iOS, so it's a shame this is that. But most iOS games kinda suck, so it goes.
But seriously, go play Bridge Constructor instead. It's way better than Dungeon Keeper.
minor incident on
Ah, it stinks, it sucks, it's anthropologically unjust
Aegeri is double-mad because of the Dungeon Keeper thing. I'm mostly mad with F2P games in general but especially the current glut that are a new level of exploitative - But @Aegeri covered that off really nicely with his long post. I'm mad with this one in particular because it's the only one I've tried (because I loved Dungeon Keeper).
ALRIGHT FINE I GOT AN AVATAR
Steam: adamjnet
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
So, if it wasn't called "Dungeon Keeper" everyone would be way less mad?
Yes.
How many people here who are exceptionally frustrated at what Dungeon Keeper is (or isn't, depending on your point of view) are mad about a game called Clash of Clans? Clash of Clans is actually a very similar concept to Dungeon Keeper, but it's basically a different IP and so it can do whatever the hell it wants. I find Clash of Clans the same distasteful awful F2P system that I dislike of course, but I don't care about it because it isn't anything I would notice or want to play in the first place. Dungeon Keeper is something I want to play and really want a proper update of. That's the difference.
Also Dungeon Keeper is still a wonderfully creative and fantastic game, something the industry could use more of and I personally feel we could use significantly less of this exploitive F2P bullshit.
All of the posts since my last one have convinced me f2p is bad overall. I guess I've just been lucky for it not to effect me yet.
It doesn't have to be though. Games like Jetpack Joyride and Punch Quest handle F2P very well. Both games are perfectly playable without spending a dime and only charge you for what are essentially cheat codes and purely cosmetic items. The IAP elements are non-intrusive. The problem is that developers of F2P games are going in the other direction and shoveling out this exploitative crap like DK and Candy Crush Saga that are built around timers and bilking people out of their money instead of coming up with genuinely compelling and fun games that treat the IAP element as a secondary aspect to actual gameplay.
Bullio on
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
Yea jet pack joyride does it right. I paid a buck for the coin doubler because I love the game. I also paid a couple bucks for some coins to unlock some jet packs because I thought they were cool.
The reason I spent anything at all is because the base game is amazing, and even though you can buy boosts you can achieve the same thing through skill and I felt a greater sense of accomplishment for doing so. It was a great game that because it was free I tried it. Once I played a bunch I threw a few bucks towards a dev I really dig.
AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
If I ever made a "free 2 play" game, I would ensure that if you spent a certain amount of money, probably equal to a standard triple AAA game, you would probably have 90% of the content unlocked and not need to spend anymore. I would also try to make as much stuff as possible permanent upgrades that once the player bought they had forever (if it was single player only anyway).
All of the posts since my last one have convinced me f2p is bad overall. I guess I've just been lucky for it not to effect me yet.
It doesn't have to be though. Games like Jetpack Joyride and Punch Quest handle F2P very well. Both games are perfectly playable without spending a dime and only charge you for what are essentially cheat codes and purely cosmetic items. The IAP elements are non-intrusive. The problem is that developers of F2P games are going in the other direction and shoveling out this exploitative crap like DK and Candy Crush Saga that are built around timers and bilking people out of their money instead of coming up with genuinely compelling and fun games that treat the IAP element as a secondary aspect to actual gameplay.
There is no one model of F2P that people will agree on. This is because everyone has different ideas about what they value. For instance in general Chinese mobile gamers flock to F2P games that are pay to win. This is because their idea of a good value can be summed up as if I'm paying money for something I damn well better get some advantage out of it. Trying to fund a game over there by selling pimp hats isn't going to make money. So saying one kind of F2P is better than another is just expressing what you value over what others value.
I don't think people understand the amount of metrics that many of these companies can gather. They know exactly what the players buy the most of, where they get stuck in the game, how long they play, when the play, when they stop playing, and a whole bunch of other stuff. The F2P models are tuned off of this data. They know when they charge too much and when they charge too little. They wouldn't keep using certain models if it wasn't popular with players. I have seen more than a few complaints from customer service where people are actually complaining because there is not enough stuff to buy.
I know some see this as exploiting people but I don't see how this is any different from the arcades of the past. Back then I generally stayed away from games that were coin sinks after a couple plays and frequented the games I could play longer on less money. But there were times when I happened to be flush with cash where I would splurge on whatever I wanted. I rarely regretted those decisions and usually had a lot of fun.
To be perfectly honest I don't understand why some F2P is fun for some people. I hate many of the F2P mechanics. So in general I just don't play them. But a large number of players out there eat them up. Like others on here I wish EA would have chosen another IP than Dungeon Master for a Clash of Clans style game. I have fond memories of the first two DM games. But I'm not the one spending all the money. These are being made for a different customer. It's not me, and if it's not you, we have to deal with the fact the game isn't being made for us.
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The_SpaniardIt's never lupinesIrvine, CaliforniaRegistered Userregular
I think the monocle popping over DK is a little much. I'd prefer a real sequel, sure, but the free to play version isn't taking anything from me. I play a very similar style of game (Dragonvale) and enjoy it a lot. I've been tapping away at it for about a year now and it's gentle, relaxing fun. It's ok for a thing not to be the type of thing you like.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
I think the monocle popping over DK is a little much. I'd prefer a real sequel, sure, but the free to play version isn't taking anything from me. I play a very similar style of game (Dragonvale) and enjoy it a lot. I've been tapping away at it for about a year now and it's gentle, relaxing fun. It's ok for a thing not to be the type of thing you like.
I agree that something is okay to not be a thing I (or others) want, which is how I would describe a large amount of games on iOS that use these free to play models. I don't agree that the only movement on the IP in many years being this kind of free to play game, which has nowhere near what the original games charms, mechanics or novel gameplay (and still would be novel now) is worth while. It's like how various other companies have been digging up and then more or less desecrating old IPs with games that really don't capture what makes the original series great. Just look at XCOM:EU and The Bureau, where one is an update of the original games genre to a modern era and was extremely well recieved while the other game was, well, not. Of course The Bureau is miles away better in quality and respect for the XCOM IP than this remake of Dungeon Keeper is and that's really saying something.
I think it's perfectly fine to send a strong message that rebooting IPs to simply change them into frankensteins monsters designed to exploit people into giving money is a bad idea. I honestly can't understand who thought this was ever a good idea and hopefully the backlash towards the game, which has been pretty vocal, might even get someone at EA to at least think about a proper remake. At the very least, I have encouraged as many people as possible to buy the original fantastic game from GoG for the mere $6 it will cost (with bonus complete lack of bullshit).
Again I understand that F2P games don't have to appeal to me, but as someone who loved the original games I do hope and expect they would make the same great gameplay that makes the series good. Not just ressurect the IPs corpse to do this to it, especially when it demonstrates all of the absolute worst aspects of F2P games in literally under 5 minutes of playing the game. I don't think you are less than 30 seconds into the tutorial before it begins telling you to spend money to speed things up. I'd also point out that even ignoring what it's doing to the IP, it's actually an incredibly shitty poorly balanced game in the first place (link to Touch Arcade, for a mobile gaming website that reviews DK on its merits as a game).
One thing we really want to express—and it’s something that hasn’t really been touched on in a lot of the discussion about the game that we’ve seen—is that in Dungeon Keeper, all content is accessible to paying and non-paying players. We didn’t design this as a “pay to play” or “pay to win” game. It is designed as a free-to-play title where players can commit time or money towards their play experience, and every piece of content in the game is accessible without having to spend a dime.
He argues that the game is not "Pay to Win" while omitting some details. When you go on a raid in dungeon keeper you actually lose the monsters that die permanently if they are lost. Meaning you have to buy or resummon them again. This can be a fairly arduous process. When invading, the strategy is actually simple and you had better hope you built your dungeon correctly (or you're instantly dead), which is to destroy the walls between the starting point and the heart straight off. Then use monsters like ghosts (pass through walls) and warlocks (ranged) to just instantly take it down. If you are paying for creatures, this is trivial to do, costs the non-paying gamer a considerable amount of time as you nick their resources when you win (but damage thankfully doesn't remain). He is right in a sense that non-paying gamers are on even turns, but eventually, it's easy to lose substantial amounts of progress very quickly due to a failed raid/being raided and then have to build it all back up again - while the paying player does not have this limitation or risk.
This is entirely because the actual game is shittily designed and balanced, with the destroy walls spell being upgraded to nine tiles practically wrecking any defense someone can mount instantly.
Edit: Also I can't help but notice in the comments many are saying that the game refuses to accept a 1 - 4 star rating, only properly assigning the rating if it is 5 stars. I don't know why that is, but on the NZ App store it currently has a rating of 2.5 stars with the majority being between 1-3 stars. So not sure what's going on there: Is this actually possible for them to do?
Edit2: It is in fact doing this. If you try to rate the app lower than 5 from within the actual thing, it doesn't let you rate it and opens some kind of support thing. If you rate it five it takes you to the store to post the score. This is of course easy to bypass by just going to the store and rating it there, but seriously that can't be right.
Edit3: But there is good news! Dungeon Keeper Gold has arisen from the ashes to become the number 2 best seller on GoG at the moment! Huzzah!
The_SpaniardIt's never lupinesIrvine, CaliforniaRegistered Userregular
*Absolute molten death glare at EA*
I was just excavating one of those 24 hour blocks in Dungeon Keeper and at about 12 hours left my imp glitched out and stopped digging, and would not continue until I canceled the job and re-issued it.
I see a whole lot of outrage over Dungeon Keeper when it looks for all the world like the exact same business model as Tiny Tower/Deathstar which are games people were shitting themselves to fawn over.
I'm not judging, I'm just saying I don't get the distinction. I've played them all to some degree, and it's Dungeon Keeper that actually feels like there's more "gameplay" (or at least more of a purpose) than the Tiny Whatever games, in my mind.
Tiny Tower did not have a legacy as a fun, clever strategy game. You can't disappoint on having no gameplay if you're an original IP. It's take it or leave it. Now, take your favorite game and imagine it FTP'd in this fashion.
Mario FTP:
-Mario has energy, every try at a level is 5 energy. You regain 3 energy every 30 minutes.
-The first mushroom is free, every one thereafter is 1 gem. Gems have to be bought with real money or earned. You generally earn 3 gems every 4 levels.
-Yoshi has to be bought with real money.
-There's only 3 worlds, more are marked "coming soon!"
etc
But hey, fans shouldn't be upset about this, for... reasons.
Also note, that when the talk first appeared, Kotaku ran an article about it and there was a big backlash against the speaker (comments and twitter), so he responded in anrticle that also has some of the points that were already mentioned in this discussion here: http://kotaku.com/i-am-not-a-cancer-on-the-game-industry-1208376438
I look at free-to-play consultants with the same amount of esteem as the geniuses who created "planned obsolescence". They made consumer goods worse in a way that was not required, it was simply allowed. Cars made money before they were designed to disintegrate at 20 times the rate. It's just that they make MORE money if people have to buy one way more often. A responsibly budgeted 'normal' video game CAN make money, but a game that requires cash at every player interaction can make infinite money. Suffice to say, there might be a way to convert games from a product to a service, but that way is not going to happen where the service is insert-money-for-the-chance-to-insert-more-money.exe
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webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
I don't think cars are a good example of planned obsolescence considering on the whole how much longer cars last these days compared to previous decades.
This new version of Dungeon Keeper makes me sad because now there is zero chance of ever getting a real Dungeon Keeper game ever again.
Before they made that horrible piece of shit, there was a tiny chance. Now there's none. Tiny is better than none.
For those interested in a "proper" Dungeon Keeper sequel there is War for the Overworld to look forward to.
You mean I won't have to wait 36 hours to dig out as single block of dirt?
Sadly I'm not joking.
And anyone should note if you've not tried Dungeon Keeper that it's actually worse, so much worse than this. In order to dig space for some rooms you need to have a dug a 3x3 area, which is 9 squares or larger. In order to dig that space eventually once you start filling up your dungeon you can be looking at digging that 9 squares area in hard rock or gems, with each block taking 36 hours (or more) each. This means a lot of "Dungeons" I've seen resemble large open spaces where every room is clustered around the soft dirt area (that you can actually dig) with a long tunnel going around the entire outside to link the various other rooms (this is to make attacking your dungeon as impossible as they can, assuming the attacker doesn't bring ghosts or wall destroying spells).
I also noticed there was an excellent response on Forbes to EAs defense of the game. It's a disgustingly bad free 2 play game and I feel Dungeon Keeper mobiles legacy will be being held up as the example of what not to do.
The_SpaniardIt's never lupinesIrvine, CaliforniaRegistered Userregular
GOD DAMN this game is infuriating. I just saved up all day for an upgrade, and the same glitch happened again. My one free imp won't go and apply the upgrade I just paid for. So I can either wait and hope that he eventually pulls his head out of his ass and does it, or cancel the non-moving upgrade that hasn't even begun for the cost of half of what I paid for it to begin with.
GOD DAMN this game is infuriating. I just saved up all day for an upgrade, and the same glitch happened again. My one free imp won't go and apply the upgrade I just paid for. So I can either wait and hope that he eventually pulls his head out of his ass and does it, or cancel the non-moving upgrade that hasn't even begun for the cost of half of what I paid for it to begin with.
Why are you playing that piece of shit? Why put yourself through that?
Currently playing: GW2 and TSW
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knitdanIn ur baseKillin ur guysRegistered Userregular
Welp. Bought FF6. Figured I better be willing to spend real money if I want a real game.
Now I just have to figure out how to play it.
“I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
-Indiana Solo, runner of blades
GOD DAMN this game is infuriating. I just saved up all day for an upgrade, and the same glitch happened again. My one free imp won't go and apply the upgrade I just paid for. So I can either wait and hope that he eventually pulls his head out of his ass and does it, or cancel the non-moving upgrade that hasn't even begun for the cost of half of what I paid for it to begin with.
I have limited sympathy for you, given your conscious decision to begin and continue playing that game.
I never finished Windwaker on the DS many years ago -- as I recall the reason I quit was that I couldn't stand going through the same dungeons over and over again. I can't even remember the storyline in it.
But Oceanhorn has a good story and the gameplay/visuals are very inspired by Windwaker (but Oceanhorn looks far prettier). As for Swordigo, it's a sidescroller but it just "feels" very Zelda-esque.
sweet. I am a fan of the zelda style of gameplay, but I didn't want a rehash of its story, especially not for the price. How well does it control?
Surprisingly well. You can use your thumb anywhere on the left half to move. One smart move is that they made it so that you can't fall of bridges etc so it's very forgiving.
Runs so so so silky smooth at 60 FPS on an iPad Air or iPhone 5S but my son completed it on his iPad 2 and it still played very well on that, too.
Warhammer Quest is $0.99 today, down from its usual price of $4.99.
There's also a neat puzzle game that came out recently called Threes. The presentation is pretty slick, and it's definitely an enjoyable game, though I could see it being something that entertains you for a few hours then you'll put it down never to play again.
Warhammer Quest is $0.99 today, down from its usual price of $4.99.
There's also a neat puzzle game that came out recently called Threes. The presentation is pretty slick, and it's definitely an enjoyable game, though I could see it being something that entertains you for a few hours then you'll put it down never to play again.
I disagree. Threes is something I can see myself coming back to for a long time. It has got that easy to learn, difficult to master vibe, and after every game I get that "just one more game" feeling.
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knitdanIn ur baseKillin ur guysRegistered Userregular
Posts
But seriously, go play Bridge Constructor instead. It's way better than Dungeon Keeper.
Steam: adamjnet
Yes.
How many people here who are exceptionally frustrated at what Dungeon Keeper is (or isn't, depending on your point of view) are mad about a game called Clash of Clans? Clash of Clans is actually a very similar concept to Dungeon Keeper, but it's basically a different IP and so it can do whatever the hell it wants. I find Clash of Clans the same distasteful awful F2P system that I dislike of course, but I don't care about it because it isn't anything I would notice or want to play in the first place. Dungeon Keeper is something I want to play and really want a proper update of. That's the difference.
Also Dungeon Keeper is still a wonderfully creative and fantastic game, something the industry could use more of and I personally feel we could use significantly less of this exploitive F2P bullshit.
It doesn't have to be though. Games like Jetpack Joyride and Punch Quest handle F2P very well. Both games are perfectly playable without spending a dime and only charge you for what are essentially cheat codes and purely cosmetic items. The IAP elements are non-intrusive. The problem is that developers of F2P games are going in the other direction and shoveling out this exploitative crap like DK and Candy Crush Saga that are built around timers and bilking people out of their money instead of coming up with genuinely compelling and fun games that treat the IAP element as a secondary aspect to actual gameplay.
The reason I spent anything at all is because the base game is amazing, and even though you can buy boosts you can achieve the same thing through skill and I felt a greater sense of accomplishment for doing so. It was a great game that because it was free I tried it. Once I played a bunch I threw a few bucks towards a dev I really dig.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
There is no one model of F2P that people will agree on. This is because everyone has different ideas about what they value. For instance in general Chinese mobile gamers flock to F2P games that are pay to win. This is because their idea of a good value can be summed up as if I'm paying money for something I damn well better get some advantage out of it. Trying to fund a game over there by selling pimp hats isn't going to make money. So saying one kind of F2P is better than another is just expressing what you value over what others value.
I don't think people understand the amount of metrics that many of these companies can gather. They know exactly what the players buy the most of, where they get stuck in the game, how long they play, when the play, when they stop playing, and a whole bunch of other stuff. The F2P models are tuned off of this data. They know when they charge too much and when they charge too little. They wouldn't keep using certain models if it wasn't popular with players. I have seen more than a few complaints from customer service where people are actually complaining because there is not enough stuff to buy.
I know some see this as exploiting people but I don't see how this is any different from the arcades of the past. Back then I generally stayed away from games that were coin sinks after a couple plays and frequented the games I could play longer on less money. But there were times when I happened to be flush with cash where I would splurge on whatever I wanted. I rarely regretted those decisions and usually had a lot of fun.
To be perfectly honest I don't understand why some F2P is fun for some people. I hate many of the F2P mechanics. So in general I just don't play them. But a large number of players out there eat them up. Like others on here I wish EA would have chosen another IP than Dungeon Master for a Clash of Clans style game. I have fond memories of the first two DM games. But I'm not the one spending all the money. These are being made for a different customer. It's not me, and if it's not you, we have to deal with the fact the game isn't being made for us.
I agree that something is okay to not be a thing I (or others) want, which is how I would describe a large amount of games on iOS that use these free to play models. I don't agree that the only movement on the IP in many years being this kind of free to play game, which has nowhere near what the original games charms, mechanics or novel gameplay (and still would be novel now) is worth while. It's like how various other companies have been digging up and then more or less desecrating old IPs with games that really don't capture what makes the original series great. Just look at XCOM:EU and The Bureau, where one is an update of the original games genre to a modern era and was extremely well recieved while the other game was, well, not. Of course The Bureau is miles away better in quality and respect for the XCOM IP than this remake of Dungeon Keeper is and that's really saying something.
I think it's perfectly fine to send a strong message that rebooting IPs to simply change them into frankensteins monsters designed to exploit people into giving money is a bad idea. I honestly can't understand who thought this was ever a good idea and hopefully the backlash towards the game, which has been pretty vocal, might even get someone at EA to at least think about a proper remake. At the very least, I have encouraged as many people as possible to buy the original fantastic game from GoG for the mere $6 it will cost (with bonus complete lack of bullshit).
Again I understand that F2P games don't have to appeal to me, but as someone who loved the original games I do hope and expect they would make the same great gameplay that makes the series good. Not just ressurect the IPs corpse to do this to it, especially when it demonstrates all of the absolute worst aspects of F2P games in literally under 5 minutes of playing the game. I don't think you are less than 30 seconds into the tutorial before it begins telling you to spend money to speed things up. I'd also point out that even ignoring what it's doing to the IP, it's actually an incredibly shitty poorly balanced game in the first place (link to Touch Arcade, for a mobile gaming website that reviews DK on its merits as a game).
Edit: For example let's consider their defense of the game.
He argues that the game is not "Pay to Win" while omitting some details. When you go on a raid in dungeon keeper you actually lose the monsters that die permanently if they are lost. Meaning you have to buy or resummon them again. This can be a fairly arduous process. When invading, the strategy is actually simple and you had better hope you built your dungeon correctly (or you're instantly dead), which is to destroy the walls between the starting point and the heart straight off. Then use monsters like ghosts (pass through walls) and warlocks (ranged) to just instantly take it down. If you are paying for creatures, this is trivial to do, costs the non-paying gamer a considerable amount of time as you nick their resources when you win (but damage thankfully doesn't remain). He is right in a sense that non-paying gamers are on even turns, but eventually, it's easy to lose substantial amounts of progress very quickly due to a failed raid/being raided and then have to build it all back up again - while the paying player does not have this limitation or risk.
This is entirely because the actual game is shittily designed and balanced, with the destroy walls spell being upgraded to nine tiles practically wrecking any defense someone can mount instantly.
Edit: Also I can't help but notice in the comments many are saying that the game refuses to accept a 1 - 4 star rating, only properly assigning the rating if it is 5 stars. I don't know why that is, but on the NZ App store it currently has a rating of 2.5 stars with the majority being between 1-3 stars. So not sure what's going on there: Is this actually possible for them to do?
Edit2: It is in fact doing this. If you try to rate the app lower than 5 from within the actual thing, it doesn't let you rate it and opens some kind of support thing. If you rate it five it takes you to the store to post the score. This is of course easy to bypass by just going to the store and rating it there, but seriously that can't be right.
Edit3: But there is good news! Dungeon Keeper Gold has arisen from the ashes to become the number 2 best seller on GoG at the moment! Huzzah!
I was just excavating one of those 24 hour blocks in Dungeon Keeper and at about 12 hours left my imp glitched out and stopped digging, and would not continue until I canceled the job and re-issued it.
http://www.slideshare.net/FamousAspect/super-mario-saga-redesigning-super-mario-bros-3-as-a-mobile-freetoplay Did just that. I also saw a video of his talk, but I can't find it right now.
Should be here at 21 minutes
Also note, that when the talk first appeared, Kotaku ran an article about it and there was a big backlash against the speaker (comments and twitter), so he responded in anrticle that also has some of the points that were already mentioned in this discussion here: http://kotaku.com/i-am-not-a-cancer-on-the-game-industry-1208376438
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
Before they made that horrible piece of shit, there was a tiny chance. Now there's none. Tiny is better than none.
Nope.
Darn, I finally decided to fall off the fence onto the side of purchasing it. Oh well maybe some other time.
Sadly I'm not joking.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
And anyone should note if you've not tried Dungeon Keeper that it's actually worse, so much worse than this. In order to dig space for some rooms you need to have a dug a 3x3 area, which is 9 squares or larger. In order to dig that space eventually once you start filling up your dungeon you can be looking at digging that 9 squares area in hard rock or gems, with each block taking 36 hours (or more) each. This means a lot of "Dungeons" I've seen resemble large open spaces where every room is clustered around the soft dirt area (that you can actually dig) with a long tunnel going around the entire outside to link the various other rooms (this is to make attacking your dungeon as impossible as they can, assuming the attacker doesn't bring ghosts or wall destroying spells).
I also noticed there was an excellent response on Forbes to EAs defense of the game. It's a disgustingly bad free 2 play game and I feel Dungeon Keeper mobiles legacy will be being held up as the example of what not to do.
Why are you playing that piece of shit? Why put yourself through that?
Currently playing: GW2 and TSW
Now I just have to figure out how to play it.
-Indiana Solo, runner of blades
I'm actually surprised there doesn't seem to be more buzz about it here...
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/oceanhorn/id708196645?mt=8
and... no IAPs...
Watch my music videos
Watch my music videos
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
I have limited sympathy for you, given your conscious decision to begin and continue playing that game.
I never finished Windwaker on the DS many years ago -- as I recall the reason I quit was that I couldn't stand going through the same dungeons over and over again. I can't even remember the storyline in it.
But Oceanhorn has a good story and the gameplay/visuals are very inspired by Windwaker (but Oceanhorn looks far prettier). As for Swordigo, it's a sidescroller but it just "feels" very Zelda-esque.
Watch my music videos
This is an instant buy for me even if it was $160. Pardon me, while I instantly buy this.
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
Runs so so so silky smooth at 60 FPS on an iPad Air or iPhone 5S but my son completed it on his iPad 2 and it still played very well on that, too.
Watch my music videos
There's also a neat puzzle game that came out recently called Threes. The presentation is pretty slick, and it's definitely an enjoyable game, though I could see it being something that entertains you for a few hours then you'll put it down never to play again.
3DS FC: 0817-3759-2788
I disagree. Threes is something I can see myself coming back to for a long time. It has got that easy to learn, difficult to master vibe, and after every game I get that "just one more game" feeling.
I finished it a while back, though I don't think I got 100%. There was some map bullshit that I didn't feel like trying to figure out.
-Indiana Solo, runner of blades