One witness, named only as Loretta, told how she had been in the McDonald's with her son when the shooting started.
She told CNN: 'I come out of the toilet and I hear, like an alarm, boom, boom, boom. He's killing the children. The children were sitting to eat. They can't run.'
Loretta said she had been in the restrooms at the same time as the shooter, with her eight-year-old son. As he started shooting, he yelled 'Allahu Akbar', she said.
Of course this doesn't mean anything. He may have just been copying things he's seen and heard.
“Reject your sense of injury and the injury itself disappears.”
― Marcus Aurelius
One witness, named only as Loretta, told how she had been in the McDonald's with her son when the shooting started.
She told CNN: 'I come out of the toilet and I hear, like an alarm, boom, boom, boom. He's killing the children. The children were sitting to eat. They can't run.'
Loretta said she had been in the restrooms at the same time as the shooter, with her eight-year-old son. As he started shooting, he yelled 'Allahu Akbar', she said.
Of course this doesn't mean anything. He may have just been copying things he's seen and heard.
Um... I'm not discounting the "Allahu Akbar" witness reports out of hand, but if you're going to back up a guy who has, if Gator is correct, used the French-Breton equivalent of Stormfront, choose ANY source other than The Daily Mail. Because that's the British Tabloid equivalent of Stormfront.
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GatorAn alligator in ScotlandRegistered Userregular
One witness, named only as Loretta, told how she had been in the McDonald's with her son when the shooting started.
She told CNN: 'I come out of the toilet and I hear, like an alarm, boom, boom, boom. He's killing the children. The children were sitting to eat. They can't run.'
Loretta said she had been in the restrooms at the same time as the shooter, with her eight-year-old son. As he started shooting, he yelled 'Allahu Akbar', she said.
Of course this doesn't mean anything. He may have just been copying things he's seen and heard.
Um... I'm not discounting the "Allahu Akbar" witness reports out of hand, but if you're going to back up a guy who has, if Gator is correct, used the French-Breton equivalent of Stormfront, choose ANY source other than The Daily Mail. Because that's the British Tabloid equivalent of Stormfront.
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Other things got ignored along the way.
Manpower maximums in the military got ignored in the escalation. Starting around late-2007/early-2008 congress decided that they were going to start paying attention to that again and dropped a few thousand military veterans onto the job market and the VA system via increasingly hostile programs intended to reduce manpower, and promoted under the guise of 'increasing readiness'.
This resulted in an increase in jobless veterans and a strain that the VA won't recover from for some time since many of the veterans are going to require lifelong healthcare assistance, and many of which are not able to receive adequate mental or physical care.
The wars in the middle east created increasingly anti-muslim rhetoric among American and European nations as hate groups found themselves suddenly legitimized by the rhetoric of prominent politicians and their ideas welcomed among some members of the military. This has created a situation where mosques and muslims have been attacked by citizens in western countries, and considered under suspicion by law enforcement. The environment has fermented to the point that some people find Islamist rhetoric more palatable and are willing to believe it when ISIS say that their country is unwilling to help them or is at war with them. Especially when you have talking heads in the media touting the wars as wars on Islam itself.
Yeah fine, day to day life hasn't changed much for some people, but ignoring that it has had an impact on western nations is just ignoring what's happening.
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jungleroomxIt's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovelsRegistered Userregular
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Its fine that the impact hasnt reached you, but theres thousands of Americans it has reached.
You take tens of thousands of veterans and jerk them around with substandard care (which impacts their families as well), not to mention the way troops are treated while in the service, and you wonder why so many of them end up as sovereign citizens, militia types, homeless, drug abusers, family abusers.
The war has fucked up the lives of a lot of people. The fact it hasnt touched your suburban bubble doesnt mean it doesnt exist.
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Its fine that the impact hasnt reached you, but theres thousands of Americans it has reached.
You take tens of thousands of veterans and jerk them around with substandard care (which impacts their families as well), not to mention the way troops are treated while in the service, and you wonder why so many of them end up as sovereign citizens, militia types, homeless, drug abusers, family abusers.
The war has fucked up the lives of a lot of people. The fact it hasnt touched your suburban bubble doesnt mean it doesnt exist.
Before I even answer this, I have to point out how hilarious it is that your post is full of assumptions about me that are literally all wrong. Like, straight up, you are arguing against a literal strawman. The fantasy person in your head does not exist.
To the actual content, of course the war has fucked up a bunch of people's lives. I already said that in the post you are responding to. But that still doesn't mean it's a big deal for the US as a whole. The impact of everything you mention is overall fairly small. Which even you acknowledge via your hilarious string of assumptions which involves admitting that, in fact, there are many for whom the the wars have not changed much.
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Its fine that the impact hasnt reached you, but theres thousands of Americans it has reached.
You take tens of thousands of veterans and jerk them around with substandard care (which impacts their families as well), not to mention the way troops are treated while in the service, and you wonder why so many of them end up as sovereign citizens, militia types, homeless, drug abusers, family abusers.
The war has fucked up the lives of a lot of people. The fact it hasnt touched your suburban bubble doesnt mean it doesnt exist.
Plus the only reason we're in this mess is because of the last time we fought a war in the middle east, and a proxy war before that.
but its not very 'murikun to point out that todays tragedy are because of yesterdays bullshit, because its all totally about how they hate freedom.
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Other things got ignored along the way.
Manpower maximums in the military got ignored in the escalation. Starting around late-2007/early-2008 congress decided that they were going to start paying attention to that again and dropped a few thousand military veterans onto the job market and the VA system via increasingly hostile programs intended to reduce manpower, and promoted under the guise of 'increasing readiness'.
This resulted in an increase in jobless veterans and a strain that the VA won't recover from for some time since many of the veterans are going to require lifelong healthcare assistance, and many of which are not able to receive adequate mental or physical care.
The wars in the middle east created increasingly anti-muslim rhetoric among American and European nations as hate groups found themselves suddenly legitimized by the rhetoric of prominent politicians and their ideas welcomed among some members of the military. This has created a situation where mosques and muslims have been attacked by citizens in western countries, and considered under suspicion by law enforcement. The environment has fermented to the point that some people find Islamist rhetoric more palatable and are willing to believe it when ISIS say that their country is unwilling to help them or is at war with them. Especially when you have talking heads in the media touting the wars as wars on Islam itself.
Yeah fine, day to day life hasn't changed much for some people, but ignoring that it has had an impact on western nations is just ignoring what's happening.
Your first, again, is not gonna be a big enough effect to change the US in any meaningful way. It's some extra bills and some issues that, let's be honest, have a decent chance of just being completely ignored anyway given how the politics of veterans affairs generally goes.
As for the second, if you are talking about the US it's not the wars that started the anti-muslim rhetoric ball rolling, it's 9/11. Which also helped create the current form of the US security state as well. The biggest blowback from the US's recent middle-eastern adventures is to turn the area into a breeding ground for extremism, some of which is floating back into the US sphere but mostly just as reinforcement to an already existing worldview. (specifically, terrorists are coming to kill us all!)
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jungleroomxIt's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovelsRegistered Userregular
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Its fine that the impact hasnt reached you, but theres thousands of Americans it has reached.
You take tens of thousands of veterans and jerk them around with substandard care (which impacts their families as well), not to mention the way troops are treated while in the service, and you wonder why so many of them end up as sovereign citizens, militia types, homeless, drug abusers, family abusers.
The war has fucked up the lives of a lot of people. The fact it hasnt touched your suburban bubble doesnt mean it doesnt exist.
Before I even answer this, I have to point out how hilarious it is that your post is full of assumptions about me that are literally all wrong. Like, straight up, you are arguing against a literal strawman. The fantasy person in your head does not exist.
To the actual content, of course the war has fucked up a bunch of people's lives. I already said that in the post you are responding to. But that still doesn't mean it's a big deal for the US as a whole. The impact of everything you mention is overall fairly small. Which even you acknowledge via your hilarious string of assumptions which involves admitting that, in fact, there are many for whom the the wars have not changed much.
I apologize for using a strawman to argue against your over-simplification and personal biases.
The fact that you handwaved 6 trillion is absolutely insane, though.
Back when we were having the big gun debate, I looked up mass murder statistics for countries around the world, and even this is kind of unusual for not-US countries
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
Posts
That the gunman shouted Allahu Akbar was widely reported based on an eyewitness:
(this from http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3703705/Major-police-investigation-way-shots-fired-shopping-centre-Munich.html)
Of course this doesn't mean anything. He may have just been copying things he's seen and heard.
― Marcus Aurelius
Path of Exile: themightypuck
Um... I'm not discounting the "Allahu Akbar" witness reports out of hand, but if you're going to back up a guy who has, if Gator is correct, used the French-Breton equivalent of Stormfront, choose ANY source other than The Daily Mail. Because that's the British Tabloid equivalent of Stormfront.
First up:
Syrian asylum seeker kills a woman injures 2 other people in machete attack.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36879196
And a suicide bomber blew themselves up in a restaurant injuring 10.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36880758
Why is Germany becoming the focus of this shit?
Don't people realize how very bad things get when you push Germany too far?
Jokes aside, isn't that kind of the point? For at least some of these groups, they want to provoke a war (which god will obviously help them win).
And Russia. And the US.
Theres a reason they call Afghanistan the graveyard of empires.
Look what going to war in the middle east has done to the US alone.
Not much in the grand scheme of things?
I mean, the US is chugging along just fine as the preeminent world superpower despite clusterfucks on multiple continents.
Id say the 6 trillion it will cost us is a fair sum, not to mention 5 thousand dead US troops and ~250,000 dead Afghans and Iraqis.
Also, no better off than pre-9/11.
I spent a few seconds searching and found this:
It's not much in the grand scheme of things. It's just a big bill the US can totally afford to pay and a lamentable but ultimately easily bearable number of dead and wounded americans that must be dealt with. Practically the defining quality of the wars GWB started is how easily america was able to just ignore them as they stretched on for fucking ever.
What US wars in the middle east have fucked up is mostly the middle east.
Other things got ignored along the way.
Manpower maximums in the military got ignored in the escalation. Starting around late-2007/early-2008 congress decided that they were going to start paying attention to that again and dropped a few thousand military veterans onto the job market and the VA system via increasingly hostile programs intended to reduce manpower, and promoted under the guise of 'increasing readiness'.
This resulted in an increase in jobless veterans and a strain that the VA won't recover from for some time since many of the veterans are going to require lifelong healthcare assistance, and many of which are not able to receive adequate mental or physical care.
The wars in the middle east created increasingly anti-muslim rhetoric among American and European nations as hate groups found themselves suddenly legitimized by the rhetoric of prominent politicians and their ideas welcomed among some members of the military. This has created a situation where mosques and muslims have been attacked by citizens in western countries, and considered under suspicion by law enforcement. The environment has fermented to the point that some people find Islamist rhetoric more palatable and are willing to believe it when ISIS say that their country is unwilling to help them or is at war with them. Especially when you have talking heads in the media touting the wars as wars on Islam itself.
Yeah fine, day to day life hasn't changed much for some people, but ignoring that it has had an impact on western nations is just ignoring what's happening.
Its fine that the impact hasnt reached you, but theres thousands of Americans it has reached.
You take tens of thousands of veterans and jerk them around with substandard care (which impacts their families as well), not to mention the way troops are treated while in the service, and you wonder why so many of them end up as sovereign citizens, militia types, homeless, drug abusers, family abusers.
The war has fucked up the lives of a lot of people. The fact it hasnt touched your suburban bubble doesnt mean it doesnt exist.
Before I even answer this, I have to point out how hilarious it is that your post is full of assumptions about me that are literally all wrong. Like, straight up, you are arguing against a literal strawman. The fantasy person in your head does not exist.
To the actual content, of course the war has fucked up a bunch of people's lives. I already said that in the post you are responding to. But that still doesn't mean it's a big deal for the US as a whole. The impact of everything you mention is overall fairly small. Which even you acknowledge via your hilarious string of assumptions which involves admitting that, in fact, there are many for whom the the wars have not changed much.
Plus the only reason we're in this mess is because of the last time we fought a war in the middle east, and a proxy war before that.
but its not very 'murikun to point out that todays tragedy are because of yesterdays bullshit, because its all totally about how they hate freedom.
Your first, again, is not gonna be a big enough effect to change the US in any meaningful way. It's some extra bills and some issues that, let's be honest, have a decent chance of just being completely ignored anyway given how the politics of veterans affairs generally goes.
As for the second, if you are talking about the US it's not the wars that started the anti-muslim rhetoric ball rolling, it's 9/11. Which also helped create the current form of the US security state as well. The biggest blowback from the US's recent middle-eastern adventures is to turn the area into a breeding ground for extremism, some of which is floating back into the US sphere but mostly just as reinforcement to an already existing worldview. (specifically, terrorists are coming to kill us all!)
I apologize for using a strawman to argue against your over-simplification and personal biases.
The fact that you handwaved 6 trillion is absolutely insane, though.
This one seems to just be a case of a disgruntled fired worker, albeit an extremely horrific example of it.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=16534