As was foretold, we've added advertisements to the forums! If you have questions, or if you encounter any bugs, please visit this thread: https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/240191/forum-advertisement-faq-and-reports-thread/

I should have had [chat] prepared!

16791112101

Posts

  • TraceTrace GNU Terry Pratchett; GNU Gus; GNU Carrie Fisher; GNU Adam We Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    the focus of the hippies was never really on social responsibility. it was on social freedom. i do what i want and no one can tell me different!

    all of the new deal and great society programs were passed and implemented by previous generations concerned about social responsibility.

    This is extremely uncharitable. Hippies were in the fields with Chavez and the United Farm Workers, for instance. And one of the biggest traumatic fractures in the history of the left came when the Hippies rebelled against their party leadership and came out against Vietnam. There was plenty of thought to social responsibility going on in the mix.
    (because they didn't want to go)

    Don't even touch that Spool.

  • 21stCentury21stCentury Call me Pixel, or Pix for short! [They/Them]Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    the focus of the hippies was never really on social responsibility. it was on social freedom. i do what i want and no one can tell me different!

    all of the new deal and great society programs were passed and implemented by previous generations concerned about social responsibility.

    This is extremely uncharitable. Hippies were in the fields with Chavez and the United Farm Workers, for instance. And one of the biggest traumatic fractures in the history of the left came when the Hippies rebelled against their party leadership and came out against Vietnam. There was plenty of thought to social responsibility going on in the mix.
    (because they didn't want to go)

    Oh, come on.

    That's disingenuous as all heck to call anti-war protesters hypocrites like that.

  • skippydumptruckskippydumptruck begin again Registered User regular
    god damn it I want to pierce my lip

  • CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Sometimes there is nothing better than laying around in your underwear.

    I lay around in a shirt and tie, with the collar loosened a little bit.

    I immediately assumed you mean literally nothing else.

    Just lying there bottomless.

    Feralkedinikspool32Harry Dresden
  • kedinikkedinik Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    People who have issues wearing a suit shoudl practice it until they're comfortable, because you look confident as a motherfucker and feel great when you're dressed to the nines.

    This sentence amuses me

    It doesn't matter if you don't like wearing suits! Keep wearing suits until it makes you feel great!

    That's how brains work though!

    You're happier with lower expectations, and your expectations are lower if you spend more time immersing yourself in less desirable situations.

    Be careful pushing that vague line of reasoning into justifying invasive regulation, sure, but I think it's a good way to approach life.

    I made a game! Hotline Maui. Requires mouse and keyboard.
  • KageraKagera Imitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered User regular
    Spool

    Come

    The FUCK

    on

    My neck, my back, my FUPA and my crack.
    AbdhyiusSo It Goes
  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    People who have issues wearing a suit shoudl practice it until they're comfortable, because you look confident as a motherfucker and feel great when you're dressed to the nines.

    This sentence amuses me

    It doesn't matter if you don't like wearing suits! Keep wearing suits until it makes you feel great!

    Yes.

    Practice a thing you're not comfortable with, until you are comfortable doing it.

    Learn to do some shit you don't like, and do it with style, because those activities will occupy much of your life. You might as well get complimented for your execution.

    Irond Will
  • 21stCentury21stCentury Call me Pixel, or Pix for short! [They/Them]Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Sometimes there is nothing better than laying around in your underwear.

    I lay around in a shirt and tie, with the collar loosened a little bit.

    Do you also shake hands with your children when you drop them off at school?

    sometimes!

    Oh my god...

    Spool...

    You're basically Stephen Harper...

    How do you feel about tar sands?

  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    Irond Will wrote: »
    i personally view courtesy and politeness to be democratic and subversive to a hierarchical status system. it's a system in which all people are treated with respect regardless of their economic or social class. i find it empowering that a CEO is viewed as a heel and a cad if he's rude to a caddy or waiter. i like that it's seen as rude when some rich boomer comes rolling into a nice restaurant in his polo because he's too successful and special to follow the rules and he is then made to feel out of place.

    Getting away from courtesy and going back to the suit conversation...

    I may have mentioned a few times that I take a dim view of dress codes in offices because my experience with them is that they're used as cudgels against junior employees.

    They're never enforced against the CEO - after all, who is going to enforce them? But the lower on the food chain you go, the more they are enforced.

    In the same way it is equalizing for the CEO to be polite to a waiter, it is insulting to be told that you have to wear slacks and a button down by an executive who rolls into work in a baseball cap and jeans.

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
    TL DR
  • kedinikkedinik Registered User regular
    edited March 2014
    I think it's fair to say that some hippies were motivated by ethics and others were at least significantly motivated by self-interest.

    Can't paint the whole group with a broad brush.

    kedinik on
    I made a game! Hotline Maui. Requires mouse and keyboard.
    FeralMrMister
  • Irond WillIrond Will WARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!! Cambridge. MAModerator mod
    Deebaser wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    shalmelo wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    ooh ooh i know this one

    business C is composed of individuals who refuse to be stifled and feel like things should be done their way -- these design guidelines are terrible i'm just going to make my part the way that it should be done. this policy doesn't make sense to me; i'm just going to ignore it. my boss wants me to work on project A but honestly i am way better suited and more interested on project B so that is what i am going to do.

    I have to say, Will, a lot of what you're saying seems motivated by a hardcore hate boner for fucking disreputable hippies. It's like you're fighting a culture war out of time. Which is fine, I guess, I mean I'm still siding with the Communists, if we want to compare who's tilting at older windmills. But I grew up in what is by all lights about as hippy an environment as they come (the lovely Ojai, California, known for its moon cults). And despite its various excesses--let's not get into the state of the science education provided by people who sincerely believe in healing crystals--I think that in terms of its values it was great.

    I mean, here's an opposing anecdote. Recently I was playing 7 wonders with a bunch of people. Normally when we play we just add up our scores by ourselves at the end. But the dude who brought the game, this time, absolutely insisted that instead of doing that we all use the little score sheet that came with the game. It took about four times as long, and involved us all awkwardly sitting around reading out sub-portions of our score (7 points from red...) while he scribbled them down. It was So. Dumb. But he had to do it! Because--there was a sheet! That's what it was for. What--were we just going to not use the sheet?

    He had a similar fit when some people wanted to trade in their wonders for new ones they hadn't tried before. He was like: oh, well they're supposed to be random. It's only the rules.

    Yeah, well sometimes the rules are dumb, and we can think about what works for or against people instead.

    i mean i am not championing all rules for their own sake

    but i do think the modern american ethic of radical individualism is harmful. i'm not a communist but i do believe in communitarianism - we all exist in society and need to understand and be mindful of who we are from the perspectives of other people and our various society as a whole.

    we need to be a good son and a good brother and a good neighbor and a good colleague and a good citizen.

    and part of that means that we follow social rules that we didn't independently invent sometimes. we don't pick our noses at the table and we don't spit on the street and we take off our hats indoors and we say please and thank you and we shower at least once a week and we don't wear our larp gear to a funeral.

    and maybe it feels like i'm some kind of 1960s square revanchist, but i don't think that the continuing lessons of the hippie movement has really done our culture any favors

    I agree with almost all of this, but being expected to wear a suit every goddamn day of your life is still a dumb relic of an age dedicated to protecting society from everything different (different in this case generally meaning non-white and non-male), and I'm glad that the custom is dying out in most areas of American society. Every man should own a suit or two and know how to wear them - I'm totally down with that. But the days of it being mandatory workwear for most of the culture cannot go away fast enough.

    There is nothing whatsoever about wearing a suit that smacks of racism, at any point of US history that I'm aware of.

    In fact, they were ubiquitous during civil rights marches.

    a poor man in a cheap suit and tie

    is a man in a suit and tie

    Wqdwp8l.png
    Deebaserspool32Abdhyius
  • DeebaserDeebaser on my way to work in a suit and a tie Ahhhh...come on fucking guyRegistered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    Kana wrote: »
    People who have issues wearing a suit shoudl practice it until they're comfortable, because you look confident as a motherfucker and feel great when you're dressed to the nines.

    This sentence amuses me

    It doesn't matter if you don't like wearing suits! Keep wearing suits until it makes you feel great!

    Yes.

    Practice a thing you're not comfortable with, until you are comfortable doing it.

    Learn to do some shit you don't like, and do it with style, because those activities will occupy much of your life. You might as well get complimented for your execution.

    Nah. Im most comfortable in sweatpants. I think i'll rock them 5 ever.

  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Sometimes there is nothing better than laying around in your underwear.

    I lay around in a shirt and tie, with the collar loosened a little bit.

    Do you also shake hands with your children when you drop them off at school?

    excel in your studies today, child32, that the lord may not turn his face from thee

    *whip cracks, buggy takes off*

    "Yes sir!"

  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    Casual wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Sometimes there is nothing better than laying around in your underwear.

    I lay around in a shirt and tie, with the collar loosened a little bit.

    I immediately assumed you mean literally nothing else.

    Just lying there bottomless.

    just like my xbox live avatar

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    the focus of the hippies was never really on social responsibility. it was on social freedom. i do what i want and no one can tell me different!

    all of the new deal and great society programs were passed and implemented by previous generations concerned about social responsibility.

    This is extremely uncharitable. Hippies were in the fields with Chavez and the United Farm Workers, for instance. And one of the biggest traumatic fractures in the history of the left came when the Hippies rebelled against their party leadership and came out against Vietnam. There was plenty of thought to social responsibility going on in the mix.
    (because they didn't want to go)

    Oh, come on.

    That's disingenuous as all heck to call anti-war protesters hypocrites like that.

    I make no judgment about the reasoning behind that desire, or whether it extended to their fellows.

  • japanjapan Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    the focus of the hippies was never really on social responsibility. it was on social freedom. i do what i want and no one can tell me different!

    all of the new deal and great society programs were passed and implemented by previous generations concerned about social responsibility.

    This is extremely uncharitable. Hippies were in the fields with Chavez and the United Farm Workers, for instance. And one of the biggest traumatic fractures in the history of the left came when the Hippies rebelled against their party leadership and came out against Vietnam. There was plenty of thought to social responsibility going on in the mix.
    (because they didn't want to go)

    Of course they didn't

    Why would anyone

    Feralspool32CasualHarry DresdenMrMisterTL DRSo It Goes
  • LudiousLudious I just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered User regular
    about 50% of chat is annoying the fuck out of me right now, my list is about to become a matrix

    Feral
  • KageraKagera Imitating the worst people. Since 2004Registered User regular
    Man all those rich and powerful people who were called out and disgraced by some social faux pas really makes you think.

    Like...

    My neck, my back, my FUPA and my crack.
  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    Yeah, self-interest and hypocrisy aren't the same thing.

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
    Mazzyxspool32MrMisterkedinik
  • CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    How dare you not want to go fight in a war that you consider to be a terrible war. Shut up and die for wars you don't believe in like everybody else!

    21stCenturyMrMister
  • kedinikkedinik Registered User regular
    Ludious wrote: »
    about 50% of chat is annoying the fuck out of me right now, my list is about to become a matrix

    Sounds like someone's got a case of The Mondays!

    I made a game! Hotline Maui. Requires mouse and keyboard.
    spool32DeebaserZampanov
  • TavTav Registered User regular
    Some of the ideas in here at the minute are pretty disgusting and I really hope I never start believing in them.

    FeralShivahnSo It Goes
  • Donkey KongDonkey Kong You wouldn't right click a car Registered User regular
    @skippydumptruck If you really think you like CS and you will for real stick with this online degree program, then I say go for it. The biggest risk with online degrees is not that no one will take your credentials seriously at the end, it's that the dropout rates are crazy high. So stick with it and you are mostly set!

    Thousands of hot, local singles are waiting to play at bubbulon.com.
    skippydumptruckkedinik
  • LudiousLudious I just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered User regular
    kedinik wrote: »
    Ludious wrote: »
    about 50% of chat is annoying the fuck out of me right now, my list is about to become a matrix

    Sounds like someone's got a case of The Mondays!

    You're about to have a case of the Shun Days

    I am going to Shun you for Days

  • MrMisterMrMister Jesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    the focus of the hippies was never really on social responsibility. it was on social freedom. i do what i want and no one can tell me different!

    all of the new deal and great society programs were passed and implemented by previous generations concerned about social responsibility.

    This is extremely uncharitable. Hippies were in the fields with Chavez and the United Farm Workers, for instance. And one of the biggest traumatic fractures in the history of the left came when the Hippies rebelled against their party leadership and came out against Vietnam. There was plenty of thought to social responsibility going on in the mix.
    (because they didn't want to go)

    For some, that was the reason. For others not. Those girls putting flowers in the guns at Kent State were in no danger of getting drafted. But they didn't want a war. It's not an accident that the insignia we most associate with hippies is a "peace sign."

    Hippies also demanded more corporate accountability, especially toward the environment (alongside individual action, e.g. composting, recycling). Sometimes we also forget how bad the environment of the time was.

    They were also anti-racists and strong supporters of the civil rights movement.

    For any individual person, they may have been an asshole, or just in it for the free love, or trying to dodge the draft because scary, or whatever. But to claim that the hippy movement as a whole had no social conscience, or that it was intolerably selfish in its orientation, is... at the very best a gross oversimplification.

    Feral21stCenturySo It Goeskedinik
  • FeralFeral MEMETICHARIZARD interior crocodile alligator ⇔ ǝɹʇɐǝɥʇ ǝᴉʌoɯ ʇǝloɹʌǝɥɔ ɐ ǝʌᴉɹp ᴉRegistered User regular
    Tav wrote: »
    Some of the ideas in here at the minute are pretty disgusting

    hey, don't shame spool32's bottomlessness like that

    every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.

    the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
    spool32
  • TehSlothTehSloth Hit Or Miss I Guess They Never Miss, HuhRegistered User regular
    edited March 2014
    TehSloth wrote: »
    if I become a software developer can I show my tattoos

    can I get my lip pierced

    can I wear jeans and a t shirt

    depends very much on where you work, a couple guys I work with have a bunch of tattoos (neck even!) although one of them is like a team lead now so he dresses up a bit but used to just wear like shorts and t-shirts. The last company I worked at was much bigger and I can only remember one person with a tattoo which was just a super boring Euler's Identity on his arm.

    >:[

    Just focus on more.... hip... I guess languages and stuff and you're more likely to fall in with the business you're looking for is how I've seen it. From places I've worked and interviewed at you could definitely see a different culture depending on what they were doing. Places doing web stuff and big into OSS and ruby and scala (gross) tended to have a much more liberal atmosphere. Like, I was in a big stuffy office with people in suits when I was interviewing with Aon Hewitt and AAA (half of my interview with AAA was going into a cubicle and taken a written test, it was the worst) for doing some weird old database stuff but I remember interviewing with a guy at some other small company that had a broken chain or something tattooed on his wrist who was like, "so let's talk about MVC".

    TehSloth on
    FC: 1993-7778-8872 PSN: TehSloth Xbox: SlothTeh
    twitch.tv/tehsloth
  • skippydumptruckskippydumptruck begin again Registered User regular
    @skippydumptruck If you really think you like CS and you will for real stick with this online degree program, then I say go for it. The biggest risk with online degrees is not that no one will take your credentials seriously at the end, it's that the dropout rates are crazy high. So stick with it and you are mostly set!

    huh

    I wonder if that is true for people who are paying their own way

    if I drop 25k on dis shit best believe I am getting a credential, even if I have to stretch it to 2 years because it's too hard to juggle with work/new baby or whatever

  • TL DRTL DR Not at all confident in his reflexive opinions of thingsRegistered User regular
    spool32 wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Sometimes there is nothing better than laying around in your underwear.

    I lay around in a shirt and tie, with the collar loosened a little bit.

    spool32
  • Irond WillIrond Will WARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!! Cambridge. MAModerator mod
    TL DR wrote: »
    Will, it is exhausting to read you go on about "kids these days" circa 1969 as though the entire counterculture movement of the time including the anti-war, environmentalism, and civil rights groups can be successfully reduced to 'lol hippies'.

    man.

    the boomers of the hippie movement were the blurst

    they agitated for power to be redirected when they didn't have it. screamed and shouted and marched and demanded.

    but then when they achieved power, they gave us reaganomics

    pulled that ladder right up

    but never stopped bloviating about their social conscience and about how they "really made a difference" back in their youth

    Wqdwp8l.png
  • DemonStaceyDemonStacey TTODewback's Daughter In love with the TaySwayRegistered User regular
    god damn it I want to pierce my lip

    Where did this come from sir Skippington?

  • CasualCasual Wiggle Wiggle Wiggle Flap Flap Flap Registered User regular
    japan wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    the focus of the hippies was never really on social responsibility. it was on social freedom. i do what i want and no one can tell me different!

    all of the new deal and great society programs were passed and implemented by previous generations concerned about social responsibility.

    This is extremely uncharitable. Hippies were in the fields with Chavez and the United Farm Workers, for instance. And one of the biggest traumatic fractures in the history of the left came when the Hippies rebelled against their party leadership and came out against Vietnam. There was plenty of thought to social responsibility going on in the mix.
    (because they didn't want to go)

    Of course they didn't

    Why would anyone

    Yeah not seeing the problem there. Vietnam was both pointless and particularly bloody. Something like 60k Americans died, I think "fuck that noise" is a perfectly valid reaction.

  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    edited March 2014
    Kagera wrote: »
    Man all those rich and powerful people who were called out and disgraced by some social faux pas really makes you think.

    Like...

    Donald Trump.

    Harry Dresden on
  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    if I become a software developer can I show my tattoos

    can I get my lip pierced

    can I wear jeans and a t shirt

    Ugh do not get your lip peirced

    TehSloth
  • spool32spool32 Contrary Library Registered User regular
    @skippydumptruck If you really think you like CS and you will for real stick with this online degree program, then I say go for it. The biggest risk with online degrees is not that no one will take your credentials seriously at the end, it's that the dropout rates are crazy high. So stick with it and you are mostly set!

    If you get a degree from a real university, through their online system, you're not really obligated to put "online" on your resume next to the name of the University are you?

    Feral
  • LudiousLudious I just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered User regular
    edited March 2014
    @syndalis @deebaser @Feral‌
    Guys my wife is having a problem with a thing at work and I do not know Excel or database stuff because I am dumb. Can you answer this possibly?
    Our department has around 160 spreadsheets uploaded to various directories on sharepoint - more are added sporadically as new projects come through each month. Each spreadsheet is updated by users at various times in the month.



    There are column names going from A to AA. The column types are varied; dates, dollar amounts, a comments field, y/n field, etc. Several of the columns contain formulas. Each spreadsheet is populated with a varying number of rows. Some have only 1 row, a few have as many as 5k, but the average is probably under 200 rows.



    I need to be able to pull the rows with data in them from all 160(ish) spreadsheets in to one source so that reports can be created based on the most up to date data. I’m limited to using excel and access. The varying number of rows makes excel problematic, at least with what I know about excel. I don’t have much experience doing linked tables in access so I’m not sure if that could even work with the large number of sources.



    What would be the best way to combine the data in to one source?

    Ludious on
  • ThomamelasThomamelas Only one man can kill this many Russians. Bring his guitar to me! Registered User regular
    Irond Will wrote: »
    Thomamelas wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    Feral wrote: »
    That photo is not at all typical of the era.

    It definitely was not a Thing(tm) for blue collar workers to wear ties and vests to a factory floor in the 1920s.

    My guess is that either that workplace environment was unusual or (more likely) the workers were told by management to dress up for photo day.

    it wasn't always ties, true. for one thing, ties can be a safety liability.

    but looking at photographs of people at work at factories or poor people out on the town you don't really see a great deal of difference between the way poor people dressed and the way rich people dressed - it tended to be button-up shirts jackets, vests, hats, sometimes ties, etc. i mean clearly the rich people had finer, fancier clothes, but the actual structure of dress was real similar.

    at some point between the 20s and 60s this proletarian ethic that poor people should dress in solidarity with their social class sort of spread and created the views we have today. i think it's a crummy ethic and i think it's mostly limiting to poor people who have been sold the idea that they're somehow selling out if they wear a tie to a job interview.

    Just as Feral was wrong about the factory, you're being pretty wrong here. There is a world of difference between the suits those workers are wearing and what their bosses would have been wearing. There wasn't a uniformity of appearance during the periods you mentioned.

    a few years ago when the vintage thing was really driving a lot of fashion designs i bought a couple of j crew jackets that were essentially rebuilt french work jackets from the 30s or so. they don't look exactly like modern sportcoats, of course, but they look more like modern sportcoats than anything else contemporary.

    and i mean i guess for the time, those workcoats looked far different from suit jackets, but the difference between the two is far less than, say, the difference between a suit jacket and a sports jersey or muscle tee.

    It's been pointed out that there were limitations in terms of fabrics for how you can cut things and have them hang. But it did make the small differences matter quite a bit. It's less apparent to our eyes but it mattered very much then. The variations of a tailcoat for instance. Or the collars of the shirts those young boys are wearing. The Edwardian era up to WWII had a great deal of restraint in men's fashions but the idea the social classes dressed alike or in a manner to make themselves indistinguishable is wrong to the point of fallacy. And even then there was a trend towards more casual clothing as improvements in manufacturing progressed. The Tuxedo ended up replacing the much more formal evening dress of the period.

    MrMisterKana
  • Donkey KongDonkey Kong You wouldn't right click a car Registered User regular
    edited March 2014
    I just got an email from my boss. It contained the subject line: "your upcoming travel dates". It might as well have been

    From: Kevin Spacey
    To: Brad Pitt
    Subject: Re: contents of the box

    Donkey Kong on
    Thousands of hot, local singles are waiting to play at bubbulon.com.
    DeebaserMrMisterspool32ElkiBogartDark Raven XZampanov
  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    edited March 2014
    Irond Will wrote: »
    Deebaser wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    shalmelo wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    MrMister wrote: »
    Irond Will wrote: »
    ooh ooh i know this one

    business C is composed of individuals who refuse to be stifled and feel like things should be done their way -- these design guidelines are terrible i'm just going to make my part the way that it should be done. this policy doesn't make sense to me; i'm just going to ignore it. my boss wants me to work on project A but honestly i am way better suited and more interested on project B so that is what i am going to do.

    I have to say, Will, a lot of what you're saying seems motivated by a hardcore hate boner for fucking disreputable hippies. It's like you're fighting a culture war out of time. Which is fine, I guess, I mean I'm still siding with the Communists, if we want to compare who's tilting at older windmills. But I grew up in what is by all lights about as hippy an environment as they come (the lovely Ojai, California, known for its moon cults). And despite its various excesses--let's not get into the state of the science education provided by people who sincerely believe in healing crystals--I think that in terms of its values it was great.

    I mean, here's an opposing anecdote. Recently I was playing 7 wonders with a bunch of people. Normally when we play we just add up our scores by ourselves at the end. But the dude who brought the game, this time, absolutely insisted that instead of doing that we all use the little score sheet that came with the game. It took about four times as long, and involved us all awkwardly sitting around reading out sub-portions of our score (7 points from red...) while he scribbled them down. It was So. Dumb. But he had to do it! Because--there was a sheet! That's what it was for. What--were we just going to not use the sheet?

    He had a similar fit when some people wanted to trade in their wonders for new ones they hadn't tried before. He was like: oh, well they're supposed to be random. It's only the rules.

    Yeah, well sometimes the rules are dumb, and we can think about what works for or against people instead.

    i mean i am not championing all rules for their own sake

    but i do think the modern american ethic of radical individualism is harmful. i'm not a communist but i do believe in communitarianism - we all exist in society and need to understand and be mindful of who we are from the perspectives of other people and our various society as a whole.

    we need to be a good son and a good brother and a good neighbor and a good colleague and a good citizen.

    and part of that means that we follow social rules that we didn't independently invent sometimes. we don't pick our noses at the table and we don't spit on the street and we take off our hats indoors and we say please and thank you and we shower at least once a week and we don't wear our larp gear to a funeral.

    and maybe it feels like i'm some kind of 1960s square revanchist, but i don't think that the continuing lessons of the hippie movement has really done our culture any favors

    I agree with almost all of this, but being expected to wear a suit every goddamn day of your life is still a dumb relic of an age dedicated to protecting society from everything different (different in this case generally meaning non-white and non-male), and I'm glad that the custom is dying out in most areas of American society. Every man should own a suit or two and know how to wear them - I'm totally down with that. But the days of it being mandatory workwear for most of the culture cannot go away fast enough.

    There is nothing whatsoever about wearing a suit that smacks of racism, at any point of US history that I'm aware of.

    In fact, they were ubiquitous during civil rights marches.

    a poor man in a cheap suit and tie

    is a man in a suit and tie

    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Toffs-And-Toughs-001.jpg

    Just to requote this again for the illustration, it's important to remember that people didn't all wear wool suits all the time because everyone was so damn classy

    That's just how clothes were usually. You have a few undershirts and then one or two jackets, and you wear the suit all the time because there's way less heating and it's cold!

    Those poor kids look surprisingly classy to our eyes today, but that doesn't mean that they were dressed classy for their time, or most importantly that they would have looked classy to their contemporaries.

    One of the changes from our modern clothing industry is that now people wear lots of generally low-price clothes, whereas back in the day guys would just wear the same two jackets for years, and there wasn't much variety to pick from unless you were rich. That's different from 'taking pride in how you look'

    Kana on
    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
    Feral
  • TavTav Registered User regular
    Hey Skippy, what sort of help does the online course offer? There are a lot of things in comp sci that I needed people to sit down and explain to me and I dunno if people online could replicate that.

This discussion has been closed.