I'm curious as to how these new stratagems function and how many of them are ones you get to use during gameplay. Hopefully not too man to keep in your head all at once in terms of when to spend your CP.
Also super curious about the different Chapter Tactics and maaaaaaaaaaaybe going to hold off on deciding doing White Scars because uh, Crimson Fists are the fucking rad as heck and they are getting their own rules?! WHAT?!~
Edit: oh man with both black templar and crimson fists getting rules I wonder if I should make a Declates Crusade army, would need two detachments of course though. HM!
Edit 2: Wait, apparently I need to not read things so early in the morning as I don't think Crimson Fists are getting their own chapter tactics. Just their own warlord trait and tactics, they get the Imperial Fist chapter tactics. Hm, maybe. Maybe.
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Mr_Rose83 Blue Ridge Protects the HolyRegistered Userregular
It seems like several of the stratagems are one-time upgrades for characters and units but the others are the equivalent of the stuff squadrons and formations got to do in the last book, like combine fire and whatnot.
Had a 1k point game at my new shop today. Brief notes;
Necrons are basically space cockroaches-if you don't wipe them all out they just keep fucking coming back.
Vanguard Vets are way better than assault marines, you pay 2 pts for a critical extra attack, get the ld and better wargear options. Elite slots aren't even hard to come by.
Seriously fuck reanimation protocols. Fuck it right in its ass.
Scarabs are bad.
Without any chapter tactics or +1A on the charge, crusader squads just don't have enough oomph. You used to break them on the charge, then grind them out. Its much harder to grind people out when you don't get the extra 50% damage output on the first round.
I elected not to use it, because I was playing against a new guy and it was a friendly game, but, spamming company vets is hilariously bullshit. 2 man squads, 1 vet and 1 sgt, the sgt gets +1A for free. So, instead of taking 5 man squads, you just take the minimum 2 man squads and get a free attack. Especially useful for putting a PF on the sgt instead of a normal vet. Again, elite slots are readily available, so if you want to maximize your damage output, spam MSU com vets in transports. All the advantages of MSU and no penalty cause you're dropping 5 units in 1 transport during deployment.
I feel like 2 man MSU will get wrecked to inefficiency fighting bigger units with the alternating activation. Say if your 5x 2man MSU squads are in a fight vs my 1x 10man squad. That's 1 activation for me, and 5 activations for you. I still have to spread out the attacks (might lose some due to overkill), but I'm still swinging before the vast majority of your guys.
I feel like 2 man MSU will get wrecked to inefficiency fighting bigger units with the alternating activation. Say if your 5x 2man MSU squads are in a fight vs my 1x 10man squad. That's 1 activation for me, and 5 activations for you. I still have to spread out the attacks (might lose some due to overkill), but I'm still swinging before the vast majority of your guys.
No, he has a point when it comes to multiple persistent fights, though how often those arise are contingent upon the armies involved. Better protection via overwatch shots is another good reason to have large units, though higher attrition through leadership is a point against. Could it be that there are benefits and hindrances to both and players must choose which will be more advantageous to their overall army strategy?
I feel like 2 man MSU will get wrecked to inefficiency fighting bigger units with the alternating activation. Say if your 5x 2man MSU squads are in a fight vs my 1x 10man squad. That's 1 activation for me, and 5 activations for you. I still have to spread out the attacks (might lose some due to overkill), but I'm still swinging before the vast majority of your guys.
Except charging bypasses this entirely.
Sure, and when things charge you? As khorne, I'd be more than happy to meet you in the middle and eat up a bunch of msu squads before they get a chance to swing.
I feel like most units in the game won't have trouble with 2 space marines.
On their turn, they charge their unit into ONE of your msu squads (get within 1", stay more then 1" away from any of the other msu squads, shouldn't be difficult), they then punk those two marines. If it was a bigger squad, the other marines would be able to fight back, but instead they're just sitting out of combat picking their noses.
Also, no. Charging doesnt bypass it entirely. You charge with 5 units. You activate 1, and attack with 2 marines. I use my countercharge stratagem and activate my one big unit and punch the other 4 squads in the face.
McGibs on
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
My demon army would drool over that prospect. You're going to charge me, give my whole 30 bloodletter unit +1 attack and strength, but only attack with two dudes before I counter charge to wipe out 5 of your units?
I feel like 2 man MSU will get wrecked to inefficiency fighting bigger units with the alternating activation. Say if your 5x 2man MSU squads are in a fight vs my 1x 10man squad. That's 1 activation for me, and 5 activations for you. I still have to spread out the attacks (might lose some due to overkill), but I'm still swinging before the vast majority of your guys.
Except charging bypasses this entirely.
Sure, and when things charge you? As khorne, I'd be more than happy to meet you in the middle and eat up a bunch of msu squads before they get a chance to swing.
I feel like most units in the game won't have trouble with 2 space marines.
On their turn, they charge their unit into ONE of your msu squads (get within 1", stay more then 1" away from any of the other msu squads, shouldn't be difficult), they then punk those two marines. If it was a bigger squad, the other marines would be able to fight back, but instead they're just sitting out of combat picking their noses.
Also, no. Charging doesnt bypass it entirely. You charge with 5 units. You activate 1, and attack with 2 marines. I use my countercharge stratagem and activate my one big unit and punch the other 4 squads in the face.
Yes, because this whole thing happens in a vacuum. You're going to have a full strength squad I've done no shooting to to blow 2CP on to counter 160 pts of marines. Even throwing 10 vs 10, you're going to be splitting all of your attacks between 5 units, and if you focus down individual units, you are more than likely going to be overkilling or underkilling, as you have to declare all of your targets before you swing. Further, whatever I rode in on is more than capable of charging first and locking down at least a section of the unit.
You're right, except its not 2 marines, its 10 marines. There is no statistical difference for me except that every section you go over/under statistical average is to my advantage.
I'd rather you charge just a 2 man squad and leave my other marines free to charge. If you're not tying all of my squads up in one go, then you're going to be wasting 2 more cp to not eat all of my intiative on the charge. It's 32 points per squad, go ahead and waste your charge on killing two marines.
I've been doing this for years with Tyranids, it works amazingly well. People have been winning tournaments for years with MSU. The activation system in combat would help more if charging alone didn't force you to blow 2 CP to stop it. All the top GT lists have had 4-8 CP, 2 CP to counter a cheap, versatile assault unit is a pretty big waste. This unit doesn't even hit as hard as 30 boyz, why would you waste 2cp on it? It's simply a cost efficient way to get 5 more attacks and force your opponent to overkill, and ironically to your point, waste CP to stop it.
My demon army would drool over that prospect. You're going to charge me, give my whole 30 bloodletter unit +1 attack and strength, but only attack with two dudes before I counter charge to wipe out 5 of your units?
Yes please.
Why would I ever charge 30 bloodletters? A 270 pt dedicated assault unit. I mean, if I got 10 of them to you, I mostly likely brought a stormraven or a landraider, both of which would absolutely decimate 30 bloodletters down to a much more reasonable number.
Everyday I wake up is the worst day of my life.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited July 2017
Because my entire army is bloodletters mostly. What else are you going to be charging? Your options against my Khorne demon army are: Do I charge bloodletters? Y/N. If the answer is no, you're probably not charging anything in the first place. If you don't charge that unit, have fun next turn when it charges you and rips everything apart, including the land raider (who might decimate one of my 30 dood bloodletter squads ).
And yes, my army is hilariously stupid but it works so much better than it has any right too.
I'd rather you charge just a 2 man squad and leave my other marines free to charge. If you're not tying all of my squads up in one go, then you're going to be wasting 2 more cp to not eat all of my intiative on the charge. It's 32 points per squad, go ahead and waste your charge on killing two marines.
Generally speaking, if those guys are all close enough where they could charge something, they are close enough where they can all be easily multicharged and you still lose all of them. Additionally, if you get unlucky in a tournament and roll Dawn of War, goodbye both your chances of placing and your differential for deciding ties as a loss will be utterly devastating (due to how many additional kill points you'll concede).
Like, I do get that in some tournaments there is a heavy MSU meta, but in my experience everyone who has tried this in the tournaments I host here has failed dramatically the moment they get one of those "Kill point" games. They might actually "win" the game (by the amount of points they kill), but lose so badly on victory points it cripples them for the rest of the tournament (because who isn't going to shoot 2 guys in the face to get an easy VP?). Plus in 8th edition with split fire, an MSU unit doesn't even take all of someones shooting anymore, you can wipe all 5 of them out with one squads shooting if you feel like it - right down to their individual weapons.
Because my entire army is bloodletters mostly. What else are you going to be charging? Your options against my Khorne demon army are: Do I charge bloodletters? Y/N. If the answer is no, you're probably not charging anything in the first place. If you don't charge that unit, have fun next turn when it charges you and rips everything apart, including the land raider (who might decimate one of my 30 dood bloodletter squads ).
And yes, my army is hilariously stupid but it works so much better than it has any right too.
I mean, I don't know why I'd walk up to the bloodletters in the first place? Like, there's so much more to the game than just saying 30 of X will wipe out 20 of Y. Is there an objective there? Do I need to even go there? Why am I not focus firing your squad so it takes 15 casualties and then explodes in the morale check?
I'd rather you charge just a 2 man squad and leave my other marines free to charge. If you're not tying all of my squads up in one go, then you're going to be wasting 2 more cp to not eat all of my intiative on the charge. It's 32 points per squad, go ahead and waste your charge on killing two marines.
Generally speaking, if those guys are all close enough where they could charge something, they are close enough where they can all be easily multicharged and you still lose all of them. Additionally, if you get unlucky in a tournament and roll Dawn of War, goodbye both your chances of placing and your differential for deciding ties as a loss will be utterly devastating (due to how many additional kill points you'll concede).
Like, I do get that in some tournaments there is a heavy MSU meta, but in my experience everyone who has tried this in the tournaments I host here has failed dramatically the moment they get one of those "Kill point" games. They might actually "win" the game (by the amount of points they kill), but lose so badly on victory points it cripples them for the rest of the tournament (because who isn't going to shoot 2 guys in the face to get an easy VP?). Plus in 8th edition with split fire, an MSU unit doesn't even take all of someones shooting anymore, you can wipe all 5 of them out with one squads shooting if you feel like it - right down to their individual weapons.
I can charge you well after I've shot the unit down to a manageable size. This isn't all or nothing.
I'm not saying build your entire army out of this unit, I'm simply pointing out it is a statistically strong unit. It will outperform most things in the codex at its cost, for the function I've described.
If you are playing ITC then it works fine. If you play by the terribly balanced book missions, well, that's how you get things like 3+ stormravens and Girlyman.
You guys are acting like I said it was the uberunit and the coming of christ. I said, "if you want to maximize your damage output", which is 100% accurate. You can take 5x2 vets with chainsword+stormbolter for 180 pts, get 40 shots at 12" and 35 attacks. That's very good for the SM codex.
Everyday I wake up is the worst day of my life.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited July 2017
If the ITC makes it so that 2 man squads of Space Marines are optimal, perhaps that's not a ringing endorsement of it being better than the book missions. Your strategy falls apart the moment you hit a kill point table, but if they have no equivalent then yeah, that's how you get stuff like 5x 2 man space marine squads.
If the ITC makes it so that 2 man squads of Space Marines are optimal, perhaps that's not a ringing endorsement of it being better than the book missions. Your strategy falls apart the moment you hit a kill point table, but if they have no equivalent then yeah, that's how you get stuff like 5x 2 man space marine squads.
They limit the amount of points you can achieve per turn, per objective. Keeps kill points from being an auto-lose for MSU, but makes it so MSU doesn't auto-win objective missions. It's an extremely balanced tournament format, and the fact that you run tournaments but aren't familiar with it is surprising.
Everyday I wake up is the worst day of my life.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
If the ITC makes it so that 2 man squads of Space Marines are optimal, perhaps that's not a ringing endorsement of it being better than the book missions. Your strategy falls apart the moment you hit a kill point table, but if they have no equivalent then yeah, that's how you get stuff like 5x 2 man space marine squads.
They limit the amount of points you can achieve per turn, per objective. Keeps kill points from being an auto-lose for MSU, but makes it so MSU doesn't auto-win objective missions. It's an extremely balanced tournament format, and the fact that you run tournaments but aren't familiar with it is surprising.
Mostly because I have no sympathy for MSU autolosing kill point games by default. I do put limits on amount of points per table though, but that is with a reasonable assumption about the number of units fielded by most armies (eg not fielding 20 MSUs).
If someone wants to spam MSU or just lots of units, they always have to consider that kill point game. Perhaps when I expend the store space and we go beyond 14 players or so I will need to address this more in larger tournaments.
But it sounds like this format specifically encourages MSU being a thing. Also I am not sure how this auto-wins objectives when everything split fires in 8th. You can remove multiple squads in one shooting phase fairly easily and holding objectives is determined by number of models, not units next to them.
Plus you get something like big guns never tire and your MSU spam is irrelevant unless they can remove that land raider from the objective.
Edit: It occurs to me they might have made it units and not models, which would heavily favor MSU spamming.
The raven guard chapter tactic is -1 to hit them if they are over 12 inches away.
Wow.
"A Raven Guard flyer flew overhead and my plasma weapon exploded."
Chapter tactics are only for infantry, bikes, and dreadnoughts. So thankfully, no stupid stealth-ravens or camo-whirlwinds.
Sneakydakkadreads will sure be dumb though.
Still an insanely powerful ability, and honestly makes me sort of worried if this is how crazy they're going right off the bat.
I am not base coating the reavers I have till I know who I am painting them as.
Requirements:
1) A CT that makes them fun to play but different from my Chaos
2) Color scheme I like preferably not red because red is not my favorite color to paint
3) Probably not black but we will see
They Really have to get out the codices for all faction fast because this sounds like factions with a codex get huge boosts over the index only factions.
The first codex of a new edition is traditionally the most underpowered one too as they baby step into a new set of rules.
Oldhammer was hampered by all the grandfathered rules and stats meaning the only changes they could add had to be in the form of even more rules and formations and bonuses instead of just making the unit itself better. Having a clean slate means they can buff whatever they want without needing 3 additional books with web-only formations stapled in there just to play your army. Simultaneous system-wide power creep that you only need one book to use is my hope for this going forward.
My mood re Raven Guard: gleeful! All the jump pack shenanigans are attached to shrike so I can just take a regular captain and be a Raptor. Still curious to see what crimson fists do before make a final decision though.
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
Being the nerd I am I thinking of list. Use the -1 for your support units like scouts, tacs, riflemen dreads. Then infiltrate some nasty stuff right in front of the enemy and also use jet pack drops. Basically how to lose some friends playing this game. Also how to get 5 dreads on the field, two in 9" of the enemy turn 1. Shrike is with the Vanguard Vets as well is the chaplain and the libby if you want him or need him there. Should with all the rerolls to charge and such be able to get those vets into almost a guaranteed first turn assault and the dreads there as well. Riflemen get the -1 to hit along with your tacs and scouts in the back. Use combat squading and spread out as needed.
H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
edited July 2017
Since a few of you play Chaos armies, I'm curious if you feel there's a viable Chaos undivided army option (ie, featuring stuff specific to all 4 gods)? Not, like tournament viable, but like playing with friends and the occasional pick-up game at a shop viable. This is a purely theoretical question, mind you, so don't put much effort into it unless you really enjoy speculative list building. I'm just curious because whenever I see people talk about their Chaos armies they mostly seem to be devoted to one god, or stick to the more generic Chaos stuff.
For undivided you probably want to do something with the Black Legion. Then you can get lord / Abaddon buff auras working.
Tri-Optimum reminds you that there are only one-hundred-sixty-three shopping days until Christmas. Just 1 extra work cycle twice a week will give you the spending money you need to make this holiday a very special one.
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TIFunkaliciousKicking back inNebraskaRegistered Userregular
I think sticking to one chaos god is just comfortable. There will be more rewards in the future for going pure Death Guard, for example. Frontline Gaming's podcast talked about an army that was a mosh pit of strong daemon characters from 2-3 alignments that was just deleting armies at some west coast tournament. Although I think it was leaning hard on big forgeworld models which might not be your jam
Summoning is cool and it looks really fun to decide what kind of daemon unit you want to throw down in the middle of the game.
Some of the CSM units are daemons at the same time. There are a couple cute 1-2 combos you can set up for the different alignments and spread them across your army. Daemon engines that are nurgle aligned can be healed by a nurgle psyker power (and warpsmiths in the same turn). Warp talons have the daemon keyword and can get the +1 strength from daemon heralds if you can get one in range by summoning or putting it on a mount.
Also some chaos unit abilities are just really good compliments even though it's not a keyword bubble buff. The fiend of slaanesh stops anything without fly from falling back so if you can summon it or get it up the field it can lock down a big unit that's not good in melee for you to charge with something else
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Der Waffle MousBlame this on the misfortune of your birth.New Yark, New Yark.Registered Userregular
My mood re Raven Guard: gleeful! All the jump pack shenanigans are attached to shrike so I can just take a regular captain and be a Raptor. Still curious to see what crimson fists do before make a final decision though.
so the new "Getting Started With 40k" magazine has pics of the new Nurgle mortar tank, the Plagueburst Crawler.
Don't know what I think of the design yet, it does have a nicely huge gun so there is that.
so the new "Getting Started With 40k" magazine has pics of the new Nurgle mortar tank, the Plagueburst Crawler.
Don't know what I think of the design yet, it does have a nicely huge gun so there is that.
There was a video that went into detail of how that person did not like it and so on
I only found out about the tank via them
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H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
It might be the paint scheme, but the upper-forward part of the hump just seems a little too crude and simple to me. Makes it look like one of the old junky Epic-scale vehicle designs that were quietly abandoned. Otherwise it's neat, but it's just missing something in my opinion.
Posts
Also super curious about the different Chapter Tactics and maaaaaaaaaaaybe going to hold off on deciding doing White Scars because uh, Crimson Fists are the fucking rad as heck and they are getting their own rules?! WHAT?!~
Edit: oh man with both black templar and crimson fists getting rules I wonder if I should make a Declates Crusade army, would need two detachments of course though. HM!
Edit 2: Wait, apparently I need to not read things so early in the morning as I don't think Crimson Fists are getting their own chapter tactics. Just their own warlord trait and tactics, they get the Imperial Fist chapter tactics. Hm, maybe. Maybe.
Nintendo Network ID: AzraelRose
DropBox invite link - get 500MB extra free.
https://the-emperor-protects.tumblr.com/post/163058444925/tuskin4-the-news-these-days
Necrons are basically space cockroaches-if you don't wipe them all out they just keep fucking coming back.
Vanguard Vets are way better than assault marines, you pay 2 pts for a critical extra attack, get the ld and better wargear options. Elite slots aren't even hard to come by.
Seriously fuck reanimation protocols. Fuck it right in its ass.
Scarabs are bad.
Without any chapter tactics or +1A on the charge, crusader squads just don't have enough oomph. You used to break them on the charge, then grind them out. Its much harder to grind people out when you don't get the extra 50% damage output on the first round.
I elected not to use it, because I was playing against a new guy and it was a friendly game, but, spamming company vets is hilariously bullshit. 2 man squads, 1 vet and 1 sgt, the sgt gets +1A for free. So, instead of taking 5 man squads, you just take the minimum 2 man squads and get a free attack. Especially useful for putting a PF on the sgt instead of a normal vet. Again, elite slots are readily available, so if you want to maximize your damage output, spam MSU com vets in transports. All the advantages of MSU and no penalty cause you're dropping 5 units in 1 transport during deployment.
Except charging bypasses this entirely.
Sure, and when things charge you? As khorne, I'd be more than happy to meet you in the middle and eat up a bunch of msu squads before they get a chance to swing.
I feel like most units in the game won't have trouble with 2 space marines.
On their turn, they charge their unit into ONE of your msu squads (get within 1", stay more then 1" away from any of the other msu squads, shouldn't be difficult), they then punk those two marines. If it was a bigger squad, the other marines would be able to fight back, but instead they're just sitting out of combat picking their noses.
Also, no. Charging doesnt bypass it entirely. You charge with 5 units. You activate 1, and attack with 2 marines. I use my countercharge stratagem and activate my one big unit and punch the other 4 squads in the face.
Yes please.
Yes, because this whole thing happens in a vacuum. You're going to have a full strength squad I've done no shooting to to blow 2CP on to counter 160 pts of marines. Even throwing 10 vs 10, you're going to be splitting all of your attacks between 5 units, and if you focus down individual units, you are more than likely going to be overkilling or underkilling, as you have to declare all of your targets before you swing. Further, whatever I rode in on is more than capable of charging first and locking down at least a section of the unit.
You're right, except its not 2 marines, its 10 marines. There is no statistical difference for me except that every section you go over/under statistical average is to my advantage.
I'd rather you charge just a 2 man squad and leave my other marines free to charge. If you're not tying all of my squads up in one go, then you're going to be wasting 2 more cp to not eat all of my intiative on the charge. It's 32 points per squad, go ahead and waste your charge on killing two marines.
I've been doing this for years with Tyranids, it works amazingly well. People have been winning tournaments for years with MSU. The activation system in combat would help more if charging alone didn't force you to blow 2 CP to stop it. All the top GT lists have had 4-8 CP, 2 CP to counter a cheap, versatile assault unit is a pretty big waste. This unit doesn't even hit as hard as 30 boyz, why would you waste 2cp on it? It's simply a cost efficient way to get 5 more attacks and force your opponent to overkill, and ironically to your point, waste CP to stop it.
Why would I ever charge 30 bloodletters? A 270 pt dedicated assault unit. I mean, if I got 10 of them to you, I mostly likely brought a stormraven or a landraider, both of which would absolutely decimate 30 bloodletters down to a much more reasonable number.
And yes, my army is hilariously stupid but it works so much better than it has any right too.
Generally speaking, if those guys are all close enough where they could charge something, they are close enough where they can all be easily multicharged and you still lose all of them. Additionally, if you get unlucky in a tournament and roll Dawn of War, goodbye both your chances of placing and your differential for deciding ties as a loss will be utterly devastating (due to how many additional kill points you'll concede).
Like, I do get that in some tournaments there is a heavy MSU meta, but in my experience everyone who has tried this in the tournaments I host here has failed dramatically the moment they get one of those "Kill point" games. They might actually "win" the game (by the amount of points they kill), but lose so badly on victory points it cripples them for the rest of the tournament (because who isn't going to shoot 2 guys in the face to get an easy VP?). Plus in 8th edition with split fire, an MSU unit doesn't even take all of someones shooting anymore, you can wipe all 5 of them out with one squads shooting if you feel like it - right down to their individual weapons.
I mean, I don't know why I'd walk up to the bloodletters in the first place? Like, there's so much more to the game than just saying 30 of X will wipe out 20 of Y. Is there an objective there? Do I need to even go there? Why am I not focus firing your squad so it takes 15 casualties and then explodes in the morale check?
I can charge you well after I've shot the unit down to a manageable size. This isn't all or nothing.
I'm not saying build your entire army out of this unit, I'm simply pointing out it is a statistically strong unit. It will outperform most things in the codex at its cost, for the function I've described.
If you are playing ITC then it works fine. If you play by the terribly balanced book missions, well, that's how you get things like 3+ stormravens and Girlyman.
You guys are acting like I said it was the uberunit and the coming of christ. I said, "if you want to maximize your damage output", which is 100% accurate. You can take 5x2 vets with chainsword+stormbolter for 180 pts, get 40 shots at 12" and 35 attacks. That's very good for the SM codex.
They limit the amount of points you can achieve per turn, per objective. Keeps kill points from being an auto-lose for MSU, but makes it so MSU doesn't auto-win objective missions. It's an extremely balanced tournament format, and the fact that you run tournaments but aren't familiar with it is surprising.
Mostly because I have no sympathy for MSU autolosing kill point games by default. I do put limits on amount of points per table though, but that is with a reasonable assumption about the number of units fielded by most armies (eg not fielding 20 MSUs).
If someone wants to spam MSU or just lots of units, they always have to consider that kill point game. Perhaps when I expend the store space and we go beyond 14 players or so I will need to address this more in larger tournaments.
But it sounds like this format specifically encourages MSU being a thing. Also I am not sure how this auto-wins objectives when everything split fires in 8th. You can remove multiple squads in one shooting phase fairly easily and holding objectives is determined by number of models, not units next to them.
Plus you get something like big guns never tire and your MSU spam is irrelevant unless they can remove that land raider from the objective.
Edit: It occurs to me they might have made it units and not models, which would heavily favor MSU spamming.
The raven guard chapter tactic is -1 to hit them if they are over 12 inches away.
Wow.
Where the leaks at?
Ugh I am making a loyalist army aren't I?
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/07/17/chapter-focus-raven-guard-july17gw-homepage-post-3/
Also strategem for 9 inch away infiltration on any unit. First turn charges go!
"A Raven Guard flyer flew overhead and my plasma weapon exploded."
"Oh what a day, what a LOVELY DAY!"
Chapter tactics are only for infantry, bikes, and dreadnoughts. So thankfully, no stupid stealth-ravens or camo-whirlwinds.
Sneakydakkadreads will sure be dumb though.
Still an insanely powerful ability, and honestly makes me sort of worried if this is how crazy they're going right off the bat.
You had me super excited that there was more info than just the RG.
It's just "Infiltrate" from the old editions, which is of course great but nothing revolutionary.
Requirements:
1) A CT that makes them fun to play but different from my Chaos
2) Color scheme I like preferably not red because red is not my favorite color to paint
3) Probably not black but we will see
Oldhammer was hampered by all the grandfathered rules and stats meaning the only changes they could add had to be in the form of even more rules and formations and bonuses instead of just making the unit itself better. Having a clean slate means they can buff whatever they want without needing 3 additional books with web-only formations stapled in there just to play your army. Simultaneous system-wide power creep that you only need one book to use is my hope for this going forward.
++ Vanguard Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Marines) ++
+ HQ +
Librarian: 1) Veil of Time, 2) Might of Heroes, Force stave, Jump Pack, Storm bolter
+ Elites +
Dreadnought: Twin autocannon, Twin autocannon
Dreadnought: Twin autocannon, Twin autocannon
Dreadnought: Twin autocannon, Twin autocannon
++ Battalion Detachment +3CP (Imperium - Space Marines) ++
+ HQ +
Chaplain: Jump Pack, Storm bolter
Kayvaan Shrike
+ Troops +
Scout Squad: 10x Camo cloak
. Scout Sergeant: Combat knife, Sniper rifle
. Scout w/Heavy Weapon: Missile launcher
. 8x Scout w/Sniper Rifle: 8x Sniper rifle
Tactical Squad
. 7x Space Marine
. Space Marine Sergeant: Chainsword, Storm bolter
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon: Lascannon
. Space Marine w/Special Weapon: Plasma gun
Tactical Squad
. 7x Space Marine
. Space Marine Sergeant: Chainsword, Storm bolter
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon: Lascannon
. Space Marine w/Special Weapon: Plasma gun
+ Elites +
Vanguard Veteran Squad: Jump Pack
. Space Marine Veteran: Lightning Claw, Storm shield
. Space Marine Veteran: 2x Chainsword
. Space Marine Veteran: Chainsword, Power axe
. Space Marine Veteran: Power axe, Storm shield
. Space Marine Veteran: Bolt pistol, Power axe
. Veteran Sergeant: Relic blade, Storm shield
Venerable Dreadnought: Assault cannon
. Dreadnought combat weapon w/Heavy Flamer: Heavy flamer
Venerable Dreadnought: Assault cannon
. Dreadnought combat weapon w/Heavy Flamer: Heavy flamer
+ Heavy Support +
Predator: Predator autocannon, Two Heavy Bolters
Created with BattleScribe
Summoning is cool and it looks really fun to decide what kind of daemon unit you want to throw down in the middle of the game.
Some of the CSM units are daemons at the same time. There are a couple cute 1-2 combos you can set up for the different alignments and spread them across your army. Daemon engines that are nurgle aligned can be healed by a nurgle psyker power (and warpsmiths in the same turn). Warp talons have the daemon keyword and can get the +1 strength from daemon heralds if you can get one in range by summoning or putting it on a mount.
Also some chaos unit abilities are just really good compliments even though it's not a keyword bubble buff. The fiend of slaanesh stops anything without fly from falling back so if you can summon it or get it up the field it can lock down a big unit that's not good in melee for you to charge with something else
Issodon's gonna be ridiculous
Don't know what I think of the design yet, it does have a nicely huge gun so there is that.
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
There was a video that went into detail of how that person did not like it and so on
I only found out about the tank via them
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609