This being my second PAX experience (and second PAX South), I have to say this was a vast improvement over last year.
Most of my comments have already been mentioned but I’ll repeat them anyways.
One of my favorite parts of last year was walking through and testing the indie tabletop games. I didn’t really get to do that this year – very crowded and very cramped.
As to the TT area, it was night and day from last year. Last year, you could have cleared the tables out and played a life-size game of Blood Bowl and you wouldn’t have bothered anyone. I actually found the crowds in the TT area a good thing. I also liked the fact there was somewhat of a split of TT vendors and PC vendors/accessories between the two areas. There were a couple of TT tourneys that filled up extremely quickly though. I’m not sure how that works in setup, but there was definitely room for expansion on the tourneys.
And like people have mentioned, the Twitch backup at the entrance to the Expo hall was kind of irritating, especially on Saturday.
All in all though, it was a thumbs up noticeable improvement over last year.
Overall I had a WONDERFUL time, and honestly the enforcers were so great it has made me want to be one after I get another couple of PAXes under my belt (this is my second one, though the first I actually got to enjoy because I got a pretty bad infection on the first day of Prime 14).
But a few things I think that could be worked on are:
-The Expo Hall was so cramped. Now I know that there will be a lot of people in one place, but the actual slots that many of the devs and vendors were assigned were just tiny, and it made trying to play some games and browse some items very hard without being jostled by other people or feeling like you are in someone's way. Perhaps remove the food from the hall entirely, put it elsewhere (I saw a lot of unused rooms), so there is more room for exhibitors and their booths?
-I am not sure if there is a reason for this, but why did everything close down so early on Sunday? The console freeplay room would not even let us check out a game at like 5PM on Sunday. I just remember there being a lot more to do when the expo hall closed at 6 at Prime on the last day.
-Speaking of the console freeplay room it felt a little understocked. Most of the time we went there the games we wanted to play were out of stock, and there were so few systems too... and really, one saturn, with one controller, and one game? I still had a lot of fun there, but some systems like the N64 and Gamecube were almost ALWAYS out of stock. Trying to play a Mario Party or Kart was a lot of work and waiting.
-I second sentiments about there not being enough places to sit. There were very few benches and chairs, and they were usually taken. Lot of open space for them to be placed too, which was odd.
-Not sure if it is a convention thing, but the food was VERY overpriced compared to the quality. Like if the quality was better I might not mind the price, but it felt pretty cheap.
-Another thing: new to this, but oh gosh, why were the pins so terribly, TERRIBLY overpriced? Besides them the swag prices were fairly reasonable (though 35 dollars for a water bottle is kind of steep, but it was a pretty nice one), but really, like 10 dollars for a pin? Even 25 for 3 and 30 for 4 was pretty dang steep. They are just little pieces of painted metal... rather cool ones I will admit, and I wish I could have collected them and put them on my lanyard, but my gosh, that much money for such a tiny, functionless item.
Either way it was a really great time. I just think a few things could be improved for a better experience.
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whypick1PAX [E] Info Booth Manager~2' from an LCDRegistered Userregular
-I am not sure if there is a reason for this, but why did everything close down so early on Sunday? The console freeplay room would not even let us check out a game at like 5PM on Sunday. I just remember there being a lot more to do when the expo hall closed at 6 at Prime on the last day.
We had to completely clear out of the third floor by midnight, so CFP wound up closing a bit earlier on Sunday than the other departments. Officially all the attendees need to be out the door by 7, so shortly after 6 is when the freeplay rooms start nudging people out.
Likewise, PAX closes earlier on Sunday because we do need to get out of the building at some point, and that involves a lot of Enforcers and exhibitors busting their asses to teardown stuff on Sunday in order to be done/almost done by Monday AM.
I see a lot of people talking about the convention food and concession areas. I actually thought it was great. I mean taste and all meh, but great for convention stuff. You could eat a meal for ten bucks! That is amazing for convention food. I liked it being on both sides. Made it easy to work your way through the Expo, grab a snack and walk back to BYOC.
I think establishing those areas as sitting areas also helps for those that needed more seating near the Expo hall. It gave "settling" spots in multiple locations. Also for those who were looking for food options, there are many places that deliver to right outside the convention center, and a great bike waiter service. We ordered "in" several times. They even brought stuff to the back door for us, let's talk about convenient. (we might have been too busy with pc tourny to leave and called for coldstone milkshakes delivered to our door. Best five bucks I have ever spent not giving up my pax hour to walk there and back lol)
I agree things seemed to close down a little early. I think they were a bit short staffed this year. (? correct me if Im wrong but its the explanation I was given) We BYOC, so sometimes we tend to let the crowds go, then run over at 11:15 for things (like merch raffle thingy) and they had closed early the last two nights.
That was my only complaint about BYOC this year as well. Not sticking to their schedule, or merely not posting when things were happening.
If you give times, stick to them. IE. if it doesn't say it closes til 12, keep it open. If a tourney starts at 2, make it as close to that as possible. We plan our day around these schedules. They need to be reliable and apparent.
Speaking of BYOC. Anyone upset about not enough PC freeplay, check out BYOC. Its the only way I can do PAX now. Its amazing. Feel free to message me if you want more info.
I am in agreement the Indie showcase needs way more space. Especially since Pax South is using this as its core theme almost. It deserves to be more of a focal point.
I like the PAX Arena. It should get some va va va voom. Jazz it up a bit more. Change up the games/platforms. Make it a finale stage for tournies. Something thats more than "oo ya.. and there are people playing smash over there." I think the location right next to the Hearthstone setup was also a deterrent. Pax goers, in my experience, want to do, not watch. Have to make them feel actively engaged or make it a good lounging point.
The expo floor felt like a replica of last year. Some changes, but very few new things. We saw dreadnought last year. We saw twitch, and superfight and most of the games were repeats. I get that they need to advertise and pax itself grew, so their audience changed, but I didn't see a lot of "new". My new game pile was small this year. I cant remember an East where I have felt like oo ive seen all of this before. I also understand that they apply to PA for a spot, but maybe try to recruit some fresh blood. Maybe expand indie world.
In contrast to others, I actually thought the expo hall was roomy. I had room to move through most except at booths where the booth owners had bottle necked themselves. Maybe I went at not as peak times (as mentioned we do that on purpose), but we specifically commented at the show that it seemed to have wider lanes and walk ways than we remembered. It was very spacious for any expo hall ive seen.
Table top does need to grow. As it seems this is going to be the table top pax (which I totally love), more people who want that are coming. Im presuming that PA already knows this, and it will probably be planned without us saying things lol.
MTG was well run, I enjoyed the schedule and its location with tabletop.
This was a great PAX. The show was better than last year overall, but definitely more low-key. My notes:
- Where were the big local developers? Gearbox, Bioware, and id/Zenimax all seem to have upcoming titles. Cloud Imperium would have been a great catch.
- I didn't understand what PAX Rising was until I visited some of the booths in that section. I didn't see anything about it on the website or the Guidebook app. Did I miss something?
- Indie Tabletop needed more space. They seemed too squished together for something that was featured on the website and show guide.
- Twitch ought to scale down or move back from the entrance a bit. Their presence creates traffic jams, and I suppose generating attention is the point -- but traffic jams are irritating.
- Tabletop freeplay could have been a bit larger. It was difficult to find a table on Saturday afternoon that wasn't reserved for tournaments. I think I would prefer more tables than necessary than fewer. Not using part of the large queue hall for Tabletop seemed odd.
- Regarding concerts, I only caught The Protomen on Friday. Their sound mix was great, much better than the mix for anything I heard at last year's concerts. Someone said earplugs were freely available -- great idea!
- The Enforcers were great, but some didn't seem to be enforcing lines, booth spaces, reducing clumping in the walkways, etc in the Expo Hall. I saw a few cosplayers posing for pictures on the show floor without any [E]s around to ask them not to. I did make it a point to thank an [E] that was managing the crowd around Twitch on Saturday.
- $4 for a soda seems excessive.
- The convention center staff locked the Riverwalk level doors in the early evening. That made getting into the building from the Riverwalk a bit inconvenient. Please ask them to not do this. I'm fine with being ushered directly onto the escalators to go up a level, but locking me out entirely is weird.
All of the above issues are minor and based solely on my observations. I haven't vetted them for accuracy beyond my own point-of-view, so feel free to correct me if I'm off-base.
Some highlights, a.k.a. "Keep Enabling These Things:"
- My cousin and her friend PAX'd for the first time at this South. They had a blast and they'll be back.
- The cousin was incredibly impressed by the con's positive attitude and the Diversity Lounge/panel content in particular.
- I loved that Capcom was there, and that they brought a game I had never heard about before.
- A six-player, five-hour game of Eldritch Horror on Saturday.
- Randomly stumbling across The Doubleclicks in Jamspace on Sunday. I bought one of their CDs as the con was closing. They are lovely people.
- Someone cosplaying as a balloonicorn and handing out gummy bears* from a hotel ice bucket bombed a friend's picture in front of the giant PAX South logo Friday night.
- All of the indie devs and tabletop creators I got to talk to.
- Meeting Palpitatertot (congrats!) and Friend in the raffle line.
- That Omega Final.
* At least, we think they were gummy bears. My friend seemed alright after eating it. I did advise him against that. Balloonicorn-Guy was stopped by an [E] and con-center staff a moment after this, so we didn't say anything.
- The convention center staff locked the Riverwalk level doors in the early evening. That made getting into the building from the Riverwalk a bit inconvenient. Please ask them to not do this. I'm fine with being ushered directly onto the escalators to go up a level, but locking me out entirely is weird.
I think those were just locked the whole time. I stepped out there Friday and Sunday around noon to take some pictures and the doors were locked then too. I think it's just to funnel everyone through the security line for badge and bag checking.
I'll throw my hat in for the need for Signup boards in the Tabletop area.
I saw a handful of TT RPGs played and ran some, but would like a better way to organize & advertise physically there.
Playing D&D (or whatever) takes a long time and people need to know so they can prepare that against their already busy schedules.
Year 1 it was too much space & not enough people
Year 2 was packed. So please plan to expand next year.
I would like to throw in a quick 2 cents about console free play:
I understand that with the new xbox one, games need to be preinstalled to actually run. However, I would get sent to machines with my game, then have to sit there for 30-40 minutes while my game installed just to play. Once it installed, I would then try to play local co cop or something similar, but then I was required to be connected to xbox live to play.
I really have no idea how to fix this, but I found it rather frustrating that I wasted an hour of my PAX time literally staring at a blank screen
<@heels> Ravenger: i do not talk to anyone
<+Ravenger> you are talking to me
<@heels> oh god, what am i doing
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xiosGamer, Artist, Interesting mind seekerAustin, TXRegistered Userregular
Had a a great time at PAX this year as I did the year before. SA has some nice restaurants close by, though finding parking was crazy hard. Some minor improvements to the layout, some fun panels on Friday and Saturday - the best Worst Apps and Cliffy B's were among my favorites. Sunday's didn't have any that particularly perked my interest and I know a number of people who felt the same. Like others are saying, maybe there needs to be some bigger players involved next year all around.
My one minor gripe was how the UT2K4 tourney was organized and handled. Great classic game choice but not put together well. Please allow me to preface this with *I'm not bitter about it whatsoever*, but as someone who has helped run numerous tourneys in the past - it could have been ran a lot better with just a few small changes. The minute I sat down, we were given no time to setup any binds or adjust any settings - it was just go and do what you can, with 20 people on a map I've never seen before and I have played a ton of maps for UT*. Granted that's fairly okay in a game where everyone's spawning around each other all the time and there isn't any real strategy, it made no sense to use it for a game between the two finalists as well (ended up another guy and myself). The 100 armor on the map was in some well hidden location you could only get to from a lift which I did not know about while the opponent did. If a stock, well known duel map for the game was chosen, such as Rankin, Ironic or Roughinery then it would have been perfectly fine - or even if we were given time to warm up and find out the location of the hidden powerup - it would have been okay. The way we started our duel also, it wasn't restart the serve and game, it was okay everyone leave the server and now you two guys are left so fight it out. I was already at low health and it made me wonder how fair that really was as the beginning of a duel which only lasts 5 minutes doesn't leave much time for comebacks off a bad start. So in the future, atleast give everyone a few minutes to get their binds and mouse sensitivity set. I realize too that the tourney was just for fun and there wasn't any official prizes but that's my 2 cent's to have made it more fun. It just felt really rushed and my experience was something I would pass on next time if it's done in the same manner. I hope this can be some advice for next years tourney if you decide to do one.
Not so much constructive as construction, it looks like PAX was the last expo to need the old section of the convention center, went past on my way out this morning, they're putting up fencing for the knockdown.
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BekerChild's Play Program DirectorSeattleRegistered User, Penny Arcade Staffregular
Just wanted to say thank you for all the feedback, and I hope you keep it coming. While we can't implement all your suggestions, sometimes opinions vary, and often there are reasons for doing what we do, we do very much appreciate you taking the time to let us know your thoughts.
I will say if you ever notice things that are easy to fix on site, i'm thinking of the bathrooms missing TP or the hand sanitizers empty, please let the Info Booth know if you can. We can make a call and get those things resolved to improve the experience for you and others.
PAX is certainly a vast and complicated show, it often does take a few visits before you get the feel for everything that exists at it and how all the little bits work. I'd recommend for any new people to take the time to read the program, it explains how many of the area's work, and until next time, get involved in this and other communities. The Community is who puts on the pre and post PAX parties, organizes free play sessions in TT, and makes PAX the very special thing that it is.
I loved Pax this year!! This was my second time (first south was my first) and I only have one suggestion for next year.
Would there be any way to put one bag check station on the river walk level of the convention? It could get set up after the con opened (set it up at like 11 or so) and then when people go down to the river walk we don't have to hike all the way back up to the main entrance. There was already convention staff at all those doors making sure we didn't go back in so I don't think it would stretch the staff to thin to set up one bag check down there.
But other than that I absolutely loved it!! And I don't know who did a weather dance to make it so dang nice this weekend but thank you to who ever it was!
Also, it would be nice for organized RPG play to be able to set up a space.
Pathfinder Society & D&D Adventurers League could better represent if they could carve out some reserved space.
You folks should try to collaborate with the San Antonio Food Truck Association (SAFTA) to get food trucks at the convention center during the convention.
I don't know this for sure but I am guessing the convention center has some kind of clause that does not allow this, due to them having their own internal food vendors. I go to a few conventions at that convention center a year, and have never seen food trucks nearby for any events that I can recall.
It's probably more like they don't let 'em down the Riverwalk area at all.
The past few years that I've been to Blizzcon, there have been food trucks right outside the convention center, and I want to say Anime Expo has done it before as well, but I like to think these are generally exceptions to the rule.
This was my first Pax South and honestly I feel like going to a few primes before may have spoiled it for me.
I have nothing against San Antonio but I highly doubt I will return for another Pax south (or even go to Pax Aus or East) but the limited amount of games on display coupled with having no big companies (no microsoft, nintendo, sony etc etc) left me with little I wanted to really check out (no offense to indie games but only a few did anything for me this year). Due to this I ended up playing more MTG with my buddy than usual (again this isn't terrible as we had lots of fun playing 2hg as its super rare to see 2hg events after pre-release etc) but doing that on both the friday & saturday left us a little underwhelmed with Pax South.
Saying all of that we arrived in San Antonio early and loved the place. The people (enforcers included) are some of the nicest people you can meet and we didn't come across a single person who was grumpy and felt put out with helping or giving directions and the riverwalk is an exceptional place to walk around - Also the river cruise for $8 is an absolute must cannot recommend that enough
Oh my goodness
Oh my Dayum
Oh my goodness
They goin' Ham
It's cool that there are such different types of people that go to PAX The reasons you just listed as why you might stick to Prime are many of the reasons that I think South might be my favorite
Oh I just remembered this and thought I'd throw it in. On the Thursday evening before PAX I was walking in front of the convention center just to scope the place out. A group of 5 or so elderly men were standing out front talking. I thought it odd that they would be interested in PAX so I listened in while I walked past them. Turns out they were part of the convention center crew. I overheard one praising the Enforcers saying that they would do a great job running everything inside and would clean the place up after everyone left so the other guys didn't have to worry about the place getting trashed or anything. I thought that was pretty cool to hear.
It's cool that there are such different types of people that go to PAX The reasons you just listed as why you might stick to Prime are many of the reasons that I think South might be my favorite
I was thinking this exact thing as you said it. We use south as our friends weekend. The expo floor is a side note, id still like it to have some new shiny things, but the pace and the city help make it easy to veg with friends and enjoying playing with each other rather just play new games.
Oh I just remembered this and thought I'd throw it in. On the Thursday evening before PAX I was walking in front of the convention center just to scope the place out. A group of 5 or so elderly men were standing out front talking. I thought it odd that they would be interested in PAX so I listened in while I walked past them. Turns out they were part of the convention center crew. I overheard one praising the Enforcers saying that they would do a great job running everything inside and would clean the place up after everyone left so the other guys didn't have to worry about the place getting trashed or anything. I thought that was pretty cool to hear.
While I only speak for myself and not PA or other [E] it is nice to hear this kind of thing from both employees of CC's or attendees. I believe we try of hardest to make it so
It's cool that there are such different types of people that go to PAX The reasons you just listed as why you might stick to Prime are many of the reasons that I think South might be my favorite
I'd say I like them both for all these reasons. Prime West is the big whiz-bang so much to see and do show, while South is the chill show to hang out with my buddies, at least for now.
Well seeing as this was my third Pax (the other two were east 2014 & 2015) i only have those to go off of. Lets start with the city. San Antonio's atmosphere was great. Friendly people, great weather and pretty good margaritas. This was the third time i also participated in the pre-pax pub crawl fundraiser as well. That of coarse was great and gotta say we kicked butt ($7K raised for Child's Play). The floor was, like many people have previously posted, congested near the entrance. But besides that i found the crowds tolerable and the Devs were all very friendly. The indie showcase, thou it was smaller than what I'm used to at east, was great and i did not find it hard to navigate it. Lets talk people. The thing that i appreciate the most and what strikes a cord with me is the people. My wife has been part of Pax for some time now and she has since brought me into the fold. I have not once felt excluded from anything and everyone is willing to explain and or play pretty much any board game you could think of. I guess my con would be like stated before, there needs to be more space for things such as the free play board games section. Other than this i had a great time and can't wait till next year.
This was a great PAX. The show was better than last year overall, but definitely more low-key. My notes:
- I didn't understand what PAX Rising was until I visited some of the booths in that section. I didn't see anything about it on the website or the Guidebook app. Did I miss something?
- Someone cosplaying as a balloonicorn and handing out gummy bears* from a hotel ice bucket bombed a friend's picture in front of the giant PAX South logo Friday night. * At least, we think they were gummy bears. My friend seemed alright after eating it. I did advise him against that. Balloonicorn-Guy was stopped by an [E] and con-center staff a moment after this, so we didn't say anything.
1. I am just now hearing about PAX Rising, so you're not alone and in fact are one up on me
2. Do you have this pic, would be humorous (I think there's a stickie where you can share with forum)?
Had a a great time at PAX this year as I did the year before. SA has some nice restaurants close by, though finding parking was crazy hard.
I may be an old hat in this regard, but driving and parking, especially in downtown/Alamo district is usually not advisable due to all the traffic and one-way streets, unless you're used to it. There are, however a lot of parking garages and lots where you can walk around the area. I think this was one of the reasons they chose the area as it is largely pedestrian friendly.
And finally, praises be unto the fickle lords of Texas weather for they hath shown great splendor upon thine city of Saint Anthony. Hark upon thy bretherin within these hallowed forums who recount the frigid premiere PAX South with the gusting teen wind chills. Amen.
Everything was great again, my only real complaint is something I don't think there's much to be done about.
Tabletop is clearly one of the main reasons a lot of people are coming to PAX South, myself included. As has been mentioned, it was very crowded this year, which is a good thing!
The problem is the tables. They're long and thin, which is fine for a group of 3-4 people playing a small game. Anything bigger than that needs a round table, which were in very scarce supply. We ended up having to play several large games (10+ players) at a long table, and the background volume from packing so many people into such a tight space meant that anybody at either end of our group would have immense difficulty hearing what was going on -- and many times they would have to stand up and reach over people in the center of the group to move pieces or even hear people talking/be heard themselves.
If it's even possible to expand the tabletop area beyond expectations, I think it's a great idea. I really missed the intimate feeling from my first PAX where there was plenty of room for games/people's possessions/food and drinks and it was easy for everybody to hear everybody else and to be heard. Whether that can be accomplished by having more seating to accommodate large groups or by spacing things out more or whatever, I have no idea, and so there's little to no expectation on my part that something be done.
But this is an extremely minor nitpick and it didn't have such a negative effect on my overall experience that I'm not planning on coming back next year regardless.
And finally, praises be unto the fickle lords of Texas weather for they hath shown great splendor upon thine city of Saint Anthony. Hark upon thy bretherin within these hallowed forums who recount the frigid premiere PAX South with the gusting teen wind chills. Amen.
Yes, that was a definite improvement over last year. I'm glad Khoo was able to negotiate a better rate for sunshine.
As I continue my Post PAX Depression/High two weeks later I thought I'd finally share my thoughts.
As was mentioned - the Indie show case was a little too close together. It's not something I thought about too much... Because I didn't try to get in there. The games in the indie showcase got less exposure in my view because they were close together. As compared to games in other booths where I would just sit down in a tiny booth with a couple people and play. I only interacted with the games on the edge of the indie showcase.
I'm not sure how relevant this will be given the construction on the convention center... But for the love of all which is holy and not... Have better maps of the overall convention center. I could not explain, using the map, how to get to the Falcon theater from the queue hall. Also - I didn't see a good explanation of PAX Arena or PAX Rising in the guide book. I'm still not clear on what exactly "PAX Rising" was...
I also was weirdly disappointed by the ads in the guidebook. Looking at the ads in the guidebook is the first thing I do at PAX as the ads will often make me want to check out a certain booth I may not have otherwise noticed. But I felt like there was only one or two which somewhat interested me at South. Were there fewer ads?
Anyhow! Overall I loved it. South revitalized me and I'm still carrying on the positive energy which I acquired from PAX. I love how South manages to be chill and energizing at the same time.
I want to thank everybody for being amazing! Attendees, enforcers, magical people behind the curtains... You're all beautiful and make PAX a wonderful experience that I look forward too all year long! I had a glorious PAX, and look forward to the next South. (And West. And *hopefully* East.)
uhhhg, they are doing the same thing with the post pax surveys that get emailed. For as much as they try to be progressive with the gender classification question by offering more than the standard male/female choices, when it comes to the race question, it's pretty restrictive. I understand why restrictive choices can be more useful when collecting data with surveys, and I imagine the extra options for the gender thing is to earn good PR and liberal brownie points, but it kinda gets undone when multiracial people can't indicate more than one race, Black people who aren't American aren't covered because of the description African American, and Native American isn't even listed as a race.
Every year I see the oddly super progressive gender question next to other demographic data which is not progressive, it kinda feels like all the things like the diversity lounge and queer focused panels are not because of actual concern for these groups, but simply because these groups have been caught up in internet fight flame wars in the past with the penny arcade guys.
Having spent a lot of time in the diversity lounge, I think I'd say that it really doesn't matter what the genesis of their inclusion is - they are included. Cynicism and letting the perfect be the enemy of the good doesn't foster progress.
I had a blast as PAX and only have one suggestion. I have a 5yo and 2yo, understandably they get tired walking around he convention so i have a stroller to push them around. I only brought them on Sunday but was not allowed to bring the stroller into the vendor area. I was told I would have to go down to the first floor to security area to drop my stroller off then come back up. If strollers are not allowed in could you please carve out a space near the entrance so that we can park them close by.
The problem is the tables. They're long and thin, which is fine for a group of 3-4 people playing a small game. Anything bigger than that needs a round table, which were in very scarce supply.
Very late reply, but I wanted to chime in on this since I was in the tabletop area for most of every day. I'm pretty sure the area will be expanded this year with the new convention space opening up. But another problem with the round tables is etiquette, which is tough to enforce. I often saw groups of two sitting at the rounds, playing a game that would actually be better at a long table (like 2-player card games), because they didn't want to squeeze in and get friendly at the long tables. It's natural for everyone to spread out, but it makes it especially tough on larger gaming groups that's for sure.
Maybe set aside tables with signs indicating they are reserved for games playing 6+ players? I dunno. At least if something like that was displayed, it would allow us or an Enforcer to politely come up and say, "Hey, we'd really like to use this space, since you have 3 players could you fill in one of the empty slots elsewhere?"
For me Pax South is a perfect "Starter" Pax. It's smaller, more community driven IMO. It was nice to just go and hang out with the Twitch casters and just talk about games and life with them. Having known some of them for over 3-4yrs it was a pleasure to finally meet the guys and girls I support daily.
The problem is the tables. They're long and thin, which is fine for a group of 3-4 people playing a small game. Anything bigger than that needs a round table, which were in very scarce supply.
Very late reply, but I wanted to chime in on this since I was in the tabletop area for most of every day. I'm pretty sure the area will be expanded this year with the new convention space opening up. But another problem with the round tables is etiquette, which is tough to enforce. I often saw groups of two sitting at the rounds, playing a game that would actually be better at a long table (like 2-player card games), because they didn't want to squeeze in and get friendly at the long tables. It's natural for everyone to spread out, but it makes it especially tough on larger gaming groups that's for sure.
Maybe set aside tables with signs indicating they are reserved for games playing 6+ players? I dunno. At least if something like that was displayed, it would allow us or an Enforcer to politely come up and say, "Hey, we'd really like to use this space, since you have 3 players could you fill in one of the empty slots elsewhere?"
Or people could just sit down at an 8 person round table and play besides them. This is how we make friends and invite others to join games. People usually arent bothered if you sit down and are like "hey were gonna play this awesome game right here, you are welcome to join us"
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KetarCome on upstairswe're having a partyRegistered Userregular
The problem is the tables. They're long and thin, which is fine for a group of 3-4 people playing a small game. Anything bigger than that needs a round table, which were in very scarce supply.
Very late reply, but I wanted to chime in on this since I was in the tabletop area for most of every day. I'm pretty sure the area will be expanded this year with the new convention space opening up. But another problem with the round tables is etiquette, which is tough to enforce. I often saw groups of two sitting at the rounds, playing a game that would actually be better at a long table (like 2-player card games), because they didn't want to squeeze in and get friendly at the long tables. It's natural for everyone to spread out, but it makes it especially tough on larger gaming groups that's for sure.
Maybe set aside tables with signs indicating they are reserved for games playing 6+ players? I dunno. At least if something like that was displayed, it would allow us or an Enforcer to politely come up and say, "Hey, we'd really like to use this space, since you have 3 players could you fill in one of the empty slots elsewhere?"
Or people could just sit down at an 8 person round table and play besides them. This is how we make friends and invite others to join games. People usually arent bothered if you sit down and are like "hey were gonna play this awesome game right here, you are welcome to join us"
That's fine advice for small to medium groups, but that doesn't really help actual large groups looking to use a full table and possibly pull up some extra chairs.
I want to echo what others have said: There weren't enough tables in the TT area. Since South is developing a rep as a TT-focused event, this needs to be resolved. Over-budget room for TT. Many are also saying that a perceived-light panel schedule led them to spend more time in TT. If that's also part of the formula for South, that's another reason to prepare for a lot more people in TT. Last year I only went to the keynote and Q&A, spent a little time checking out the expo, and the rest of the time I gamed in TT. It was great!
Again, as others have said, developing a way to match TT gamers together would be awesome, and this system would serve all the PAXes. Would it be possible to have volunteer Enforcers teach games, or possibly do this with a non-Enforcer volunteer squad? Even if it's completely informal, it would be great to have a way for people to announce that they're willing to teach X game to new friends. My friends and I were lucky to have Japester teach us Blood Rage last year, but we organized that on here beforehand.
I also agree that the Indie Tabletop stuff was weirdly placed and cramped on the expo floor. I understand that the expo gets more traffic than TT, but I still think the audience for these developers is mostly going to be in TT anyway.
Lastly, keynotes. My first PAX was Prime with Wil Wheaton speaking. He was awesome. We would have voted for him for President when he was done. Neither South keynote has even been good so far. I realize it's hard to predict how good someone's speech is going to be before you invite them to give it, but there's got to be a way to find someone who has a good story to tell and the ability to actually tell it.
Regardless of any of that, the con was awesome, and I'm already mentally scheduling things I want to do next year! Keep up the great work!
Posts
Most of my comments have already been mentioned but I’ll repeat them anyways.
One of my favorite parts of last year was walking through and testing the indie tabletop games. I didn’t really get to do that this year – very crowded and very cramped.
As to the TT area, it was night and day from last year. Last year, you could have cleared the tables out and played a life-size game of Blood Bowl and you wouldn’t have bothered anyone. I actually found the crowds in the TT area a good thing. I also liked the fact there was somewhat of a split of TT vendors and PC vendors/accessories between the two areas. There were a couple of TT tourneys that filled up extremely quickly though. I’m not sure how that works in setup, but there was definitely room for expansion on the tourneys.
And like people have mentioned, the Twitch backup at the entrance to the Expo hall was kind of irritating, especially on Saturday.
All in all though, it was a thumbs up noticeable improvement over last year.
But a few things I think that could be worked on are:
-The Expo Hall was so cramped. Now I know that there will be a lot of people in one place, but the actual slots that many of the devs and vendors were assigned were just tiny, and it made trying to play some games and browse some items very hard without being jostled by other people or feeling like you are in someone's way. Perhaps remove the food from the hall entirely, put it elsewhere (I saw a lot of unused rooms), so there is more room for exhibitors and their booths?
-I am not sure if there is a reason for this, but why did everything close down so early on Sunday? The console freeplay room would not even let us check out a game at like 5PM on Sunday. I just remember there being a lot more to do when the expo hall closed at 6 at Prime on the last day.
-Speaking of the console freeplay room it felt a little understocked. Most of the time we went there the games we wanted to play were out of stock, and there were so few systems too... and really, one saturn, with one controller, and one game? I still had a lot of fun there, but some systems like the N64 and Gamecube were almost ALWAYS out of stock. Trying to play a Mario Party or Kart was a lot of work and waiting.
-I second sentiments about there not being enough places to sit. There were very few benches and chairs, and they were usually taken. Lot of open space for them to be placed too, which was odd.
-Not sure if it is a convention thing, but the food was VERY overpriced compared to the quality. Like if the quality was better I might not mind the price, but it felt pretty cheap.
-Another thing: new to this, but oh gosh, why were the pins so terribly, TERRIBLY overpriced? Besides them the swag prices were fairly reasonable (though 35 dollars for a water bottle is kind of steep, but it was a pretty nice one), but really, like 10 dollars for a pin? Even 25 for 3 and 30 for 4 was pretty dang steep. They are just little pieces of painted metal... rather cool ones I will admit, and I wish I could have collected them and put them on my lanyard, but my gosh, that much money for such a tiny, functionless item.
Either way it was a really great time.
We had to completely clear out of the third floor by midnight, so CFP wound up closing a bit earlier on Sunday than the other departments. Officially all the attendees need to be out the door by 7, so shortly after 6 is when the freeplay rooms start nudging people out.
Likewise, PAX closes earlier on Sunday because we do need to get out of the building at some point, and that involves a lot of Enforcers and exhibitors busting their asses to teardown stuff on Sunday in order to be done/almost done by Monday AM.
I think establishing those areas as sitting areas also helps for those that needed more seating near the Expo hall. It gave "settling" spots in multiple locations. Also for those who were looking for food options, there are many places that deliver to right outside the convention center, and a great bike waiter service. We ordered "in" several times. They even brought stuff to the back door for us, let's talk about convenient. (we might have been too busy with pc tourny to leave and called for coldstone milkshakes delivered to our door. Best five bucks I have ever spent not giving up my pax hour to walk there and back lol)
I agree things seemed to close down a little early. I think they were a bit short staffed this year. (? correct me if Im wrong but its the explanation I was given) We BYOC, so sometimes we tend to let the crowds go, then run over at 11:15 for things (like merch raffle thingy) and they had closed early the last two nights.
That was my only complaint about BYOC this year as well. Not sticking to their schedule, or merely not posting when things were happening.
If you give times, stick to them. IE. if it doesn't say it closes til 12, keep it open. If a tourney starts at 2, make it as close to that as possible. We plan our day around these schedules. They need to be reliable and apparent.
Speaking of BYOC. Anyone upset about not enough PC freeplay, check out BYOC. Its the only way I can do PAX now. Its amazing. Feel free to message me if you want more info.
I am in agreement the Indie showcase needs way more space. Especially since Pax South is using this as its core theme almost. It deserves to be more of a focal point.
I like the PAX Arena. It should get some va va va voom. Jazz it up a bit more. Change up the games/platforms. Make it a finale stage for tournies. Something thats more than "oo ya.. and there are people playing smash over there." I think the location right next to the Hearthstone setup was also a deterrent. Pax goers, in my experience, want to do, not watch. Have to make them feel actively engaged or make it a good lounging point.
The expo floor felt like a replica of last year. Some changes, but very few new things. We saw dreadnought last year. We saw twitch, and superfight and most of the games were repeats. I get that they need to advertise and pax itself grew, so their audience changed, but I didn't see a lot of "new". My new game pile was small this year. I cant remember an East where I have felt like oo ive seen all of this before. I also understand that they apply to PA for a spot, but maybe try to recruit some fresh blood. Maybe expand indie world.
In contrast to others, I actually thought the expo hall was roomy. I had room to move through most except at booths where the booth owners had bottle necked themselves. Maybe I went at not as peak times (as mentioned we do that on purpose), but we specifically commented at the show that it seemed to have wider lanes and walk ways than we remembered. It was very spacious for any expo hall ive seen.
Table top does need to grow. As it seems this is going to be the table top pax (which I totally love), more people who want that are coming. Im presuming that PA already knows this, and it will probably be planned without us saying things lol.
MTG was well run, I enjoyed the schedule and its location with tabletop.
See you at East and South next year!
- Where were the big local developers? Gearbox, Bioware, and id/Zenimax all seem to have upcoming titles. Cloud Imperium would have been a great catch.
- I didn't understand what PAX Rising was until I visited some of the booths in that section. I didn't see anything about it on the website or the Guidebook app. Did I miss something?
- Indie Tabletop needed more space. They seemed too squished together for something that was featured on the website and show guide.
- Twitch ought to scale down or move back from the entrance a bit. Their presence creates traffic jams, and I suppose generating attention is the point -- but traffic jams are irritating.
- Tabletop freeplay could have been a bit larger. It was difficult to find a table on Saturday afternoon that wasn't reserved for tournaments. I think I would prefer more tables than necessary than fewer. Not using part of the large queue hall for Tabletop seemed odd.
- Regarding concerts, I only caught The Protomen on Friday. Their sound mix was great, much better than the mix for anything I heard at last year's concerts. Someone said earplugs were freely available -- great idea!
- The Enforcers were great, but some didn't seem to be enforcing lines, booth spaces, reducing clumping in the walkways, etc in the Expo Hall. I saw a few cosplayers posing for pictures on the show floor without any [E]s around to ask them not to. I did make it a point to thank an [E] that was managing the crowd around Twitch on Saturday.
- $4 for a soda seems excessive.
- The convention center staff locked the Riverwalk level doors in the early evening. That made getting into the building from the Riverwalk a bit inconvenient. Please ask them to not do this. I'm fine with being ushered directly onto the escalators to go up a level, but locking me out entirely is weird.
All of the above issues are minor and based solely on my observations. I haven't vetted them for accuracy beyond my own point-of-view, so feel free to correct me if I'm off-base.
Some highlights, a.k.a. "Keep Enabling These Things:"
- My cousin and her friend PAX'd for the first time at this South. They had a blast and they'll be back.
- The cousin was incredibly impressed by the con's positive attitude and the Diversity Lounge/panel content in particular.
- I loved that Capcom was there, and that they brought a game I had never heard about before.
- A six-player, five-hour game of Eldritch Horror on Saturday.
- Randomly stumbling across The Doubleclicks in Jamspace on Sunday. I bought one of their CDs as the con was closing. They are lovely people.
- Someone cosplaying as a balloonicorn and handing out gummy bears* from a hotel ice bucket bombed a friend's picture in front of the giant PAX South logo Friday night.
- All of the indie devs and tabletop creators I got to talk to.
- Meeting Palpitatertot (congrats!) and Friend in the raffle line.
- That Omega Final.
* At least, we think they were gummy bears. My friend seemed alright after eating it. I did advise him against that. Balloonicorn-Guy was stopped by an [E] and con-center staff a moment after this, so we didn't say anything.
I think those were just locked the whole time. I stepped out there Friday and Sunday around noon to take some pictures and the doors were locked then too. I think it's just to funnel everyone through the security line for badge and bag checking.
I saw a handful of TT RPGs played and ran some, but would like a better way to organize & advertise physically there.
Playing D&D (or whatever) takes a long time and people need to know so they can prepare that against their already busy schedules.
Year 1 it was too much space & not enough people
Year 2 was packed. So please plan to expand next year.
I understand that with the new xbox one, games need to be preinstalled to actually run. However, I would get sent to machines with my game, then have to sit there for 30-40 minutes while my game installed just to play. Once it installed, I would then try to play local co cop or something similar, but then I was required to be connected to xbox live to play.
I really have no idea how to fix this, but I found it rather frustrating that I wasted an hour of my PAX time literally staring at a blank screen
<+Ravenger> you are talking to me
<@heels> oh god, what am i doing
My one minor gripe was how the UT2K4 tourney was organized and handled. Great classic game choice but not put together well. Please allow me to preface this with *I'm not bitter about it whatsoever*, but as someone who has helped run numerous tourneys in the past - it could have been ran a lot better with just a few small changes. The minute I sat down, we were given no time to setup any binds or adjust any settings - it was just go and do what you can, with 20 people on a map I've never seen before and I have played a ton of maps for UT*. Granted that's fairly okay in a game where everyone's spawning around each other all the time and there isn't any real strategy, it made no sense to use it for a game between the two finalists as well (ended up another guy and myself). The 100 armor on the map was in some well hidden location you could only get to from a lift which I did not know about while the opponent did. If a stock, well known duel map for the game was chosen, such as Rankin, Ironic or Roughinery then it would have been perfectly fine - or even if we were given time to warm up and find out the location of the hidden powerup - it would have been okay. The way we started our duel also, it wasn't restart the serve and game, it was okay everyone leave the server and now you two guys are left so fight it out. I was already at low health and it made me wonder how fair that really was as the beginning of a duel which only lasts 5 minutes doesn't leave much time for comebacks off a bad start. So in the future, atleast give everyone a few minutes to get their binds and mouse sensitivity set. I realize too that the tourney was just for fun and there wasn't any official prizes but that's my 2 cent's to have made it more fun. It just felt really rushed and my experience was something I would pass on next time if it's done in the same manner. I hope this can be some advice for next years tourney if you decide to do one.
I will say if you ever notice things that are easy to fix on site, i'm thinking of the bathrooms missing TP or the hand sanitizers empty, please let the Info Booth know if you can. We can make a call and get those things resolved to improve the experience for you and others.
PAX is certainly a vast and complicated show, it often does take a few visits before you get the feel for everything that exists at it and how all the little bits work. I'd recommend for any new people to take the time to read the program, it explains how many of the area's work, and until next time, get involved in this and other communities. The Community is who puts on the pre and post PAX parties, organizes free play sessions in TT, and makes PAX the very special thing that it is.
Thank you.
Would there be any way to put one bag check station on the river walk level of the convention? It could get set up after the con opened (set it up at like 11 or so) and then when people go down to the river walk we don't have to hike all the way back up to the main entrance. There was already convention staff at all those doors making sure we didn't go back in so I don't think it would stretch the staff to thin to set up one bag check down there.
But other than that I absolutely loved it!! And I don't know who did a weather dance to make it so dang nice this weekend but thank you to who ever it was!
Pathfinder Society & D&D Adventurers League could better represent if they could carve out some reserved space.
The past few years that I've been to Blizzcon, there have been food trucks right outside the convention center, and I want to say Anime Expo has done it before as well, but I like to think these are generally exceptions to the rule.
I have nothing against San Antonio but I highly doubt I will return for another Pax south (or even go to Pax Aus or East) but the limited amount of games on display coupled with having no big companies (no microsoft, nintendo, sony etc etc) left me with little I wanted to really check out (no offense to indie games but only a few did anything for me this year). Due to this I ended up playing more MTG with my buddy than usual (again this isn't terrible as we had lots of fun playing 2hg as its super rare to see 2hg events after pre-release etc) but doing that on both the friday & saturday left us a little underwhelmed with Pax South.
Saying all of that we arrived in San Antonio early and loved the place. The people (enforcers included) are some of the nicest people you can meet and we didn't come across a single person who was grumpy and felt put out with helping or giving directions and the riverwalk is an exceptional place to walk around - Also the river cruise for $8 is an absolute must cannot recommend that enough
Oh my Dayum
Oh my goodness
They goin' Ham
I was thinking this exact thing as you said it. We use south as our friends weekend. The expo floor is a side note, id still like it to have some new shiny things, but the pace and the city help make it easy to veg with friends and enjoying playing with each other rather just play new games.
While I only speak for myself and not PA or other [E] it is nice to hear this kind of thing from both employees of CC's or attendees. I believe we try of hardest to make it so
I'd say I like them both for all these reasons. Prime West is the big whiz-bang so much to see and do show, while South is the chill show to hang out with my buddies, at least for now.
2. Do you have this pic, would be humorous (I think there's a stickie where you can share with forum)?
I may be an old hat in this regard, but driving and parking, especially in downtown/Alamo district is usually not advisable due to all the traffic and one-way streets, unless you're used to it. There are, however a lot of parking garages and lots where you can walk around the area. I think this was one of the reasons they chose the area as it is largely pedestrian friendly.
And finally, praises be unto the fickle lords of Texas weather for they hath shown great splendor upon thine city of Saint Anthony. Hark upon thy bretherin within these hallowed forums who recount the frigid premiere PAX South with the gusting teen wind chills. Amen.
Tabletop is clearly one of the main reasons a lot of people are coming to PAX South, myself included. As has been mentioned, it was very crowded this year, which is a good thing!
The problem is the tables. They're long and thin, which is fine for a group of 3-4 people playing a small game. Anything bigger than that needs a round table, which were in very scarce supply. We ended up having to play several large games (10+ players) at a long table, and the background volume from packing so many people into such a tight space meant that anybody at either end of our group would have immense difficulty hearing what was going on -- and many times they would have to stand up and reach over people in the center of the group to move pieces or even hear people talking/be heard themselves.
If it's even possible to expand the tabletop area beyond expectations, I think it's a great idea. I really missed the intimate feeling from my first PAX where there was plenty of room for games/people's possessions/food and drinks and it was easy for everybody to hear everybody else and to be heard. Whether that can be accomplished by having more seating to accommodate large groups or by spacing things out more or whatever, I have no idea, and so there's little to no expectation on my part that something be done.
But this is an extremely minor nitpick and it didn't have such a negative effect on my overall experience that I'm not planning on coming back next year regardless.
Yes, that was a definite improvement over last year. I'm glad Khoo was able to negotiate a better rate for sunshine.
As was mentioned - the Indie show case was a little too close together. It's not something I thought about too much... Because I didn't try to get in there. The games in the indie showcase got less exposure in my view because they were close together. As compared to games in other booths where I would just sit down in a tiny booth with a couple people and play. I only interacted with the games on the edge of the indie showcase.
I'm not sure how relevant this will be given the construction on the convention center... But for the love of all which is holy and not... Have better maps of the overall convention center. I could not explain, using the map, how to get to the Falcon theater from the queue hall. Also - I didn't see a good explanation of PAX Arena or PAX Rising in the guide book. I'm still not clear on what exactly "PAX Rising" was...
I also was weirdly disappointed by the ads in the guidebook. Looking at the ads in the guidebook is the first thing I do at PAX as the ads will often make me want to check out a certain booth I may not have otherwise noticed. But I felt like there was only one or two which somewhat interested me at South. Were there fewer ads?
Anyhow! Overall I loved it. South revitalized me and I'm still carrying on the positive energy which I acquired from PAX. I love how South manages to be chill and energizing at the same time.
I want to thank everybody for being amazing! Attendees, enforcers, magical people behind the curtains... You're all beautiful and make PAX a wonderful experience that I look forward too all year long! I had a glorious PAX, and look forward to the next South. (And West. And *hopefully* East.)
Every year I see the oddly super progressive gender question next to other demographic data which is not progressive, it kinda feels like all the things like the diversity lounge and queer focused panels are not because of actual concern for these groups, but simply because these groups have been caught up in internet fight flame wars in the past with the penny arcade guys.
Very late reply, but I wanted to chime in on this since I was in the tabletop area for most of every day. I'm pretty sure the area will be expanded this year with the new convention space opening up. But another problem with the round tables is etiquette, which is tough to enforce. I often saw groups of two sitting at the rounds, playing a game that would actually be better at a long table (like 2-player card games), because they didn't want to squeeze in and get friendly at the long tables. It's natural for everyone to spread out, but it makes it especially tough on larger gaming groups that's for sure.
Maybe set aside tables with signs indicating they are reserved for games playing 6+ players? I dunno. At least if something like that was displayed, it would allow us or an Enforcer to politely come up and say, "Hey, we'd really like to use this space, since you have 3 players could you fill in one of the empty slots elsewhere?"
Or people could just sit down at an 8 person round table and play besides them. This is how we make friends and invite others to join games. People usually arent bothered if you sit down and are like "hey were gonna play this awesome game right here, you are welcome to join us"
That's fine advice for small to medium groups, but that doesn't really help actual large groups looking to use a full table and possibly pull up some extra chairs.
Again, as others have said, developing a way to match TT gamers together would be awesome, and this system would serve all the PAXes. Would it be possible to have volunteer Enforcers teach games, or possibly do this with a non-Enforcer volunteer squad? Even if it's completely informal, it would be great to have a way for people to announce that they're willing to teach X game to new friends. My friends and I were lucky to have Japester teach us Blood Rage last year, but we organized that on here beforehand.
I also agree that the Indie Tabletop stuff was weirdly placed and cramped on the expo floor. I understand that the expo gets more traffic than TT, but I still think the audience for these developers is mostly going to be in TT anyway.
Lastly, keynotes. My first PAX was Prime with Wil Wheaton speaking. He was awesome. We would have voted for him for President when he was done. Neither South keynote has even been good so far. I realize it's hard to predict how good someone's speech is going to be before you invite them to give it, but there's got to be a way to find someone who has a good story to tell and the ability to actually tell it.
Regardless of any of that, the con was awesome, and I'm already mentally scheduling things I want to do next year! Keep up the great work!