PAX Prime 2014 Constructive Feedback

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Posts

  • JKwonJKwon Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    Feedback in regards to the demos.

    The Evil Within did NOT need to be 30 minutes. I would have been happy with 15 minutes. There needs to be a standardized demo time cap IMO.

    PAX Prime 2010 [x]
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  • BekerBeker Child's Play Program Director SeattleRegistered User, Penny Arcade Staff regular
    PedroAsani wrote: »
    Then the other side of the Merch Booth would be better for impromptu trading. My point is that the Merch Queue is confined to an arbitrarily small area with an "overflow" area that exists but isn't talked about. Unlike the Expo Hall which can't do a whole lot (apart from the above points) there is room for a larger queue for the Merch Booth. Larger queues mean less likelihood of needing an artificial Cap, and marking out time sections will assist in that area.
    Keep in mind that the full queue for Merch is only needed for an hour or two each morning, maybe a little more Friday morning. Once the day gets going its pretty much stays in the taped off area. This can certainly change, but at this point Prime is very crowded with stuff, so when considerations of space come up its not "what is the best solution" its more "what is the least bad solution to maximize space for the whole show".

    -Beker/Erick
    gQPRxvs.png
  • zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    I don't necessarily agree with all the suggestions about changing the merch line, but every time I was near it all weekend it was totally full and either capped or near capping, with people milling about waiting for it to uncap. Maybe I was "lucky" to always see it like that.

  • PurpleSkyPurpleSky Registered User regular
    Is it just me or does it seem that people are over exaggerating the crowding of the expo hall and con in general. Yes there are large crowds of people, yes there are long lines, but in all honestly my encounters of these situations have been just having to stay "excuse me" and walk slower. Yes there are situations where you might bump into someone but that has been rare and in the congested areas yeah you have to walk a little slower. I feel like this is a situation that can only be marginally improved to reduce only a small amount of irritation.

    I bring this up because my experience of this doesn't seem to be that bad. The large crowds have never caused me to miss something in the expo hall (especially since there are plenty of routes to reach a destination where you can avoid the congestion). And yes there have been times where someone has bumped into me but they're so minor that I can't remember when they happened. I just say sorry or excuse me and go about my day.

    mcdermott
  • BirrhanBirrhan Registered User regular
    Good thing: moving LoL away from the 6th floor.

    Bad thing: moving TT to the Motif. The TT space at the Motif was, as others have noted, under equipped (slow elevators and lack of space, mostly). It really needs a space sufficient in size to support all that interest. I miss having those little alcoves on the 2nd floor for a quick board game, to help recover from "Expo Hall Overload".

    Suggestion: (not at all colored by my play preferences): move TT into the queue room, and devote a proper theater to LoL (Benoroya or Paramount)? Or return TT to its old place at least?

    Really, everything else was pretty tight, and I had loads of fun. I sympathize with the dissent about line capping, but after having seen the 7.5 hour waits (!!!) for Epic Mickey a few years back, it's a necessity. Just remember that those people that camped were waiting to wait a further ~2.5 hours in line. There's some irony in that, and the wait itself is price enough.

  • Badash112Badash112 Registered User regular
    PurpleSky wrote: »
    Is it just me or does it seem that people are over exaggerating the crowding of the expo hall and con in general. Yes there are large crowds of people, yes there are long lines, but in all honestly my encounters of these situations have been just having to stay "excuse me" and walk slower. Yes there are situations where you might bump into someone but that has been rare and in the congested areas yeah you have to walk a little slower. I feel like this is a situation that can only be marginally improved to reduce only a small amount of irritation.

    I bring this up because my experience of this doesn't seem to be that bad. The large crowds have never caused me to miss something in the expo hall (especially since there are plenty of routes to reach a destination where you can avoid the congestion). And yes there have been times where someone has bumped into me but they're so minor that I can't remember when they happened. I just say sorry or excuse me and go about my day.

    Everyone has a different tolerance for that sort of thing. While a stranger touching you might not be that big of a deal, some people really can't handle that sort of thing. I usually attend PAX with a group that includes a PTSD sufferer who really has a terrible time when strangers touch him. Fortunately the medical badges allow him to sit away from crowds for Panels, but he doesn't really get to experience the expo hall.

    zerzhul
  • PedroAsaniPedroAsani Brotherhood of the Squirrel [Prime]Registered User regular
    Beker wrote: »
    PedroAsani wrote: »
    Then the other side of the Merch Booth would be better for impromptu trading. My point is that the Merch Queue is confined to an arbitrarily small area with an "overflow" area that exists but isn't talked about. Unlike the Expo Hall which can't do a whole lot (apart from the above points) there is room for a larger queue for the Merch Booth. Larger queues mean less likelihood of needing an artificial Cap, and marking out time sections will assist in that area.
    Keep in mind that the full queue for Merch is only needed for an hour or two each morning, maybe a little more Friday morning. Once the day gets going its pretty much stays in the taped off area. This can certainly change, but at this point Prime is very crowded with stuff, so when considerations of space come up its not "what is the best solution" its more "what is the least bad solution to maximize space for the whole show".

    Were this any other booth I would agree, because finding space in Expo is like finding unicorns. But Merch was using the area by the window and near the "signing table" as an unofficial overflow for a lot of the weekend. With a little reorganisation that space can be made official, and remove the need for a Queue Cap and the general milling about that happened. Added bonus, the signing table would then be free and not hidden when it was actually in use.

  • PedroAsaniPedroAsani Brotherhood of the Squirrel [Prime]Registered User regular
    PurpleSky wrote: »
    Is it just me or does it seem that people are over exaggerating the crowding of the expo hall and con in general. Yes there are large crowds of people, yes there are long lines, but in all honestly my encounters of these situations have been just having to stay "excuse me" and walk slower. Yes there are situations where you might bump into someone but that has been rare and in the congested areas yeah you have to walk a little slower. I feel like this is a situation that can only be marginally improved to reduce only a small amount of irritation.

    I bring this up because my experience of this doesn't seem to be that bad. The large crowds have never caused me to miss something in the expo hall (especially since there are plenty of routes to reach a destination where you can avoid the congestion). And yes there have been times where someone has bumped into me but they're so minor that I can't remember when they happened. I just say sorry or excuse me and go about my day.

    I think that there are a few different views of it. Not everyone can handle crowds, so to them it would be a big deal. To the Enforcers, they need to keep the lanes moving and so crowds and pockets of stationary people are a problem that needs to be solved. Queue Capping is, at least in my eyes, the single biggest cause of those pockets. Fire Marshal looks at large non-moving crowds and sees kindling. And to you, you appear to see a simple routing problem.
    Birrhan wrote: »
    I sympathize with the dissent about line capping, but after having seen the 7.5 hour waits (!!!) for Epic Mickey a few years back, it's a necessity. Just remember that those people that camped were waiting to wait a further ~2.5 hours in line. There's some irony in that, and the wait itself is price enough.

    If someone wants to wait all day for the chance to play a 30 minute demo, that's fine. I'm not looking to make the queues shorter. Just fairer. Queue Caps would mean that people would wait near the end of the queue, and then rush in when it opened. The ability to have longer queues means you remove the need to cap, except at the end of the day when any new people simply won't get in.

  • mcdermottmcdermott Registered User regular
    zerzhul wrote: »
    I don't necessarily agree with all the suggestions about changing the merch line, but every time I was near it all weekend it was totally full and either capped or near capping, with people milling about waiting for it to uncap. Maybe I was "lucky" to always see it like that.

    I hit the booth three times personally (I have trouble making decisions) and once with a friend, and the only time it was capped was Friday morning. I don't doubt it capped off and on throughout the weekend, especially mornings, but overall I think you were indeed just "lucky." Though most times I saw it it was pretty full (like 75% capacity or more) so I definitely don't doubt you.
    Everyone has a different tolerance for that sort of thing. While a stranger touching you might not be that big of a deal, some people really can't handle that sort of thing. I usually attend PAX with a group that includes a PTSD sufferer who really has a terrible time when strangers touch him. Fortunately the medical badges allow him to sit away from crowds for Panels, but he doesn't really get to experience the expo hall.

    That's pretty awful, and I definitely sympathize (especially as somebody who has experienced PTSD myself), but at the risk of sounding callous I'm just not sure this is something that can be fixed. There might be some improvement possible, but I'm not sure an expo hall at this kind of event will necessarily ever be a comfortable experience.

  • EnglishseigeEnglishseige Registered User regular
    In my Experience over the last 5 years, there has been a little give and take every year. This year seemed to be a little less visually distracting (not including the evolve booth), but felt like the lanes between booths were easier to navigate. I am very thankful that the animal cage fighting seemed to be Mostly contained on their carpet. and i wish i could say the same for Evolve. That is where i felt there was the most congestion on the floor. I may have just been lucky as i tend to plan my routes around the smaller vendor booths rather than the most direct way.

    And i will say this about the Indy Megabooth. That is one place i feel I have to visit at least twice per con. I love seeing all the stuff in there and finding new things to play. In years past it has taken me more than 30 min, just to walk the whole area because of congestion. this year felt significantly less crowded and better managed by the Enforcers. it only took my 10 min to oogle all the games on display. and that was on Friday morning.

    Overall I feel this year at PAX felt less cramped. But it also did not have as much to show compared to previous years for games that i am interested it. Great show though, no big complaints.

    The LOL regional location was the biggest improvement this year, while moving the Main theater to Benaroya Hall was the worst IMO.

  • bananabreadybananabready Registered User new member
    Would echo the TT concerns and augment them.

    First of all, for anyone who encountered me, SH, crashing their games--you are much appreciated. For true. I simply THANK YOU for letting me hear your passion for the games and then for the owners/creators, allowing me to barge in on you, (sometimes during your business meetings in the lounge at the Sheraton...oops...even while trying to pick your brain I tried to illustrate to your envious developer or investor I was there because you were worth it).

    To PAX, wonderful thing you've got going. I'm sad to hear the TT concerns but I understand them. GenCon does accommodate it's TT population way more...do with that what you will.

    And now a pause for the solemn memory of TT gaming...nay, not really...you see, TT gaming was our past and will be our future. Imagine a zombiepocalypse. Or a great depression. Friends and family will come together to came long after the TV has been killed.

    TT gaming is the foundation upon which all long-term video gaming is built.

    RESPECT!

    Game on!

    See you next year, (I'll be wearing a sport jacket; please forgive me.)

    -SH

    adias.angel
  • bananabreadybananabready Registered User new member
    *game

  • bananabreadybananabready Registered User new member
    Oh yeah, and some of the "enforcers" or whatever you call them were power trippin' on us all. Egads!

  • bananabreadybananabready Registered User new member
    *egads in this case = not good for business

  • dmosineedmosinee Davenport, IARegistered User regular
    Whenever ticket/registration availability comes up, someone always says 'all solutions have been discussed and there are big problems with them all,' but I have never seen any discussion around the simplest solution of all... charging more.

    I think anyone who looked at the current situation (10 minute window to get badges at $125 for anyone who is able to sit at a computer all day every day, $300+ on eBay/CL for everyone else) objectively would agree that it is not very equitable. I totally disagree with the notion that people who are able to sit with their finger over the mouse button deserve to go to pax more than people who work jobs away from computers or happen to be in a car/plane at the moment the sale goes live. My wife and I paid up for eBay badges for prime 2014 because we really wanted to go and it was still worth it at $300 -- but we were uneasy about the prospect of scams, and I would much rather have given money to Mike and Jerry et al than some eBay dude.

    I want to point out that scalping is not the real problem here -- it's annoying and looks bad, but it is just a symptom of the extreme supply and demand imbalance surrounding the badges. There are major logistical hurdles with increasing the supply of badges at this point (this has been discussed to death in many contexts), so the logical path to balance is to reduce demand by increasing the price.

    At $200 for a 4-day badge (and a similar increase for the day passes), I suspect it would take at least 12 hours to sell out, which would give a lot more people who really cared about it the chance to get one. It would also tamp down some/most of the scalping activity, as there would be significantly less potential profit in it. True, some people who went previously would get pushed out by this change -- but those would be the people who can't be bothered to scrape together an extra $75 for four full days of entertainment. The show would also generate more revenue, some of which could be used to address the other issues that the ballooning attendance has caused.

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  • zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    Charging more has absolutely been discussed every time this has been brought up. It's even been addressed by the folks that run PAX directly :)

    Spiritfirebacon_avenger
  • PedroAsaniPedroAsani Brotherhood of the Squirrel [Prime]Registered User regular
    edited October 2014
    Charging more would move the badges out of the hands of some people, into the hands of others. The core problem is Supply <<< Demand. How to fix it? Increase Supply. WSCC is expanding in a few years and until then the choices are to put up with it, or move to a different city with a bigger venue. Depending on the construction plan, the latter choice may be forced by the city of Seattle.

    Charging more would simply make more money, providing they sold the same number of tickets (which is likely). What could they do with the money? Better swag bags is a common thought, but what about a better experience? A few suggestions I have heard include getting Pike closed between 9th and 5th (side streets for access only), increasing security in the wake of this years badge-snatchers, and "getting rid of scalpers". That last one would seem to need a law put in place by Seattle. Lobbying fund? I don't think people would go for that much, unless once scalping was illegal any badges that were seized went right back on sale at face value. Then I think you would have fistfuls of cash thrown at you.

    Overall though, getting more PAX tickets is going to need radical change, and people don't like that. Moving PAX out of Seattle? Suggested, and caused quite a debate in these forums. Enlarging WSCC? In the works, but not going to happen overnight. Finding more space in Seattle? Say where, but they probably already looked there and couldn't get it or it was too far. Bumbleshoot being on the same weekend doesn't help. But that weekend is what allows PAX Prime to be 4 days, with the Labor Day weekend. There isn't another suitable time on the calendar to do something like this. Well, Memorial Day, but that's in May. If they ever wanted to take PAX East to 4 days, that would be the weekend to look at. and MLK Day would be for PAX South to go to 4 days. But for Prime? The only other day is in October. It's Columbus Day, but that would then require moving PAX Aus around...

    Like I said, radical change.

    PedroAsani on
  • Kirby4LifeKirby4Life Registered User regular
    PedroAsani wrote: »
    Charging more would move the badges out of the hands of some people, into the hands of others. The core problem is Supply <<< Demand. How to fix it? Increase Supply. WSCC is expanding in a few years and until then the choices are to put up with it, or move to a different city with a bigger venue. Depending on the construction plan, the latter choice may be forced by the city of Seattle.

    Charging more would simply make more money, providing they sold the same number of tickets (which is likely). What could they do with the money? Better swag bags is a common thought, but what about a better experience? A few suggestions I have heard include getting Pike closed between 9th and 5th (side streets for access only), increasing security in the wake of this years badge-snatchers, and "getting rid of scalpers". That last one would seem to need a law put in place by Seattle. Lobbying fund? I don't think people would go for that much, unless once scalping was illegal any badges that were seized went right back on sale at face value. Then I think you would have fistfuls of cash thrown at you.

    Overall though, getting more PAX tickets is going to need radical change, and people don't like that. Moving PAX out of Seattle? Suggested, and caused quite a debate in these forums. Enlarging WSCC? In the works, but not going to happen overnight. Finding more space in Seattle? Say where, but they probably already looked there and couldn't get it or it was too far. Bumbleshoot being on the same weekend doesn't help. But that weekend is what allows PAX Prime to be 4 days, with the Labor Day weekend. There isn't another suitable time on the calendar to do something like this. Well, Memorial Day, but that's in May. If they ever wanted to take PAX East to 4 days, that would be the weekend to look at. and MLK Day would be for PAX South to go to 4 days. But for Prime? The only other day is in October. It's Columbus Day, but that would then require moving PAX Aus around...

    Like I said, radical change.

    First part I agree with. Higher ticket prices wont change a thing. Second part about the swag bag I don't. The problem with better swag bags are the greed of the people. I remember the past 3 years I went, prior to this year, many people took multiple bags EVERY single day. I may not be the best at names but I can remember faces and I saw the same people going back for more bags. Whether its for LoL codes, CAH boosters, etc. WSCC is already planned to get bigger... All we can do is wait... And even then the problem wont be solved... PAX has gotten bigger than itself... THATS the problem.

  • dmosineedmosinee Davenport, IARegistered User regular
    PedroAsani wrote: »
    Charging more would move the badges out of the hands of some people, into the hands of others.

    Exactly. I posit that it would move badges out of the hands of many locals who only sort of care about the show, but still try to get as many tickets for themselves and friends as they can because they're dirt cheap (I can recall paying about as much for a 3D movie and snack as a 1-day Pax badge) into the hands of people who are more dedicated to being there and willing to pay more. I'm not talking about making them $1000 and only letting rich people attend -- anyone who truly cares can afford to pay true market price (let's say $60 for a 1-day) for an entire day of awesome entertainment that only comes up once a year.
    PedroAsani wrote: »
    The core problem is Supply <<< Demand. How to fix it? Increase Supply

    Or reduce demand.

    Sure it would be great if they could just all of a sudden have twice as many badges to sell, but that's not a realistic solution to the problem at least in the short term (and probably not even in the medium term). There are MAJOR logistical challenges associated with any attempt to increase supply at this point. So the choices are to either just live with the current system ($125 and official if you're lucky, $300 and shady if you're unlucky) or try to move it toward a point of balance where the people who really want to go are able to do so in an official way without resorting to a de facto lottery.

    If folks will riot just out of principal at the idea of Mike and Jerry making more money from it, then they could just donate the extra $ to Child's Play. Like I said above, my wife and I will go to Pax regardless -- the only question is who should make all the extra money on it, Child's Play or random eBay people?

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  • cursecurse Bellevue, WARegistered User regular
    dmosinee wrote: »
    anyone who truly cares can afford to pay true market price (let's say $60 for a 1-day) for an entire day of awesome entertainment that only comes up once a year.

    This statement is incorrect. There are plenty of people who would love to go and are already stretching their budgets. All you do with this proposal is shift the crowd attending to those with more money. And I'm saying this as someone who can afford to pay more. The implication that those that can't afford to pay more don't deserve to go or don't care is a bad assertion.

  • dmosineedmosinee Davenport, IARegistered User regular
    I would suggest that those who can't afford some moderate additional cost are no more deserving to go than people who aren't able to sit in front of the computer all day for weeks waiting for a tweet.

    In fact, I would suggest that the girl who skips going out to a eat for a few weeks, or passes on a new video game she wants in order to pay for a Pax badge is more deserving to go than the guy whose friend works a job where he is never more than 30 seconds away from a web browser.

    This is my opinion of course, and opinions differ -- but when contemplating a change to the status quo it should be compared to the status quo, and not to some third option that does not, and can not, exist (tons more badges for sale).

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  • zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    Making arguments about who deserves PAX more or less is ridiculous. This is not constructive feedback.

    ASimPersonDesert Leviathan
  • cursecurse Bellevue, WARegistered User regular
    zerzhul wrote: »
    Making arguments about who deserves PAX more or less is ridiculous. This is not constructive feedback.

    Agreed. Will stop now.

  • dmosineedmosinee Davenport, IARegistered User regular
    Ok I've said my piece about badge availability. As for things that happened at the actual show, I share the sentiment that the line-capping at certain booths/areas/events became a real issue.

    As others have said, it encourages people to just stand around in a big cloud clogging up areas while they wait to try and mad-scramble into the line as soon as it becomes uncapped. It would have been less disruptive to traffic flow etc if they just made the line twice as long, even if they had to cut into the walkway to do it; although who's to say that the double length line wouldn't just fill up and get capped too.

    There's no easy solution here, but maybe a few things could be done. I think the booth operators should be instructed to be a little more conscious of just how much volume they are likely to receive, and adjust their experience accordingly. I know everyone wants to have the most amazing booth in the show to get good press, but if the experience is long and only a relative handful at a time can go through (cough, Telltale) you're going to have major line issues and a lot of people won't even get a chance to line up to see it. I would also have loved if some of the slow booths had a kind of two-track line; where I could wait 3 hours to play a 20 minute demo, or wait 15 minutes to just walk through and look over the shoulder of a few demo players. At some booths the natural layout accommodated this kind of spectating, but the enclosed ones (Tales from the Borderlands and The Order 1866 stand out most) had zero visibility inside.

    I've seen proposals to have some kind of Disney-esque voucher system where if you return at a certain time you can enter the line, but I just can't see how it would be practical to operate at Pax. The enforcers did a very good job trying to manage the lines given the circumstances, but there's no way they could also administrate some kind of complicated voucher system at the same time.

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  • PedroAsaniPedroAsani Brotherhood of the Squirrel [Prime]Registered User regular
    dmosinee wrote: »
    I share the sentiment that the line-capping at certain booths/areas/events became a real issue.

    As others have said, it encourages people to just stand around in a big cloud clogging up areas while they wait to try and mad-scramble into the line as soon as it becomes uncapped. It would have been less disruptive to traffic flow etc if they just made the line twice as long, even if they had to cut into the walkway to do it; although who's to say that the double length line wouldn't just fill up and get capped too.

    Queuing theory and dozens of studies. If you draw a graph of times people are willing to wait for something, it usually looks like this with most people willing to accept a short wait, a rapid drop off as the wait time increases, and then the hardcore fans sticking around until they get what they are after, no matter how long it is.
    dmosinee wrote: »
    There's no easy solution here, but maybe a few things could be done. I think the booth operators should be instructed to be a little more conscious of just how much volume they are likely to receive, and adjust their experience accordingly. I know everyone wants to have the most amazing booth in the show to get good press, but if the experience is long and only a relative handful at a time can go through (cough, Telltale) you're going to have major line issues and a lot of people won't even get a chance to line up to see it. I would also have loved if some of the slow booths had a kind of two-track line; where I could wait 3 hours to play a 20 minute demo, or wait 15 minutes to just walk through and look over the shoulder of a few demo players. At some booths the natural layout accommodated this kind of spectating, but the enclosed ones (Tales from the Borderlands and The Order 1866 stand out most) had zero visibility inside.

    Throughput should be measured for each booth, and estimated wait times should be posted throughout the queue system. This one thing will handle queuing much better than has been done previously. Extending the queues where possible is a huge help, based on the graph above. If 50% of people are willing to wait 30 minutes but only 20% an hour, an hour long queue will stop most people camping the cap. A 30 minute queue will be camped and lead to people effectively jumping the queue. That gets frustrating, because we all have an innate sense of fairness about these things.
    dmosinee wrote: »
    I've seen proposals to have some kind of Disney-esque voucher system where if you return at a certain time you can enter the line, but I just can't see how it would be practical to operate at Pax. The enforcers did a very good job trying to manage the lines given the circumstances, but there's no way they could also administrate some kind of complicated voucher system at the same time.

    Disney have a large space and relatively few attractions compared to PAX. Something like this could be implemented, but you are looking at a system (first off the top of my head) where a PAX badge has a unique QR on the back, each booth has a reader, and it's all linked through an app on your phone so you can keep track of when you are supposed to be somewhere. That kind of system comes with huge costs, and could only be offset if either (a) it increased efficiency so much they were allowed to sell more tickets or (b) the flow data was of commercial interest to someone.

    dmosinee
  • PavioPavio Registered User regular
    I for one would like to see the tweets about "PAX is x% complete!" come to an end. They're just depressing. Constant reminders about the time you have left (or don't have left) takes you out of the moment. It's like spending your day off work thinking about how you have to go back to work tomorrow. For the life of me I can't understand why anyone thought that was a good idea.

    dfa8x4zsakr9.jpg


    LazorzmcdermottCodextehFishadias.angelThunderous_TNotoriusBENMalgaras
  • HodurHodur RedmondRegistered User regular
    I've been lucky enough to attend a lot of Primes, dating back to Bellevue. And I've seen on the boards a lot of the same discussions each year since it's gotten big. Here's the stuff I can think of that the PA group might actually be able to take into account and change (for example - they can't do anything about scalping - they just can't.)

    The LoL thing: I totally get why some people love it. When it first showed up, it amazed me and I thought it was great. But, honestly it's gotten too big to be "inside" a PAX hall. So, how about giving it a venue it deserves: Key Arena! Seriously. I've been in multiple conventions there over the years and we even had a few company meetings in there - it can work and work great for something like that. McCaw hall is also available for "rental" and holds 3000 people. The 5th Avenue theater holds 3000, the Moore theater holds 1800, the showbox holds 1100 standing (600 sitting). These would all be great venues to help expand PAX for stuff like this. Heck, I'd like to see MORE stuff like LoL during PAX - like the Halo tourney a few years ago (but at separate venues per above).

    Long lines at booths. Honestly - this is more on the exhibitors vs the PA crews. Far too many think that they not only own the space they've bought, but also the hallways surrounding their booths. BUT, what can be done is this: each booth is given the space they rent, and that's surrounded by visible markings on the ground. Booths cannot go beyond those markings (even with lines of people). They need to absorb the traffic they create to keep the halls clear for movement. (This was how COMDEX did it back in the day when it got huge and it works).

    Enforcers. I've definitely seen this change over the years as well. In the early days when getting a ticket wasn't an issue, enforcers truly were people who went to help, but I worry now it's just people who can't get a ticket and use the mechanism to get in. How to fix this? Go with the rule: if you get reported for being a douche, you won't be invited back (as an enforcer). Maybe even have some "secret shoppers" sort of thing - going up to them, asking for help, etc.

    Lastly - Two big things:

    I now bring my kids to PAX and I really appreciate the fact that they keep it pretty dang "family friendly" and I just wanted to let them know (if they read these things) that it's much appreciated.

    And the people who attend PAX is what makes it what it is. Keep on being cool to one another. Help people out when you see they need help. The little friendly gestures I see each year is what keeps me coming back.



    nixterbacon_avengervespachica
  • BekerBeker Child's Play Program Director SeattleRegistered User, Penny Arcade Staff regular
    Hodur wrote: »
    Enforcers. I've definitely seen this change over the years as well. In the early days when getting a ticket wasn't an issue, enforcers truly were people who went to help, but I worry now it's just people who can't get a ticket and use the mechanism to get in. How to fix this? Go with the rule: if you get reported for being a douche, you won't be invited back (as an enforcer). Maybe even have some "secret shoppers" sort of thing - going up to them, asking for help, etc.

    For everyone, If you ever have a negative interaction with an enforcer (or positive for that matter), please feel free to email Kristin (klindsay at penny-arcade.com). She manages the enforcers and even if you don't catch their handle, if you can describe where you interacted with them, what time, and a decent description we can probably identify who it was. Or if you think about it during the PAX, come to the Info Booth, she (or a proxy like me) is often there and happy to chat. There are literally thousands of enforcers with the 4 shows at this point and we are always working on identifying opportunities to educate and improve our enforcer community. They are still an amazing group, and we strive to keep them that way.

    -Beker/Erick
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  • SanDogWepsSanDogWeps Limerick Monger San DiegoRegistered User regular
    The Enforcers out front of the WSCC doing the counterfeit badge checking are a spectacular bunch, but I wish they were better advertised. Scalping/reselling is going to happen - see plenty of other threads. But perhaps a community effort could be made to "helpfully" let buyers know to go get their badges verified before handing over their hard earned coin. Maybe even a twitter alert saying "Hey folks! There's some counterfeit badges out there that are COMPLETELY MISSING the back side!" Forewarned is forearmed.

    Oh - and Cookie Brigade on Demand - however this happens, keep it up. I think they deploy sensors that detect stomach rumbling and suddenly there's someone there selling cookies.

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    LazorzRhea_starstorm
  • YoungFreyYoungFrey Registered User regular
    SanDogWeps wrote: »
    The Enforcers out front of the WSCC doing the counterfeit badge checking are a spectacular bunch, but I wish they were better advertised. Scalping/reselling is going to happen - see plenty of other threads. But perhaps a community effort could be made to "helpfully" let buyers know to go get their badges verified before handing over their hard earned coin. Maybe even a twitter alert saying "Hey folks! There's some counterfeit badges out there that are COMPLETELY MISSING the back side!" Forewarned is forearmed.
    .

    I think Twitter/forums/newsposts are all going to ever only reach a fraction of the audience. Not everybody is that tied in. A visible sign by every/most entrance will do way more than those will.

  • PedroAsaniPedroAsani Brotherhood of the Squirrel [Prime]Registered User regular
    YoungFrey wrote: »
    SanDogWeps wrote: »
    The Enforcers out front of the WSCC doing the counterfeit badge checking are a spectacular bunch, but I wish they were better advertised. Scalping/reselling is going to happen - see plenty of other threads. But perhaps a community effort could be made to "helpfully" let buyers know to go get their badges verified before handing over their hard earned coin. Maybe even a twitter alert saying "Hey folks! There's some counterfeit badges out there that are COMPLETELY MISSING the back side!" Forewarned is forearmed.
    .

    I think Twitter/forums/newsposts are all going to ever only reach a fraction of the audience. Not everybody is that tied in. A visible sign by every/most entrance will do way more than those will.

    Yes. This is a note for all sections of all PAXen: more signage for everything, everywhere. Naming the theaters is cool, but please also use the convention center room numbers unless you plan on replacing/covering the convention center signs with your own. I've been to all four venues and whether you are familiar with the layout or in a brand new space, the benefits of signage cannot be overstated. So adding large signs for "Counterfeit Badge Checks" is good, but adding "[PAX Theater Name, Convention Centre Room Number]" is better.

  • Aardvark VulgarAardvark Vulgar Registered User regular
    edited March 2015
    I'm not sure if it's iust me but over the past years I've noticed the panel freebies has been dropping. I don't want to sound greedy when I say I want free handouts but I do like the small gifts they used to give, such as DLC codes or small swag that could be tossed a month later. This year I attended the most panels of all the PAXs that I've gone to. Of the 8+ panels only one gave stuff to their attendees.
    I don't want much but a small hand out is always appreciated, especially since most panels take 2-3 hours total including wait time and the panel itself.

    Does anyone else agree with me or am I the only one? I remember getting water bottles, shirts, codes ect in years past. I think dlc codes are the easiest and cheapest for most companies and if they could do that I know it would make people happy at the most cost efficient way.

    I typed this up on my phone, sorry for any spelling or grammar errors.

    Aardvark Vulgar on
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  • WolfmanASTNWolfmanASTN Registered User regular
    I'm not sure if it's been posted yet or not, but I would love for there to be an official cosplay contest at the show, that way we'd be able to use one of the theaters. There are a few booths that do contests, but they're extremely limited to how many people can enter and everything is confined to their booth space.

  • kylechukylechu Registered User regular
    I know this thread is old and that there's a lot of moving pieces when it comes to scheduling panels, but I think panels that rely heavily on audience interaction (like Pitch Your Game Idea) should be on Friday - Sunday and not Monday if possible. When they're on a Monday morning, fewer people turn up, and it ends up less entertaining. While Pitch Your Game Idea was alright last year, it was nowhere near as much fun as it used to be, which I'm sure could be attributed to other factors like me turning into a jaded old man, but I feel like at least some of the blame lies with it being on a Monday morning with a relatively thin crowd.

  • DashDDashD Dread Pirate Chef Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    I'm not sure if it's been posted yet or not, but I would love for there to be an official cosplay contest at the show, that way we'd be able to use one of the theaters. There are a few booths that do contests, but they're extremely limited to how many people can enter and everything is confined to their booth space.

    My response to this is going to make it sound as if I don't like cosplay and cosplayers. I don't. I have huge respect for the costumes they make and the time they put into it.

    That said, PAX has never encouraged cosplay. They don't discourage it, either. There is a time and place for cosplay and PAX really isn't it. If someone wants to dress in their favorite character's outfit, that's fine. When those characters have a six foot wingspan or a tail, etc, it makes that dark, already overcrowded floor that much harder to navigate.

    There are already so many conventions that have cosplay contests, PAX doesn't really need one, too.


    "Brilliant! Oh wait, if we were meant to fly, we would have been born with little bags of nuts."
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  • PedroAsaniPedroAsani Brotherhood of the Squirrel [Prime]Registered User regular
    DashD wrote: »
    I'm not sure if it's been posted yet or not, but I would love for there to be an official cosplay contest at the show, that way we'd be able to use one of the theaters. There are a few booths that do contests, but they're extremely limited to how many people can enter and everything is confined to their booth space.

    My response to this is going to make it sound as if I don't like cosplay and cosplayers. I don't. I have huge respect for the costumes they make and the time they put into it.

    That said, PAX has never encouraged cosplay. They don't discourage it, either. There is a time and place for cosplay and PAX really isn't it. If someone wants to dress in their favorite character's outfit, that's fine. When those characters have a six foot wingspan or a tail, etc, it makes that dark, already overcrowded floor that much harder to navigate.

    There are already so many conventions that have cosplay contests, PAX doesn't really need one, too.

    Actually, an official cosplay competition in one of the theaters might alleviate both your issues.

    I agree that large costumes make navigating the expo floor and even the corridors problematic. It's something that people need to realise when putting their stuff together. A dedicated space would be useful for people to show off their creations and then change into something easier to navigate the show floor. Cospitality Lounge is a good start. Give them room to expand and it will help. (I know asking for space at PAX is like asking for water on the moon.)

    An additional help would be dedicated photo space. Every year temporary blockages are set up by people wanting to take pictures of cosplayers. And who wouldn't? They put some cool stuff together. But it's always in the worst place for high density foot traffic. Work out somewhere they can do this without causing a roadblock.

    Finally, a few etiquette pointers for cosplaers would be good. Remember your bulk and pointy bits are going to be an inconvenience and frustration to those around you unless you take care. Consider changing out of the larger parts before venturing into the expo floor or attending a panel. Obviously if you are going there to show it off to the creator, you need the full regalia. But otherwise, consider trimming down to something crowds can deal with.

    As a Cosplayer, I apologize to all those I poked with my antlers. I try and follow my own advice, but I am a dumb meat sack as we all are sometimes.

  • zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    DashD wrote: »
    I'm not sure if it's been posted yet or not, but I would love for there to be an official cosplay contest at the show, that way we'd be able to use one of the theaters. There are a few booths that do contests, but they're extremely limited to how many people can enter and everything is confined to their booth space.
    There is a time and place for cosplay and PAX really isn't it.
    Considering all the talented cosplayers that attend PAX in costume, I think this couldn't be further from the truth.

    PAX doesn't hold cosplay competitions, imo, because the only competitions they hold are game tournaments. A cosplay competition is a great place for someone to excel with a panel, which is community or industry submitted content as opposed to PAX provided content.

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