[DARK SOULS 3] Everything ends.

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Posts

  • MorkathMorkath Registered User regular
    Wyborn wrote: »
    Morkath wrote: »
    like i don't think you can't make reasonable arguments here for this

    but you guys are being stubborn and grumpy about it and you're making arguments like "WELL YOU SHOULD JUST LEAVE" and "IT IS A BAD REWARD ANYWAY" and those are the things that the bad guys in after-school specials say

    Reasonable fictional arguments;

    "I am having problems getting through this area either due to a specific enemy in the area or the environment, but I prefer to fight bosses on my own."
    "I am just farming souls or items in this area, I'm not ready to kill the boss yet."
    "You were a bit rubbish and I don't think you can help with the boss, so I am going to summon someone else."

    If you, as a sunbro, want to just kill bosses. Put your summon sign down by the boss. If you put it anywhere else, you are saying you are there to kill mobs and/or see the zone.

    It's not that I just want to kill bosses

    I want to help people get to bosses. To help achieve victory! When I don't feel like doing that, I just put down a white sign, because... well that's what that's for

    I mean I get that you're saying it's not valid to want to fight a boss, either, sure, but on the same note why even set up that expectation in the guy you're getting to help you? Why not just summon a white phantom instead of a sunbro?

    Hell I fight my way through zones by myself, I've never summoned anyone to actually help me kill a boss, but I've also never dismissed anyone for any reason. If I summon somebody, they're with me unless they're a complete butthole. Outside of that, we're together to the end! It's... kind of what it's about, jolly cooperation?

    I mean, again, just pick up a white sign if you're going to run me to the boss door and banish me, it's a party foul

    What if there wasn't a white sign there? (for them)

    When I summoned people to run through areas, I didn't really pay attention to what color they were. Just what their gear was, and making sure they weren't hostile. Also most people don't bother even taking off the sunbro covenant item, no matter what they are doing. There is no reward for going covenantless, so why deal with the hassle of swapping it around?

    I can understand why you are disappointed in this case, but really blaming it on the host is just kind of silly to me.

    hobbessig.png
    turtleantfirewaterword
  • MeldingMelding Registered User regular
    what if every time you sent a phantom home your risk of invasion went up?

    discuss.

    WybornThe BetgirlSCREECH OF THE FARGCorp.ShephardKetBra-TalMr FuzzbuttGoatmon
  • WybornWyborn GET EQUIPPED Registered User regular
    Well, man, I don't think a Sunbro can be blamed for an inattentive host, and at the same time saying that somebody is being a bad Sunbro or silly because they're miffed or disappointed that the intent and color of a covenant is being ignored? That's kind of reductive and petty

    Nobody's under an obligation to do anything but I own my disappointment, and I'm not behaving erroneously when I ask people to be slightly more thoughtful in how they treat the people who help them conquer big challenges or get through hard levels

    Pretending that this behavior, that disappointment and the discussion stemming from it, is somehow wrong or stemming from a poor attitude, is not a very kind way to be.

    dN0T6ur.png
    Corp.ShephardKetBraStiltsProlegomena
  • PlatyPlaty Registered User regular
    The only honourable man is the invader, for the transaction is understood by all.

    All the nice and honorable people I encountered so far in this game were either fellow or hostile invaders

    Moridin889
  • MeldingMelding Registered User regular
    purple phantoms seem to often hate fight clubs. i have been killed 4 times hosting endless fights of summoned phantoms. 3 of the four kills were from purples. having only summoned about 7 or 8 also skews this. red sunbros seem to love it however.

  • PlatyPlaty Registered User regular
    I imagine people who invade as a purple phantom often do so for the rewards

    But I hope they just did so because they didn't know what a fight club was!

  • Speed RacerSpeed Racer Scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratchRegistered User regular
    edited April 2016
    Letting the sunbro earn a medal is the courteous thing to do

    It's a little bit rude not to do it

    You are basically getting the bellhop to carry your bags and then not tipping them

    That's the bellhop's job, you never promised the bellhop jack shit, but there's still a certain way that that human interaction is supposed to occur

    Speed Racer on
    WybornKetBraTransporterStilts-TalProlegomenamasterofmetroidAshcroft
  • BarcardiBarcardi All the Wizards Registered User regular
    edited April 2016
    People that expect to be summoned and do nothing but boss fights are the same as the people that read messages without rating them.

    Now lets all jolly cooperate and find more secrets in the levels. I just found
    a witch who sells dark magic
    thanks to a white phantom leading me around.

    Barcardi on
  • Grey GhostGrey Ghost Registered User regular
    You know what, Black Knight
    You can just stay in that fucking swamp and rot for all I care

    QRK7dOP.gif
    PSN: GrahamCR | Switch Friend Code: SW-7440-9863-2027
    WybornSCREECH OF THE FARGEvilCaketurtleantazith28
  • PlatyPlaty Registered User regular
    Black Knight, Black Knight, riding through the... night

    Prolegomena
  • MorkathMorkath Registered User regular
    edited April 2016
    Wyborn wrote: »
    Well, man, I don't think a Sunbro can be blamed for an inattentive host, and at the same time saying that somebody is being a bad Sunbro or silly because they're miffed or disappointed that the intent and color of a covenant is being ignored? That's kind of reductive and petty

    Nobody's under an obligation to do anything but I own my disappointment, and I'm not behaving erroneously when I ask people to be slightly more thoughtful in how they treat the people who help them conquer big challenges or get through hard levels

    Pretending that this behavior, that disappointment and the discussion stemming from it, is somehow wrong or stemming from a poor attitude, is not a very kind way to be.

    The problem is, there are two people in this equation.

    One of them has (mostly) full control over what they signify they are willing to be summoned for and content they are helping with.
    If you want to kill a boss, you put your sign down near the door.
    If you want to do the level, you put your sign down anywhere but the door.

    One of them has no idea what the person they are summoning wants to do, outside of where their sign is placed.

    Telling one of these people they are not allowed to summon phantoms of a certain color, because of how YOU specifically want to play that covenant is silly.

    I am sorry you can't always run through the level helping someone with the entire thing, but as there is a pretty established protocol for what sign placement and expectations means, it IS silly to try and place any blame on the host. They have no way to tell you they aren't doing the boss.

    Morkath on
    hobbessig.png
    turtleant
  • ChincymcchillaChincymcchilla Registered User regular
    Letting the sunbro earn a medal is the courteous thing to do

    It's a little bit rude not to do it

    You are basically getting the bellhop to carry your bags and then not tipping them

    That's the bellhop's job, you never promised the bellhop jack shit, but there's still a certain way that that human interaction is supposed to occur

    This is neither here nor there in terms of the discussion

    But um

    What is a bellhop

    I have a podcast about Power Rangers:Teenagers With Attitude | TWA Facebook Group
  • Speed RacerSpeed Racer Scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratchRegistered User regular
    Letting the sunbro earn a medal is the courteous thing to do

    It's a little bit rude not to do it

    You are basically getting the bellhop to carry your bags and then not tipping them

    That's the bellhop's job, you never promised the bellhop jack shit, but there's still a certain way that that human interaction is supposed to occur

    This is neither here nor there in terms of the discussion

    But um

    What is a bellhop

    Like an attendant at a nice hotel

    Gets you things you ask for, carries your bags to your room, etc

  • Grey GhostGrey Ghost Registered User regular
    Letting the sunbro earn a medal is the courteous thing to do

    It's a little bit rude not to do it

    You are basically getting the bellhop to carry your bags and then not tipping them

    That's the bellhop's job, you never promised the bellhop jack shit, but there's still a certain way that that human interaction is supposed to occur

    This is neither here nor there in terms of the discussion

    But um

    What is a bellhop

    Those guys at nice hotels that carry your bags up to your room

    QRK7dOP.gif
    PSN: GrahamCR | Switch Friend Code: SW-7440-9863-2027
  • knitdanknitdan Registered User regular
    The person in a fancy hotel who transports your bags to your room. It's expected (but not strictly required) that you will give them a tip for this service.

    “I was quick when I came in here, I’m twice as quick now”
    -Indiana Solo, runner of blades
    Speed Racer
  • MeldingMelding Registered User regular
    nah man, signs are at bonfires because it's easier to put a sign down where you summon in than walk over outside a boss door. If there is a sign outside of a boss door, then yes they explicitly want to fight the boss, but otherwise? there is still an expectation that if we make it to the boss i'm going to fight it. I'm here to help you beat the area, the boss is in the area.

    Ultimately the host is going to be the one who dictates the end of this relationship, but if you terminate it early then i have every right to be frustrated by it. Just like if you enter a fog gate and i were to never enter it. I think you'd be annoyed.

    PlatyWybornSCREECH OF THE FARGDrDinosaurKetBraStiltsmasterofmetroid
  • MorkathMorkath Registered User regular
    edited April 2016
    Letting the sunbro earn a medal is the courteous thing to do

    It's a little bit rude not to do it

    You are basically getting the bellhop to carry your bags and then not tipping them

    That's the bellhop's job, you never promised the bellhop jack shit, but there's still a certain way that that human interaction is supposed to occur

    This is a bad example, because a bellhop doesn't also sometimes pick up your bags at the airport, put them into the cab, then ride the cab with you. When you are actually going to your house, instead of a hotel.

    e:
    I am not going to buy tickets to the policeman's ball, for them conducting traffic when a stoplight is out.
    I will donate to a firehouse after they save my house from being on fire.

    Morkath on
    hobbessig.png
  • ChincymcchillaChincymcchilla Registered User regular
    Oh!

    A Tim Curry

    I have a podcast about Power Rangers:Teenagers With Attitude | TWA Facebook Group
    Speed RacerThe Betgirlturtleant
  • WybornWyborn GET EQUIPPED Registered User regular
    edited April 2016
    Morkath wrote: »
    Wyborn wrote: »
    Well, man, I don't think a Sunbro can be blamed for an inattentive host, and at the same time saying that somebody is being a bad Sunbro or silly because they're miffed or disappointed that the intent and color of a covenant is being ignored? That's kind of reductive and petty

    Nobody's under an obligation to do anything but I own my disappointment, and I'm not behaving erroneously when I ask people to be slightly more thoughtful in how they treat the people who help them conquer big challenges or get through hard levels

    Pretending that this behavior, that disappointment and the discussion stemming from it, is somehow wrong or stemming from a poor attitude, is not a very kind way to be.

    The problem is, there are two people in this equation.

    One of them has (mostly) full control over what they signify they are willing to be summoned for and content they are helping with.
    If you want to kill a boss, you put your sign down near the door.
    If you want to do the level, you put your sign down anywhere but the door.

    One of them has no idea what the person they are summoning wants to do, outside of where their sign is placed.

    Telling one of these people they are not allowed to summon phantoms of a certain color, because of how YOU specifically want to play that covenant is silly.

    I am sorry you can't always run through the level helping someone with the entire thing, but as there is a pretty established protocol for what sign placement and expectations means, it IS silly to try and place any blame on the host.

    This "established protocol" isn't exactly what you're making it out to be, especially when alternatives to summoning Sunbros exists, you know? It's not like there's a rulebook about this sutff, there's just the kind of courtesy we extend to each other.

    It is 100% a host's choice as to who they summon: they can summon the boss killers or they can summon someone else. Either is fine! That is a valid metric by which to intuit phantom intent. And it's not that you're not allowed to summon Sunbros and then dismiss them early. Certainly that is within your right. But it's still discourteous, given what Sunbros as a covenant are there for.

    It's not the kind of thing that affects how I behave as a Sunbro; if I put down my sign it's because I'm going to throw myself behind the host 100%. The spirit of jolly cooperation is about helping people and being comrades-in-arms and trying to make sure the host is getting the help they need, either because they're intimidated or tired or just not quite skillful enough to pull through a particular set of tasks. And I'm happy to help. That service is in many ways its own reward.

    But if someone dismisses me at the boss door I'm still going to think they're acting a dick. I'm curious as to why my thinking someone is acting a dick is apparently so hard to accept

    Wyborn on
    dN0T6ur.png
  • Speed RacerSpeed Racer Scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratchRegistered User regular
    edited April 2016
    This is basically the tipping debate seperated from the economical realities that tipping interacts with, thereby making it even more abstract and more prone to having long protracted arguments about

    In short I am very sad that we're already at page 103 because I would love to watch you people burn the world down

    Speed Racer on
  • Speed RacerSpeed Racer Scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratch scritch scratchRegistered User regular
    Oh!

    A Tim Curry

    I think he was the concierge but basically

This discussion has been closed.