The swag bags need to go away. They keep being gutted every year and this year was just embarrassing. Either get some actual worthwhile content in them or cut them out entirely.
The main Expo Hall feels more impersonal and closed off than ever before and with less interesting content. When I started out six years ago the booths were more open and almost every booth was staffed by actual devs. Now they're almost all walled off where they just want you to get in, play their shit, and get the fuck out. I realize that this is partially due to the increase in attendees but at this point the Expo Hall just feels like E3's leftovers. It's just kinda boring and loud and a giant traffic jam.
Speaking of which, what was with all the dipshits that kept standing right in the middle of the walkways? I had to bust out the high decibel pub crawl leader voice on more than a few occasions to get people the fuck out of the way. I know you can't fix stupid but damn that was annoying. Normally people at PAX at better about this sorta thing.
The Indie Megabooth is still in that corner which means it's still a complete mess. At this point the Megabooth is the best part of the whole damn Expo Floor (and I'm hardly the only person that thinks that) and it really needs some room to breath.
League of Legends needs to get out of the convention center (still). They're a waste of space in an already crowded main convention center and the crush of people trying to get out of the old queue room into the Expo Hall made that end of the Hall a complete mess. That whole area could be better used for any of the other things people are saying need more room. Since LoL is basically its own self-contained thing just it in Benaroya and bring back the Paramount as our main theater, the acoustics are better in there anyway.
On that note, the Paramount was a complete waste this year. It's a vastly superior theater to Benaroya and needs to be utilized better.
Tabletop was a disaster with chunks of it just all over the place. This needs to be in a central location so that people can have places near the library to play.
It's good to have the 6th floor back. It's nice having an open booth area that wasn't blasting obnoxious bullshit and had wiggle room to check out neat stuff again.
One less concert night == boooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Most of the center staff were fine but there were one or two that had some serious attitude problems. One in particular in the Annex had a severe case of "mall cop-itus" and apparently forgot that he wasn't actually just some guy directing traffic and checking badges.
The line taping is a great idea. Some spots were a smiiiidge too narrow but practice makes perfect and all that. It's hard to get in line when half of a spot extends in a wall, that sorta thing.
I am okay with scalping, personally. It creates an opportunity should I not be lucky enough to get badges and it allowed me to sell my extra Saturday pass before going in (only $5 over face). I also noticed far fewer than last year. I think I only saw one or two guys with stacks of badges for sale vs. last year when there were a lot of them.
They were better organized this year. There were only a couple right at the center but there were more stationed on the main streets to the convention center so they had a much bigger net this time around.
PAX Prime has gotten to the point where some hard decisions need to be made regarding what goes where because it has gotten too big for its own good and it's turned into a clusterfuck. I'm really not sure I'm coming back after seeing how things have been progressing the past six years. Especially since the actual "buying a badge" thing this year was so badly handled with the constant delays and lack of communication (to the point that some businesses are really not happy with how this year's badge sales went due to it screwing them up). The last day was awesome due to [REDACTED] and [REDACTED] and of course seeing my friends again but hopefully by this time next year I'll be living in Seattle so I can just see everyone anyway. I may miss out on opportunities like what happened this year but I can live without that.
(forgive typos I'm ill)
The staff and enforcers at PAX do a great job every year. I understand space/attendance/stuff is limited and it's hard to get everything in and at the same time making everyone happy. I will try to keep this in mind while I form my critique of PAX prime.
Purchasing badges - Again it was crazy buying tickets this year. I work from home and can afford to be near a computer when the twitter notice goes off. I was already at my PC when the notice went off this year and immediately went to the PAX site within 5-10 seconds of receiving the text on my phone. I got in the queue and was able to purchase tickets not long after. After no more than five minutes from the text to the point where I could select badge quantities, 4 day had sold out. I think the popularity of PAX has outgrown the WSCC. If there are nearby cities in western WA, that could host PAX, I wouldn't mind traveling if it means more space. A lot of scalpers were outside with stacks of badges. Those could of been families going at the regular rate. I would prefer a stricter registration system for badges. Names on badges or something.
It was difficult for me to stand around and watch people play games on the Expo floor as I was constantly getting pushed and shoved by random people walking by. There was just too many people in a cramped space.
There is no solution, someone above suggested printing names on badges...that won't really help. Is every single person going to have their ID checked every time they enter the expo?
It's a system I've seen at other conventions, and it's one where people present their ID to pick up their badge up to several days before the convention. The name wouldn't necessarily be on the badge, but you're pretty much assumed to be the person that matches the badge if you have the badge in the first place, as you presented ID to get it.
SDCC has this sort of system in place, for example, and is larger than PAX, so it is possible to have a name/ID-tied system for a large-scale convention
Fidchel on
PAX Prime 2012 (Pin-Up Gardener Poison Ivy)
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
We did GenCon for the first time this year and it was amazing. One thing that really opened my eyes though was how much space Wizards used there. They took up pretty much equivalent to the indie area on the 6th floor that included a life-size castle wall display. If I were to wager a guess I am thinking it's less about the money and more about a return on investment. Until PAX can give a good TT experience they don't have a reason to sink a large chunk of cash. Why sink in hundreds of thousands when only an extremely small percentage of the attendees will be able to find you.
And yes I agree with you 100%, tabletop needs to finally get some love from the PAX organizers.
I think you said it better than how I was trying to say it. Agree completely. Wizards isn't spending the time at PAX that it could or should because PAX isn't very TT-friendly.
PAX Prime 2012 (Pin-Up Gardener Poison Ivy)
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
SDCC has this sort of system in place, for example, and is larger than PAX, so it is possible to have a name/ID-tied system for a large-scale convention
I'm not sure how that would stop scalpers, it might make it slightly more difficult, but it certainly wouldn't stop them. This idea has been brought up before, and it's not something they want to do link
There is not, the WSCC is the largest convention space in the pacific northwest.
This is not the case. The Oregon Convention Center for example, has approximately a million square ft. to the WSCC's 400k ~ , I believe Khoo mentioned off hand in this (or maybe last) years "badges have sold out" thread that it might be time to start looking at other venues...going by memory though.
I love, love. LOVE the WSCC, but I really think a move to a bigger venue is needed. I said recently, that I was concerned with the rarity and value of passes increasing that it might actually pose a safety concern for attendees. For the first time this year, people had their badge's snatched off them outside the convention centre. link. I don't want to guess what the next first for PAX Prime will be.
As an aside, were you not at Prime this year BigRed? We usually streetpass you 3 or 4 times over the weekend, and didn't tag you at all this year.
We did GenCon for the first time this year and it was amazing. One thing that really opened my eyes though was how much space Wizards used there. They took up pretty much equivalent to the indie area on the 6th floor that included a life-size castle wall display. If I were to wager a guess I am thinking it's less about the money and more about a return on investment. Until PAX can give a good TT experience they don't have a reason to sink a large chunk of cash. Why sink in hundreds of thousands when only an extremely small percentage of the attendees will be able to find you.
And yes I agree with you 100%, tabletop needs to finally get some love from the PAX organizers.
I think you said it better than how I was trying to say it. Agree completely. Wizards isn't spending the time at PAX that it could or should because PAX isn't very TT-friendly.
Wizards had two floors of the annex to themselves. What more do you want?
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
There is no solution, someone above suggested printing names on badges...that won't really help. Is every single person going to have their ID checked every time they enter the expo?
It's a system I've seen at other conventions, and it's one where people present their ID to pick up their badge up to several days before the convention. The name wouldn't necessarily be on the badge, but you're pretty much assumed to be the person that matches the badge if you have the badge in the first place, as you presented ID to get it.
SDCC has this sort of system in place, for example, and is larger than PAX, so it is possible to have a name/ID-tied system for a large-scale convention
Don't people end up waiting for hours just to get their passes at sdcc? Or was that gdc? Either way I don't think adding another line is going to improve PAX.
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
SDCC has this sort of system in place, for example, and is larger than PAX, so it is possible to have a name/ID-tied system for a large-scale convention
I'm not sure how that would stop scalpers, it might make it slightly more difficult, but it certainly wouldn't stop them. This idea has been brought up before, and it's not something they want to do link
There is not, the WSCC is the largest convention space in the pacific northwest.
This is not the case. The Oregon Convention Center for example, has approximately a million square ft. to the WSCC's 400k ~ , I believe Khoo mentioned off hand in this (or maybe last) years "badges have sold out" thread that it might be time to start looking at other venues...going by memory though.
I love, love. LOVE the WSCC, but I really think a move to a bigger venue is needed. I said recently, that I was concerned with the rarity and value of passes increasing that it might actually pose a safety concern for attendees. For the first time this year, people had their badge's snatched off them outside the convention centre. link. I don't want to guess what the next first for PAX Prime will be.
As an aside, were you not at Prime this year BigRed? We usually streetpass you 3 or 4 times over the weekend, and didn't tag you at all this year.
IIRC, the OCC and the WSCC's official numbers are measured differently and the actual usable spaces are comparable.
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
I had a great time at my first PAX Prime!
However, I have two items that I feel need to be voiced.
1) I don't know who was in charge of the stage crew for the concerts in the main concert hall but they didn't know what the hell they were doing. There was feed back through the speakers; every night this happened at least twice. The balance for the performers was consistently off when they would first start playing. Good example, when Guitar Bros. played, one of the performances I was extremely psyched for, you could barely hear one of them for the first five minutes of the performance. I would be amazed if the performers have not complained about this to whoever was in charge. Also, blinding spot lights in the audiences eyes were major issues. There were times the spot lights would be shining in our eyes (main floor seating) for minutes at a time and we couldn't see anything past them. Personally, I had to actually close my eyes because these spotlights were so damn bright and unrelenting. And I know it wasn't just me as I heard quite a few people around me complaining at the time. I get the attraction of a light show but this had to be the worst light show I've ever seen. Rotate the damn lights! Seriously, higher some professionals.
2) Although I loved the fact that the tabletop and D&D play was in the Motif where I was staying, they definitely do not have the elevator capacity to support such high attendance. Saturday night I had to wait 15 minutes for an elevator back to my room on the 15th floor. Sunday afternoon I left my room, got in the elevator and realized I'd forgotten my badge. literally took me 20 minutes to go back up, get my badge, and come back down to the lobby. And every trip in the elevator? Shoulder to shoulder, crammed in like sardines. I got to know some people a little more than I would have liked.
Still, except for the two above items I had a great time. And regardless of the stage crews the bands that played were GREAT. I mean, come on! Bit Brigade doing the Legend Of Zelda?! It doesn't get much better. The games were great, the people were awesome, and the enforcers deserve a HUGE shout out. I had an awesome time and cannot wait till next year.
I'm personally a fan of the concerts at Benaroya instead of Paramount. Lack of mosh pit didn't bother me that much (not many people seemed to take advantage of that last year) and you could do the same thing, albeit with seats in the way, at Benaroya. The acoustics were fine for me. Seating is better at Benaroya.
PAX West 2017 Checklist:
[X] Order Badges [X] Hotel [ X ] Flight [ X ] Time Off [ X ] Bobcat [ . ] Office Set [ . ] Challenge Coin [ . ] Sanity
Wizards had two floors of the annex to themselves. What more do you want?
Wizards has a separate budget for D&D and Magic. Those two floors of the annex were entirely devoted to Magic. There was no visible presence for D&D in the WSCC, and just finding where to play TT games was difficult. Hence the cry for a centralized, visable TT area.
PAX Prime 2012 (Pin-Up Gardener Poison Ivy)
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
Don't people end up waiting for hours just to get their passes at sdcc? Or was that gdc? Either way I don't think adding another line is going to improve PAX.
Lines at PAX are par for the course. Being mugged for a badge is new and scary and a sign that something needs to change to keep people safe and make sure people aren't having to pay through the nose just to attend. Reducing or removing the scalpers by tying a badge to a name would go a long way for both.
PAX Prime 2012 (Pin-Up Gardener Poison Ivy)
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
Wizards had two floors of the annex to themselves. What more do you want?
Wizards has a separate budget for D&D and Magic. Those two floors of the annex were entirely devoted to Magic. There was no visible presence for D&D in the WSCC, and just finding where to play TT games was difficult. Hence the cry for a centralized, visable TT area.
Magic is tabletop, too. Take it up with Wizards if you don't like what they're bringing to PAX.
I agree having a better traveler tabletop space would be nice, but I don't think that influences what Wizards does. They have all the space they need to show of whatever products they choose.
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
Wizards had two floors of the annex to themselves. What more do you want?
Wizards has a separate budget for D&D and Magic. Those two floors of the annex were entirely devoted to Magic. There was no visible presence for D&D in the WSCC, and just finding where to play TT games was difficult. Hence the cry for a centralized, visable TT area.
Magic is tabletop, too. Take it up with Wizards if you don't like what they're bringing to PAX.
I agree having a better traveler tabletop space would be nice, but I don't think that influences what Wizards does. They have all the space they need to show of whatever products they choose.
If you compare Wizard's Gencon space to Wizard's PAX space it, it's sad at best. They have a huge area with many games running at Gencon that dwarfs the area at PAX. This should have been DnD's big year with 5e introduction but they had just the little area at the Motiff.
Also while Wizards held the same Annex spaces as the last couple year, I saw much less of a presence with their merch, etc. I'm not sure how to entirely express it in words but it was much less of a presence than last year.
I agree with all the comments that a more cohesive tabletop play area would be really nice. I had some trouble with that this year as well.
Also, I know this might overcomplicate PAX XP more than the PA team wants, given that there are already issues with the QR codes going missing & whatnot, but a PAX XP Pinny Arcade pin as a prize for completing the scavenger hunt would be pretty sweet. I've completed it every year since they started it and it would be awesome to have a special pin to show off for it.
PAX Prime attendee: '08, '09, '10, '11, '12, '13, '14, '15, and soon to be '16
On this note I think PAX always has been more of a video game convention simply because there wasn't one for fans. Its why I've been going all of these years. I totally don't mind that TT games are at PAX but honestly I feel TT has its convention voids filled already via GenCon and I believe others. Yes it sounds like this year's PAX TT wasn't organized well but I really hope the scales don't tip because I really feel PAX should remain video game centric. Or become really big to encompass all of gaming.
Well if you ever go to PAX East, you'll see LOADS of TT. It sounds like there were just a bunch of breakdowns in TT for prime this year, most of them being communication related. It definitely sucks, but I'm sure that the issues will at least be looked at for next year (and hopefully solved in some reasonable fashion).
I definitely feel like the size of the venue contributes to the fragmentation of the tabletop gaming and other areas; having different types of tabletop gaming essentially split across three discrete areas makes things hard to navigate with the Annex, the Expo hall, and Motif. I spent a ton of time trucking between Motif and the Expo Hall, and the tabletop game check out area was really space constrained. I would really like tabletop to feel more integrated with the rest of PAX, but I don't know how to resolve this issues given the amount of space available.
I think my priorities would be: Make tournaments / tabletop libraries closer to each other, then try and integrate tabletop play more into the main venue.
This year I spent the least amount of time I've ever spent in the Expo Hall, didn't even wait 3 hours to play a game; all for the same reasons everyone else has offered - loud, crowded, and too impersonal. What I did do is play more tabletop and go to events outside of PAX like the Shadow Realms event and Fortnite. Both of these events might be good models for more developers to follow - smaller, more intimate events. If they halved the number of booths in the Expo Hall but then reserved hotel rooms, bars, small venues for developers to use instead it could expand the show to some extent - like a creeping creeping thing its tendrils would slowly take over downtown Seattle. Tabletop might be able to squeeze in to the Expo Hall or swap with the 6th floor which could move down stairs?
Also, when I hear LoL has to go (I've never played LoL so I have no dog in the fight) I'm wondering if people heard what Mickey Neumann had to say during the Storytime - you're essentially telling those people who like LoL "You're having fun wrong." As if LoL is some how not a video game worthy of PAX because its a big, popular eSport. I think they finally used the queue room from something useful this year and it was fairly unobtrusive. Go or stay, I don't really care - the outright disdain for it just isn't cool or becoming of such a classy crowd.
Next, Scalpers. Yes they are annoying. I thought there were fewer of them and I took their begging for passes as desperation. I don't think they did as well this time around. The "solutions" for fixing scalping have all be posited before and the arguments for them have been refuted. There is no sure-fire, hum-dinger way of wiping out scalpers (and no I will not be contacting my representative to "fix" the problem) because people will either find a way to exploit the new system too or new people will be hurt by the new system. The current system offers a fair chance to an event that I and a lot of other people are excited to go to and I've yet to be convinced that there is a better system.
The way I look at it, PAX is not a guaranteed thing, we are not entitled to it. At any time they could pull the plug and that's that. Yes we should offer up our criticism but let's remember that the powers-that-be are doing this for the community and not for money and power. Not every decisions is fueled by a mustache twirling evil plot - they were trying to make 40,000+ people happy.
I wish there was a list of where to grab pictures from the companies official photographers. I lost a several cards. (Including the one from 2k with Handsome Jack) An easy to access registry of photo galleries would be awesome.
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BekerChild's Play Program DirectorSeattleRegistered User, Penny Arcade Staffregular
Being mugged for a badge is new and scary and a sign that something needs to change to keep people safe and make sure people aren't having to pay through the nose just to attend.
People snatching badges is not something new, we have had a few reports for a couple of years on it. All of the instances I have heard of have been snatch and grabs, then they run away, not like an actual mugging. They also seem to happen a lot behind the convention center in freeway park where attendees tend to hang out and let their guard down. Uniformed officers have walked around out there, but they can't see everything, and there a lots of avenues for escape. Your best protection for this is to secure your badge, i.e. use a cowhitch if nothing else. It always makes me super sad to have to hear someone say their badge was stolen, because there really is not much we can do.
Well if you ever go to PAX East, you'll see LOADS of TT.
Exactly. Our first ever PAX was East so when we arrived at Prime our first time we were really disappointed that TT didn't have the same presence. At East after the expo hall closes that is where a lot of people hang out. TT and Indie are by far my favorite parts of PAX.
2) Although I loved the fact that the tabletop and D&D play was in the Motif where I was staying, they definitely do not have the elevator capacity to support such high attendance. Saturday night I had to wait 15 minutes for an elevator back to my room on the 15th floor. Sunday afternoon I left my room, got in the elevator and realized I'd forgotten my badge. literally took me 20 minutes to go back up, get my badge, and come back down to the lobby.
I only went to the Motif once because of this, getting in and out of there was a disaster. I was also annoyed that Wizards apparently did some kind of raffle to see who got in the Sunday night con-exclusive 4 hour D&D adventure and I didn't see any notice of that before Pax. I figured it would be something you just lined up for. I guess it all worked out since my friends and I ended up going to the Pillars party that night which was spectacular so all's well that ends well.
1) All the diversity stuff (Diversity Lounge, banning booth babes, panels, etc.) It means A LOT to have places like PAX stand up for inclusiveness, especially with all the horrible things that have been happening lately.
2) The Benaroya! Worth the walk IMHO.
Things I wasn't so crazy about:
1) I know it's been talked about a lot but I still think registration needs some changes. Trying to get badges is definitely the worst part of PAX.
2) The Expo Hall was nuts. Maybe get some of the bigger booths out of the expo hall and into their own rooms?
3) Swag bags. WHY.
The good
*Panels were excellent this year. There was an awesome variety to choose from.
*The show overall had great variety. I was able to tabletop, pen and paper, magic, video game, and even check out some indie and organization stuff.
*Enforcers were always helpful and friendly. I saw a few that were short with answers but never actually rude. I appreciated their help and willingness to step up to make sure others had a good time.
The bad
*Demo times vs waits. Some demos were simply too long which caused line problems. As it has been mentioned before the capping had issues. It was a whole new struggle to get into a line that was capped. If you waited close by then you were shooed away. If you circled around then you would most likely miss a spot. If you even had luck getting into a line then you were still there for 3 hours waiting to play. There has to be a healthy medium. I'm not sure what that medium looks like, perhaps someone else can think of one.
*Time between panels. It felt as if you had to run from one theater to another at break neck speed or bug out early in order to get to the next panel. This always happens when there is a lot going on but I felt like most of the bigger panels did not have enough time between them to reasonably get to and from them.
*Swag Bags. Like others have said. I was more than disappointed with the contents and felt that they were a waste of paper. I saw more than one get picked up, dug through, and immediately thrown away. I don't want a bag that is only going to be filled with paper advertisements. The magic cards could be passed out in the Magic area or at the booth. And the eye drops burn like a thousand suns and should never be used on a living thing unless it is for self defense. Either have more things in the bags that are worth picking them up for, or simply do away with it.
*League of Legends. This event needs to find another host. It is as simple as that. I don't think there should be this big regional event that requires you to have a badge for a whole different event in order to participate. It is upsetting that each year it is harder and harder to get badges but the problem is expounded when a good chunk of those badges are going to what could be considered a whole different event (where many who attend the LoL stuff will not even use their PAX badge to its full potential cause they are only there for LoL stuff and not the expo hall, freeplay areas, etc.). It was nice that they had their own area this year though.
I love those eye drops. They sting for a minute, but then vision is CRYSTAL CLEAR
I made the worst mistake of my life of trying them when I had costume contact lenses on the first year they came in the bags. I cried. I ripped those lenses out of my eyes. And then cried some more.
I tried using the drops again without any contacts and it still felt like a thousand hot pokers were being inserted into my retinas.
Those things are satan's sweat bottled and sold as a "soothing" lie!
*League of Legends. This event needs to find another host. It is as simple as that. I don't think there should be this big regional event that requires you to have a badge for a whole different event in order to participate. It is upsetting that each year it is harder and harder to get badges but the problem is expounded when a good chunk of those badges are going to what could be considered a whole different event (where many who attend the LoL stuff will not even use their PAX badge to its full potential cause they are only there for LoL stuff and not the expo hall, freeplay areas, etc.). It was nice that they had their own area this year though.
I wanted to agree with this too. Not that I hate LoL or WANT them to go away but it's not really a part of PAX so making them part of the same event just makes things harder for everybody. If it's true that a lot of people are buying PAX badges just for LoL, there would be more badges for everyone if the events were ticketed separately (I really doubt that LoL people love fighting for PAX tickets any more than pure PAXers do). They could still hold their tournament during PAX if they want but they can run admittance separately from PAX. People that want to go to both could get a badge for each. If we really must keep them a part of PAX, at least offer a LoL-only badge so everyone can go see what they want.
Rude enforcers and bad line management. I had a enforcer grab my arm when trying to direct my group to condense the line. It was most defiantly not OK to ever touch someone without permission. Several times had lines condense to an unreasonable small corner of the queue room when it was pretty obvious that the panel in question was not going to fill or it would take at least a half hour for the queue room to need condensing. Some of the queue rooms in the Sheraton were at least 20 degrees hotter then the hallway and were terrible to be in.
When leaving AI, leading everyone past that swag table forced people into way too crowded of a hallway for way to long where I kept experiencing people pushing from behind and again very uncomfortable touching.
Overall, Enjoyable experience but a couple really bad experiences.
*League of Legends. This event needs to find another host. It is as simple as that. I don't think there should be this big regional event that requires you to have a badge for a whole different event in order to participate. It is upsetting that each year it is harder and harder to get badges but the problem is expounded when a good chunk of those badges are going to what could be considered a whole different event (where many who attend the LoL stuff will not even use their PAX badge to its full potential cause they are only there for LoL stuff and not the expo hall, freeplay areas, etc.). It was nice that they had their own area this year though.
I wanted to agree with this too. Not that I hate LoL or WANT them to go away but it's not really a part of PAX so making them part of the same event just makes things harder for everybody. If it's true that a lot of people are buying PAX badges just for LoL, there would be more badges for everyone if the events were ticketed separately (I really doubt that LoL people love fighting for PAX tickets any more than pure PAXers do). They could still hold their tournament during PAX if they want but they can run admittance separately from PAX. People that want to go to both could get a badge for each. If we really must keep them a part of PAX, at least offer a LoL-only badge so everyone can go see what they want.[/quote]
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they do this for Halo Fest a few years ago. Where having a PAX badge can get you into it, but it was a separate event as a whole? IMHO I think that would be the best route to go. Having the regional tournament be a separate event with it's own tickets but allowing PAX badge holders access to watch it in person.
But back to the critiquing!
The Good: Had a lot of fun at panels and other events outside the main expo hall! Got to play some good table top demos and enjoy playing full games with the creators.
The Bad: Expo hall was too crowded this year. And no solid consolidation for table top free play.
Not sure how I forgot about it, but yeah there were definitely some overzealous enforcers out there in regards to people moving. I was grabbed on the arm once in Expo, and had some friends that were pulled by the shoulder. Definitely not ok.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they do this for Halo Fest a few years ago. Where having a PAX badge can get you into it, but it was a separate event as a whole? IMHO I think that would be the best route to go. Having the regional tournament be a separate event with it's own tickets but allowing PAX badge holders access to watch it in person.
Halo Fest was run as its own thing inside of PAX, but the only way to get in was with a PAX badge. There were not separate tickets for it. There was a "halo fest badge" but that was just a souvenir and had no value or use.
*League of Legends. This event needs to find another host. It is as simple as that. I don't think there should be this big regional event that requires you to have a badge for a whole different event in order to participate. It is upsetting that each year it is harder and harder to get badges but the problem is expounded when a good chunk of those badges are going to what could be considered a whole different event (where many who attend the LoL stuff will not even use their PAX badge to its full potential cause they are only there for LoL stuff and not the expo hall, freeplay areas, etc.). It was nice that they had their own area this year though.
I wanted to agree with this too. Not that I hate LoL or WANT them to go away but it's not really a part of PAX so making them part of the same event just makes things harder for everybody. If it's true that a lot of people are buying PAX badges just for LoL, there would be more badges for everyone if the events were ticketed separately (I really doubt that LoL people love fighting for PAX tickets any more than pure PAXers do). They could still hold their tournament during PAX if they want but they can run admittance separately from PAX. People that want to go to both could get a badge for each. If we really must keep them a part of PAX, at least offer a LoL-only badge so everyone can go see what they want.
While LOL was much less intrusive with the new location, I have to agree. If space is at such a premium, then maybe a event like this is better in it's own venue with it's own ticketing system.
*League of Legends. This event needs to find another host. It is as simple as that. I don't think there should be this big regional event that requires you to have a badge for a whole different event in order to participate. It is upsetting that each year it is harder and harder to get badges but the problem is expounded when a good chunk of those badges are going to what could be considered a whole different event (where many who attend the LoL stuff will not even use their PAX badge to its full potential cause they are only there for LoL stuff and not the expo hall, freeplay areas, etc.). It was nice that they had their own area this year though.
I wanted to agree with this too. Not that I hate LoL or WANT them to go away but it's not really a part of PAX so making them part of the same event just makes things harder for everybody. If it's true that a lot of people are buying PAX badges just for LoL, there would be more badges for everyone if the events were ticketed separately (I really doubt that LoL people love fighting for PAX tickets any more than pure PAXers do). They could still hold their tournament during PAX if they want but they can run admittance separately from PAX. People that want to go to both could get a badge for each. If we really must keep them a part of PAX, at least offer a LoL-only badge so everyone can go see what they want.
While LOL was much less intrusive with the new location, I have to agree. If space is at such a premium, then maybe a event like this is better in it's own venue with it's own ticketing system.
I could say the same thing about table top. To quote @DaPaladin "Also, when I hear LoL has to go (I've never played LoL so I have no dog in the fight) I'm wondering if people heard what Mickey Neumann had to say during the Storytime - you're essentially telling those people who like LoL "You're having fun wrong." As if LoL is some how not a video game worthy of PAX because its a big, popular eSport. "
I don't go to PAX just for LoL, or just for Table Top, or just for triple A title demos, or just for indie games, or just for panels, or just for 3DS gaming... However, there are plenty of people that go that spend a ton of their time only doing one thing. Picking one of the more popular events at PAX and saying "we think they should leave" isn't a solution.
Pins for trade!
2015 PAX Prime Omeganaut (I will forever hate Katamari)
*League of Legends. This event needs to find another host. It is as simple as that. I don't think there should be this big regional event that requires you to have a badge for a whole different event in order to participate. It is upsetting that each year it is harder and harder to get badges but the problem is expounded when a good chunk of those badges are going to what could be considered a whole different event (where many who attend the LoL stuff will not even use their PAX badge to its full potential cause they are only there for LoL stuff and not the expo hall, freeplay areas, etc.). It was nice that they had their own area this year though.
I wanted to agree with this too. Not that I hate LoL or WANT them to go away but it's not really a part of PAX so making them part of the same event just makes things harder for everybody. If it's true that a lot of people are buying PAX badges just for LoL, there would be more badges for everyone if the events were ticketed separately (I really doubt that LoL people love fighting for PAX tickets any more than pure PAXers do). They could still hold their tournament during PAX if they want but they can run admittance separately from PAX. People that want to go to both could get a badge for each. If we really must keep them a part of PAX, at least offer a LoL-only badge so everyone can go see what they want.
While LOL was much less intrusive with the new location, I have to agree. If space is at such a premium, then maybe a event like this is better in it's own venue with it's own ticketing system.
I could say the same thing about table top. To quote @DaPaladin "Also, when I hear LoL has to go (I've never played LoL so I have no dog in the fight) I'm wondering if people heard what Mickey Neumann had to say during the Storytime - you're essentially telling those people who like LoL "You're having fun wrong." As if LoL is some how not a video game worthy of PAX because its a big, popular eSport. "
I don't go to PAX just for LoL, or just for Table Top, or just for triple A title demos, or just for indie games, or just for panels, or just for 3DS gaming... However, there are plenty of people that go that spend a ton of their time only doing one thing. Picking one of the more popular events at PAX and saying "we think they should leave" isn't a solution.
It's not so much wrong as much as the premium space is currently at. I have no issue with LOL with the new location but it's seems kind of odd to have a huge event like PAX with another huge event inside of it. The LOL tournament is a independent thing, it doesn't need PAX to be held. There is enough interest that it could be a stand alone event and let more of the LOL fans attend. Right now both PAX and LOL are limited due to number of PAX badges. People who want to see LOL and LOL only will have a better chance if it's a separate event. People who want to see PAX and not LOL will also have a better chance. And if they want to see both, they can get a badge to each.
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The main Expo Hall feels more impersonal and closed off than ever before and with less interesting content. When I started out six years ago the booths were more open and almost every booth was staffed by actual devs. Now they're almost all walled off where they just want you to get in, play their shit, and get the fuck out. I realize that this is partially due to the increase in attendees but at this point the Expo Hall just feels like E3's leftovers. It's just kinda boring and loud and a giant traffic jam.
Speaking of which, what was with all the dipshits that kept standing right in the middle of the walkways? I had to bust out the high decibel pub crawl leader voice on more than a few occasions to get people the fuck out of the way. I know you can't fix stupid but damn that was annoying. Normally people at PAX at better about this sorta thing.
The Indie Megabooth is still in that corner which means it's still a complete mess. At this point the Megabooth is the best part of the whole damn Expo Floor (and I'm hardly the only person that thinks that) and it really needs some room to breath.
League of Legends needs to get out of the convention center (still). They're a waste of space in an already crowded main convention center and the crush of people trying to get out of the old queue room into the Expo Hall made that end of the Hall a complete mess. That whole area could be better used for any of the other things people are saying need more room. Since LoL is basically its own self-contained thing just it in Benaroya and bring back the Paramount as our main theater, the acoustics are better in there anyway.
On that note, the Paramount was a complete waste this year. It's a vastly superior theater to Benaroya and needs to be utilized better.
Tabletop was a disaster with chunks of it just all over the place. This needs to be in a central location so that people can have places near the library to play.
It's good to have the 6th floor back. It's nice having an open booth area that wasn't blasting obnoxious bullshit and had wiggle room to check out neat stuff again.
One less concert night == boooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Most of the center staff were fine but there were one or two that had some serious attitude problems. One in particular in the Annex had a severe case of "mall cop-itus" and apparently forgot that he wasn't actually just some guy directing traffic and checking badges.
The line taping is a great idea. Some spots were a smiiiidge too narrow but practice makes perfect and all that. It's hard to get in line when half of a spot extends in a wall, that sorta thing.
They were better organized this year. There were only a couple right at the center but there were more stationed on the main streets to the convention center so they had a much bigger net this time around.
PAX Prime has gotten to the point where some hard decisions need to be made regarding what goes where because it has gotten too big for its own good and it's turned into a clusterfuck. I'm really not sure I'm coming back after seeing how things have been progressing the past six years. Especially since the actual "buying a badge" thing this year was so badly handled with the constant delays and lack of communication (to the point that some businesses are really not happy with how this year's badge sales went due to it screwing them up). The last day was awesome due to [REDACTED] and [REDACTED] and of course seeing my friends again but hopefully by this time next year I'll be living in Seattle so I can just see everyone anyway. I may miss out on opportunities like what happened this year but I can live without that.
The staff and enforcers at PAX do a great job every year. I understand space/attendance/stuff is limited and it's hard to get everything in and at the same time making everyone happy. I will try to keep this in mind while I form my critique of PAX prime.
Purchasing badges - Again it was crazy buying tickets this year. I work from home and can afford to be near a computer when the twitter notice goes off. I was already at my PC when the notice went off this year and immediately went to the PAX site within 5-10 seconds of receiving the text on my phone. I got in the queue and was able to purchase tickets not long after. After no more than five minutes from the text to the point where I could select badge quantities, 4 day had sold out. I think the popularity of PAX has outgrown the WSCC. If there are nearby cities in western WA, that could host PAX, I wouldn't mind traveling if it means more space. A lot of scalpers were outside with stacks of badges. Those could of been families going at the regular rate. I would prefer a stricter registration system for badges. Names on badges or something.
It was difficult for me to stand around and watch people play games on the Expo floor as I was constantly getting pushed and shoved by random people walking by. There was just too many people in a cramped space.
LoL needs to go.
There is not, the WSCC is the largest convention space in the pacific northwest.
It's a system I've seen at other conventions, and it's one where people present their ID to pick up their badge up to several days before the convention. The name wouldn't necessarily be on the badge, but you're pretty much assumed to be the person that matches the badge if you have the badge in the first place, as you presented ID to get it.
SDCC has this sort of system in place, for example, and is larger than PAX, so it is possible to have a name/ID-tied system for a large-scale convention
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
I think you said it better than how I was trying to say it. Agree completely. Wizards isn't spending the time at PAX that it could or should because PAX isn't very TT-friendly.
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
I'm not sure how that would stop scalpers, it might make it slightly more difficult, but it certainly wouldn't stop them. This idea has been brought up before, and it's not something they want to do link
This is not the case. The Oregon Convention Center for example, has approximately a million square ft. to the WSCC's 400k ~ , I believe Khoo mentioned off hand in this (or maybe last) years "badges have sold out" thread that it might be time to start looking at other venues...going by memory though.
I love, love. LOVE the WSCC, but I really think a move to a bigger venue is needed. I said recently, that I was concerned with the rarity and value of passes increasing that it might actually pose a safety concern for attendees. For the first time this year, people had their badge's snatched off them outside the convention centre. link. I don't want to guess what the next first for PAX Prime will be.
As an aside, were you not at Prime this year BigRed? We usually streetpass you 3 or 4 times over the weekend, and didn't tag you at all this year.
Wizards had two floors of the annex to themselves. What more do you want?
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
Don't people end up waiting for hours just to get their passes at sdcc? Or was that gdc? Either way I don't think adding another line is going to improve PAX.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
IIRC, the OCC and the WSCC's official numbers are measured differently and the actual usable spaces are comparable.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
the WSCC and OCC are about the same size
However, I have two items that I feel need to be voiced.
1) I don't know who was in charge of the stage crew for the concerts in the main concert hall but they didn't know what the hell they were doing. There was feed back through the speakers; every night this happened at least twice. The balance for the performers was consistently off when they would first start playing. Good example, when Guitar Bros. played, one of the performances I was extremely psyched for, you could barely hear one of them for the first five minutes of the performance. I would be amazed if the performers have not complained about this to whoever was in charge. Also, blinding spot lights in the audiences eyes were major issues. There were times the spot lights would be shining in our eyes (main floor seating) for minutes at a time and we couldn't see anything past them. Personally, I had to actually close my eyes because these spotlights were so damn bright and unrelenting. And I know it wasn't just me as I heard quite a few people around me complaining at the time. I get the attraction of a light show but this had to be the worst light show I've ever seen. Rotate the damn lights! Seriously, higher some professionals.
2) Although I loved the fact that the tabletop and D&D play was in the Motif where I was staying, they definitely do not have the elevator capacity to support such high attendance. Saturday night I had to wait 15 minutes for an elevator back to my room on the 15th floor. Sunday afternoon I left my room, got in the elevator and realized I'd forgotten my badge. literally took me 20 minutes to go back up, get my badge, and come back down to the lobby. And every trip in the elevator? Shoulder to shoulder, crammed in like sardines. I got to know some people a little more than I would have liked.
Still, except for the two above items I had a great time. And regardless of the stage crews the bands that played were GREAT. I mean, come on! Bit Brigade doing the Legend Of Zelda?! It doesn't get much better. The games were great, the people were awesome, and the enforcers deserve a HUGE shout out. I had an awesome time and cannot wait till next year.
[X] Order Badges [X] Hotel [ X ] Flight [ X ] Time Off [ X ] Bobcat [ . ] Office Set [ . ] Challenge Coin [ . ] Sanity
Wizards has a separate budget for D&D and Magic. Those two floors of the annex were entirely devoted to Magic. There was no visible presence for D&D in the WSCC, and just finding where to play TT games was difficult. Hence the cry for a centralized, visable TT area.
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
Lines at PAX are par for the course. Being mugged for a badge is new and scary and a sign that something needs to change to keep people safe and make sure people aren't having to pay through the nose just to attend. Reducing or removing the scalpers by tying a badge to a name would go a long way for both.
PAX Prime 2013 (Bollywood Black Mage)
PAX Prime 2014 (Renaissance Lady Link)
Magic is tabletop, too. Take it up with Wizards if you don't like what they're bringing to PAX.
I agree having a better traveler tabletop space would be nice, but I don't think that influences what Wizards does. They have all the space they need to show of whatever products they choose.
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
If you compare Wizard's Gencon space to Wizard's PAX space it, it's sad at best. They have a huge area with many games running at Gencon that dwarfs the area at PAX. This should have been DnD's big year with 5e introduction but they had just the little area at the Motiff.
Also while Wizards held the same Annex spaces as the last couple year, I saw much less of a presence with their merch, etc. I'm not sure how to entirely express it in words but it was much less of a presence than last year.
Also, I know this might overcomplicate PAX XP more than the PA team wants, given that there are already issues with the QR codes going missing & whatnot, but a PAX XP Pinny Arcade pin as a prize for completing the scavenger hunt would be pretty sweet. I've completed it every year since they started it and it would be awesome to have a special pin to show off for it.
I think my priorities would be: Make tournaments / tabletop libraries closer to each other, then try and integrate tabletop play more into the main venue.
Also, when I hear LoL has to go (I've never played LoL so I have no dog in the fight) I'm wondering if people heard what Mickey Neumann had to say during the Storytime - you're essentially telling those people who like LoL "You're having fun wrong." As if LoL is some how not a video game worthy of PAX because its a big, popular eSport. I think they finally used the queue room from something useful this year and it was fairly unobtrusive. Go or stay, I don't really care - the outright disdain for it just isn't cool or becoming of such a classy crowd.
Next, Scalpers. Yes they are annoying. I thought there were fewer of them and I took their begging for passes as desperation. I don't think they did as well this time around. The "solutions" for fixing scalping have all be posited before and the arguments for them have been refuted. There is no sure-fire, hum-dinger way of wiping out scalpers (and no I will not be contacting my representative to "fix" the problem) because people will either find a way to exploit the new system too or new people will be hurt by the new system. The current system offers a fair chance to an event that I and a lot of other people are excited to go to and I've yet to be convinced that there is a better system.
The way I look at it, PAX is not a guaranteed thing, we are not entitled to it. At any time they could pull the plug and that's that. Yes we should offer up our criticism but let's remember that the powers-that-be are doing this for the community and not for money and power. Not every decisions is fueled by a mustache twirling evil plot - they were trying to make 40,000+ people happy.
People snatching badges is not something new, we have had a few reports for a couple of years on it. All of the instances I have heard of have been snatch and grabs, then they run away, not like an actual mugging. They also seem to happen a lot behind the convention center in freeway park where attendees tend to hang out and let their guard down. Uniformed officers have walked around out there, but they can't see everything, and there a lots of avenues for escape. Your best protection for this is to secure your badge, i.e. use a cowhitch if nothing else. It always makes me super sad to have to hear someone say their badge was stolen, because there really is not much we can do.
Exactly. Our first ever PAX was East so when we arrived at Prime our first time we were really disappointed that TT didn't have the same presence. At East after the expo hall closes that is where a lot of people hang out. TT and Indie are by far my favorite parts of PAX.
hahaha
I only went to the Motif once because of this, getting in and out of there was a disaster. I was also annoyed that Wizards apparently did some kind of raffle to see who got in the Sunday night con-exclusive 4 hour D&D adventure and I didn't see any notice of that before Pax. I figured it would be something you just lined up for. I guess it all worked out since my friends and I ended up going to the Pillars party that night which was spectacular so all's well that ends well.
1) All the diversity stuff (Diversity Lounge, banning booth babes, panels, etc.) It means A LOT to have places like PAX stand up for inclusiveness, especially with all the horrible things that have been happening lately.
2) The Benaroya! Worth the walk IMHO.
Things I wasn't so crazy about:
1) I know it's been talked about a lot but I still think registration needs some changes. Trying to get badges is definitely the worst part of PAX.
2) The Expo Hall was nuts. Maybe get some of the bigger booths out of the expo hall and into their own rooms?
3) Swag bags. WHY.
*Panels were excellent this year. There was an awesome variety to choose from.
*The show overall had great variety. I was able to tabletop, pen and paper, magic, video game, and even check out some indie and organization stuff.
*Enforcers were always helpful and friendly. I saw a few that were short with answers but never actually rude. I appreciated their help and willingness to step up to make sure others had a good time.
The bad
*Demo times vs waits. Some demos were simply too long which caused line problems. As it has been mentioned before the capping had issues. It was a whole new struggle to get into a line that was capped. If you waited close by then you were shooed away. If you circled around then you would most likely miss a spot. If you even had luck getting into a line then you were still there for 3 hours waiting to play. There has to be a healthy medium. I'm not sure what that medium looks like, perhaps someone else can think of one.
*Time between panels. It felt as if you had to run from one theater to another at break neck speed or bug out early in order to get to the next panel. This always happens when there is a lot going on but I felt like most of the bigger panels did not have enough time between them to reasonably get to and from them.
*Swag Bags. Like others have said. I was more than disappointed with the contents and felt that they were a waste of paper. I saw more than one get picked up, dug through, and immediately thrown away. I don't want a bag that is only going to be filled with paper advertisements. The magic cards could be passed out in the Magic area or at the booth. And the eye drops burn like a thousand suns and should never be used on a living thing unless it is for self defense. Either have more things in the bags that are worth picking them up for, or simply do away with it.
*League of Legends. This event needs to find another host. It is as simple as that. I don't think there should be this big regional event that requires you to have a badge for a whole different event in order to participate. It is upsetting that each year it is harder and harder to get badges but the problem is expounded when a good chunk of those badges are going to what could be considered a whole different event (where many who attend the LoL stuff will not even use their PAX badge to its full potential cause they are only there for LoL stuff and not the expo hall, freeplay areas, etc.). It was nice that they had their own area this year though.
I made the worst mistake of my life of trying them when I had costume contact lenses on the first year they came in the bags. I cried. I ripped those lenses out of my eyes. And then cried some more.
I tried using the drops again without any contacts and it still felt like a thousand hot pokers were being inserted into my retinas.
Those things are satan's sweat bottled and sold as a "soothing" lie!
At least they work for somebody out there.
I wanted to agree with this too. Not that I hate LoL or WANT them to go away but it's not really a part of PAX so making them part of the same event just makes things harder for everybody. If it's true that a lot of people are buying PAX badges just for LoL, there would be more badges for everyone if the events were ticketed separately (I really doubt that LoL people love fighting for PAX tickets any more than pure PAXers do). They could still hold their tournament during PAX if they want but they can run admittance separately from PAX. People that want to go to both could get a badge for each. If we really must keep them a part of PAX, at least offer a LoL-only badge so everyone can go see what they want.
Much Improved Keynote and some great panels
Bad
Rude enforcers and bad line management. I had a enforcer grab my arm when trying to direct my group to condense the line. It was most defiantly not OK to ever touch someone without permission. Several times had lines condense to an unreasonable small corner of the queue room when it was pretty obvious that the panel in question was not going to fill or it would take at least a half hour for the queue room to need condensing. Some of the queue rooms in the Sheraton were at least 20 degrees hotter then the hallway and were terrible to be in.
When leaving AI, leading everyone past that swag table forced people into way too crowded of a hallway for way to long where I kept experiencing people pushing from behind and again very uncomfortable touching.
Overall, Enjoyable experience but a couple really bad experiences.
I wanted to agree with this too. Not that I hate LoL or WANT them to go away but it's not really a part of PAX so making them part of the same event just makes things harder for everybody. If it's true that a lot of people are buying PAX badges just for LoL, there would be more badges for everyone if the events were ticketed separately (I really doubt that LoL people love fighting for PAX tickets any more than pure PAXers do). They could still hold their tournament during PAX if they want but they can run admittance separately from PAX. People that want to go to both could get a badge for each. If we really must keep them a part of PAX, at least offer a LoL-only badge so everyone can go see what they want.[/quote]
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they do this for Halo Fest a few years ago. Where having a PAX badge can get you into it, but it was a separate event as a whole? IMHO I think that would be the best route to go. Having the regional tournament be a separate event with it's own tickets but allowing PAX badge holders access to watch it in person.
But back to the critiquing!
The Good: Had a lot of fun at panels and other events outside the main expo hall! Got to play some good table top demos and enjoy playing full games with the creators.
The Bad: Expo hall was too crowded this year. And no solid consolidation for table top free play.
While LOL was much less intrusive with the new location, I have to agree. If space is at such a premium, then maybe a event like this is better in it's own venue with it's own ticketing system.
I could say the same thing about table top. To quote @DaPaladin "Also, when I hear LoL has to go (I've never played LoL so I have no dog in the fight) I'm wondering if people heard what Mickey Neumann had to say during the Storytime - you're essentially telling those people who like LoL "You're having fun wrong." As if LoL is some how not a video game worthy of PAX because its a big, popular eSport. "
I don't go to PAX just for LoL, or just for Table Top, or just for triple A title demos, or just for indie games, or just for panels, or just for 3DS gaming... However, there are plenty of people that go that spend a ton of their time only doing one thing. Picking one of the more popular events at PAX and saying "we think they should leave" isn't a solution.
2015 PAX Prime Omeganaut (I will forever hate Katamari)
It's not so much wrong as much as the premium space is currently at. I have no issue with LOL with the new location but it's seems kind of odd to have a huge event like PAX with another huge event inside of it. The LOL tournament is a independent thing, it doesn't need PAX to be held. There is enough interest that it could be a stand alone event and let more of the LOL fans attend. Right now both PAX and LOL are limited due to number of PAX badges. People who want to see LOL and LOL only will have a better chance if it's a separate event. People who want to see PAX and not LOL will also have a better chance. And if they want to see both, they can get a badge to each.