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The Fall of [Chat]

ThomamelasThomamelas Only one man can kill this many Russians. Bring his guitar to me! Registered User regular
edited March 2014 in Debate and/or Discourse
So Operation Frequent Wind. First thing that needs to be said about it is that fart jokes shouldn't be used as actual operational names. Seriously.

With the NVA heading towards Saigon, it became clear that there were going to be some issues getting the remaining Americans out of the country. So Task Force 76 was assembled and sent off the coast of Vietnam. It consisted mostly of amphibious assault ships designed to ferry Marines on and off a beach via helicopter. Joining them were the USS Hancock, the USS Midway and Task Force 73 to provide naval and air support. As Tan Son Nhut came under artillery fire on the 28th of April, the helicopters of Task Force 76 took off to begin to evacuate US staff from the Defense Attache Office compound and the US Embassy. In the planner's minds this would be a nice simple helicopter rescue. Things didn't go according to plan. The DAO was emptied pretty quickly and went mostly according to plan right up until the last convoy of buses arrived. A fire fight broke out between members of an ARVN unit which caught the last buss in the crossfire and the ARVN refused entrance of the group at gunpoint.

There was a brief diplomatic exchange in which the local commander of the US Forces pointed out that while it was the still the country of South Vietnam and the ARVN did have jurisdiction, if they were going to use the ancient theory of might makes right then perhaps he might want to count how many Cobra gunships the Americans had (5) and how many gunships the ARVN commander had access to (0). Unlike most diplomatic exchanges it ended pretty quickly and the DAO and it's support staff cleared out of Tan Son Nhut by the 29th. They were airlifted by a combination of Marine Helicopters and Air America choppers.

The US Embassy on the other hand was more problematic. They had set up a code phrase and song combination on Armed Forces Radio to let people know to evacuate. When people heard that the temperature in Saigon was 112 degrees and then heard I'm Dreaming of a White Christmas it was time to head to the US Embassy. Which is a fine plan on paper but when you give this instruction to 2500 people, the odds of them keeping it a secret is next to non-existent. This triggered a panic and by the morning of the 29th, there were 10,000 people waiting outside the embassy. Evacuations moved fairly quickly with a helicopter landing every 10 minutes or so. By 4:30 am on the 30th the gates of the Embassy had fallen with the remaining Marines and staff having withdrawn to the Chancery, then gating the stairwell to keep people from swarming the LZ on the roof. By 7:30 am the last of the Marines were on board the last flight from Embassy. By 11:30 am tanks rolled into the Presidential Compound and South Vietnam ceased to exist.

Marine helicopters making 682 trips managed to evacuate over 7,000 Americans, South Vietnamese and other 3rd party nationals. It was a truly staggering effort, with pretty much every safety regulation ignored. But even with that only two deaths occurred, both pilots. But it's really only part of the story. While the Marines were flying people out, so was just about every other helicopter in South Vietnam. The Helicopter landing craft, the aircraft carriers, and really any platform a pilot could land on was called into service. There were more helicopters then places to land.

i0lRpEQ.jpg

45 Hueys, and 1 Chinook were pushed off the sides of ships to make room. Other helicopters dropped off passengers and ditched at sea with all of the pilots recovered. Most of the estimates for the number of helicopters that ditched that way are between 100 to 150. Two pilot managed to land a Cessna on the decks of two of the aircraft carriers.

A9uBqTc.jpg

But it wasn't complete. At the US embassy alone it's estimated that 400 people slated for evacuation were left behind. And the evacuation left us with one of the most iconic images of the whole Vietnam conflict.

JKSl9N6.jpg

This is an Air America Flight landing at the Pittman Apartments. It's commonly misidentified as the US Embassy.

In the end, over 100,000 people were evacuated from South Vietnam. Most of them ended up at Camp Pendleton here:

ASuGFYr.jpg

Thomamelas on
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  • KalkinoKalkino Buttons Londres Registered User regular
    Twitter has been banned in Turkey! So illiberal !

    Freedom for the Northern Isles!
    surrealitycheck
  • ThomamelasThomamelas Only one man can kill this many Russians. Bring his guitar to me! Registered User regular
    Also to go with the history above:
    myself wrote:
    In 1975 it was pretty clear that the North Vietnamese were going to take Saigon and win the Vietnam War. The US Military had completely withdrawn years earlier and the only thing that seemed to slow the NVA down was a desire to not outrun their own supply lines. There had been a massive evacuation of war orphans and it became clear that many left behind would be subject to reprisals. This was the problem that faced Al Topping who was the head of the Saigon Pan Am office. The locals working for him were considered likely to suffer at the hands of the invading forces. So he began to gather a list of employees and some others that the State Department request be on the flight. As part of this, he offered his staff the chance to bring their immediate family. Which ended up being a bit larger then he expected. The flight could hold 300 or so people. He had a list of 500. He managed to get the list trimmed down but by the time he did, the FAA had declared the area a war zone and wouldn't allow commercial flights in or out. This wasn't an absurd concern. One of the airlift flights for Operation Babylift had crashed after an explosion suspected of being anti-aircraft fire had torn it's back door off.

    Tense talks with the Pan Am home office managed to secure permission for one flight in. But the local commander of Tan Son Nhut was refusing to allow any South Vietnamese nationals onto the base and the plane. During the evacuation of Da Ning, the World Airways flights taking off had had people still trying to board them even as the aircraft taxied. So Al Topping paid off a South Vietnamese official to allow him to adopt all of the local staff and their families. This got him enough room to be able to get the four buses of staff and families onto the airbase. But that wasn't enough to get the airplane off the ground. The head of the airbase had demanded a massive bribe, and was handed a leather satchel full of cash on the tarmac.

    When Flight #841 to Manila from Saigon took off, it had 463 people on board. It was laid out to support 375. The FAA had given extraordinary permission for people to sit in the aisle and stand during the flight. That was the last US Airline flight out of Saigon. Within 48 hours the shelling of the city began and the final military evacuation was underway. Perhaps I'll write up Operation Frequent Wind in another post.

  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary The softer edge of the universe.Registered User regular
    Speaking of falling:

    AAC3B5B0DB8F12CAAC4A405C71CEDA408E246207

    Jenlyns here got a bit funny in the head and I had to give him a good savaging in my shiny new paladin armor. He fell over pretty hard when I whacked him over the head with my shield the seventh time. I got a buddy taking him back to Ul'dah now to get cleaned up.

    488W936.png
  • knitdanknitdan Oh no Too much hunnyRegistered User regular
    It appears Iran is building a fake aircraft carrier for some unknown purpose.

    nytimes.com/2014/03/21/world/middleeast/a-ship-being-built-in-iran-looks-awfully-familiar-to-the-us.html?_r=0

    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    I have been talking to this girl on and off for a few weeks now and she really likes me, and I think she's pretty cool, but she is in a poly arrangement with her roommates and apparently every single thing we talk about has been one over by them and feedback has been offered. "Oh, I think he's blah blah blah." "Well, I think he's (foo)." Sometimes in real time when I thought we were alone.

    I am not really sure I like having my shit open for community review. I am not a signatory to their articles of hippie confederation!

  • ThomamelasThomamelas Only one man can kill this many Russians. Bring his guitar to me! Registered User regular
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    I have been talking to this girl on and off for a few weeks now and she really likes me, and I think she's pretty cool, but she is in a poly arrangement with her roommates and apparently every single thing we talk about has been one over by them and feedback has been offered. "Oh, I think he's blah blah blah." "Well, I think he's (foo)." Sometimes in real time when I thought we were alone.

    I am not really sure I like having my shit open for community review. I am not a signatory to their articles of hippie confederation!

    Try explaining it to her? I did that with Leigh about over sharing our sex life with her mother. I mean it didn't seem to help but at least I said something.

  • bloodyroarxxbloodyroarxx Registered User regular
    just had the strangest craving for french toast

    Yeah man, I tell ya what, man, that dang ol' internet, man, you just go in on there and point and click, talk about w-w-dot-w-com, mean you got the naked chicks on there, man, just go click, click, click, click, click, it's real easy, man.
  • ElldrenElldren Is a woman dammit I'm a good person yes it's trueRegistered User regular
    just had the strangest craving for french toast

    thats not strange at all!

    fuck gendered marketing
    ronyaDeebaserPLA
  • knitdanknitdan Oh no Too much hunnyRegistered User regular
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    I have been talking to this girl on and off for a few weeks now and she really likes me, and I think she's pretty cool, but she is in a poly arrangement with her roommates and apparently every single thing we talk about has been one over by them and feedback has been offered. "Oh, I think he's blah blah blah." "Well, I think he's (foo)." Sometimes in real time when I thought we were alone.

    I am not really sure I like having my shit open for community review. I am not a signatory to their articles of hippie confederation!

    Post everything she says in [chat] so you can both "enjoy the benefit" of community review.

    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
    KalkinosurrealitycheckKanaFeral
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    Thomamelas wrote: »
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    I have been talking to this girl on and off for a few weeks now and she really likes me, and I think she's pretty cool, but she is in a poly arrangement with her roommates and apparently every single thing we talk about has been one over by them and feedback has been offered. "Oh, I think he's blah blah blah." "Well, I think he's (foo)." Sometimes in real time when I thought we were alone.

    I am not really sure I like having my shit open for community review. I am not a signatory to their articles of hippie confederation!

    Try explaining it to her? I did that with Leigh about over sharing our sex life with her mother. I mean it didn't seem to help but at least I said something.

    Yeah, I need to address that. Apparently she hasn't been in a relationship outside their little trio for like ten years so I imagine that maybe there is an element of just it never even occurred to her.

    Feral
  • CorehealerCorehealer The Apothecary The softer edge of the universe.Registered User regular
    just had the strangest craving for french toast

    Délicieux.

    488W936.png
  • bloodyroarxxbloodyroarxx Registered User regular
    Jacob that's umm quite a thing.

    Actually it's downright awkward and rude.

    Yeah man, I tell ya what, man, that dang ol' internet, man, you just go in on there and point and click, talk about w-w-dot-w-com, mean you got the naked chicks on there, man, just go click, click, click, click, click, it's real easy, man.
  • TavTav Registered User regular


    kinda disappointed this chat isn't about the post-hardcore band The Fall Of Troy

  • kedinikkedinik Registered User regular
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    I have been talking to this girl on and off for a few weeks now and she really likes me, and I think she's pretty cool, but she is in a poly arrangement with her roommates and apparently every single thing we talk about has been one over by them and feedback has been offered. "Oh, I think he's blah blah blah." "Well, I think he's (foo)." Sometimes in real time when I thought we were alone.

    I am not really sure I like having my shit open for community review. I am not a signatory to their articles of hippie confederation!

    Unfortunately, IIRC, hippies deem an expression of romantic interest as constructive consent to Hippie Confederation jurisdiction.

  • TavTav Registered User regular
    pVHMQGi.jpg

    Patton Oswalt in sixth grade at the D&D club. He's the one holding the manual, in case it wasn't obvious.

    @Elendil‌

    JacobkoshCorehealerBogartbloodyroarxxElldrenKageraDelmainZampanovevilbob
  • ThomamelasThomamelas Only one man can kill this many Russians. Bring his guitar to me! Registered User regular
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    Thomamelas wrote: »
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    I have been talking to this girl on and off for a few weeks now and she really likes me, and I think she's pretty cool, but she is in a poly arrangement with her roommates and apparently every single thing we talk about has been one over by them and feedback has been offered. "Oh, I think he's blah blah blah." "Well, I think he's (foo)." Sometimes in real time when I thought we were alone.

    I am not really sure I like having my shit open for community review. I am not a signatory to their articles of hippie confederation!

    Try explaining it to her? I did that with Leigh about over sharing our sex life with her mother. I mean it didn't seem to help but at least I said something.

    Yeah, I need to address that. Apparently she hasn't been in a relationship outside their little trio for like ten years so I imagine that maybe there is an element of just it never even occurred to her.

    Quite likely.

    ElldrenShivahnFeral
  • KalkinoKalkino Buttons Londres Registered User regular
    Bacon and egg is the solution

    Freedom for the Northern Isles!
  • ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    I wonder what South Vietnam would be like today if it had held out.

    aRkpc.gif
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    So the new Captain America film is getting very positive reviews. And Kate Bush is doing some live shows for the first time in about three decades. And I am thinking of taking the afternoon off to mooch around town doing as little as possible while sipping beer.

    More news as it arrives.

    surrealitycheck
  • JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    Bogart wrote: »
    So the new Captain America film is getting very positive reviews. And Kate Bush is doing some live shows for the first time in about three decades. And I am thinking of taking the afternoon off to mooch around town doing as little as possible while sipping beer.

    More news as it arrives.

    This is all excellent news.

    kedinikBogartBobCesca
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Jacobkosh wrote: »
    I have been talking to this girl on and off for a few weeks now and she really likes me, and I think she's pretty cool, but she is in a poly arrangement with her roommates and apparently every single thing we talk about has been one over by them and feedback has been offered. "Oh, I think he's blah blah blah." "Well, I think he's (foo)." Sometimes in real time when I thought we were alone.

    I am not really sure I like having my shit open for community review. I am not a signatory to their articles of hippie confederation!

    Bypass all this and just show her your cock.

    JacobkoshTavKagerajakobaggerKanaFeral
  • Mojo_JojoMojo_Jojo But do you really believe him? Registered User regular
    Bogart wrote: »
    So the new Captain America film is getting very positive reviews. And Kate Bush is doing some live shows for the first time in about three decades. And I am thinking of taking the afternoon off to mooch around town doing as little as possible while sipping beer.

    More news as it arrives.

    I'm glad the Captain America film is doing well. The first one was about as good as it could have been given the obsession with origin stories in favour of interesting stories. Free of that, I can see it being good.

    I'll be spending most of the day sitting on a plane. Hopefully drinking.

    Homogeneous distribution of your varieties of amuse-gueule
  • PodlyPodly you unzipped me! it's all coming back! i don't like it!Registered User regular
    @Thomamelas‌ nobody cares about your boring history lesson

    because I just got a better history lesson

    @desc adam x set all vinyl nothing before like 1998

    dem energy flash remixes

    it's like my jeans magically flared out from my ankles to unimaginably wide circumferences


    ....


    also

    @Evil Multifarious‌ that article is amazing

    also also

    i may have drank a lot of powers

    just roll with it

    follow my music twitter soundcloud tumblr
    9pr1GIh.jpg?1
    surrealitycheck
  • KalkinoKalkino Buttons Londres Registered User regular
    ronya wrote: »
    I wonder what South Vietnam would be like today if it had held out.

    Lazy counter factual time!

    Just like South Korea but with more baguettes

    Freedom for the Northern Isles!
  • KalkinoKalkino Buttons Londres Registered User regular
    It seems my tablet decided to play a podcast via the speakers for at least part of my train journey today, while I obliviously listened to music on my phone. This would explain why people were giving me funny looks

    Freedom for the Northern Isles!
    Mojo_Jojoronyajakobagger
  • PodlyPodly you unzipped me! it's all coming back! i don't like it!Registered User regular
    also @Evil Multifarious‌ i like how they set a clear demarcation between black metal and doom metal and when the body comes on the playlist the authenticity of the evening is sullied because how dare the restaurant try to sully a black metal epicurean experience with that slow tempo trash!!!!!!!

    @Tav‌ ^^^

    follow my music twitter soundcloud tumblr
    9pr1GIh.jpg?1
    Evil Multifarious
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Mojo_Jojo wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    So the new Captain America film is getting very positive reviews. And Kate Bush is doing some live shows for the first time in about three decades. And I am thinking of taking the afternoon off to mooch around town doing as little as possible while sipping beer.

    More news as it arrives.

    I'm glad the Captain America film is doing well. The first one was about as good as it could have been given the obsession with origin stories in favour of interesting stories. Free of that, I can see it being good.

    I'll be spending most of the day sitting on a plane. Hopefully drinking.

    The origin story was the GOOD part of the film.

    Captain America's problem was it spent the last half of the movie quickly setting up The Avengers rather then being it's own film with an actual plot and ending.

    kedinik
  • MortiousMortious The Nightmare Begins Move to New ZealandRegistered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Mojo_Jojo wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    So the new Captain America film is getting very positive reviews. And Kate Bush is doing some live shows for the first time in about three decades. And I am thinking of taking the afternoon off to mooch around town doing as little as possible while sipping beer.

    More news as it arrives.

    I'm glad the Captain America film is doing well. The first one was about as good as it could have been given the obsession with origin stories in favour of interesting stories. Free of that, I can see it being good.

    I'll be spending most of the day sitting on a plane. Hopefully drinking.

    The origin story was the GOOD part of the film.

    Captain America's problem was it spent the last half of the movie quickly setting up The Avengers rather then being it's own film with an actual plot and ending.

    I would have prefered more WW2 shenanigans.

    Move to New Zealand
    It’s not a very important country most of the time
    http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
    James
  • STATE OF THE ART ROBOTSTATE OF THE ART ROBOT Registered User regular
    Metal genres are serious business.

    PodlyKalkinojakobaggersurrealitycheckKana
  • STATE OF THE ART ROBOTSTATE OF THE ART ROBOT Registered User regular
    "We're Kill Metal not Death Metal"

    Podlysurrealitycheck
  • jeffinvajeffinva Koogler coming this summerRegistered User regular
    www.thinkgeek.com/product/d562/

    STEAM_0:1:18117820, Twitch: puulse, PSN: Jeff_en-la-boca, Nintendo: jeffinva
  • knitdanknitdan Oh no Too much hunnyRegistered User regular
    There are people here who could make that for you.

    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
  • ArchangleArchangle Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Mojo_Jojo wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    So the new Captain America film is getting very positive reviews. And Kate Bush is doing some live shows for the first time in about three decades. And I am thinking of taking the afternoon off to mooch around town doing as little as possible while sipping beer.

    More news as it arrives.

    I'm glad the Captain America film is doing well. The first one was about as good as it could have been given the obsession with origin stories in favour of interesting stories. Free of that, I can see it being good.

    I'll be spending most of the day sitting on a plane. Hopefully drinking.

    The origin story was the GOOD part of the film.

    Captain America's problem was it spent the last half of the movie quickly setting up The Avengers rather then being it's own film with an actual plot and ending.
    Also I know that Red Skull is a part of the comics mythology, but when its presented as "You know what we need? Someone more evil than Hitler" and you get Hugo Weaving in full "Agent Smith" mode it comes across as an unbelievable caricature.

  • kedinikkedinik Registered User regular
    Fasting in order to get blood work done in a few hours; so hungry.

  • PodlyPodly you unzipped me! it's all coming back! i don't like it!Registered User regular
    Metal genres are serious business.

    straight 16th note solos but squelching vox instead of gurgling vox?

    i though you were kvlt?

    *sets every home in the world on fire*

    follow my music twitter soundcloud tumblr
    9pr1GIh.jpg?1
    STATE OF THE ART ROBOTTL DR
  • STATE OF THE ART ROBOTSTATE OF THE ART ROBOT Registered User regular
    Podly wrote: »
    Metal genres are serious business.

    straight 16th note solos but squelching vox instead of gurgling vox?

    i though you were kvlt?

    *sets every home in the world on fire*

    Death to false metal.

    Podly
  • BogartBogart Streetwise Hercules Fighting The Rising Odds Registered User, Moderator mod
    @Kalkino - check your pms.

  • ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    on the 170 into the City, as I have done so many times before, but the creeping dread that I am wasting my limited time is a new sensation.

    aRkpc.gif
  • ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    Archangle wrote: »
    shryke wrote: »
    Mojo_Jojo wrote: »
    Bogart wrote: »
    So the new Captain America film is getting very positive reviews. And Kate Bush is doing some live shows for the first time in about three decades. And I am thinking of taking the afternoon off to mooch around town doing as little as possible while sipping beer.

    More news as it arrives.

    I'm glad the Captain America film is doing well. The first one was about as good as it could have been given the obsession with origin stories in favour of interesting stories. Free of that, I can see it being good.

    I'll be spending most of the day sitting on a plane. Hopefully drinking.

    The origin story was the GOOD part of the film.

    Captain America's problem was it spent the last half of the movie quickly setting up The Avengers rather then being it's own film with an actual plot and ending.
    Also I know that Red Skull is a part of the comics mythology, but when its presented as "You know what we need? Someone more evil than Hitler" and you get Hugo Weaving in full "Agent Smith" mode it comes across as an unbelievable caricature.

    it has to be pretty unbelievable

    believable evil is not good escapism

    aRkpc.gif
  • ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    singapore moves with or without you. half the buildings that lined the road I once travelled every day are already gone, and the titan that is mass transit gnaws at the survivors. I would complain about being unmoored but the ship had never stopped to begin with: the pace of change was no lesser in the past, and any impression otherwise only an illusion cast by the brevity of youth

    aRkpc.gif
    knitdanElldrenjeffinvaDasUberEdwardCorehealer
This discussion has been closed.