D&D Summoner

RenegadeAce · November 2006

I've just joined a D&D Campaign starting at level 5, and I've decided to play some sort of character centered around summoning. Anything 3.5 is allowed (including realm specific).

I've been looking over my books, and I can't really find anything that specializes in this.

Druid seems to be the obvious choice as a base class, as they can spontaneously cast summon spells, but I'm willing to play anything.

Do any of you have experience playing a summoning character? Is there any prestige classes ideally suited for it? I really haven't been able to find any prestige classes for it besides alienist, which doesn't really fit, or master specialist, with a choice of conjuration to get swift summons.

Any and all help is appreciated, thanks again.

gredavin · November 2006

Take Augmented Summoning.

That is all I can recommend.

INeedNoSalt · November 2006

You're not going to find much in the way of D&D in the way of summoning giant monsters to do your bidding. There're the Summon Monster I-IX spells, and the Planar summoning/binding spells. That's about it.

Druid doesn't seem quite as obvious when you consider they summon animals mostly (Summon Natures Ally) and a Sorcerer can spontaneously cast every single spell he knows (and gets to summon monsters.)

MechMantis · November 2006

INeedNoSalt wrote:

You're not going to find much in the way of D&D in the way of summoning giant monsters to do your bidding. There're the Summoner Monster I-IX spells, and the Planar summoning/binding spells. That's about it.

Druid doesn't seem quite as obvious when you consider they summon animals mostly (Summon Natures Ally) and a Sorcerer can spontaneously cast every single spell he knows (and gets to summon monsters.)

lolwut?

Sorcerers take time to cast things just like Wizards.

INeedNoSalt · November 2006

MechMantis wrote:

INeedNoSalt wrote:

You're not going to find much in the way of D&D in the way of summoning giant monsters to do your bidding. There're the Summoner Monster I-IX spells, and the Planar summoning/binding spells. That's about it.

Druid doesn't seem quite as obvious when you consider they summon animals mostly (Summon Natures Ally) and a Sorcerer can spontaneously cast every single spell he knows (and gets to summon monsters.)

lolwut?

... Yes. Sorcerers are spontaneous casters. They don't memorize spells in advance.

Edit to match your edit: Spontaneous casting = doesn't have to memorize in advance.

RenegadeAce · November 2006

You're not going to find much in the way of D&D in the way of summoning giant monsters to do your bidding. There're the Summoner Monster I-IX spells, and the Planar summoning/binding spells. That's about it.

That seems kind of odd. They've got prestige classes to specialize in pretty much anything you can think of, while an obvious mechanic like summoning is largely ignored, anyone know the reasoning behind it?

DevoutlyApathetic · November 2006

RenegadeAce wrote:

You're not going to find much in the way of D&D in the way of summoning giant monsters to do your bidding. There're the Summoner Monster I-IX spells, and the Planar summoning/binding spells. That's about it.

That seems kind of odd. They've got prestige classes to specialize in pretty much anything you can think of, while an obvious mechanic like summoning is largely ignored, anyone know the reasoning behind it?

It can be annoying as fuck to play with a guy whose turn takes longer than everybody else's at the table? Including the DM?

I'll throw together some things for the OP in a bit, but do you have access to Complete Mage and/or Unearthed Arcana?

Clawshrimpy · November 2006

I'd say be a Shaper Psion and focus on Astral Contructs to the point of going after Ectopic Adept from Complete Psionic.

RenegadeAce · November 2006

I'll throw together some things for the OP in a bit, but do you have access to Complete Mage and/or Unearthed Arcana?

Yep, both

Thanatos · November 2006

Alienist comes to mind.

Echo · November 2006

Thanatos wrote:

Alienist comes to mind.

Aw, this brings back memories of that big campaign I followed on ENWorld with some gnome alienist and his pet... thing. (The halfling with a bug phobia.)

laughingfuzzball · November 2006

Thaumatergist improves planar ally spells, but that might be too high leve for what you want.

A wizard specializing in conjuration will give you about what you're looking for right off the bat. Augment Summoning and Extend Spell will be very useful.

piL · November 2006

Clawshrimpy is right, Shaper Psions are the best focused summoners I've seen. I don't know what Ectopic Adept is. Also, Thaumatugist in the DMG was mentioned, but I'll give it props, but you have to be a cleric (I think). It's pretty high level, and just makes planar ally more effective.

Amongst my RPG making desires, I've considered making a more streamlined DnD system with less branching and more videogame-esue rigid balancing, which could allow something like a summoner. As a Thaumaturgist, you can take leadership and summon an angel or a demon to be your cohort and show up when you need fightingness. Most higher level outsiders are casters, so they'll be able to hide and be invisible a lot more.

DevoutlyApathetic · November 2006

laughingfuzzball wrote:

Thaumatergist improves planar ally spells, but that might be too high leve for what you want.

A wizard specializing in conjuration will give you about what you're looking for right off the bat. Augment Summoning and Extend Spell will be very useful.

Thaumatergist is open at 8th level, you'll need an extra feat as a Sor/Wiz to get in though (Arcane Disciple: Summoner Domain.) Practically, the Thaumatergist is of so-so quality. You'll want to have taken Augment Summoning long before 9th level is your shtick is summoning and the first ability is very dependent upon your DM running the planar ally spells in a reasonable manner. Now 3rd and 4th level are some damn nice abilities I'll grant you and 5th isn't horrible.

I'm failing to see the attraction of Alienist. Summon Monster spells win over Nature's Ally by virtue of weird monsters that can do weird shit. Alienist gives up all those guys right when they start being really cool.

RenegadeAce, what would you like your summoned friends to do? Rip things apart or slightly less ripping with more focus on utility? Also, do you generally prefer divine or arcane spells (aside from summons?)

EDIT: piL Thaumatergist is great if you can get to level 4 with effectively quickened summons once every fight. 3rd level doubles the duration of all summons as well so it isn't horrible.

piL · November 2006

DevoutlyApathetic wrote:

EDIT: piL Thaumatergist is great if you can get to level 4 with effectively quickened summons once every fight. 3rd level doubles the duration of all summons as well so it isn't horrible.

It's still not focused as much as I'd like. It becomes more of a, "Now you summon decently well in addition to your other things," instead of sacrificing things and getting exceptional summoning ability. Given the quality of the things you can summon (the things you summon are kind of meh), combined with inability to scale them up like you can do the other thing (19 wis with item bonus melee cleric with more physical makes an awesome thaumaturgist using the summoned monsters as support since focusing entirely on your summoned creatures is hardly more effective).

thorpe · November 2006

Play Call of Cthulhu lol.

Litejedi · November 2006

Actually, I'm taking back all my advice, I already made a thread for this exact type of question. If you would like to read my advice, look in that thread.

siliconenhanced · November 2006

I believe there's an exalted prestige class in the Book of Exalted Deeds that deals with this. Let me check.

No surprisingly, there's not. Though I swore there was a class devoted to this. However, there are several spells (chief among them, Armageddon) that deal with summoning big nasty celestials to stomp around.

awesome_andy · November 2006

I play second edition so my opinion probably doesn't matter but the way us fossils would play, just be a summoner and cater your spells and roleplaying towards summoning.
Granted you only get a total of seven or so sommuning spells but play it like you're top shit and your DM will hopefully play along.
Unless they have a 3.5 rule about DM's having to be rule nazi.

Rapacious · November 2006

If you can go evil there is a Prestige class from the tome of magic called a fiendbinder. Summon and bind a fiend as a semi-permanant (though unwilling) companion and run around with it. Additionaly you get a couple summoning fiend related abilities, which at best enable you to summon a "legion" of fiends (about 10 vrocks/herozu). Nice idea if you dont mind the truespeak rules. I'm not sure when you can get access to it (7th or 8th level maybe, too lazy to look it up).

DeVryGuy · November 2006

Be sure to purchase a Lesser Metamagic Rod of Extend Spell as soon as possible. Your summons aren't that good to you if you can't keep them around the whole fight.

Regardless if they are only animals, there is nothing wrong with a Druid's summons. I play a 5th Level Shapeshift Druid in my Forgotten Realms game, and pretty much beat the shit out of a Green Dragon last session thanks to my summoned Dire Wolf enhanced by Augment Summoning (+13 melee attack for d8+12 damage is pretty hardcore at 5th level) combined with Call Lightning hitting him for an additional 3d6 every round.

MegaMan001 · November 2006

It could be really fun to play a sorcerer forcused around the Summon Monster X spells. Especially if the character, say, couldn't necessarily control what monsters they get to summon. Could be very fun indeed with a kind of impulsive personality.

Pkmoutl · November 2006

Litejedi wrote:

Actually, I'm taking back all my advice, I already made a thread for this exact type of question. If you would like to read my advice, look in that thread.

No one listens to us, LJ. Face the facts. We could stand on the mountain top and shout our 30+ years combined experience in all things D&D/RPG, and they'd still start threads with titles like "How To Emprove My Ranger?"

And all we can do is make fun of the fact that he spelled "improve" wrong. All else is a whistle in the wind.

TDL · November 2006

Pk, I am going to come to you house and force you to play DnD with me at gunpoint.

You just wait.

DeepQantas · November 2006

awesome_andy wrote:

Unless they have a 3.5 rule about DM's having to be rule nazi.

Page 77 of The Guideline Compendium and later an errata for the core rules' Gameplay Conduct section.

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